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sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

Vonage connection question

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Currently, I have my phone jack (connected to my telco) daisy chained to another phone jack, which is on the other side of the wall. Can I connect the Vonage adapter to this daisy chained phone jack, and have the connection work for the original phone jack? (See attached picture.)

PX Eliezer
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Yes, but:

1) You absolutely MUST disconnect the telco line at the network interface device (NID) whether or not the service is live. You should also leave a note in the NID box so that no one accidentally reconnects it.

2) If you have some type of alarm system hooked up on this circuit, problems will result because the alarm system will not be able to grab control in an emergency. That's a separate issue from the more general question of VoIP and alarms.

3) If the preceding points are addressed, you should be good to go.



sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

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Why would I have to disconnect it at the NID? This is simply two phone jacks daisy chained, with one of the two phone jacks eventually connected to the NID outside.

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said by sjvirchow:

Why would I have to disconnect it at the NID? This is simply two phone jacks daisy chained, with one of the two phone jacks eventually connected to the NID outside.

Because if any of the jacks are still connected to the NID, the Vonage "signal" is going to feed back out to the telco's line.

ALSO, the telco line can still be carrying voltage, even if your service is disconnected.

But since you seem skeptical....

If your intent is to totally disconnect from your local phone company, you need to isolate your inside wiring from the line (or lines, if there are more than one) feeding your home, that come from the telephone company central office (a telephone company line is sometimes referred to as a "PSTN line" - PSTN is an acronym for "Public Switched Telephone Network"). You need to disconnect the line even if it appears to be dead, because at some point the phone company could place voltage across that line for one reason or another, and that could damage your equipment, and even possibly start a fire! So here is how to isolate your inside wiring from the telephone company's line.

»michigantelephone.workbench.net/

Yes, you can connect Vonage to the NID (or more simply, disconnect your telco at the NID and connect Vonage to any wall plug). Most people advise you to disconnect the telco's incoming line (at the NID) and clearly mark it not to be reconnected until VOIP is disconnected.

»[Vonage] vonage and disconnecting nid

Signs inside the NID will prevent someone from accidentally replugging the telephone company wires into your household wires. Replugging the wires can damage your VoIP adapter and system.

»www.ehow.com/how_7462294_wire-vo···nes.html

AND FROM VONAGE:

Using your home telephone wiring for Vonage service requires that you totally disconnect the telephone wiring inside your home from the telephone company's outside wiring that comes to the house. This disconnection, however, is reversible.

»support.vonage.com/app/answers/d···_id/1069


sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

My NID has the option to switch the connection off (pulling a switch breaks the circuit between the jacks and the phone line drop.)

Could I just do that?


PX Eliezer
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said by sjvirchow:

My NID has the option to switch the connection off (pulling a switch breaks the circuit between the jacks and the phone line drop.)

Could I just do that?

Yes....

....but I would try to fix it in place w/ some electrical tape, and leave a note in the box as well.

The reason for that is if some telco repairperson or someone else accesses the box by mistake.


sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

Great, thanks for your help!



cork1958
Cork
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join:2000-02-26

reply to sjvirchow
As stated in PX Eliezer's post:

"You need to disconnect the line even if it appears to be dead, because at some point the phone company could place voltage across that line for one reason or another, and that could damage your equipment, and even possibly start a fire!"

I know someone who that exact thing happened to, if that's enough of a reason for you to disconnect it at the NID!!
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2 edits

reply to sjvirchow
Since the image you posted implies that you have a DSL connection, that does complicate things since you can't simply disconnect every connection to the NID.

With a DSL connecton, you will need a dedicated "homerun" connection from the NID to the DSL modem, but any other connections to the NID must be disconnected from the NID. The Vonage connection can then use the remaining in-house telco wiring.

If you still have voice service on the DSL line that you want to continue to use in addition to your Vonage service, that complicates things more. In that case, I will assume that the telco voice line that is shared with the DSL service is "line one". Keep the "line one" wire pairs connected to the NID (still connected to phone devices using DSL filters), but disconnect all "line two" wire pairs from the NID, and use "line two" in your home wiring for the Vonage service (this has nothing to do with line 1 or line 2 on the Vonage adapter). I have in the past had a telco POTS connection on a shared DSL line, and a Vonage connection sharing the in-house wiring as I just described, so it certainly can work. Just be sure that the telco and Vonage connections only share the same in-house cabling, not the same wire pairs.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.


PX Eliezer
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said by NetFixer:

With a DSL connection, you will need a dedicated "homerun" connection from the NID to the DSL modem, but any other connections to the NID must be disconnected from the NID. The Vonage connection can then use the remaining in-house telco wiring.

