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TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8

1 edit

Dyson: upright vs canister?

The time for me has finally come... my first Dyson vacuum purchase. I've wanted one for such a long time, and now that I am moving in a new place, it's time to make the move.

I'm a little overwhelmed by all the models and reviews I've read. I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with both canister and upright models, and pitch in on which they think is "better"? Considering either the DC25 or DC28 especially.

I realize better is a very subjective term, so let me elaborate. Suction is supposedly better in the upright model, but some people complain it is heavy. I'm 6'1" and strong, so weight is not an issue. I also do not have any stairs where I am going. It's a condo.

I heard the upright ball model work well, but I'm concerned at all the recent 1 star reviews I've read on Amazon. Anyone I know who owns a Dyson rave about it, but they've all had it for years.

Is it possible the build quality recently took a nosedive? Or are they just whiny customers expecting miracles?



John97
Over The Hills And Far Away
Premium
join:2000-11-14
Spring Hill, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House
·ooma

My parents bought a Dyson DC33 last year. Two months in, it died. They took it to a repair shop specified by Dyson. They said it needed a control board and the part was on backorder and it could be 2-3 months before they could get one. This was unacceptable, and a phone call was placed to Dyson directly. After alot of drama, the unit was picked up from the local shop and sent directly to Dyson. Got it back a month later.

The experience my parents had scared me off Dyson when my wife started squawking at me about needing a new vacuum for the upstairs bedrooms, so I bought an LG. They came out with a line to compete with Dyson.

I bought this one:

»www.amazon.com/LG-Kompressor-Upr···03GZGOHY

We really like it.

We have a relative staying with us temporarily who brought a DC17, which we have been using downstairs. It seems to work ok, but we both like the LG unit alot more.

When our relative leaves and takes the DC17, I'm going to probably buy another LG for use downstairs.

»www.amazon.com/LG-Kompressor-Upr···04B9LX5W
--
So put me on a highway, and show me a sign.
And take it to the limit one more time...



TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8

It's quite alarming, because the most recent reviews on most vacuums, including your LG, are all disappointed customers. You often read how quick they break, how unhelpful customer service is, etc. etc.

For 700$ on a vacuum, (which is what the DC28 costs in Canada... we get royally fooked on appliance prices here) I expect absolute flawless performance.



John97
Over The Hills And Far Away
Premium
join:2000-11-14
Spring Hill, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House
·ooma

I agree, and I just noticed those last few bad reviews of the LG. When I bought it, I couldn't find any. We love the thing. The 5-year warranty (like Dyson) still makes me comfortable.

One thing that caught my eye recently is that there are an awful lot of refurbished Dysons for sale online. Woot.com seems to have one listed almost every other day. They only warranty the refurbs for 6-months.

I bought the LG from Sears, so I can take it there for service since they fix everything they sell. When I bought it, I told the salesguy about my parents' experience with Dyson (which Sears also sells). He told me that if they had bought from there, they would have just given them another one if it couldn't be repaired in a timely manner.
--
So put me on a highway, and show me a sign.
And take it to the limit one more time...



TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8
reply to TigerLord

I'm also considering Miele models. The reviews aren't as polarized and the price range is almost identical. It's worth exploring, because if I am about to spend two car payments on a vacuum, it better last!



Jackorama

join:2008-05-23
Kingston, ON
reply to TigerLord

I have the upright DC25 (a couple of years now). Had the canister first, but my apartment is too small and the canister would catch on the edges of everything it pass by making it hard to use.

I like the upright, it's light weight and it takes about 10 min. to do the apartment. You don't have to adjust the height going from carpets to floor and has very strong suction (be careful, have a few bare patches in the carpet because of that).

The only things I don't like is when using the hose, the powerful suction causes the hose to pull back. I have to hall the hose over my shoulder and hold it with one hand while the other hand moves the attachment around to clean. And emptying the clear bin is not as simple as holding it over the garbage and pushing a button, well not if you have people in your house hold with long hair (long hair wraps around the inside cylinder and has to be pulled out by hand).

The Dyson is the only good vacuum I've had, the others were a cheap Kenmore upright and a Hover upright. The Dyson has been the best so far.
--
"Whenever they invent something that's moron proof, someone comes by and invents a better moron."

"Ever stop to think, and forget to start again?"

