Canadian Chat → [Baseball]Official 2012 Toronto Blue Jays Thread

Well, that time of the year, we're only a couple weeks away from the beginning of spring training, then the grapefruit season, then regular season. As least one of our Jays are pumped:

quote:

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Arencibia believes team is ready to compete with powerhouses in AL East

You don’t have to push J.P. Arencibia too hard on which team he thinks is the best in the American League East.

The Toronto Blue Jays catcher believes his team has all the parts to jump past the New York York Yankees, Boston Red Sox and the Tampa Bay Rays in baseball’s meanest division.

Arencibia, left-fielder Eric Thames and pitcher Brett Cecil, along with Hall of Fame second baseman Robbie Alomar, made the rounds in Halifax on Thursday as part of the Blue Jays annual caravan.

Blue Jays general manager Alex Anthopoulos only plans minor adjustments, if any at all, to his roster between now and the start of spring training next month, meaning he’s counting on the 2010 nucleus of the 81-81 Jays to get him to the top of the division.

"For me, I don’t see ourselves other than on the top of the division," Arencibia said. "I go into the off-season, I go into everything I do, that’s the way I think and I believe.

"I know we’re in a tough division. The Yankees are always going to be the Yankees and the Red Sox are going to be the Red Sox. Tampa is always a good team and the Orioles added guys. For me it’s about going out and playing and letting what happens on the field take care of itself."

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Naturally, our yearly polling question:





I can't see under 70....obviously..nor do I see much for than 90, but hopefully Arencibia see's something I don't.

I can't say I'm too impressed with AA's off season doings so far..

He signs a 41 year old reliever (Oliver) and another reliever who's yet to make any real impact (Santos)...

The bullpen was this team's achilles heel last year. And he's done nothing to improve it, and both Francisco and Rauch are gone. Rauch never had it, but Francisco had a decent second half.

Obviously it sucks that they didn't win the Yu Darvish sweepstakes, but that is a gamble in itself and I'm glad they didn't overpay for the right to just negotiate with him.

It's too bad however that they didn't go after an established closer like Papelbon.

The Yu fiasco would have been just that, a fiasco, over $50M just to talk. I am disappointed to that Alex didn't find more bullpen help. Not sure if it's a cash issue or inability to close the deal.

Jays are better off without FFF. He's too inconsistent.

Papelbon might have been okay, however, at 2.94 ERA, not always great for saving games, IMHO. Not for $11-13M a year that Philly is giving him.

But not having an established veteran closer IMO is hampering the team's ability to sign other talent... I forgot that AA re-acquired Jason Frasor. He's always been a stable bullpen arm, but he's not a closer.

I mean, who do we have that's big name? Jose Bautista is about the only big name we have.

Arencibia, Lind, Romero, Escobar is good too. Thames and Snider. The team doesn't have the line-up that the Yanks or Sox have. Which is why i don't think they'll win more than 90. But if some of the up and comer do the stuff they need to...like Lawrie, it might turn out good.

Don't forget that Prince Fielder has yet to sign, and the Jays were on his short list...

Forget Fielder - 20+ million for upwards of 10 years - no way!

The Jays lamented the contracts they gave Wells & Rios - it will be more of an albatross around their necks with a guy who's 275 lbs. and will be nothing more than a very overpaid DH 4-5 years from now.

Santos was a very good pickup, guy can throw strikes and get people out. Less nervous 9th innings Jay's fans have had to endure the last couple of years.

Frasor fastball is consistent mid-90's and Oliver has had an ERA of 2.29, 44 K's and only 11 walks in 50+ innings with a 1.14 WHIP. Good setup guy and occasional closer when Santos can't go. Heck, even Frasor could get some saves if need be, he has good stuff.

I have faith in AA that he's not finished yet reshaping the Jays - there's 3 months till the season starts, plenty of time to make (a) trade(s)!

That, and he's always said his target to really start challenging the Sox, Yankees and Rays is the 2013 season.

Really, all I'm hoping for this year is to see improvement. I'll be happy with a season record that is well above .500.

We got to see the Jays last night for their winter tour. Brilliant marketing for Canada's team. Even the players were talking about how much they are now understanding how big the fan base really is for Toronto.

It was way past his bed time.

He made the Jays site #shamelessshowingoff

»toronto.bluejays.mlb.com ··· c_id=tor

That's awesome! You think you guys can make it out west (called out east over here) this year?

Oliver is a fantastic reliever. But you need to remove his starter days. His last couple years as short relief in Texas? He's been nothing short of great.