Thanks for the extensive info which of course is correct if he had DSL....!

But I would hope that he would have told us if that were the case....Wow.

---------------------------------

Lincoln, Nebraska has long been served by independent phone companies (the grand old Lincoln Telephone & Telegraph which after many changes is now part of Windstream). So perhaps their NID look different from what we are used to with the former Bell System areas or former GTE areas....


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said by PX Eliezer:

said by NetFixer:

With a DSL connection, you will need a dedicated "homerun" connection from the NID to the DSL modem, but any other connections to the NID must be disconnected from the NID. The Vonage connection can then use the remaining in-house telco wiring.

Thanks for the extensive info which of course is correct if he had DSL....!

But I would hope that he would have told us if that were the case....Wow.

---------------------------------

Lincoln, Nebraska has long been served by independent phone companies (the grand old Lincoln Telephone & Telegraph which after many changes is now part of Windstream). So perhaps their NID look different from what we are used to with the former Bell System areas or former GTE areas....

Actually, the OP did indirectly tell us that the connection is DSL. Here is a copy of the image that was posted by the OP of the connection:



Notice the box labeled "DSL Modem"?
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

PX Eliezer
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Mmmph.

How would the DSL modem make any sense where he has it in the scheme of things?

It makes no sense in regard to the NID or in regard to the Vonage adapter, as shown on his diagram.

Obviously you are right in saying that he has something there labelled DSL, but beyond that it's as mixed up as a Dali painting.



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said by PX Eliezer:

Mmmph.

How would the DSL modem make any sense where he has it in the scheme of things?

It makes no sense in regard to the NID or in regard to the Vonage adapter, as shown on his diagram.

Obviously you are right in saying that he has something there labelled DSL, but beyond that it's as mixed up as a Dali painting.

I think that the posted image was what the OP understood as what would be necessary, not what was actually currently in use. Hence my advice regarding how to proceed if the connection were actually DSL.

I have been physically involved in similar situations where a client would do a DIY VoIP install using DSL connections (as well as some involving a client doing a number port to a VoIP supplier for the telephone number assigned to a DSL connection, and suddenly finding that their DSL service was disconnected along with the voice service when the port went through).

Ohm's law is by no means intuitive to those without an engineering or physics background.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.


sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

1 edit

Many apologies, I should have mentioned that I am in the process of switching to Cable internet service, and dropping the DSL connection. I guess DSL was on my mind when picking the picture. I would also be dropping my landline, as Windstream wants $60 a month for it without DSL, and I would be porting my number to Vonage and using Vonage over the Time Warner cable internet connection.



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said by sjvirchow:

Many apologies, I should have mentioned that I am in the process of switching to Cable internet service, and dropping the DSL connection. I guess DSL was on my mind when picking the picture.

In that case, once you have made the transition, your task of using your home telco wiring to distribute the Vonage connection will be greatly simplified. Just disconnect all of the wiring from your NID to your house wiring and you should be good to go. The only "gotcha" I can think of would be if you have multiple cables wired in a radial pattern to your house wiring from the NID (instead of only one cable that is daisy chained to multiple phone jacks). In that case, you would just need to make sure that the disconnected wire pairs in the NID were properly spliced together in order for all in-house jacks to be active.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.


sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

said by NetFixer:

said by sjvirchow:

Many apologies, I should have mentioned that I am in the process of switching to Cable internet service, and dropping the DSL connection. I guess DSL was on my mind when picking the picture.

In that case, once you have made the transition, your task of using your home telco wiring to distribute the Vonage connection will be greatly simplified. Just disconnect all of the wiring from your NID to your house wiring and you should be good to go.

So then I could just plug the RJ11 from the Vonage adapter to the phone jack that's daisy chained to the main phone jack (after breaking the circuit between my house wiring and the telco's wiring at the NID) and it would work? Or would I actually have to wire an RJ11 from Vonage to my NID?


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said by sjvirchow:

So then I could just plug the RJ11 from the Vonage adapter to the phone jack that's daisy chained to the main phone jack (after breaking the circuit between my house wiring and the telco's wiring) and it would work? Or would I actually have to wire an RJ11 from Vonage to my NID?

Yes, just run a normal rj-11 telephone patch cord to the nearest phone jack. If you also needed a telephone connection in that room, you could just use an external duplex adapter to connect both the phone and the wall jack to the Vonage adapter.




--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.


sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

Click for full size
So It'd look like this?


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said by sjvirchow:

[image]
So It'd look like this?

Except for the specific equipment brands/models, it looks very similar to what I do.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.


sjvirchow

join:2010-04-29
Lincoln, NE

Great, thanks for your help!


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