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to Mike Wolf
Re: [DTA] Motorola's High Definition Digital Transport AdapterYes, I have the same issue using a Thomson (Technicolor) DCI105 DTA connected to a VCR in the same area as one of my Cisco RNG100 STBs.
I have to slide something over the DTA's cabled IR receiver "bug" to prevent the RNG's remote from accidentally changing the channel on the DTA while I have it set to record from.
The use of RF remotes should avoid this type of interference. |
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I tried black electrical tape to cover the IR port but surprisingly it didn't work and the signal still went through lol. I finally just hid the whole thing behind furniture and that was the end of the issue. Only use the DTA for one channel.
I don't think the RF remote thing would work if both the DTA's and cable boxes used that same frequency like they do for the IR remotes. I mean I would think the RF remote thing would be better suited for use with the better equipment like the set top cable boxes, because the DTA's are just a stop gap measure to pacify customers with only limited basic cable service and it would be silly to put all that technology into it. I think the money should be better spent making the set top cable boxes cheaper to rent and more plentiful. |
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to telcodad
As mentioned, going RF probably wouldn't help, and may make it worse. At with with IR, you can block it with a shade. The issue is, to make it simple for customers, all the boxes use the same ID codes. It seems as if going RF could be even worse unless there is a way to pair a remote with a specific box. Otherwise, someone in one room could control all the boxes in the entire house! |
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exactly what I was talking about, I mean at least with bluetooth it can be paired up, plus give a handy battery life indication. |
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to andyross
said by andyross:As mentioned, going RF probably wouldn't help, and may make it worse. At with with IR, you can block it with a shade. The issue is, to make it simple for customers, all the boxes use the same ID codes. It seems as if going RF could be even worse unless there is a way to pair a remote with a specific box. Otherwise, someone in one room could control all the boxes in the entire house!
I had the same concern when I first read about RF remotes, but apparently ZigBee/RF4CE uses a pairing system similar to Bluetooth according to this paper referenced in the Wikipedia article: » www.daintree.net/downloa ··· ntro.pdf |
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| telcodad |
to PaulGo
Well, looks like the Moto HD-DTA 100u unit may be making its debut soon, according to this article on the Light Reading Cable website last week: Comcast HD-DTAs Reach the FCC » www.lightreading.com/doc ··· lr_cable |
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KearnstdSpace Elf
Premium Member
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ |
to PaulGo
How many more cents would it cost for RF remotes to use something like a garage opener does? I mean you can have two garage doors with two openers from the same model and mfg and their remotes will never cross channels and open the wrong door.
(Not a rant but an actual technical question) |
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to telcodad
and yet other US cable co rent older SD boxes for $2-$3 MO.
Service Electric Cablevision even let's buy cable cards with no outlet or mirroring fees. |
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| Joe12345678 |
to J Jefferson3
the cable co's own Cable labs so it's more of a round about way of have control over the cable box market. Now the phone systems used to for you to rent the phone.
There have been alot of law suit over being forced to rent the cable box. But there may be some areas that no one has used in a law suit over that may open the door as well.
analog cable is on the way out on lot's of other systems all over the place. Other then small systems, Some small systems that are part of big cable systems, System with SDV still have more analog but even that is going away. |
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| Joe12345678 |
to Kearnstd
well the boxes will need RF as well + software to pear / pick a remote that is for that box. |
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it's still insane that the remotes for the Pace and Technocolor Thompson DTA's control the RNG boxes like the Cisco RNG200N |
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GTFan
join:2004-12-03
Austell, GA |
to telcodad
said by telcodad:Well, looks like the Moto HD-DTA 100u unit may be making its debut soon, according to this article on the Light Reading Cable website last week:
Comcast HD-DTAs Reach the FCC
»www.lightreading.com/doc ··· lr_cable
That's great news - sounds like they won't cost Comcast much more than the SD DTAs do today, so they should be cheap to rent. Should also allow Comcast to encrypt local QAMs in those markets where they want to get rid of traps or reduce theft. But we still don't know which channels they'll be allowed to decrypt, I guess we'll find out once someone gets one. |
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to Mike Wolf
said by Mike Wolf:it's still insane that the remotes for the Pace and Technocolor Thompson DTA's control the RNG boxes like the Cisco RNG200N It's because they are using the same codeset. It makes it easier for the companies to standardize on a remote. Very few people have more than one box in the same room. From what I've read, some of the newer boxes may use Bluetooth or similar that requires 'pairing' a remote with it's box. Hopefully, they'll still understand IR to allow the use of universal remotes. |
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Paul F
join:2009-05-15
Portland, OR |
Paul F
Member
2011-Dec-14 12:19 am
said by andyross:said by Mike Wolf:it's still insane that the remotes for the Pace and Technocolor Thompson DTA's control the RNG boxes like the Cisco RNG200N It's because they are using the same codeset. It makes it easier for the companies to standardize on a remote. Very few people have more than one box in the same room. From what I've read, some of the newer boxes may use Bluetooth or similar that requires 'pairing' a remote with it's box. Hopefully, they'll still understand IR to allow the use of universal remotes. Wow, that means your iPad/Tablet/Android could now be a universal remote. |
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said by Paul F:said by andyross:From what I've read, some of the newer boxes may use Bluetooth or similar that requires 'pairing' a remote with it's box. Hopefully, they'll still understand IR to allow the use of universal remotes.
