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Cloneman

join:2002-08-29
Montreal

Tomato QoS classes question

I'm not familiar with QoS is "supposed" to behave, however I find something peculiar with how it works.

If you have the following setup -

Low : 60% (maximum)
high: 80% (maximum)

It appears to break when you run traffic in both classes. My expectation is that these two classes together will never use more than 80%, however this does not appear to be the case. When both 'classes' are being maxxed out, the router allows them to use 100% of the available bandwidth (as specified by the "MAX Bandwith" limit)

Is this is how its supposed to behave?

In which case, the only 'sane' setup is to have only 2 classes, and the 'high one' should be something that will never use a lot of bandwidth.

This seems quite stupid to me. any sort of setup where the sum of classes exceeds 100%, is a broken setup, more or less.

AwolRJ

join:2007-01-05
Niagara Falls, ON

Thats why when ya set up your Qos max bandwith limits in the download and upload you leave room for overhead. Google Qos and it will give the percentage and explain why. Its working just as you told it.


Cloneman

join:2002-08-29
Montreal

reply to Cloneman
yeah I've read up on QoS and it still seems odd to me.

If you have

Low 60%
Medium: 80%
High 100%

I wonder if High will actually have much of an advantage when low and medium are being stressed at the same time. I haven't tested this particular scenario, I'll have to try it out



Ott_Cable

@teksavvy.com

In general, high is for small amount of citical traffic like Ack/VoIP/Games that needs a guaranteed amount of bandwidth. It is not for bulk traffic.

If you combine the Low & medium and make a limit say 80%, you could reserve some room for the high...


Cloneman

join:2002-08-29
Montreal

if I combine low and medium to 80%, then low will have 30% and medium 50%?

Then low and medium would be using only a fraction of available bandwidth... when they are alone on the pipe...



Ott_Cable

@teksavvy.com

I meant combine the two classes into a single one, so you'll let them use up to say 80% of the traffic.


Cloneman

join:2002-08-29
Montreal

said by Ott_Cable :

I meant combine the two classes into a single one, so you'll let them use up to say 80% of the traffic.

Which brings me back to my original point... the only sane setup is to have two classes.... in TOTAL


Ott_Cable

@teksavvy.com

It really depends on how you classify your traffic.

Given your numbers, my conclusion is that you do not use the higher priorities of traffics for small important traffic. So the only thing that would align with your way of thinking is high vs low/bulk class of traffics. Someone else might want a finer classification of those higher priority traffic, but that doesn't match your style.

The min setting is what you want to guarantee and the max is what you allow it to take if there were no more traffic that is higher priority than it.

There are a lot of limitations on what the QoS does and what it doesn't. It is not smart at all. I would prefer it to have something like a port trigger that would dynamically change the ratios if it sees a certain traffic (say when it sees me using VoIP).

It also cannot control what you download directly. It can only discard your download packets so that TCPIP would adjust the data rate indirectly. On the upload side, it can only queue so much before it would affect your latency. Unless it is psychic, it can't tell how much of your high priority traffic would actually be. It can only preserve a certain amount of traffic.


Cloneman

join:2002-08-29
Montreal

reply to Cloneman
What I find interesting is, I have QoS setup nicely , and it works pretty well even on downstream.

My actual setup is, 80% "low" and 100% "highest" (maximums)

which works pretty well to push my voip above other connections.

Still, i find it confusing how it works when you have 3-4 classes. Perhaps one day when I have time I'll try to figure it out, but for the time being using more then two classes seems to be a real headache.



Ott_Cable

@teksavvy.com

reply to Cloneman
So if you want to reserve say minimum 20% of the bandwidth for High, you would set High: min = 20%. That's gone from your pool!

Whatever that is left for your max would be available for the next lower priority. So for the highest class, a min of 20% and max of 30% would leave 70%-80% for the rest of the classes.

The important thing is that the sum of all the min have to be less than 100% because that's what your are reserving for each of them.
They could get more if there are no higher priority traffic.


InvalidError

join:2008-02-03
kudos:5

reply to Ott_Cable

said by Ott_Cable :

There are a lot of limitations on what the QoS does and what it doesn't. It is not smart at all.

Real QoS uses the DSCP field in IP headers and routers along the way make routing and enforcement (such as rate limits per DSCP value) decisions based on PHB settings, no random guessing about which traffic should go first, everything goes at wire-speed and traffic that needs priority gets to jump in front of the queue while excess low priority traffic gets dropped.

But since ISPs cannot trust what subscribers set DSCP to, lack of a fully standard behavior between AS domains and various other issues, DSCP is usually scrubbed at the network edge and all the consumer market has left is "ghetto-QoS" where the router cannot do much other than shuffle packets to try keeping the inbound/outbound traffic within specified values.

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