"Those of you who think you know everything are annoying those of us who do."


themagicone

join:2003-08-13
Osseo, MN
reply to TigerLord

I have the DC25 Animal version. It's worked great except for a switch going out. Took it to the repair shop and had it back in 2 weeks. Thing actually worked a lot better after being repaired. With 3 dogs and once a week vacuuming it's amazing what the thing picks up.



bryank

join:2000-03-23
Plainfield, IL
reply to TigerLord

I've owned several different vacuums (Hoover, Kirby, & now Dyson) and we just love our Dyson. We've had our Dyson Animal for about 8 years now and it works just as good as when we bought it. I did have to replace the hose recently from normal wear and tear, but it was a minimal cost. The greatest part about Dyson's is how quickly they come apart to clean out and the suction is amazing!

Having 2 cats and 2 kids, I don't think I would ever go without a Dyson. Now as for the question at hand, I think upright. I just don't get the canister models; seems to be clumsy.


itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA
reply to TigerLord

said by TigerLord:

I'm also considering Miele models. The reviews aren't as polarized and the price range is almost identical. It's worth exploring, because if I am about to spend two car payments on a vacuum, it better last!

Go with the Miele. Dyson is overhyped "technology" with little performance benefit. Don't believe me? Take your old vacuum (with the clogged bag, dull roller, slipping belt, etc.) and vacuum a room. Buy the cheapest POS you can find. You will also be "amazed" at what it picks up. Why? Because your old machine was in disrepair and the new one is, well, new.

Also decide if you want bagless or bagged. One of the things I hated about our bagless was it didn't have much capacity. So you would have to empty it quite frequently. Then there was the stink. Despite claims it always stank and we had to wash the plastic pieces quite frequently. Then there was the dust cloud when you dumped it. In short, it sucked a$$.

Gave up the bagless junk and went with a Kenmore Progressive (which is a Panasonic IIRC) that has a real bag. I change the bag maybe 2-3x a year when it's full or stinks. No dust cloud, no nothing. Pop it out and into the trash. Pop a new one in and were good to go. No cleaning plastic and waiting for it to dry.

You can keep the bagless junk - bags are much easier to deal with.


TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8

I do agree that Dyson has a powerful PR machine behind it and I'm sure a lot of the 5 star reviews are buyers suffering from the placebo effect -- the hive mind attitude.

There are arguments to be made for bagless models because it is true that filled bags will reduce suction and cost of bags add up over time, but as I have mentioned, I've read VERY little criticism on Miele vacuums, the reviews are overwhelmingly positive while Dyson's are highly polarized depending of model.

The Dysons do look cooler and more modern, but int he end, it's all about the performance. Thanks for your input!


wth
Premium
join:2002-02-20
Iowa City,IA
reply to TigerLord

Our 6 year old DC07 works well and has had no problems.



IIIBradIII
Comm M-E-L Instr

join:2000-09-28
Greer, SC
reply to TigerLord

Check Consumer Reports vacuum ratings before buying - they didn't seem too impressed with the Dysons.


disy

join:2003-01-02
Norwalk, CT
reply to TigerLord

Our Miele is fantastic....went crazy and got the silver Capricorn and it has been fantastic - love the ability to increase and decrease suction depending upon the surface/fabric you are vacuum cleaning and I also think it is quiet compared to other vacuums



SparkChaser
Premium
join:2000-06-06
Downingtown, PA
kudos:3
reply to TigerLord

I haven't seen the Oreck mentioned. Not good? Cost too much?


itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA
reply to TigerLord

said by TigerLord:

I do agree that Dyson has a powerful PR machine behind it and I'm sure a lot of the 5 star reviews are buyers suffering from the placebo effect -- the hive mind attitude.

That's kind of where we were at with Dyson. Most vac reviews have that - you buy a new one because you think your old one isn't working well. Vacuums are such simple machines it's probably lack of maintenance or clogged up hoses that are the real issue. So any brand new machine is going to be better than an old one. A car with 100k miles will feel worse than one new right off the lot.

And Dyson does have great PR - make up a problem ("Loss of suction") and target those that have a great need - animal people with a machine "just for them".

quote:
There are arguments to be made for bagless models because it is true that filled bags will reduce suction and cost of bags add up over time, but as I have mentioned, I've read VERY little criticism on Miele vacuums, the reviews are overwhelmingly positive while Dyson's are highly polarized depending of model.
Our Kenmore has a light that tells you when to change the bag. We have a dog and a cat and carpet throughout the house. I think I change the bag about 2x a year usually when the smell is bad or the light comes on. Have not really noticed that much loss of suction. It will still get the dog hair on the linoleum in the kitchen very well when the light is on.