The only reason Santos "has yet to make any real impact" is because he played for a sub-.500 White Sox team. The truth is, he strikes out A LOT of guys. Last year he struck out 13.1 players per 9 innings. In the AL East, that's what you need for a closer. People like to shit on BJ Ryan because of his contract and what happened at the end, but they always forget his first season as a Jay. BJ Ryan was a monster that first season. He had 38 saves in 42 tries and struck out 89 in 72.1 innings (11.1 K/9). He was nearly unhittable. Then he had his Tommy John surgery and that was that. I'm not going to defend year 2-5, because it just wasn't good. But 2006? No one can say he wasn't a premiere closer.

Could Santos flop? Sure. Anyone can when playing the AL East elite as much as the Jays do. But this guy has lights out talent AND he only costs a $1m, plus he's controllable for another 3 years.

Here's the way I see the 2012 Blue Jays. Am I as optimistic as Arencibia? No.

I think this team has all the tools to play with the best in the AL East, but will they all put it together this year? Who knows.

Let's go around the Diamond...

1B: Lind is a good player. He had a dominant start and got hurt, and never seem to get in the groove again. Who knows what will happen this year. If they pull off the unspeakable and sign Fielder, now we are talking.

2B: Johnson is an offensive upgrade over Hill and a Defensive wash. So this position is better.

3B: Lawrie is miles better than the hole that was 3rd for most of the season last year. Encarnacion, McCoy, Macdonald... No one can argue MacDonald's glove, but he is just relatively bad at the plate. Improved, assuming Lawrie can avoid an extended sophomore slump.

SS: Escobar again, but another year of experience. Solid position. Great defense and very competent lead off man.

RF: Jose Bautista. One of the best outfielder's in the game and arguable the best hitter in the league the last 2 years.

CF: Colby Rasmus: Upgrade over Rajai Davis/Cory Patterson in EVERY way except Davis' speed.

LF: Questionable. Can Snider finally figure it out at the plate? He's good enough in the field. Thames? I think if Snider can play to his talent, Thames is a downgrade. Thames has Ok Defense, and an OK bat. This position is a question.

C: Another year of Arencibia. Hopefully he can remember how to hit properly. Not great defensibly, but has great offensive potential but he struggle last year. Mathis will be a solid backup & mentor. Also on the 40 man roster is Travis D'Arnaud who has the potential to be a top flight elite catcher down the road.

SP: Romero emerged as one of the best pitchers in the AL last year. Morrow at the end of the year really started locking it down. McGowan if he avoids injuries is another power arm who did pretty well to end the year. Cecil I think is a good 4th or 5th starter but he had a rough year. Perez pitched well when needed. Henderson Alvarez did great to end the year. Drabek has the tools to be a good pitcher, but he needs to figure it out. Overall, this could be the biggest question mark, it could also be a strength. Romero and Morrow are locks; The rest are up in the air.

RP: I have a lot of faith in Janssen, Carreno, Frasor, Oliver & Villaneuva. I think Litsch is a far more effective reliever than he is starting pitcher. Santos, I think, could be great. I'd argue this could be our biggest strength this year.

So how does it compare to the AL East? Tough to say. If it all comes together, they can compete. But the Red Sox are still a team, despite there hilariously terrible September, that is built well. But they have to go through some cultural changes with a new GM and new Manager. NY still has a stacked roster. TB doesn't seem to have changed too much. Could be another long season, but it could be one where we are watching exciting, meaningful baseball in September.

Brandon Morrow is getting $20,000,000 over 3-years. Option for 4th year at $10,000,000. Seems a little rich...but I digress, I am not working in the front office, only thing I know was that he wanted $4.2 million for next year, the Blue Jays offered $3.9 million, so off to arbitration, however, Alex had a change of heart and offered this sweetheart deal. Better be worth it, it's a lot of money for a 11-game winner with an ERA of over 4.5.

»www.montrealgazette.com/ ··· ory.html

»www.thestar.com/article/ ··· -seasons

Just proves that he is all talent.

Hah, "Random"...

I guess MLB wants to catch the next big cheater.

Jays are amassing a 'Super Bullpen' signing former Reds closer, Francisco Cordero. Their Bullpen is approaching the 6-inning bullpen team they had in the 90's of Hentgen, Ward, Henke.

Frasor/Janssen, Cordero, Santos. That could be mighty scary for an opposing team. Litsch I think could be a good middle/long reliever, along with Villaneuva and/or Joel Carreno. Not to mention Oliver and Perez too. There's some decent potential there for a real solid pen.

