 mech1164I'll Be Back
join:2001-11-19
Lodi, NJ
 ·Optimum Online
| reply to fifty nine
Re: Supply and Demand said by fifty nine:But piracy shouldn't be regarded as competition for paid content.
That would like comparing working and robbing a bank as a means of earning a living.
Again all well and good. NOW REALITY: IT DOESN'T MATTER TO THE CONSUMER. Look at it this way. For centuries people have imbibed spirits and to great excess. Now when the Government tried to in the "For the betterment of the Country" use the Volstead Act to make prohibition the law of the land. Look how that worked out. Without a legal means to get their enjoyment. People went to great (and very illegal) means to satisfy them. It wasn't until years later when they realized what a mess they had made by doing this legislation did they repeal it. Same thing happening now. People will do whatever they have to if they want it bad enough. Legal be dammed. |
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 firephotoKDEPremium
join:2003-03-18
Brewster, WA
 ·Frontier Communi..
| You guys are arguing about piracy in relation to mainstream television with commercials. This is the television that broadcasts a show during prime time once and might replay that same episode 2 maybe 3 times per year on that channel again but only after months gap after the first showing and never on a regular schedule in it's original order in it's entirety again. The first time these programs air EVERYTHING is paid for and profit is to be had, anything else is just double dipping and extra icing on the cake.
Quit propping up the piracy argument from both sides with a misguided understanding of what's going on. It makes you no better than this stupid article with someone pandering to a 80 year old dirtbag ceo hoping to sway him on matters of todays technology right after he shows his ignorance by bitching about the results on a search engine as if it wasn't suppose to show what is really existing on the internet.
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Say no to JAMS! |
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 Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium
join:2002-03-03
USA
kudos:4 | said by firephoto: The first time these programs air EVERYTHING is paid for and profit is to be had, anything else is just double dipping and extra icing on the cake.
Nonsense. Most prime time series never make a profit. Those that do make their profits if and when the series goes in to syndication, assuming they stick around long enough to be sold for reruns on all the cable channels.
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The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, I'm from the government and I'm here to help.
»www.politico.com/2012-election/
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 elwoodbluesElwood BluesPremium
join:2006-08-30
HarperLand
·Cybersurf Intern..
| reply to firephoto
But piracy exists because content people want is not available where they live or how they want to view it.
Up here in Canada one of our cable companies teamed up with FX and created FX Canada.
What's on it? Older shows that FX cancelled (Lights out), non current seasons of SoA, and a host of reality shows to fill out the schedule, but I'm expected to pay through the nose for this.
I can't watch Boardwalk Empire unless I subscribe to the Uber premium gold pressed latimum package, I'd be happy to shell out $x for HBO, if I could get it by itself,without the bundled bs, to me it's worth it.
So the restrictions put in place by the media companies has forced me to look elsewhere for their content and they aren't legal means.
I'm not justifying what I'm doing, but the reality if I could get what I wanted to watch, when I wanted to (even if it means paying for HuluPlus)I would resort to those alternative methods of getting my fix.
Now you can say wait for the Blu Ray/DVD to come out. OK, so in the above example of Boardwalk Empire, I'll have to wait till next fall (HBO releases the Blu Ray/DVD's just before the next season starts) to watch the previous season and the cost is now higher then if I just paid $X/month to HBO.
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No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake....... |
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| reply to firephoto
Actually, everything *isn't* paid for. If you actually worked in television (as I have), you'd realize that the hope is that everything is paid for, but often times isn't.
When the next-day's Nielsen report hits the networks *and* the advertisers, a less than promised audience results in a lower rate for the advertising. These days, only stupid advertisers pay the rate card. |
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elwoodbluesElwood BluesPremium
join:2006-08-30
HarperLand Reviews:
·Cybersurf Intern..
| said by desarollo:Actually, everything *isn't* paid for. If you actually worked in television (as I have), you'd realize that the hope is that everything is paid for, but often times isn't.
When the next-day's Nielsen report hits the networks *and* the advertisers, a less than promised audience results in a lower rate for the advertising. These days, only stupid advertisers pay the rate card.
I've been in the TV business for 6yrs, lower ratings result in what is we call Make Good, making up for the lower ratings by providing advertising elsewhere for free.
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No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake....... |
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| reply to mech1164
said by mech1164:said by fifty nine:But piracy shouldn't be regarded as competition for paid content.
That would like comparing working and robbing a bank as a means of earning a living.
Again all well and good. NOW REALITY: IT DOESN'T MATTER TO THE CONSUMER. Look at it this way. For centuries people have imbibed spirits and to great excess. Now when the Government tried to in the "For the betterment of the Country" use the Volstead Act to make prohibition the law of the land. Look how that worked out. Without a legal means to get their enjoyment. People went to great (and very illegal) means to satisfy them. It wasn't until years later when they realized what a mess they had made by doing this legislation did they repeal it. Same thing happening now. People will do whatever they have to if they want it bad enough. Legal be dammed. Agreed. It doesn't matter to consumers because piracy largely has no consequences. Yeah, sure a few people get sued but the vast majority escape scot free.
It has come to the point where people view piracy as an entitlement. Sure SOPA was bad in many ways and I absolutely don't support it in its current form but no one who works in the industry can deny that piracy is a problem. |
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| reply to elwoodblues
said by elwoodblues:But piracy exists because content people want is not available where they live or how they want to view it.
Up here in Canada one of our cable companies teamed up with FX and created FX Canada.
What's on it? Older shows that FX cancelled (Lights out), non current seasons of SoA, and a host of reality shows to fill out the schedule, but I'm expected to pay through the nose for this.
I can't watch Boardwalk Empire unless I subscribe to the Uber premium gold pressed latimum package, I'd be happy to shell out $x for HBO, if I could get it by itself,without the bundled bs, to me it's worth it.
