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PaulGo

join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD

[DTA] Motorola's High Definition Digital Transport Adapter

Although this has not been announced by Comcast, Motorola has started production of an HD DTA which Comcast will probably pick up since the FCC is now allowing HD DTAs.

Motorola's High Definition Digital Transport Adapter (HD-DTA100u) is a low cost, customer premise device that allows broadcast digital signals to be decoded from MPEG-2 transport, then converted to an analog or HDMI signal intended for display on SD and HD capable devices and QAM integrated televisions. This allows subscribers to have the basic benefits of HD content in their home at no cost from over-the-air channels, as well as allow for a limited number of basic cable channels to be displayed in HD without the additional cost of an advanced STB.

Features:
Single 54 to 1002 MHz digital video tuner
Digital video (64 QAM/256QAM)
MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 digital standard definition and high definition video processor
Accelerated 2-D graphics
Integrated graphical user interface
On-screen diagnostics
External high-efficiency power supply
8MB Flash, 128MB Ram of memory

»www.motorola.com/staticfiles/Vid···2011.pdf


gar187er
I do this for a living

join:2006-06-24
Dover, DE
kudos:4
they have been working on that for some time now, bout a year or so....never saw a paper on it though....nice find
--
I'm better than you!


halfband
Premium
join:2002-06-01
Huntsville, AL
reply to PaulGo
Yeah, nice find.
They have actually list HD DTAs on our local rate card as an option for limited basic HD subscribers since early summer. Since they have not been available they provide a HD set top box programmed to only get the limited basic channels.
--
Registered Bandwidth Offender #40812


PaulGo

join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD
One problem with the HD DTA is that they do not have analog audio outputs. This is a problem if you have a set with a DVI (HDCP) input which requires a analog sound input.


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
There is this converter from SIIG (»www.siig.com/av-products/convert···dio.html) that can do the conversion, at a cost, but as the user comments on Amazon say, there can be HDCP issues:
»www.amazon.com/HDmi-Audio-Conver···015DTUJ8

Monoprice has some (cheaper) converters that convert HDMI to various analog video/audio formats (Component/VGA/Composite):
»www.monoprice.com/products/subde···id=10114


PaulGo

join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD

1 edit
I was looking art the Monoprice one that goes from HDMI to component. The other option is putting the RF channel 3 out into a VCR and using the audio from the VCR.
Whatever happened to providing backward comparability to DVI that was always supposed to be part of the standard. Hopefully Comcast will come up with a solution for the people who have DVI. I would think that a DVI set would be one of the most likely candidates for an HD DTA.

Also this would work and the price is pretty good since I also have a Blu-ray player hooked up to the TV.

»www.monoprice.com/products/produ···format=2


cypherstream
Premium,MVM
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
kudos:3
reply to PaulGo
The RF output is asking for trouble.

I'd hate to see people hook up with that and expect to see HD!


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
said by cypherstream:

The RF output is asking for trouble.

I'd hate to see people hook up with that and expect to see HD!

I believe PaulGo is only talking about using the RF output to get the (analog) audio signals, for the HD video he would use an HDMI-to-DVI adapter.


PaulGo

join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD
Correct. HDMI for HD and RF only to get sound.


Paolo
Mr. Wireless

join:2004-05-29
canada
this is suppost to be a "LOW COST" solution probaly the basic way to get Digital Cable. For someone who needs more intermediate or Advanced capabilities, why not just get the regular STB from your cable company? They cost roughly $40 bucks Canadian for sale, and they have a lot more outputs such as composite video, L/R, as well as the RF. if this is not compatible with your tv, then that is when you should be looking for the next STB up, hope this helps
--
Happiness is like peeing your pants... Everyone can see it, but only you can feel its Warmth!!


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
Unfortunately, in the U.S. we currently cannot buy our own STBs (at least for Comcast) like we can our cable modems. We must still rent them from Comcast.

The SD DTAs cost about $1.99/month, not sure what the HD-DTAs will rent for. STBs currently start at about $7.95 - $8.95 a month.


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
reply to PaulGo
What's interesting about the Motorola HD-DTA is that it shows having both IR and RF remote control (though it doesn't seem to have an input for the corded IR receiver - with RF remote controls, you don't need that).

Most of the new HD-DTAs seem to be using RF remote controls, like this one from Evolution: »www.evolutionbb.com/cable/assets···5.11.pdf


J Jefferson3

@comcast.net
reply to Paolo
Sorry Paolo, but we are 2 different countries with 2 different rules, so none of your information (From Canada)is going to help us here in the USA!!!

