dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
69110
share rss forum feed


SimplePanda
Go Habs Go
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to static416

Re: Rogers Upstream Bonding

said by static416:

said by wysiwyg1972:

There's more to the internet than just P2P.

Oh I completely agree. I incrementally backup my 350GB photo library to an offsite location using VPN and a filesync program. I also back it up to a cloud service, and both would benefit from faster upload. Watch movies while I travel on my 3G iPad that are streamed on the fly from my home computer. All these would benefit from a better upload.

Thing is bittorrent and P2P are useful for a lot of purposes other than just the obvious (piracy). Wuala lets you get credits for cloud storage in exchange for contributing storage via P2P. Lots of indie music and movies are legitimately distributed via P2P. »sites.google.com/site/sxswtorrent/
»vodo.net/

But right now, because P2P is effectively killed on Rogers, they basically preventing a huge portion of the population from taking advantage of the benefits of distributed file sharing. And until P2P is protected on all ISPs, legitimate companies are going to be hesitant to rely on it for their business.

I disagree with this just a touch.

Rogers doesn't block P2P. They block specific protocols that happen to implement P2P. Indeed, P2P itself isn't a protocol or technology, just the name we give to protocols and technology that works a certain way.

There are many ways to implement distributed storage / exchange systems that Rogers doesn't block harm with their throttling and there are a lot of commercial entities who rely on P2P tech.

Skype being a major one that I can think of...

That said, Rogers upload speeds are pretty much a joke now. 2Mbps on a 50 (100Mbps bursting connection)? Just laughable. With TekSavvy offering 7Mbps uploads now Rogers has a very, very short amount of time to get my Ultimate connection working faster than 2Mbps upload before i jump ship.


Napalm

@rogers.com
reply to static416

said by static416:

So, wait, if Rogers increases upload speeds significantly, say to 25/10 or even 25/5, won't that kind of destroy their rationale for throttling the upload on P2P?

Well when you're "downloading" something it's not only the download going on but also your computer will continuously send acknowledgements and other traffic management packets upstream to the server it downloads from.

Now if you increase a lot the "downstream" bandwidth without touching the upstream one, you can get the situation where you can't practically attain the max download speed because your computer cannot keep up with sending acknowledgements fast enough.

So you have to increase the "upstream" too to a certain down/up ratio that will allow you to reach the enhanced downstream bandwidth potential.

This has nothing to do with p2p, it's valid for most kinds of traffic.

Nap.


SimplePanda
Go Habs Go
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

Also, Rogers hates P2P I think less for the bandwidth involved but more for the absurdly high number of connections that a Torrent client creates. As I recall DOCSIS CMTS gear pre-3.0 had a lot of trouble with rapid/high volume connection opening/closing.

Also, purely from a peering perspective having more upload traffic is better for Rogers as peering generally involves ratio trading.


Zachary1

join:2011-02-23
Oshawa, ON
reply to Sanek

Currently have 2 channels for my upstream (Both lights on my modem are blue) I live in oshawa btw :P


nhs ice

join:2006-08-16
Toronto, ON
reply to Sanek

I am here at Toronto with intersection of Sumach & Gerrard st. I am still seeing only one channel on the upstream. Hey Zachary, may I ask is there any improvement on your upload speed, like faster speed?


Sanek

join:2006-08-10
Kanata, ON

said by nhs ice:

I am here at Toronto with intersection of Sumach & Gerrard st. I am still seeing only one channel on the upstream. Hey Zachary, may I ask is there any improvement on your upload speed, like faster speed?

Should not be any improvement - this is limited by the profile. If he could not achieve the promised max before, he might be able to now though.


nitzguy
Premium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON

said by Sanek:

said by nhs ice:

I am here at Toronto with intersection of Sumach & Gerrard st. I am still seeing only one channel on the upstream. Hey Zachary, may I ask is there any improvement on your upload speed, like faster speed?

Should not be any improvement - this is limited by the profile. If he could not achieve the promised max before, he might be able to now though.

Can you still run a program like docsdiag?...used to be able to back in the day to see what the profiles are actually set at and all the other goodies...I haven't had cable in about 6 years now though so I'm out of the loop when it comes to that.

But you won't see a faster upload, more like a balance to the current upload if there is congestion in the area.

Bonding is good but...you will hit a theoretical max on cable...


HiVolt
Premium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:21

Rogers blocks SNMP access from customer side... So you cant run any diag tools that rely on SNMP.
--
BUCK FELL. From UBB to AVP. Same wolf in sheep's clothing.



Frankgg

@cgitmsmdc.ca

I just got this e-mail from Rogers

Dear XXXXX,

RE: Your Rogers account XXX-XXXXXXXXXXX

We're pleased to inform you that we're upgrading your Rogers Hi-Speed Internet upload speed at absolutely no additional charge so you can send emails and share photos 700% faster than before!

