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flycuban

join:2005-04-25
Homestead, FL

Own you?

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.



mmay149q
Premium
join:2009-03-05
Dallas, TX
kudos:48

said by flycuban:

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.

Maybe, or maybe it's as simple as not downloading the updates?

Matt


Lark3po
Premium
join:2003-08-05
Madison, AL
Reviews:
·Knology
reply to flycuban

said by flycuban:

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.

If you got a subsidized phone on contract do you really own the phone before the contract terms are met? I ask because I truly don't know.

I personally no longer buy phones on contract for this very reason. I will pay full price for a (unlocked) phone I like and be in total control over what is and what is not on it.

slckusr
Premium
join:2003-03-17
Greenville, SC
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Charter
reply to flycuban

said by flycuban:

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.

Its not just Verizon, Motorola also likes to keep things locked up (bootloaders). This stuff wont change and there arent enough people to get loud enough to make them care.

At least Verizon has an excuse to lock some things down (tethering does use spectrum, which cost money).


MovieLover76

join:2009-09-11
kudos:1
reply to mmay149q

It also fixes the problem with the phone rebooting frequently, I have the phone and I needed this update, not downloading it isn't a good option, better option is to root the phone.


hottboiinnc
ME

join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
reply to flycuban

you may own the device- but not their network. Your monthly fee gives you the privilege to use it and they say what happens on it. If you don't like it; then there are other carriers that will take your business.


hottboiinnc
ME

join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
reply to Lark3po

actually no because they could request the phone back. If you cancel within the first 15-30 days they actually do want the device back. I don't know why VZ wouldn't though. They can resell the device again as "refurb" and make another $60+ off it. After all that's how NEW/Asurion gets their phones.



mmay149q
Premium
join:2009-03-05
Dallas, TX
kudos:48
reply to MovieLover76

said by MovieLover76:

It also fixes the problem with the phone rebooting frequently, I have the phone and I needed this update, not downloading it isn't a good option, better option is to root the phone.

See I have the same phone, and I have it overclocked 900mhz and I don't have this issue at all, is the rebooting due to a over heating issue?

Matt
--
I am no longer an AT&T Employee. Check out my kudos! »/profile/1626573
Have U-verse questions? Please email uversecare@att.com and they will assist you!!


amarryat
Verizon FiOS

join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to Lark3po

said by Lark3po:

said by flycuban:

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.

If you got a subsidized phone on contract do you really own the phone before the contract terms are met? I ask because I truly don't know.

I would say yes. Because you will have to pay an ETF if you quit early, and they won't get the phone back.


MovieLover76

join:2009-09-11
kudos:1
reply to mmay149q

The rebooting issue was due to the MR1 radio from the last update, though some thunderbolt users were lucky and weren't effected by it as much as others. my phone rebooted every other day or so, twice while i was on a call



mmay149q
Premium
join:2009-03-05
Dallas, TX
kudos:48

Ahh that's probably why I don't have the issue, I rooted my phone the day the option was available, and I have never downloaded any updates at all, just a few 3rd party roms based off the original. I pretty much don't download the VZW updates, I know better O:) unless there's a major issue with the device.

Matt
--
I am no longer an AT&T Employee. Check out my kudos! »/profile/1626573
Have U-verse questions? Please email uversecare@att.com and they will assist you!!



mmay149q
Premium
join:2009-03-05
Dallas, TX
kudos:48
reply to hottboiinnc

said by hottboiinnc:

you may own the device- but not their network. Your monthly fee gives you the privilege to use it and they say what happens on it. If you don't like it; then there are other carriers that will take your business.

So what happens when no one is satisfied with all the carriers and the terms to use their network? Everyone should just put up with it and feel privileged to pay more for antiquated technology that's been around for 30 years now?

Matt
--
I am no longer an AT&T Employee. Check out my kudos! »/profile/1626573
Have U-verse questions? Please email uversecare@att.com and they will assist you!!

ISurfTooMuch

join:2007-04-23
Tuscaloosa, AL
reply to hottboiinnc

said by hottboiinnc:

you may own the device- but not their network. Your monthly fee gives you the privilege to use it and they say what happens on it. If you don't like it; then there are other carriers that will take your business.

