dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
7329
share rss forum feed

dyhrdmet

join:2008-10-25
Springfield, NJ
reply to JCO65

Re: Local Sports Blackouts

said by JCO65:

He should be able to see a non exclusive Flyers game on Both channels, although it most likely Versus's feed would be a simulcast from the CSN Philly feed.

you'd have to hope there isn't a loophole or flaw in the rules that dictates that both feeds get blacked out instead of neither. and you're probably right that the non-exclusive broadcast would be CSN Philly.

JCO65

join:2010-01-15
Brick, NJ
kudos:1
Give you an example about what happened last year, Versus aired a few non exclusive Rangers games. They picked up the MSG feed and that feed was shown both on Versus and MSG locally with NO blackout on either channel. This was for regular season gams.


gar187er
I do this for a living

join:2006-06-24
Dover, DE
kudos:4
reply to dyhrdmet
nhl blackout areas need to looked at...corporate is looking at ours, because when the caps pens game was on versus (national), it was blacked out because the blackout areas have my area (dover, DE) as a washington market, however we get CSN philly.....so i couldnt watch it on tv, or online through gamecenter live.....

i have someone looking into it, cause ill be damned if i miss the rest of that series when they air on national.....
--
I'm better than you!

dyhrdmet

join:2008-10-25
Springfield, NJ
there's actually a lot of gray areas in each of the leagues' blackout policies (nba, nhl, and mlb; probably mls too). i can see Dover, DE as being connected to both Baltimore and Philly, and Baltimore is in the same RSN market as Washington, DC, so by proxy, you're in Caps territory and Flyers territory, even if Comcast doesn't recognize it by not making both CSN Philly and CSN DC available to you. maybe that connection is a stretch.

or, you hit one of those issues that i hit when i started this thread where I was clearly outside the Philly market, yet was being blacked out of Philly games on the national networks.

more power to you if you could get anyone to look at it.


gar187er
I do this for a living

join:2006-06-24
Dover, DE
kudos:4
already do have people looking into it

the way i see it if we have csn philly, we are a philly sports market...period.....hopefully the powers to be see it that way too...
--
I'm better than you!

dyhrdmet

join:2008-10-25
Springfield, NJ
well, you need to consider that some MSOs are giving cusotmers out of market RSNs (and the sattelite providers have all of them), so that's not quite a rule. if you get CSN Philly without blackouts on that channel, then you're in the Philly market, but the opposite isn't always true. Same with CSN DC. but I agree that Delaware is at least Philly and Baltimore, if not Philly, Baltimore, and Washington.


Matt B

@208.89.140.x
reply to dyhrdmet
So it happened again on Saturday for the Flyers vs Kings game. CSN Philly was blacked out again, but there was no game on Versus. There was the Penguins game on ROOT though. So does this mean that whenever the Pens play on ROOT I'm not going to see the Flyers game either?...thank god for the free NHL center ice preview. At least I'll be able to see the games until that runs our (OCt. 23rd I think)

dyhrdmet

join:2008-10-25
Springfield, NJ
if you're seeing the Flyers on Center Ice and not on CSN, then your local Comcast thinks that you're outside Flyers territory (right or wrong, i don't know).

The Q

join:2008-06-26
Collegeville, PA
reply to Matt B
The way the NHL blackout rules are written, carriage or non-carriage of a RSN (regional sports network) or the game in question unfortunately does not necessarily matter.

The fact that you are in the team's territory (or multiple team territory) is what matters and that the game "could possibly" be available to you on a RSN or local station is more important that you actually having access to said game.

It's done to protect the rights holders and "encourage" the cable company to carry the local station or cable network that actually has the game.

Fans lose in this scenario.


gar187er
I do this for a living

join:2006-06-24
Dover, DE
kudos:4
if that were the case i would have access to that teams broadcast, but i dont....

we are a philly market...period....not a washington....we carry ZERO washington stations....nothing....our nbc/cbs affiliates are all philly...

i can see if maybe we had a a single washingotn station....but we dont....

matt at least has 2 local carriers...i only have 1....
--
I'm better than you!

Mike H

join:2011-10-17
reply to The Q
I am also from State College and would like to watch the Flyer's games. Are you basically saying that there is no way to tell if a game will be available or not? (And it seems like so far they won't be?) Wanted to watch more games than just the nationally televised ones


happyman

@comcast.net
reply to dyhrdmet
i have direct tv and all my flyers games get blacked out. but i have comcast internet and phone and cant watch the flyers on the computer why is that???