Best of all, you don't have to do a thing - your Rogers Hi-Speed Extreme Plus Package will be automatically upgraded on August 26, 2011 to a faster upload speed of up to 7Mbps1 (currently up to 1Mbps).

All other aspects of your Rogers service(s) remain the same.

Enjoy your service upgrade and thank you for choosing Rogers for your high speed internet needs.

HOW MUCH ARE YOU USING?
Check & track your internet usage at rogers.com/keepingpace




Contact Us | Privacy Policy | rogers.com

1 Speeds may vary with internet traffic, server gateway/router, computer (quality, location in the home, software and applications installed), home wiring, home network or other factors. Also see the Acceptable Use Policy at rogers.com/keepingpace. Modem set-up: the system is configured to maximum modem capabilities within Rogers own network.

Rogers One Mount Pleasant Road - 10 P Toronto ON M4Y 2Y5



SimplePanda
Go Habs Go
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

1 edit

CONFIRMED!

- You may need the Cisco device to take advantage of faster upload speeds. I assume the 4 channel capable SMC is also possible but the tech I spoke to was under the impression that "only the new device would work which is why we're rolling it out now". Grain of salt here.

- Extreme plus is going to 7Mbps. Ultimate is going to 10Mbps.

- This will all happen on the 26th of August.

All of the numbers and info above was provided by the tech directly with no prompting so this looks pretty official.

Happy day!


nhs ice

join:2006-08-16
Toronto, ON

Hey Panda,

I have not receive any mail or never got a mail from Robbers before for upgrading or account changes confirmation. Is this a 100% thing that it will happen?

For the modem, are you sure that smc is not or not up too to technical to handle upstream bonding better than the new cisco? If your information is correct, I may need to call robbers' store to find out about the modem in-stock. This is a good new for all of us.


the cerberus

join:2007-10-16
Richmond Hill, ON
reply to SimplePanda

Wow, I was expecting 2 or 4, 7mbps upload sounds great.
Now they are competing.



SimplePanda
Go Habs Go
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

1 edit
reply to nhs ice

I haven't received any information by notification either. I just prodded a tech for information. Put me on hold for 2 minutes and came back and said (paraphrased):

"Yes, as you are in Ontario you will get upgraded on August 26th, which is this Friday. You have the Cisco modem, which you need in order to get the upgrade. Because you have Ultimate you'll be getting upgraded to 10Mbps upload speeds instead of 7Mbps."

I asked a bunch of questions and confirmed that Extreme+ is going to receive 7Mbps but I didn't get information about any tiers below E+.

I asked if I -needed- the Cisco and if the SMC device would work instead and was told "you need the Cisco but don't worry because you already have it". I suspect this was a misunderstanding on tech's part though.

I personally suspect that the SMC works fine as it handles 4x upstream channels. If Saturday arrives you don't have faster upload speeds you can call to check though.



SimplePanda
Go Habs Go
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
reply to the cerberus

Also it goes without saying that TPIA is probably going to have to wait a while.


Sanek

join:2006-08-10
Kanata, ON
reply to SimplePanda

said by SimplePanda:

I haven't received any information by notification either. I just prodded a tech for information. Put me on hold for 2 minutes and came back and said (paraphrased):

"Yes, as you are in Ontario you will get upgraded on August 26th, which is this Friday. You have the Cisco modem, which you need in order to get the upgrade. Because you have Ultimate you'll be getting upgraded to 10Mbps upload speeds instead of 7Mbps."

I asked a bunch of questions and confirmed that Extreme+ is going to receive 7Mbps but I didn't get information about any tiers below E+.

I asked if I -needed- the Cisco and if the SMC device would work instead and was told "you need the Cisco but don't worry because you already have it". I suspect this was a misunderstanding on tech's part though.

I personally suspect that the SMC works fine as it handles 4x upstream channels. If Saturday arrives you don't have faster upload speeds you can call to check though.

Well I suspect they will start with GTA as always, but I have not even heard anyone else mention anything about this. I have 2 connections myself - a Rogers one and a TSI one (both cable), so I guess I'll see if anything happens on the 26th.


SimplePanda
Go Habs Go
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
reply to Sanek

To be fair you guys got LTE before Toronto (for some reason).

So tit for tat. hehe


Sanek

join:2006-08-10
Kanata, ON

said by SimplePanda:

To be fair you guys got LTE before Toronto (for some reason).

So tit for tat. hehe

I'd still like some additional confirmation if they are indeed doing these speed upgrades. I don't really trust a single Rogers CSR and considering that this pretty much popped out of nowhere, I'm still a bit skeptical.

I know Rogers were testing Upstream Bonding in some areas, but they started that relatively recently and they were only using 2 upstream channels (I have a feeling they would probably want to use all 4 channels for upstream for 10Mbit...).