So the restrictions put in place by the media companies has forced me to look elsewhere for their content and they aren't legal means.
I'm not justifying what I'm doing, but the reality if I could get what I wanted to watch, when I wanted to (even if it means paying for HuluPlus)I would resort to those alternative methods of getting my fix.
Now you can say wait for the Blu Ray/DVD to come out. OK, so in the above example of Boardwalk Empire, I'll have to wait till next fall (HBO releases the Blu Ray/DVD's just before the next season starts) to watch the previous season and the cost is now higher then if I just paid $X/month to HBO.
You have the Canadian Government partly to blame for this. They're so hell bent on protecting Canadian content that they'll cripple US content that wants to make its way to Canadian shores.
»www.media-awareness.ca/english/i···ules.cfm |
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elwoodbluesElwood BluesPremium
join:2006-08-30
HarperLand Reviews:
·Cybersurf Intern..
| This has nothing to do with Cancon, but rights issues, they may have sold the SoA S4 rights to another company in Canada, which has put it on the shelf, so nobody else can have it.
My point was that I want to watch S4 of SoA,but I can't legally, so I'll find an alternative method.
CanCon is about creating "Made in Canada" shows, some networks (CTV) tried to do an end run around it buying the rights to Idol Canadian Idol or Talent shows (Canada has talent), both bombed horribly.
CanCon is to ensure there is something that ensuring that we keep our Canadian culture, otherwise the networks would just gobble up every available US program and become secondary US broadcasters.
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No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake....... |
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elwoodbluesElwood BluesPremium
join:2006-08-30
HarperLand Reviews:
·Cybersurf Intern..
| reply to Romney2012
said by Romney2012:said by firephoto: The first time these programs air EVERYTHING is paid for and profit is to be had, anything else is just double dipping and extra icing on the cake.
Nonsense. Most prime time series never make a profit. Those that do make their profits if and when the series goes in to syndication, assuming they stick around long enough to be sold for reruns on all the cable channels. They make money when they sell content to the rest of the world during it's first run.
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No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake....... |
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Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
| reply to fifty nine
said by fifty nine:It has come to the point where people view piracy as an entitlement. Sure SOPA was bad in many ways and I absolutely don't support it in its current form but no one who works in the industry can deny that piracy is a problem.
Actually, I think it is the industry with the entitlement issues... they feel they should be entitled to continue their business model by force even though technological advances have made it too difficult to control distribution of their product.
There are also many people in the industry who don't see this as a problem. There are actually artists who release their works to the world for free (imagine that!). Record companies and their shareholders definitely see this as problem; they would do better to look for the opportunity. |
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| It should entitlement to expect that you be paid for your work.
It should not be an entitlement to expect that you have the right to steal the work of others. |
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Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to CXM_Splicer
said by CXM_Splicer:said by fifty nine:It has come to the point where people view piracy as an entitlement. Sure SOPA was bad in many ways and I absolutely don't support it in its current form but no one who works in the industry can deny that piracy is a problem.
Actually, I think it is the industry with the entitlement issues... they feel they should be entitled to continue their business model by force even though technological advances have made it too difficult to control distribution of their product. This is just a bass-ackwards way of looking at the issue. You start by assuming that piracy is the way it is, and enforcing copyright laws is some weird new stupid idea (i.e. "continuing their business model by force".)
There is nothing new here. Piracy, counterfeiting, forging, knockoffs, fake watches, copying designer or trademarked clothing, copy machines to distribute printed content, etc. etc. etc. The Internet is just the next tool that does good but also enables easy copying in violation of copyright law. It's ridiculous to say that THIS tool is somehow unique and countermeasures are futile.
Rather than "continuing their business model by force", they are trying to assert their historic rights of ownership under copyright, as has been going on for centuries.
There are also many people in the industry who don't see this as a problem. There are actually artists who release their works to the world for free (imagine that!). Record companies and their shareholders definitely see this as problem; they would do better to look for the opportunity.
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Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| said by MyDogHsFleas:This is just a bass-ackwards way of looking at the issue. You start by assuming that piracy is the way it is, and enforcing copyright laws is some weird new stupid idea (i.e. "continuing their business model by force".)
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Rather than "continuing their business model by force", they are trying to assert their historic rights of ownership under copyright, as has been going on for centuries.
I guess who is bass ackwards depends on which which way you are facing 
Piracy IS the way it is... not by my assumption but by reality. If it weren't, we wouldn't be having this conversation. And they are not simply trying to assert their historic rights, they are trying to gain more and more rights to increase their revenues even further. It is what the shareholder primacy doctrine demands. The copyright laws have changed so much since their 'historic' times that they bear almost no resemblance to the original intent. How long was the original copyright term? How long is it now?
Again this is bass-ackwards. The fact that some artists release their works for free (or at least some of their works), and that some artists sell direct to the public through the Internet bypassing the record companies, does NOT lead one to the conclusion that free copying of works SHOULD BE THE LAW (or at least the accepted practice). This like saying some stores are online only so ALL stores MUST be online only. It's the choice of an artist or a store which way to go! Don't make it mandatory just because you happen to like one or the other. Choose with your dollars and your attention.
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Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| reply to fifty nine
said by fifty nine:It should entitlement to expect that you be paid for your work.
Well if you are talking about the artists, then yes, you certainly can blame the industry for that. They have been cheating artists out of fair pay for their work for a long time now. Unfortunately, nothing in the currently proposed legislation addresses that issue.
I highly doubt you are talking about the industry itself failing to get paid... they are making more money now than they ever have before.
It should not be an entitlement to expect that you have the right to steal the work of others.
Very strange that corporate America is always praising the tenets of Free Market Capitalism yet every chance they get, they make it less free because it benefits them. |
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