Yes, but tethering is not a network function; it's a phone function. The tethering happens after the data has been received by the phone. At that point, it is no longer traversing their network.

That would be like your ISP telling you that you can't use a wireless router in your house. Once that data comes out of the LAN side of their modem, it isn't any concern of theirs what you do with it. Or, if you want an older example, it would be like the phone company telling you that you had to only use a telephone that you rented from them. If you wanted more extensions in your house, you had to get the phone company out to install them, and you paid more for renting extra phones. It didn't matter that you still only had one line. If you wanted another phone, or a different kind of phone, you had to get Ma Bell's OK.

WernerSchutz

join:2009-08-04
Sugar Land, TX

And that is exactly what they are working toward. All the government regulation and customer protections be damned. I am looking forward when those kind of "features" come to a car or a house that you buy.

Fascism is a lot of fun.


jjeffeory

join:2002-12-04
USA
reply to mmay149q

I can tell you the answer. We do without. Screw us! You want to participate in modern society? Too bad. Pay up or shut up!

Sucks, huh?


jjeffeory

join:2002-12-04
USA
reply to ISurfTooMuch

I had a cable company tell me that I couldn't use a router at home. It was against their TOS. That was in '06 in a LARGE metro area too. I looked at them and laughed!



joako
Premium
join:2000-09-07
/dev/null
kudos:6
reply to Lark3po

said by Lark3po:

said by flycuban:

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.

If you got a subsidized phone on contract do you really own the phone before the contract terms are met? I ask because I truly don't know.

I personally no longer buy phones on contract for this very reason. I will pay full price for a (unlocked) phone I like and be in total control over what is and what is not on it.

Of course you do. I'm not 100% sure about Verizon but with AT&T I could get an iPhone for $200 for signing a contract, never activate the iPhone, sell it on ebay, remove the data plan and not have any issues.

The contract is a discount for the phone in exchange for agreeing to have service for X period of time. You own the phone, and there's no reversing that. If you cancel the contract you can't return the phone, you must keep the phone and pay the termination fee, which goes down each month you had the service.
--
PRescott7-2097

hottboiinnc
ME

join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
reply to mmay149q

You do as the carrier wishes and you agree to. You signed the contract agreeing to their terms of using that device. You know up front that it will cost you extra for the hotspot device then you agree to pay for it if you wish to use it.



joako
Premium
join:2000-09-07
/dev/null
kudos:6
reply to slckusr

said by slckusr:

said by flycuban:

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.

Its not just Verizon, Motorola also likes to keep things locked up (bootloaders). This stuff wont change and there arent enough people to get loud enough to make them care.

At least Verizon has an excuse to lock some things down (tethering does use spectrum, which cost money).

Tethering doesn't use spectrum. It allows the transfer of data between your phone and computer.

With all the carriers going to metered per-MB plans, it's not relevant. If you pay for 2GB of data, it is the same resources for the carrier if you use the data on your phone, on your tethered computer, or on your ass for that matter.

Tethering using more data than accessing the internet on your phone, so the carriers will make more revenue if more users tether.
--
PRescott7-2097

hottboiinnc
ME

join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
reply to ISurfTooMuch

Yes but putting that device on a computer can and most likely will cause more strain on the network due to pulling more data over it.


hottboiinnc
ME

join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
reply to jjeffeory

and if its in your contract yes they can. Still their network that you lease access to.



Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2
reply to MovieLover76

said by MovieLover76:

The rebooting issue was due to the MR1 radio from the last update...

If that's the case, someone will pull the radio out of that update and make it available for install only, leaving out the hotspot-disabling part. This requires a rooted phone, of course.

en103

join:2011-05-02
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to mmay149q

I was supposed to be why net neutrality rules were attempted.
To ensure that carriers wouldn't 'double dip' or block certain services.
Instead - they just raise prices.
Personally - since there is a 2GB 'cap' (overage charged), they shouldn't care if I tether or not. Most likely, they'd like to keep those that have data lines from using the phone as a modem w/o extra revenue.


slckusr
Premium
join:2003-03-17
Greenville, SC
kudos:1
reply to joako

Tethering doesnt directly use spectrum, but getting the data from the web to your phone sure does.


dr_jack

join:2002-04-21
Irving, TX
reply to hottboiinnc

said by hottboiinnc:

Yes but putting that device on a computer can and most likely will cause more strain on the network due to pulling more data over it.