But for the USA the Dta's is becoming the Cheap Permanent Replacement box for all normal SD Programming, because it does not have the full encryption's schemes and is only an 1 way device and most people can install themselves, and we are no longer stocking any additional Motorola SD boxes either, just maintaining all the existing ones for the people who do want On-Demand programing!!!

On The HD side, the reason boxes are expensive is because, US Cable labs charges $150 a box just for certification alone (they charge this to everybody), because they are in charge of all those technical standards like seeing if you Cable Card will work and to make sure the HDMI signals work and to make sure stuff is encrypted when it should be and so on and so on)!!!!! and the HDMI connection is worth $150 dollars even for computers!! But though they cost a few bucks to manufacture since they are made in China, someone still needs to pay for it!!!

So to keep Cable costs down for the MSO's only (Sorry not for you) they are now making HD Dta's with the HDMI connection (Even with a discount being charged still $75 just for that part), and then just using Full HD boxes for everything else, because everything else is being controlled electronically could disable DVR and/or HD with a push of a few buttons with out requiring truck rolls which saves money!!!! Thus even the cheap people could still have access to certain services!!!

Also unlike Canada, we in the USA are really killing all types of analog services, we 1. all ready killed it in the form of the broadcasting stations from over the air,!! 2. killed most, if not all of analog on Comcast systems in the USA,!!! 3. As a side effect of HD, VCR and some DVD recorders are being slowing killed off because they only record in standard resolution of 480i!!! Also even the Video games systems have HDMI now, PS3, then XBOX 360, and even Nintendo gets the Message With the upcoming Wii U!!! 4. Even Blu-Ray Players are starting to remove the analog ports with the Component first then Composite!!

I do want you people to NOT wait until the last minute to get ready, but in case you did not know, analog is dying and soon to be DEAD!!!!
Digital is the future so start buying HDMI cables and Enternet Cables too because that is the ONLY way your ever going to see 1080p or soon to be even higher resolutions because Hollywood does not trust you people!!!

By the Way i should not be telling you this part but to further this point i have all ready been working with a test TV from a MAJOR manufacturer that does not even have the Composite Connections, that is NO Yellow, Red and White on the back on this TV!!Shocker!!! It still has Component, but that is to test the Video quality difference between Component and HDMI, and is to test technical difference between 720p and 1080p, first tv to not do any programming in 480 i or p!!! Personally it is beautiful every time i see it, But has loads of HDMI and USB connections!!!

(Of course it could be used right now for Testing those HD Dta's but of course i not giving that information away yet!!!!)

Sorry for the long post but there are A lot of NEW people coming here in the last few days even thought us, regular people know all this stuff all ready!!!!!!


PaulGo

join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD
Judging how well the HDMI works on the Motorola boxes I think the cable companies should gert a refund! If you put the HDMI through a receiver in a DCX box it loses its settings - on the DCX3400 it defaults to 720P and on the DCX3501 it defaults to 1080P.

Since you have a familiarity with HD DTAs will any of the ones Comcast is purchasing have an analog audio output so it can be used with TVs that have DVI inputs?


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
reply to cypherstream
said by cypherstream:

The RF output is asking for trouble.

I'd hate to see people hook up with that and expect to see HD!

and we both knwo that's definately going to occur


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
reply to Paolo
the cable providers really have no desire to support HD DTA equipment because they want you to use their digital set top boxes, and I fully support it.


Paolo
Mr. Wireless

join:2004-05-29
canada
Do they make regular SET TOP BOXES? just answer that question, forget about what I said about buying them? YES? ok so if you need seperate L/R analog outputs why not just get that one? problem solved.

The DTA's should be the BASIC BARE BONES, the STB's are the next one up, then the HD Box are next, then the HD PVR's are the top of the line. Follow that and you should be fine regardless if your cable company does not allow you to sell it.
--
Happiness is like peeing your pants... Everyone can see it, but only you can feel its Warmth!!


PaulGo

join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD
The cost in my area for an HD STB is $9.25 per month. Currently the cost of a standard definition DTA is free but should eventually go to $1.95 per month. The TV in question is in a guest bedroom so it is rarely used. Currently I am paying for fur HD boxes plus one DVR (at $16 per month). I will just probably go for the Monoprice switch-box when the HD DTA is available if Comcast does not offer an HD DTA with an analog audio output.


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
reply to J Jefferson3
so J. you sneaky sneaky boy, you've been holding out on us? kidding

anyway yeah its a matter of time till equipment no longer encorporates analog connections, like how new set top boxes no longer have an RF output. I've noticed that on HDTV's with 1920x1080 native resolution, there is an option to use "native" or "full pixel" mode when displaying 1080i/p video and I've noticed a big difference in the amount of screen real estate.