Wow, that means your iPad/Tablet/Android could now be a universal remote. The spec sheet on the Moto HD-DTA100u (» www.motorola.com/staticf ··· 2011.pdf), and most of the other HD-DTAs I've seen, says it uses "RF4CE remote control." This is a low-cost, low-power, RF system that is similar but different from Bluetooth (» en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZigBee). However, the specs on the HD-DTA100u do say that it also has an "IR remote control sensor (XMP-1)," so that should also allow it to be controlled by IR universal remotes that support the XMP protocol. |
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jwhite4
join:2002-03-21
Philadelphia, PA |
to GTFan
said by GTFan:That's great news - sounds like they won't cost Comcast much more than the SD DTAs do today... Although to a degree the ship has sailed, it would be nice if they were low cost enough that it was the ONLY DTA Comcast needed to deploy. From a supportability perspective, I have to think having less variations in equipment (ie. phase out the SD STB's and DTA's) would make sense. Jeff |
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Russ6
join:2011-03-17
Houston, TX |
Russ6
Member
2011-Dec-21 1:17 am
Comcast's Xfinity Universal Digital Transport Adapter HD-DTA100u hits the FCCwireless goodness Published December 6, 2011 NOTE: Click the following link for the short article, picture and link to the FCC documents: » www.wirelessgoodness.com ··· dta100u/ |
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to jwhite4
I've said before that I would love more than anything to see Comcast start making HDTV "standard", in other words, your "included with your cable TV subscription" STBs would have HDMI ports, and they'd work. Not feeling the need to pay extra for HDTV, we have a DTA hidden behind our bedroom wall-mount TV, the TV tuned to NTSC 3. I have feared that, should we ever want HDTV on that TV, I'd have to put a STB in a closet, fish 25' of HDMI cable, and use a wired IR extender to control the stupid thing. This Motorola HD DTA is small enough to fit in the recessed media box (» www.datacommelectronics. ··· edia-Box) hidden behind the TV, just like the SD DTA we have now. That would be awesome. The only catch is that the pictures of this Motorola HD DTA show it not having an IR input port, like our Pace does. If this turns out to be the case, I'd have to buy an IR extender to put a little sticky eye on the front of the TV, but that would still be easier than room-to-room IR.  PS--If your STB's output is HDMI only and you want to connect it to a pre-DVI TV, all you need is this: » www.startech.com/AV/Conv ··· HDMI2DVI...and if your TV's DVI audio inputs are analog-only, add on this: » www.monoprice.com/produc ··· format=2A bit pricey, but a good deal cheaper than replacing the TV, especially if it's a large-screen TV. |
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 PaulGo
join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD |
PaulGo
Member
2011-Dec-21 10:07 pm
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to mahohmei1
Lots of luck to you and I feel your pain having to watch SD on a nice flat screen HDTV. |
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to mahohmei1
said by mahohmei1:The only catch is that the pictures of this Motorola HD DTA show it not having an IR input port, like our Pace does. If this turns out to be the case, I'd have to buy an IR extender to put a little sticky eye on the front of the TV, but that would still be easier than room-to-room IR.
