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kspies007
Premium
join:2003-02-10
El Monte, CA

Problems with T1 data speeds (Cbeyond on Verizon wires)

Hi - I have an issue with a T1 connection that our office uses. This is a full T1 with 5 phone lines (voice over IP) all managed by Cbeyond. The voice part is great not a single issue. The problem is with our data connection. We are having problems with a cloud app that we use constantly in the office to check out customers. The app developer says the issue is related to our ISP and our connection speeds. I have tested it and it comes back with upload speeds that are consistently 20 to 50% less than than the d/l at 700/800 and our d/l speeds are not great averaging 1300kbps.
I physically reset the Cbeyond IAD (router) last Friday and for a day we had fantastic results and our apps hummed. But after a day we went back to the poor upload speeds. I reset the IAD again and it looked good for a few hours.
The problem is that Cbeyond does not see any problems on the line. One tech said there were a few errors on the circuit but it shouldn't be problematic. I know that we are between 12 or 13,000 feet from the telco office and I'm wondering if this is the issue. We had terrible DSL service with Verizon when we had it, and I convinced myself the issue wouldn't repeat with a T1, but I'm guessing maybe the physics of the connection is a problem.
My question is this. How should I proceed with Cbeyond when they say everything is ok? They are going to send out a tech but I am concerned they will do a hardware reset and problem is fixed for 4 to 24 hours. How do I go about getting a long term solution and is one even possible? I do think adding a 2nd T1 would help with our cloud app problems but it also seems wrong that I need to purchase more when the company is not delivering on what they promised.
We have 4 phone lines and 1 fax but only 1 is usually used at a time. I have tested it when there is no one at the office with the same results. And after resetting the IAD on Friday I tested it on a wireless laptop with 4 other PC's connected and tested at 1514/1465. I'm ok with only getting 1250/1300 but I need it to be consistent on both d/l & u/l as it affects the performance of our cloud app.

Thank you so much for any advice and assistance. We're paying $425 for the T1 (phones and data) and adding a bonded T1 is another $200 but I'm not sure adding 50% cost will be approved.

Be well!


BandwidthNow

join:2006-03-22

The inherent advantage of a T1 is that the bandwidth is supposed to be symmetrical. How long have you had this issue (days/weeks/months)? I would request an all out replacement of the IAD before too long.


kspies007
Premium
join:2003-02-10
El Monte, CA

We've had these issues for at least 6 weeks, but from the outset our upload was not equal to our d/l speed (most often). I had tried to get support to address this from the outset but their response was everything was in the green from their view. I've only chosen to try and resolve this now as the office has gotten busier and we need the system to perform more efficiently than it has.

The tech is coming tomorrow. I know it's going to be a challenge to get this resolved as a reset of the router makes everything look perfect.
Thanks


cooldude9919

join:2000-05-29
kudos:5
reply to kspies007

Not to change the subject but if you are doing cloud type stuff where throughput is that important i would see what else you can get besides a single t1. Some sort of metro ethernet offering in the 5mb/5mb or 10mb/10mb range may not be a whole lot more than you are paying now. Though with being 13k ft from the CO i would guess any kind of EOC would be out, but it may be worth checking for fiber providers near you.
Who is your cable company, time warner or comcast? I would check with them as they both do a metro ethernet product. Ive gotten 20mb/20mb for around ~$900 from comcast and that included them building out and no up front cost for me, though this varies by market and construction cost to get fiber in your building.


kspies007
Premium
join:2003-02-10
El Monte, CA

Update - They replaced the IAD (router) and no change. Of course the service was working perfectly while the tech was there so we got nothing resolved. Today it's back to the 1.2mbps/900kbps.

Fiber is not available from Verizon because of the distance. The fiber prices from Metro Ethernet are over $1,000. Time Warner can only provide 2x2 at max or 8x1 and the cloud app requires uplink speed as well.