The thing for me is less dust when I empty the bag. With the bagless (Hoover Savvy) I'd go outside the house, dump the cup into the trash can and a cloud would appear. Tap it and it's filter and another cloud. All the crap you were trying to get rid of. Then after a while the whole thing would stink so I'd take it to the basement and soak things in the slop sink. Some bagless models also have filters to clean and change

With the bag I toss it in the trash when I am done and there is no dust cloud, no cleaning other parts, no nothing. Sure I have to remember to hit Sears up for bags once or twice a year but I'm at the mall that often so it's OK by me.

quote:
The Dysons do look cooler and more modern, but int he end, it's all about the performance. Thanks for your input!

True - but the Mieles have that Germanic Industrial Design thing going on too.


Reality

@videotron.ca

Have to agree with itguy05 guy above. Had my Kenmore for about 12 years now. Only thing I had to change was a belt on the powered vacuum head last year. Think I paid 300 or 350$ for it back then and it was a high amperage model.

I would really have to be in love with vacuuming to spend about 800$ on a vacuum. Not going to happen.

My wife had one of those canister bagless types. It's exactly like what itguy05 mentioned above when emptying it. We both hated emptying it. We tossed hers. I would only use a bag model.

With Kenmore, the sears guarantee's are straight up. For repair, every corner repair shop has the parts stocked since I do believe Kenmore and Electrolux are about the same, Or likely just rebranded.

Really, I can't see myself putting down 800 on those over-hyped things.

When you think about it, a cleaning lady will charge you 50$ for 3-hrs or so of house work. Save your money, buy a 350$-Kenmore and get a cleaning lady in your place one a week or every two weeks with the money saved. It will go further for you.



Spork35

join:2011-07-13
Methuen, MA
reply to TigerLord

We bought a DC25 last month. It was our first Dyson. We had a 5 year old cyclonic Hoover but it just wasn't getting everything up. We just used the Hoover the day before the Dyson arrived. It was crazy how much the Dyson got out of seeming 'clean' carpet. We suspected that was the case and that's why we got the Dyson. We found it online brand-new for $400 with a retail price of $550. So far we've used it 4-5 times with amazing results. I'm still in shock we spend $400 on a vacuum but it does work great.

I'd recommend the DC25 as good vacuum.
»www.abcvacuumwarehouse.com/vacde···BID=2167
Price went up to $450 but still a good deal.
--
"We are the Borg. You WILL be assimilated!" -ST:TNG



cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7

2 recommendations

reply to John97

said by John97:

They said it needed a control board and the part was on backorder and it could be 2-3 months before they could get one.

WTF does a vacuum need a control board for? On. Off. There's nothing else to control.

8744675

join:2000-10-10
Decatur, GA
reply to TigerLord

I have gotten all my vacuum cleaners from the trash for the last 20 years. Most just needed a good cleaning, belt, or power cord repair. I have a nice Dirt Devil Upright with hose and attachments, a Hoover Upright, and I have given at least 5 or 6 other nice ones away. Who needs to spend $800 for a $200 vacuum that you can get for free at the curb.



Spork35

join:2011-07-13
Methuen, MA

said by 8744675:

I have gotten all my vacuum cleaners from the trash for the last 20 years. Most just needed a good cleaning, belt, or power cord repair. I have a nice Dirt Devil Upright with hose and attachments, a Hoover Upright, and I have given at least 5 or 6 other nice ones away. Who needs to spend $800 for a $200 vacuum that you can get for free at the curb.

Like everything it depends on what level of 'clean' you want to achieve. The Dyson is a step above anything else in what it can do for you. If a mid quality 'clean' is satisfactory for you then by all means dumpster dive for gold. We won't go back to a normal vacuum again after trying a Dyson. If you want to come up to Massachusetts we'll give you our old vacuum which is still a great cyclonic Hoover but it fails to achieve the 'clean' we want.
--
"We are the Borg. You WILL be assimilated!" -ST:TNG

itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA

said by Spork35:

Like everything it depends on what level of 'clean' you want to achieve. The Dyson is a step above anything else in what it can do for you. If a mid quality 'clean' is satisfactory for you then by all means dumpster dive for gold. We won't go back to a normal vacuum again after trying a Dyson. If you want to come up to Massachusetts we'll give you our old vacuum which is still a great cyclonic Hoover but it fails to achieve the 'clean' we want.