The Q

join:2008-06-26
Collegeville, PA
reply to Mike H
Below I found on In Demand's web site about NHL Center Ice but basically sums up the issue:

»www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=26371

Third paragraph. State College I imagine is in the Flyers and Penguins territory (at least).

WHY ARE THERE BLACKOUTS?
Blackout restrictions exist to protect the local telecasters of each NHL game in the local markets of the teams. Keep in mind that blackout policies and restrictions are different for every sports package that your system may carry. (NHL CENTER ICE is designed for the NHL fan who wants to see NHL games in addition to those which involve the team(s) in their local markets).

If you are located in a team's television territory, check your local listings for all locally televised games. NHL CENTER ICE is not able to televise these games.

If you are located in a team's television territory and their local regional sports network is not available on your current cable or satellite provider, you will not be able to see these games in NHL CENTER ICE. This is a distribution issue between the regional sports network and the cable/satellite provider. The blackout remains intact as the local regional sports network has the rights to these games in your area.

Blackouts are not based on arena sell-outs.


Matt B

@comcast.net
reply to dyhrdmet
So apparently it doesn't matter whether there is any other game on or not. Looks like they all are going to be blacked out. Tonight's game is blacked out and there are no other games on any channels. No game on Versus, no Penguins game on Root and nothing on NHL Network. What is the point of Comcast carrying the channel here in State College if they are not going to show the games? Not a great way to retain fans!!

JCO65

join:2010-01-15
Brick, NJ
kudos:1
reply to dyhrdmet
If the State College area had the Flyers games on in their area last year and not now, I may have one possible explanation. In previous years the NHL Center Ice package was able to offer first and second round playoff games. That was their key advertising point in addition to the 40 out of markets games.

Now that NBC/Comcast will air ALL playoff games on its networks over the next 10 years, I believe the NHL changed it's policy regarding protection of primary markets. In the State College area, primary market is Pittsburgh[ROOT and Penquins] have to be protected above Philadelphia channels[CSN and Flyers].


heat84
Bit Torrent Apologist

join:2004-03-11
Fort Lauderdale, FL
reply to QLR
said by QLR:

Thanks for some insight into this. I definitely think MLB needs to fix this. I tried to watch some Braves on ESPN3 and MLB.tv and I keep running into the above issue. Iam in Tallahassee, which is somehow Braves territory, and SportSouth isnt available. And its rights holder, Comcast, shows the feed that excludes the Braves. Just terrible all the way around.

You can bypass the ESPN3 blackout with a proxy server or Tor.
--
Bit Torrent is my DVR.

JCO65

join:2010-01-15
Brick, NJ
kudos:1

1 edit
reply to dyhrdmet
Smart move by Comcast and NHL Network. As in the past when Comcast had to black out a local teams game, now instead of the blackout NHL Net is just switched to the Canadian feed, where it is just updates and live look instead of just a blackout. Noticed that during the Rangers telecast last Thursday night. Nice alternative.

dyhrdmet

join:2008-10-25
Springfield, NJ
that's probably NHL Network's doing instead of Comcast, but nice just the same. any programming is better than a black screen. at least NHL Network has that as alternate programming - Versus has poker reruns and things like that.

Os

join:2011-01-26
US
Reviews:
·Comcast
reply to gar187er
I don't know if it applies to hockey, but for MLB, all of Delaware (including Wilmington) is considered to be in the Baltimore/Washington market, and Orioles and Nationals games air live on MASN/MASN2.

I would think it is largely similar for at least Kent and Sussex counties in Delaware.

Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:1
reply to dyhrdmet
when there is a grey area the CATV provider should just ignore the blackout.

While I am not a sports fan I think the blackout should be made illegal nationwide. sports blackouts exist for the sole purpose of screwing the fans.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports

dyhrdmet

join:2008-10-25
Springfield, NJ

1 recommendation

the basic idea of the blackouts is simple. your local channel has the right to make you watch their coverage (and usually you want to) instead of losing you to a national channel airing the same game (though the NBA doesn't have blackouts). protect the local carrier because the national coverage is for out-of-market viewers. makes sense.

but in practice, it doesn't work well because I don't think there's a rule that the Regional Sports Network has to be carried within its immediate footprint of its teams, let alone the extended footprints that match up to the territory claimed by those teams that drive the blackout map.

Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:1
actually the type of blackout I want to see banned is the ones where if the game is not a sellout the league reserves the right to prevent any broadcast in the local market. network or cable.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports

dyhrdmet

join:2008-10-25
Springfield, NJ
said by Kearnstd:

actually the type of blackout I want to see banned is the ones where if the game is not a sellout the league reserves the right to prevent any broadcast in the local market. network or cable.

oh, that stupid NFL blackout rule? I think only the NFL has the power to get away with it. With such a vast amount of money involved in NFL TV rights, it's almost somewhat ironic that they won't let you watch a home game on TV if there's still seats available at the stadium.

JCO65

join:2010-01-15
Brick, NJ
kudos:1
reply to dyhrdmet
This did not happen before the HD upgrades. Previously, NHL Network was just blacked out with NO programming. NHL Net did the same Canadian feed again last night instead of Rangers-Habs game. Might actually be a Comcast move now that entire Freedom region is finished with analaog cuts and HD additions[effective this coming Tuesday with Monmouth upgrades].

Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:1
reply to dyhrdmet
does C-Band still work for pulling down channels or has that been all closed up?

Because I think if I owned a bar and suffered blackouts id get a C-Band on the roof and just aim it at a different bird and show the game. because afaik no law or contract agreement between the NFL and a broadcaster says someone cant point their dish at a different bird in orbit.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports

Joe12345678

join:2003-07-22
Des Plaines, IL
I don't think it's free to air


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
reply to dyhrdmet
said by dyhrdmet:

said by Kearnstd:

actually the type of blackout I want to see banned is the ones where if the game is not a sellout the league reserves the right to prevent any broadcast in the local market. network or cable.

oh, that stupid NFL blackout rule? I think only the NFL has the power to get away with it. With such a vast amount of money involved in NFL TV rights, it's almost somewhat ironic that they won't let you watch a home game on TV if there's still seats available at the stadium.

Well, not to get your hopes up too much, but the FCC has just asked for public comment on whether it should eliminate the rule that requires these blackouts for cable and satellite operators:

FCC Asks For Comment On Sports Blackout Rule
MediaDailyNews - Friday, Jan. 13, 2012
»www.mediapost.com/publications/a···ule.html

"The FCC took a step that could impact the NFL and other leagues' policies of blacking out games in local markets - at least on paper. The FCC asked for public comment on whether it should eliminate a rule requiring cable and satellite operators to honor the blackouts that local stations abide by.

Five consumer groups, including the Sports Fans Coalition and Media Access Project, have asked the FCC to consider eliminating the rule, which mostly would affect the NFL, but apply to other leagues.

In the end, even if the FCC drops the rule, its unlikely to have much impact for viewers.

The NFL blacks out games in local markets if all general-admission tickets are not sold out 72 hours before kickoff. (The rule does not apply to suites and club seats.) Sixteen NFL games were blacked out this year, down from 26 last season. Blackout policies at Major League Baseball, NHL and the NBA do not involve attendance, but broadcast rights.

Regardless of what happens with the FCC move, comments are due by Feb. 13. Any policy change would not affect NFL blackouts on local broadcast stations.

Cable or satellite operators that want to carry games would have to go through a difficult process of getting the signal some other way."

Joe12345678

join:2003-07-22
Des Plaines, IL
What about league rules? now I can see this as being if you buy NFL Sunday ticket, MLB EI, NBA League pass or NHL center ice you will get all games and all feeds on the system.

Let's say you like one team and you want there broadcast even when they play the local team you should have that right.

Also people MLB EI should be able to get the all the FOX games.


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15

2 edits
Some recent articles on the possible elimination of the sports blackout rule, with the NFL's and NAB's responses:

FCC urged to end sports blackout rule
Associated Press - February 13, 2012
»hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/···=DEFAULT

NFL Says Sports Blackout Protects Broadcasters, Fan Experience
Key to promoting fan attendance, which in turn is key to the fan experience both in the stadium and on TV
Broadcasting & Cable - February 13, 2012
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···ence.php

NAB Favors Blackout Rules, 5 Senators Oppose Them
MediaDailyNews - February 14, 2012
»www.mediapost.com/publications/a···hem.html


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
Latest news on the possible elimination of the sports blackout rule:

Sports Fan Coalition: Ending FCC Blackout Rule Probably Won't End Blackouts
Answers arguments from NFL that if the government policy were lifted, cable ops could circumvent it
Broadcasting & Cable - February 28, 2012
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···outs.php

"The issue is essentially in the bottom of the first inning. The FCC is currently seeking comment on whether or not to open a proceeding at all. Once it does, there will be more comment, and then the FCC is under no obligation to act. Some dockets in which rulemakings have been proposed remain open for months and even years without action."