I think this team is, on paper, better than last year. They are certainly on the cusp of being one of the better teams in the AL. Right now, you'd have to say it's the Rangers, Angels, Yankees, Red Sox and Tigers. Rays, Jays and Indians are right behind them. The rest are bad: Orioles, Royals, Mariners, White Sox and Athletics. Twins I'm not sure about...

Interesting... Bullpen was pretty bad last year, at least in the first half. Blew a bunch of games.

If the starters can be better, namely Morrow & Cecil, it might not be half bad.

Yeah, I just heard that. Maybe they read the nasty article from the Sun that stated that Rogers was the worst owner ever. Francisco, not to be confused with (Frant) Francisco (FFF). He had 37 saves last year, only issue, he's probably older than a lot of our posters here...

Did anyone watch the state of the franchise a few days ago?

There was one question that stood out and I'm kind of surprised the media hasn't picked up on it. One man questioned AA about having contacted the Blue Jays and not getting any contact back when he wanted them to scout his farm team in the Dominican (I believe it was the Dominican) and mentioned that the Blue Jays already had two farm teams there. After being brushed aside by the Blue Jays he said he contacted the Rangers and they immediately sent scouts out to the team and proceeding to sign 5 players, one being a catcher and not sure what other positions he had mentioned.

So AA kind of BS'd the answer saying to contact him again, but I'm puzzled why the media didn't pick up on it. The Rangers are a good team, and they signed 5 players from that team. While they may come to nothing, it puzzles me that AA and the Blue Jays didn't even take a look.

This seems like something the media would of had a field day on.

Must have been an independent farm team. I would like to have more info on the farm.

What I got out of the state of the franchise that there were a few season tickets holders that are quite pissed off about the Jays but were pretty much quieted down by the other holders who seemed to be giving AA kudos' especially since they were showing "3" fingers as the amount of playoffs they'll make in the next 5 years.

I say they were smoking something before doing that.

Yeah, I would of loved to have gotten more information. I figured the media would look into that by reporting the 5 players who the Rangers signed, where exactly the farm team was located, the success/failure of the farm team, etc.

I forgot about that. That's really the only other thing that came out of the state of the franchise. Beaston, whether on purpose or not, really put pressure on both AA and Farrell. Not only that, but the fans who watched might now have unreasonable expectations which could work against them.

Maybe Alex and John need so pressure.

I have now also heard of some talk about putting grass in the stadium. That would be really nice. Much depends on whether or not the Argo's use the stadium past 2012. Unfortunately, grass fields don't work to well with other rentals, so Rogers Centre would become a "baseball" only stadium. That's the way it should be. Apparently the Jays were after some guys, but it seems there are a lot of players not willing to play on artificial turf, even if they were to only DH. I was under the impression that the stuff they were using was pretty soft. I seem to recall when I was on it it didn't feel all that bad, not compared to the garbage they used at exhibition stadium which basically was green carpet over cement.

Yeah, I think they mentioned Beltran was one of the players who didn't want to play on the turf. It would be nice to get the grass, but I doubt it'll happen anytime soon. While the Blue Jays seem like they want it, it's hard to convince the owners when they are lining their pockets with other events that would have to stop with the installation of glass.

Jays sign Janssen to two year $5.9 contract.

Seems like a good deal for both of them. Janssen has been reasonable solid for the Jays. (2.26 ERA last year)

$4 million option for 2014.

Jays win exhibition opener 7-1 over the Pirates.

Lawrie had 2 doubles (4 RBI) and Thames had a HR.

Jays had split squad today. 1 win, 1 tie.

They are 3W-2L-1T

(ties are allow in Grapefruit games)

Jays won 5-2 today..(over Astro's) -- Bautista is back in form, 2 HR's, Snider hit a solo too.

Should be noted:

Jays are 6W, 2L and 1T so far this spring season. Not that it means 'everything' but it doesn mean something.

Got my first set of tickets today...kids will enjoy.

I don't take any result in Spring seriously. No one is really playing their full team, pitchers aren't playing full games, etc.

Hopefully you and your kids will enjoy the game. Who are the Jays playing for the game?

It will be Baltimore, first Saturday game at the dome. Kids will enjoy it regardless, they'll run the bases afterwards, ride the train before and after. I'll leave at 8 in the morning, arrive at Yorkdale around 9, see if we can get some gear, take train to Union Station, have lunch, go to dome early, sit in outfield 100's, catch some practice balls, then head to our section. The Jays are still the best value around for major league sports.