Again, old vs new. Clean the hoses, replace all the filters (even bagless have filters) and put a new belt on the power head. I'd bet it will pick up stuff your Dyson misses.

Or try this one. Go to Wal Mart, buy the cheapest POS you can find. Take it home. Vacuum with your Dyson. Go over it with the POS. I'll be it will also pick up stuff the Dyson left behind.

Don't believe me? From this page:
»www.1377731.com/museum/

quote:
And speaking of sneaky vacuum cleaner salesman tricks (and there were many), here's a classic gimmick that many people [still] fall for: The salesman, ever concerned for the good health and sound hygiene of his prospective customers, would ask the housewife to carefully vacuum a portion of her carpet with her old [and he would emphasize the word “old”] vacuum cleaner.

He would then make a sly comment along the lines of, “I’ll bet you think your carpet is clean now, Mrs. Jones, don’t you. After all, you just used YOUR vacuum cleaner on it.” Of course she would agree, not wanting to concede the possibility that her present sweeper was inferior.

Then he would grandly shove her old cleaner aside and set-to vacuuming the same spot with his sparkling new cleaner. He’d open the dirt-bag and dump the contents onto the rug — that she had just cleaned — commenting about how much dirt her old vacuum had left behind.

This is a terrific sales technique; and one that sold many a new cleaner! Only thing is, the same process would also work in reverse: If the salesman vacuumed first with the machine he was demonstrating, and the housewife then used hers afterward, she, too, would find dirt in her machine. It’s the simple physics of the fact that one pass of vacuuming will not remove all the dirt from a carpet, no matter how carefully the chore is carried out. Some dirt will always remain behind!
Here's another one:
»www.businessknowhow.com/marketin···ysec.htm

In the end as long as you enjoy the vac that's all that matters (if enjoying a vac is possible ).


Spork35

join:2011-07-13
Methuen, MA

4 edits

1 recommendation

said by itguy05:

Again, old vs new. Clean the hoses, replace all the filters (even bagless have filters) and put a new belt on the power head.

I spend 4 hours breaking it down then replaced the belt and cleaned everything last year. It use to get a new air filter and HEPA filter every year. It doesn't have the power of a Dyson. When you look at the CFM's Dyson is the leader. I did the vacuum testing for myself. I didn't buy the hype behind Dyson but the wife wanted one anyways. I tested it very methodically for 2 days. I was trying to prove it worked the same as the old one so we could send it back to get the $400 back for something else like a new PC. We also have an old POS vacuum for a spare which was used in the testing as well as a hand-held dustbuster for shits.

I came to this conclusion. As long as there's someone pushing a great product like a Dyson there will always be someone trying to push the fact it's crap. I was the later but became the former after seeing it for myself.

I do love the off the wall mom/pop websites you posted trying to prove a non-existent point though. Try to post some reputable sites next time.

Edit: For testing the carpet was vacuumed 4 times with each vacuum. North to South, South to North, East to West, then West to East. 4 passes was plenty to get the idea of which vacuum was the best IMHO. When the Dyson made 1 pass after the Hoover's 4 passes it almost filled up the Dyson's container. The Hoover's container was about full after 4 passes. I couldn't tell how much was in the POS vacuum as it had a bag but the results were the same with the POS vacuum and the Hoover. The Dustbuster didn't get much but then again I didn't expect it would. It's more of a mess tool then a 'cleaning' tool.

--
"We are the Borg. You WILL be assimilated!" -ST:TNG

itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA

said by Spork35:

I came to this conclusion. As long as there's someone pushing a great product like a Dyson there will always be someone trying to push the fact it's crap. I was the later but became the former after seeing it for myself.

As long as you are happy that's all that matters. I wouldn't call Dyson great as there are plenty of vacs that are better.

Did you try your testing with a new vacuum? Curious as there are also seals that can deteriorate after time, especially in a canister vac.

quote:
I do love the off the wall mom/pop websites you posted trying to prove a non-existent point though. Try to post some reputable sites next time.
What non existent point? Google Vacuum Salesman Tricks and you too can read all about it. I doubt any "real name brand website" will post the tricks they use to sell a vacuum.