So, basically you agree that the point of the fee is to make it difficult for a user to use the 2 GB of data for which they have already paid (assuming a $30/month data plan).

I am sure that all the carriers love to charge customer a fee for minimum usage and then have them use very little data.

If you have already paid for 2 GB, you should be free to use it as you wish. If you pull more than 2 GB ("..strain on the network"), then overages increase the bill.

GLIMMER

join:2004-01-17
Fisher, IL
reply to mmay149q

you mean under clocking it right its got a 1ghz processor



FFH
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
reply to joako

said by joako:

With all the carriers going to metered per-MB plans, it's not relevant. If you pay for 2GB of data, it is the same resources for the carrier if you use the data on your phone, on your tethered computer, or on your ass for that matter.

Tethering using more data than accessing the internet on your phone, so the carriers will make more revenue if more users tether.


I agree about pricing on UBB, BUT ........

said by hottboiinnc:

Yes but putting that device on a computer can and most likely will cause more strain on the network due to pulling more data over it.

But the above is also true. So where is the tradeoff. If the ISP charges for tethering they get more money for expanding infrastructure to handle increased demand.
--
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»www.speedtest.net/wave/afe201cb84d45c88


asdfdfdfdfdf

@myvzw.com
reply to hottboiinnc

So what? I thought we were moving to pay per use where those who use more will be paying more to offset the costs of such additional strain.



mmay149q
Premium
join:2009-03-05
Dallas, TX
kudos:48
reply to jjeffeory

said by jjeffeory:

I can tell you the answer. We do without. Screw us! You want to participate in modern society? Too bad. Pay up or shut up!

Sucks, huh?

Not really, if we unite as a nation and all decide to drop our phones I'm pretty sure the carriers will change their tune when all their customers leave, honestly, investors can't keep a company afloat if they aren't getting return on investment.

Matt
--
I am no longer an AT&T Employee. Check out my kudos! »/profile/1626573
Have U-verse questions? Please email uversecare@att.com and they will assist you!!

elray

join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·EarthLink
reply to joako

said by joako:

said by slckusr:

said by flycuban:

I guess verizon feels that they own your device that YOU paid for.

Its not just Verizon, Motorola also likes to keep things locked up (bootloaders). This stuff wont change and there arent enough people to get loud enough to make them care.

At least Verizon has an excuse to lock some things down (tethering does use spectrum, which cost money).

Tethering doesn't use spectrum. It allows the transfer of data between your phone and computer.

With all the carriers going to metered per-MB plans, it's not relevant. If you pay for 2GB of data, it is the same resources for the carrier if you use the data on your phone, on your tethered computer, or on your ass for that matter.

Tethering using more data than accessing the internet on your phone, so the carriers will make more revenue if more users tether.

That's only true if the tetherers buy larger buckets, or pay overages. Tetherers watching the meter WILL use more spectrum, but the carrier will not make additional revenue unless they exceed their quota; by charging the tethering surcharge up front, the carrier makes up for the revenue loss without having to resort to an overage charge.

Bucket plans aren't sold on the basis of every user achieving 100% utilization. Not by a long shot.

If you want to argue that "all bits are equal" and enforce same in the contract, then you'll find bits priced for peak-access, and your "up to 2GB" plan will become an "up to 1GB" plan for the same price, and in place of overages, you'll just pay for each additional GB at the base rate.

AT&T demonstrated how little spectrum is available for data with its iPhone fiasco - and with "smart" phone subscriptions and data volumes expecting to skyrocket, the carriers are scrambling to both accomodate the demand for the functionality, while pricing data within reach of Mom's family plan, and schooling 100 million subscribers on how to conserve, in order to fit everyone within the narrow bandwidth that's available. That means clamping down on casual tethering. Sorry.