SimplePanda
Go Habs Go
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

The date quoted here was "August 26th at 7Mbps". A Rogers tech I talked to checked and came back and quoted "August 26th at 7Mbps" and added "10Mbps for Ultimate". I never mentioned a date to her and she offered it unprompted along with the additional speed bump for ultimate.

Rogers techs generally don't have information that specific when they're just guessing and or parroting you to get you off the phone...

So I'm thinking/hoping that this is accurate.


ubi21

join:2005-07-07
Thornhill
reply to Sanek

Email confirmation or not, you can always just power cycle your modem on the 26th and see if you get a new profile.

On a side note, my area in Thornhill channel bonded early last week. Connection wasn't that stable initially but seems to be solid so far this week. It will be interesting to see if anything happens on the 26th.


resa1983
Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:10

Anything for Extreme, or is it just Extreme Plus & Ultimate getting the boost?



HiVolt
Premium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:21
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
·TekSavvy Cable

said by resa1983:

Anything for Extreme, or is it just Extreme Plus & Ultimate getting the boost?

Probably just E+ & Ultimate, so they dont have to give it to TPIA since those tiers are still not offered.
--
BUCK FELL. From UBB to AVP. Same wolf in sheep's clothing.

resa1983
Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:10

Technically Rogers should be offering it now, per the interim decision handed out a week or so ago?

But yeah, the prices for the new tiers are just too high to be able to make money off of. :\


nhs ice

join:2006-08-16
Toronto, ON
reply to SimplePanda

"I never mentioned a date to her and she offered it unprompted along with the additional speed bump for ultimate". Is that the 75mb/s people are talking about or it is an additional speed bump in the download over 75mb/s?



nitzguy
Premium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON
reply to Sanek

If you guys think you're going to get 10mb/s upload sustained...you're going to be sadly mistaken . You might get bursts of it but I hope I'm mistaken. It seems very sketchy given the spec and currently with 2 channel bonding I just can't see them going to 10 on a consistent basis...3 or 5 maybe...but not 10...

...While the OP indicates there is room for 11 upstream channels, this is further from the truth. We'd all like to think that 5-42mhz is available for Cable services, but sadly it is not.

We have this little thing called Video on Demand...you wonder how they do that? They've allocated upstream channels for the STBs to talk to the Headends.... Also typically while the spec calls for 5-42mhz, typically again anything under 20mhz is not used, its just too noisy to be able to carry anything useful. So, after you leave VOD their room, you have typically between 26 and about 40mhz...so about 4 channels of space available (14mhz @ 3.2mhz spacing...about 12.8mhz)...

This is probably cable's greatest weakness...it can push all the DL it wants, but UL speeds are going to be constrained unless node sizes become extremely tiny (50 modems per node or probably 150 homes passed which sounds really expensive on paper) + TPIA on top of it?...I guess we'll see what happens on the 26th but I'm skeptical.



BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
reply to Sanek

I wonder if they will beat Bells pricing during the launch period, I could see a few Fibe Internet customers (especially those on crappy IKNS remotes) jumping over in a New York minute



HiVolt
Premium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:21
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
·TekSavvy Cable

said by BliZZardX:

I wonder if they will beat Bells pricing during the launch period, I could see a few Fibe Internet customers (especially those on crappy IKNS remotes) jumping over in a New York minute

Especially with Rogers offering higher usage caps.
--
BUCK FELL. From UBB to AVP. Same wolf in sheep's clothing.


sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
Ottawa
kudos:13
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·WIND Mobile
reply to nitzguy

Nitzguy has absolutely nailed it ... there are only about 4 upstream channels available and given Rogers throttling the upstream to slow upstream usage, and the fact that Rogers has been very reluctant to increase upstream speeds on a single channel above 1 Mbps, I would be extremely surprised to see sustainable speeds across 4 channels bonded in excess of about 6Mbps. The only real advantage the 3 additional bonded channels is the lack of contrtol traffic which will allow them to deliver greater than 4Mbps sustained.


Xuhum
Premium
join:2007-10-05
Canada
reply to Sanek

Does anyone know if it would make a difference or perhaps help to sustain faster upload speeds if Rogers switched all their QPSK & 16QAM (10.24 Mbits/sec per/ch) Upload Modulation to 32-QAM, or 64QAM (30.72 Mbits/sec per/ch)?



GI Suck
I Got Mail Yay

join:2004-01-14
Oshawa, ON
reply to Sanek

I rebooted my modem last night and didn't get channel bonding on the upstream. I'm in North Oshawa. Does that mean I'm SOL? I also didn't get an email informing me of an upgrade.



Joe6354

@rogers.com
reply to Sanek

I call BS on this... only one person got the email? Talking to reps doesn't count. The fact is that only one person has received an official notice in writing from rogers.