Spork35

join:2011-07-13
Methuen, MA

said by itguy05:

Did you try your testing with a new vacuum? Curious as there are also seals that can deteriorate after time, especially in a canister vac.

The Hoover isn't even 5 years old and was like $250 originally. If it goes down that much over that course of time it's not worth the price. I've not tested a Miele but we aren't fans of bags either. Dyson and Miele are the leaders in vacuums. Like most things in life you get what you pay for. At $400 the Dyson offered the best bang for the buck between Miele and Dyson. The other brands were in the $250-350 range so it wasn't a hard sell to grab a Dyson for a few bucks more especially when it came with more attachments and a better warranty.

said by itguy05:

I doubt any "real name brand website" will post the tricks they use to sell a vacuum.

Consumer reports doesn't sell anything. CNet doesn't sell anything. Tons of other sites dedicated to reviews and info that are large and well respected. I don't do cloak and dagger stuff myself.
--
"We are the Borg. You WILL be assimilated!" -ST:TNG

sk1939
Premium
join:2010-10-23
Mclean, VA
kudos:10
Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
·Verizon FiOS
reply to TigerLord

This and many other reasons are why I'm glad I have hardwood floors; Shop Vac the large stuff up, then use the wet Swifer for the rest.

As far as the Dyson goes, they look impressive, but their reliability is questionable. You can also find better vaccums for less money.



TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8
reply to TigerLord

I've decided to go with Miele for four reasons:

1) ConsumerReport did not like the Dysons much, and the user reviews are just as polarized there as they are on Amazon or other popular sites. CR basically said the Dyson were overpriced vs their performance ratio (you pay for the PR)

2) The Miele are well reviewed on CR, the user reviews are mostly positive both on CR and other review sites

3) The Miele vacuums are "modular." Let me explain. The Miele basically have a few series of canisters they call S4, S5, S7, etc... then within each category, you'd get the S4281, S4921, S4019, S5351, S591, etc... basically, within each series of canister you get the exact same performance. The only thing that changes from model numbers within the same series is the color of the canister and the attachments that come with them. In that sense, it's a great money saver because where I am going I will only have hardwood floors. So I can dispense of any carpet attachments and save a few hundred dollars, and get their best hardwood attachment instead. If I move in a few years, I can just buy a new attachment if I ever have carpets.

For each category of attachment (hard floor and carpet) they have various attachments ranging in price and quality. For instance, the SEB- 236 is their best carpet attachment with an electronic brush head, but it's 330$... I'll only get their widest hard floor attachment instead, the SBB-400, thus saving 330$ for something I will never use in the short future.

4) They have a better warranty, is easier to get serviced in my area and they seem to be better engineered (though the ol' German engineering motto is no longer what it used to be).

The Miele S5 ranked in at #2 with 71 points, just under a Kenmore Intuition in #1 with 72 points. The Miele is also twice the price, but you get twice the power. It's only worth it if you like your "clean" to be VERY clean, which I do like.

Expand your moderator at work


tmh

@verizon.net
reply to TigerLord

Re: Dyson: upright vs canister?

I think Dysons are a solution to a non-existent problem.

"Doesn't lose suction". Well, how much suction do you need? Enough to pull the carpet off the floor? The brush does most of the work loosening the dirt. After that, it doesn't take a lot to lift it off the floor. I seriously doubt even a Dyson will work well without a functioning brush roller.

I've switched from bagged to bagless, and to bagged again for the reasons already listed: small capacity, dust flying everywhere, filters that actually trap more dust than the vortex thingie.

My current vacuum is an Oreck. That's a well designed machine. Very light and does a good job. When its full, I throw away the bag and I'm done.



jester121
Premium
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL

2 recommendations

reply to TigerLord

Go to Walmart, buy one of these: »www.walmart.com/ip/Bissell-Power···11039508

In 9-12 months, put it out at the curb and go buy another one.

In 5 years you'll still have a vacuum that's less than a year old and works great, for --
When the zombies come, he will be waiting.



iknow

@optonline.net
reply to cdru

some vacuums use a stepper motor sometimes called a digital motor, but not this one. all this one needed was this. »www.vacuum-direct.com/dyson-dc17-switch.aspx which fits many models. they probably named it a "control board" because they had no idea of the proper term, or just wanted to make it sound sophisticated so they could charge a lot for it..