Joe12345678

join:2003-07-22
Des Plaines, IL
reply to PaulGo
4 HD boxes + a DRV wow you are better with directv where you can pay less rent and get better MRV.


cypherstream
Premium,MVM
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
kudos:3
reply to PaulGo
Well look at some of these specs. How is this not advanced? This is better than most of the set top boxes out there now!

Single 54 to 1002 MHz digital video tuner
(Most only go to 864 MHz)

MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 digital standard definition and high definition video processor
(Most only do MPEG-2)

Accelerated 2-D graphics
(They all do 2-D graphics... I don't know if what they have now could be called 'accelerated' though).

Integrated graphical user interface
(Yup have that today on full boxes)

On-screen diagnostics
(Again we have this today as well, this is a standard)

External high-efficiency power supply
(This is a good change to keep the box small)

8MB Flash, 128MB Ram of memory
(This is the same if not more memory than some of the original HD set top boxes. It's no DVR platform, but thats a decent amount of RAM. Some earlier SA boxes had 48 - 96 MB of RAM).

Also they said it can generate on screen graphics at 1280x720. That's a 720p HD-GUI... much better than what you have today. Some only do 960x540. Only the newest stuff do HD graphics... and not on Comcast. Were talking Verizon IMG 1.9, DirecTV's new HD-GUI which I've been running this since early beta tests for awhile. Also Dish Networks vip 922 DVR, Tivo Premier and Moxi.

This is a pretty decent box for just simple HDTV / NON-DVR. What is it missing?
Return path? Can it do SDV? IPTV? VOD? Probably not.
MoCA for MRV? Doesn't look like it.

But if you don't need any of that then this is a nice little HD DTA!


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
reply to J Jefferson3
hey dude you worry me sometimes because you always seem like your yelling and one spark away from nuclear meltdown.

GTFan

join:2004-12-03
reply to J Jefferson3
said by J Jefferson3 :

Sorry for the long post but there are A lot of NEW people coming here in the last few days even thought us, regular people know all this stuff all ready!!!!!!

What are you, 13? Can you please stop ending every sentence with multiple exclamation marks? It's called a period, please use it.

andyross
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-04
Schaumburg, IL
reply to Mike Wolf
said by Mike Wolf:

anyway yeah its a matter of time till equipment no longer encorporates analog connections, like how new set top boxes no longer have an RF output. I've noticed that on HDTV's with 1920x1080 native resolution, there is an option to use "native" or "full pixel" mode when displaying 1080i/p video and I've noticed a big difference in the amount of screen real estate.

The problem with going full-pixel for cable/broadcast is you often end up seeing garbage at the edges. In particular, you could end up seeing the CC signals (flickering lines) along the top of upconverted SD. Also, on mine, the top 2-3 lines are wrapped from the bottom when the box is on a 720p channel. My TV is set up to allow overscan for the box, but uses full-pixel for the BD player.

RF will certainly slowly disappear. I think in a year or two, new BD players cannot have ANY analog outputs (they already cannot do HD on component.)


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
yeah I've noticed the edge noise on the top of the screen but I very rarely see it, generally only during non HD commercials.


PGHammer

join:2003-06-09
Accokeek, MD
reply to cypherstream
However, it would be a nice option for FPTVs with HDMI (we actually have a 32" LCD FP with HDMI connected to a DTA in the breakfast nook - the HDMI-out would be preferred over RF).


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
reply to telcodad
said by telcodad:

What's interesting about the Motorola HD-DTA is that it shows having both IR and RF remote control (though it doesn't seem to have an input for the corded IR receiver - with RF remote controls, you don't need that).

Most of the new HD-DTAs seem to be using RF remote controls, like this one from Evolution: »www.evolutionbb.com/cable/assets···5.11.pdf

Here is a recent press release from ABI Research on the Fierce Telecom site on RF remote controls:

Bluetooth and ZigBee Set to Spur RF Remote Control Market to 217 Million Shipments by 2016
»www.fiercetelecom.com/press_rele···shipment


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
wouldnt bluetooth be best? i mean the ps3 uses it, as well as the tivo slide remote, as well as alot of other things, so wouldnt that be something to consider?


telcodad
Premium
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:15
It looks like the ZigBee RF4CE technology is targeted at low-cost, low-power applications like remote controls, as opposed to Bluetooth.

See: »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZigBee


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
you know whats annoying is the new platnium remotes that are used wtih the new set top boxes like the Cisco RNG200N control the DTA boxes from Pace and Technicolor.