| [DSL] PPPoE and Multiple Static IP Questions Hello all.
I hope to become a new TekSavvy user next month, however I have some questions. I am coming from the original ADSL from Bell where the static external IP address, let's call it E1.E1.E1.1 for simplicity sake is hardcoded into my modem (Bell is retiring this Bell Global service after about 12 years as it was really only ever available to a limited market for a limited time and barely anyone use it anymore, this was the 1.1Mbps up and 2.2mpps down with static IP). On my server I connect the ethernet port and hardcode my IP address E1.E1.E1.1 into it....
I am completely new to the PPPoe concept (we use Roger's at work, again with fixed IP's from the router). I understand PPPoE has no IP until it logs in. And here is what I want to do.... I'm just not clear on HOW....
I have one Windows Server that hosts my personal email on Exchange and a webserver so this requires an external public IP. This is how I have it configured now and I don't want to go reconfiguring to use a DMZ or anything else. I understand Windows 2008 R2 can handle PPPoE and there are some changes that need to be done so it connects when rebooting automatically.
I also have several home computers that need access to the internet. They do not require external static IPs. Currently they all connect through my Windows server, however it is my understanding connection sharing on 2008 server with an AD via PPPoE is not possible or is a virtual headache/nightmare. I know it is not recommend to have a server configured in this way, I have done this for 10 years now, and it works for what I need it for.
So what I want to do is connect the server direct to get one fixed permanent IP and then use say a linksys box or something to get a second fixed permanent IP (or dymanic if I can have one fixed and one dymanic, although nothing explains if you get one static IP if you can also get a dynamic, so for the couple of bucks I was going to do the two IP solution) to handle the local desktops/notebooks.
So as far as I understand a PPPoE modem serves no purpose other than to convert the signal into something ethernet will understand. It does not login, it does not give IP's, etc.
I have read how people talk about bridged modes and so on with the modem....
If I understand it, in bridged mode (assuming TekSavvy can do this), I could plug the modem into a switch and then the switch into my server's extneral public interface to the network and a linksys into the switch as well. They could both login via PPPoE and get an external IP. Since if I understand correctly PPPoE will sort of work like a DHCP with reserved addresses, how would it know which IP belongs to my server (being a web server it needs to be the same) and which would go to the Linksys?
Alternatively if I understand I could buy a router, the router would login via PPPoe and be assigned an external IP (the gateway) of say E1.E1.E1.E1 and then ports 2 and 3 of the router would have E1.E1.E1.E2 and E3 all being the same is 206.1.1.1 and .2 and .3. All being public externally available IP addresses. Then I would need three static IP's, correct? And then the Linksys would say use E3 and then connect the the internal network on I1.I1.I1.1
I'd prefer to keep costs down. I know there are some combo modem/routers and some modems I believe with multiple ports.
I really am not sure what I need here, so if you could recommend what I need for a modem from TekSavvy and if I can do my bridged solution and guarantee my server always has the same IP or if I need to go the router method, can you recommend something that would work. For the router method would a Sonicwall TZ series work, I assume a simple retail unit would not.
Worst case I get a single IP adress low speed DSL connection for my server and then buy a cable connection for the home computers....
Any advice would be appreciated.... |
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| You could just buy a block of static Ips from teksavvy
/30 2 IPS (/30 subnets) $5/mo.
gives u 2 ips. if thats what your after statically.
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| reply to DrewV
said by DrewV :how would it know which IP belongs to my server (being a web server it needs to be the same) and which would go to the Linksys?
If you plug two devices into the modem through a switch (ie, router + server), then each item will require a separate PPPoE login with TSI. AFAIK, this means you pay for two internet accounts, but I could be wrong. You would have to ask them.
The other way to do this is to get rent a static IP and a static subnet. The router's WAN port gets the static via PPPoE, and you set up the subnet on the LAN side, disabling NAT in the router. If you do this, all your LAN hosts will get a public IP out of the subnet, until the pool is exhausted.
But since public IP addresses cost money, and you already said you don't want them for your other LAN hosts, what you really want is a multi-LAN router that can do NAT on one LAN and no-NAT on the other (for the server). Consumer routers won't do this, so you'll have to step up to m0n0wall or some corporate $$$$ solution. m0n0wall is actually a good fit for this job and costs you only the x86 hardware of your choice.
Or, just use ICS in Windows to share the PPPoE out to your other local hosts. I wouldn't do it, but it's an option.
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db |
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| reply to morisato
Yes that is what I was planning to do, but after much reading on PPPoE, it doesn't seem that simple. How does it know which static external IP goes to which device, and alot of what I read seems to indicate a router is required which takes a gateway external IP and then you have to route the other two external IPs to the approriate devices, not using NAT... |
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| reply to DrewV
Yep, you're going to need a router. You probably want one anyways as in your proposed setup any traffic between the LAN and the server would be routed via TekSavvy severely constraining your bandwidth. PPPoE is a tunnel similar to a VPN, there would be no ability to route between without going to TekSavvy's PPPoE endpoint.