The $400 we pay to CBeyond includes 5 phone lines, virtual receptionist and 1,000 long distance minutes so it's a pretty sweet deal. I think we're just going to have to fork out another $200 to them to bond two T1's. At least with that we should be able to make up for the line challenges but it gets me because we work fine when we get what we pay for which is 1.5


cooldude9919

join:2000-05-29
kudos:5

said by kspies007:

Update - They replaced the IAD (router) and no change. Of course the service was working perfectly while the tech was there so we got nothing resolved. Today it's back to the 1.2mbps/900kbps.

Fiber is not available from Verizon because of the distance. The fiber prices from Metro Ethernet are over $1,000. Time Warner can only provide 2x2 at max or 8x1 and the cloud app requires uplink speed as well.

The $400 we pay to CBeyond includes 5 phone lines, virtual receptionist and 1,000 long distance minutes so it's a pretty sweet deal. I think we're just going to have to fork out another $200 to them to bond two T1's. At least with that we should be able to make up for the line challenges but it gets me because we work fine when we get what we pay for which is 1.5

You are talking to the wrong people at time warner, sounds like a small business / cable modem rep. You need an enterprise level rep, if your really interested i can have our national rep look someone up for you. If you think 3mb will be enough then $600 isnt bad for that with phones, but obviously t1's arent going to scale that well, so if you want 4.5mb, 6mb, etc it will be worth seeing what time warner can offer, because they can do phones as well. Ive gotten 10mb/10mb data only for $600 from time warner a few times.

BandwidthNow

join:2006-03-22

1 edit
reply to kspies007

The other possible issue is old, bad, worn out copper. Either at your premise or at the CO. I've dealt with this before quite a few times. Not sure what you can get them to do to have the copper upgraded, but it'll probably take a few more calls and complaints. 900 Kbps upload is completely unacceptable. I would complain about this till the cows come home

Even though a full T1 is technically supposed to be 1.544 Mbps down/up- with overhead you're more likely to get something in the range of 1.4 (give or take a few bits). But to have it all the way down to less than 1 meg?? I wouldn't accept that.

Assuming it's not issues with your equipment, bad copper, or just problems with the carrier's network- have you factored in that it could be because it's an IA T1, rather than a stand-alone data T1? As I'm sure you already know, bandwidth is used every time a phone call is made. This would of course explain the inconsistency. And perhaps when a call is ended for some reason the bandwidth is not reallocating properly. Sounds far fetched but just wanted to throw that out there.

Where are you in your contract term? Did it just start?


kspies007
Premium
join:2003-02-10
El Monte, CA

I have a feeling it's a line issue as well as our DSL connection used to be very problem-some. I'm not sure why Cbeyond isn't seeing errors on the circuit if it's a line issue (one tech said he saw some and then the next said it was ok, so maybe I'm not getting the complete story)? 1.3 would be acceptable to me so I'm not being greedy here, I just need the dropouts to stop as it affects the system so drastically. I understand the overhead for the lines and when I've been testing it the phones and network have been quiet. However, even with the phones the upload should not be affected differently.
We're in the 3rd month of a 2 year contract. So we'll either have to fight and get them to resolve or break the contract based on the SLA (both are big fights). One of the biggest challenges is that Cbeyond has no way to test the speed from the IAD itself. All they can do is ping it and check for errors. That's rather limited from my perspective.

I think that if we added a second T1 it would help a great deal as the bigger pipe would be more forgiving of the drop outs. They want another $200 for the bonded T1 and I think an acceptable solution fair to both of us would be $100 more for the 2nd T1 but as of yet they won't go for it.

If you have any thoughts as to how to get them to deliver I would be greatly appreciative.
Thanks everyone



bbwithdrawls

join:2008-08-30
Vanleer, TN
reply to kspies007

you need to check on your end if something is downloading , patches, peer to peer or something else , be surprised what a small network will reach out and grab files especially if you allow updates, virus definitions , you tube and of course peer to peer