Yes, looking at the data sheet for the Motorola HD-DTA ( » www.motorola.com/staticf ··· 2011.pdf ), while it says it has a front panel IR remote sensor, there does not appear to be an input for a wired IR sensor. However, it says it is also capable of RF remote control (RF4CE), so the RF signals should be able to get into that hidden media box. The data sheet indicates that IR remote control is the "default mode" for the HD-DTA, so it sounds like there is some way to change it to use the RF mode. However, it's not clear that once it is set to use the RF mode (for controlling the HD-DTA box), the remote would still use the IR mode to control the few TV set items that the current DTA remotes do (Power, Volume and Mute). |
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 ·PenTeleData
ARRIS SB8200
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The DirecTV remotes can do both RF and IR. How it works is you go into a menu and select it to do RF. The receiver has a 2 way IR sensor on it that talks back to the remote and says "hey remote, switch to RF mode". It also programs the remote to operate other equipment this way too. There's a menu and you select your device (like TV) then you select the manufacturer (say Samsung for instance) and it will program the remote. If it doesn't work you can search by model number. It's great because there's no codes to remember or look up. Maybe the Motorola DTA will work the same? Keep in mind RF remotes are much more sensitive. If you bump the dang thing under the blanket, you might change the channel or something. They don't have to see the box so yes they work perfectly under blankets and such.. both on purpose and by accident  |
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According to this press release issued today by GreenPeak Technologies ( » www.businesswire.com/new ··· Controls ), the new RF remotes that Comcast will be using will also have an IR mode to be able to control existing TVs: "The Comcast RF remote control uses GreenPeak ZigBee RF4CE communication controller chips and is a hybrid RF/IR solution that supports both legacy infrared (IR) equipment as well as new RF set-top box equipment, which supports RF4CE technology. Comcast has deployed RF remotes with the first of its Xcalibur products, the next-generation Xfinity TV service currently available in Augusta, GA, and plans to expand availability in 2012 and beyond. Comcast also plans to use the new RF remote control to support legacy TVs and set-top boxes based on IR protocols currently used by their customers." |
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The issue is: Do the new receivers support IR along with RF? If not, then virtually all universal remotes will be useless. |
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Good question. Hopefully the new RF-remote equipped STBs will also have IR remote sensors built-in, like the new Motorola HD-DTA, as I have mentioned in my postings above. If not, as more and more RF remote controlled equipment becomes available, I would expect that new universal remotes will then be produced that will be both IR and RF capable. Of course, that will mean that you will have to replace any current IR-only ones that you may be using.  |
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to telcodad
The IR sensor is, in fact, the same one that the existing SD DTAs use - it connects to the DTA via a long thin wire and acts as a receiver/extender. That *should* mean that the same remotes that Comcast uses with the DTAs in service today would be usable for the HD DTAs.
NOTE - According to the User Manual submitted to the FCC, the standard remote will be a modified version of the existing silver remote used with the larger STBs (Motorola/Pace), as opposed to the SD DTA remote. In other words, it (the new remote) will replace *all* existing Comcast remotes - STB and DTA alike. (That's actually a relief, as right now, the STBs and DTAs use differing remotes from each other, despite using the same battery type.) |
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PaulGo
join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD |
PaulGo
Member
2012-Feb-2 8:39 pm
Just a bit of information about a Standard definition DTA's ability to pick up and display a HD channel in standard definition. Comcast - Montgomery County, MD I believe accidentally added channel 808 (Newschannel 8) which is HD to the DTA lineup. On my Thomson brand DTA it picks up the picture and sound! I also have a Motorola SD DTA that only picks up the sound but no picture. In addition I have a DCT700 (SD)which has no sound and no picture on that channel. I looked at the channel mapping for channel 808 on the DTAs and it was mapped to 611mhz which is the HD frequency for that channel. The SD version of the channel is 28 which is 681mhz.
what does it mean - probably very little except Thomson built in the ability to decode HD signals. |
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said by PaulGo:Just a bit of information about a Standard definition DTA's ability to pick up and display a HD channel in standard definition.
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what does it mean - probably very little except Thomson built in the ability to decode HD signals.
Actually, to me it means that Comcast would not have to replace all of the DTAs they just distributed if they ever eliminated the SD versions of channels and went totally HD. It appears that the MPEG decoder chips used in some of them can handle the HD streams (but just output them in SD). In this SA/Cisco area, I received 2 Comcast-branded Pace DC50Xu DTAs and (later on) an Xfinity-branded Thomson (Technicolor) DCI105 DTA. I wonder if those Pace DTAs can also handle HD channels? I know my Cisco RNG100 SD STBs can tune to and decode the HD channels. They most likely have similar circuitry as my Cisco RNG150 HD units, but just lack the additional HD circuits and Component/HDMI jacks. |
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GTFan
join:2004-12-03
Austell, GA |
GTFan
Member
2012-Feb-3 7:55 am
In my area the el cheapo Pace DTAs do not handle the HD channels. |
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said by GTFan:In my area the el cheapo Pace DTAs do not handle the HD channels.
Do you mean that you had a similar situation as PaulGo, where an HD channel was accidentally added to the DTA's channel map, and found that the Pace DTA could not decode it (and output an SD version)? Normally, the channel map in a DTA only allows it to tune to SD channels. The new Motorola HD-DTA unit (the subject of this thread) will add the capability to handle HD channels and provide an actual HD signal (through its HDMI output). |
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