I'd consider something like pfSense which can be run on any old computer. Your router takes the static IP assigned to your account, and the extra subnet is routed to that IP. How your router handles it would be up to you. Having two separate interfaces would work, one with your LAN subnet and one with your purchased subnet.
As an alternative, you can do 1:1 NAT and I believe it is supported on consumer grade routers using 3rd party firmware. With that all traffic to the server IP would be forwarded to the server, and all traffic originating at the server would be sent to the internet with that IP. The server itself would however have a private IP and go via NAT, but that shouldn't be an issue for most uses. It would be transparent to anyone connecting to the server.
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Taylor Byrnes |
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 GuspazGuspazPremium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:16 | The other advantage of 1:1 NAT is that you can use all the IPs; you get 4 usable IPs out of a /30 instead of 2.
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Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org |
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| reply to DrewV
Thank you for all your feedback and suggestions. For now, I do not want to do NAT 1:1, I strictly want to route my /30 subnet to my one or two servers....
In order to route it is my understanding I would configure a router as such:
WAN (first usable): 222.222.222.2
Gateway: 222.222.222.1
Subnet 255.255.255.252 (or whatever it works out for a /30)
LAN: 222.222.222.3
Gateway: blank
Then I would have one IP I could assign to my server public NIC as 222.222.222.4
Is that correct? if I wanted to hook up a 2nd server I'd need to order a /29.
So if I understand the above is correct (going by what I have read that is both right and wrong). Two questions.
1. Why won't a home router route the additional IPs if configured that way, ie, what is the feature called that I would need to look for on something more business class. ie. a Sonicwall TZ100 or perhaps a Cisco SRP500 or SR500. I assume all of those could do it fine...
2. In the above scenario a /30 would really only get me one server connected.... Is there a way with the Speedstream 516 modem for it not to be in bridge mode and if I order just a static IP, that I could use the modem to provide the login PPPoE credentials assign my static public IP 222.222.222.2 to my server where I put that address into the NIC, and avoid having my server do the PPPoE login? I'm thinking this is all I really need to do (I just want the server to see a public IP on the NIC and pretend it knows nothing about PPPoE), I may not need the 2 IPs and could then get by with my one server...
Thanks again for everyones help, I am slowly understanding this I think... I know I could trial and error it, but that means more downtown and perhaps uneeded equipment/costs/services... I'm pretty good at that part of tinkering, just trying to minimize that aspect.... |
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Reviews:
·link2voip
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| No, if you route your /30 then your router setup will look like this:
WAN: 1.1.1.1 (static IP from TSI)
LAN: 2.2.2.1 (your subnet is 2.2.2.0/30, or 2.2.2.0 - 2.2.2.3)
Server: 2.2.2.2
Network ID: 2.2.2.0 (unusable address)
Broadcast: 2.2.2.3 (not assignable to any host)
For this to work the way you expect you need to turn off NAT in the router. Sometimes this means changing it from "gateway" mode to "router" mode.
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db |
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| I am in the same situation.
I am switching from BELL to Teksavvy
I have a /29 (8 IP's) static IP from Teksavvy.
So far, I have a router (router #1) logging into the DLS box using PPPOE
Router #1 is configured as such:
IP + 0 is the Network
IP + 1 is the Gateway: This is the address of the router doing PPPOE
IP + 2...+ 6 are usable static IP's
IP + 7 is the broadcast
Router #1 is dedicated to route the subnet to the static IP the DSL box has.
Router #1 also needs a DNS entry.
I will have servers on IP+2, IP+3
I have another router (router #2) set as IP+4 to provide NAT and DHCP to
desktops and wireless. I don't want them having a public IP.
Router #2 will need the correct configuration so it can give gateway (IP+4)
and DNS servers to its DHCP clients.
I am having connectivity issues...but I will stick at it.
When I get it figured out, I'll update |
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Roop
join:2003-11-15
Ottawa, ON Reviews:
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| reply to DrewV
to decrease monthly costs, i would not recommend routing any extra subnets you get from teksavvy. rather you should nat them.
for example:
/30 gives you this:
.0 network ip
.1 usable
.2 usable
.3 broadcast
that's if you're routing it. if you just do a straight NAT, you can use all 4 IPs for your own purpose, ie:
192.168.1.1 nat -> external.0
192.168.1.2 nat -> external.1
192.168.1.3 nat -> external.2
192.168.1.4 nat -> external.3
all that plus your PPPoE static gives you 5 total static public IPs.
that may require you re-engineer your network but with the looming end of ipv4 addresses and the extra cost of the IPs, I would recommend it. |
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