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george357
Premium
join:2009-09-18
Weaverville, NC
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Charter

[Need Info] Installing OS on SSD?

I upgraded my boot drive to an SSD and used an Acronis image to basically take everything installed and move it to the SSD. I have since read/heard that it is better to do a fresh install when moving from a mechanical drive to SSD.

Is this accurate?

I do have incredible performance increases since the install but if it could be better I do not mind doing a fresh install.

Would you do a fresh install in this situation?
--
The wise man seeks everything in himself; the ignorant man tries to get everything from somebody else. ~Anonymous

Cancer Cures Are Just A Crunch Away



grant tyrone

@pacbell.net

yes. that is accurate.
install any firmware updates to SSD before installing OS.
change bios to AHCI. install fresh,
after OS install, turn defrag to never or off.

set hard drive power off to never in advanced power options in control panel.



george357
Premium
join:2009-09-18
Weaverville, NC
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Charter

said by grant tyrone :

yes. that is accurate.
install any firmware updates to SSD before installing OS.
change bios to AHCI. install fresh,
after OS install, turn defrag to never or off.

set hard drive power off to never in advanced power options in control panel.

Thanks for the info, I did do all those steps except the fresh install. Any idea on the why of this or how much better it is to go this route?
--
The wise man seeks everything in himself; the ignorant man tries to get everything from somebody else. ~Anonymous

Cancer Cures Are Just A Crunch Away


DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

its due to the block size

on SSD's and some 2TB+ drives they use a 4k sector size and if the formating isn't alligned then you get a block that crosses sectors (ok I know I'm not explaining it the best)

but basicly it makes it so it has to write to both 4k sectors everytime even if the file is sub 4k it wastes 8k writing it which is also slower

there are ways to allign it but I haven't done it so I'm not sure how

win7 and most modern OS's will allign during the install but XP doesn't know that it should so XP has to be manually alligned

the whole issue boils down to a new thing called advanced format drives

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Format



george357
Premium
join:2009-09-18
Weaverville, NC
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Charter

said by DarkLogix:

its due to the block size

on SSD's and some 2TB+ drives they use a 4k sector size and if the formating isn't alligned then you get a block that crosses sectors (ok I know I'm not explaining it the best)

but basicly it makes it so it has to write to both 4k sectors everytime even if the file is sub 4k it wastes 8k writing it which is also slower

there are ways to allign it but I haven't done it so I'm not sure how

win7 and most modern OS's will allign during the install but XP doesn't know that it should so XP has to be manually alligned

the whole issue boils down to a new thing called advanced format drives

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Format

Thanks for the info and the link, DarkLogix! I wonder if it would better to do the reinstall or investigate the re-alignment possibilities?
--
The wise man seeks everything in himself; the ignorant man tries to get everything from somebody else. ~Anonymous

Cancer Cures Are Just A Crunch Away


DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

there are a few things that windows7 will do automaticly when its being installed on an SSD

so if the OS is windows7 then I would reinstall
I don't have a list off hand of what those things are but I'm sure a list can be found, so if a reinstall is annoying (I know I wouldn't want to reinstall if I didn't have to) then its possible that a list of optimizations cn be found to manualy do what win 7 would do on a fresh install



george357
Premium
join:2009-09-18
Weaverville, NC
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Charter

I think I will spend a few days researching it and see what I come up with, if it doesn't look promising or effective then I will re-install. A re-install will allow me to free up the 12GB that Acer restore takes and get rid of their crapware as well.



DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

In that case I'd re-install just to get rid of the bloatware



lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Reviews:
·CableOne
reply to grant tyrone

said by grant tyrone :

after OS install, turn defrag to never or off.

I have a question.....I put an SSD in a new laptop and loaded Win 7 Pro. I did not know that Task Scheduler was set to defrag the drive until now after reading this thread.

I just looked at it, and it had defragged the drive at least once or twice (I don't know what it did or how it did it, but it said it was successful). I just deleted the task.

The computer is working fine, and the SSD is still super fast. Could it have harmed the SSD by defragging it when scheduled to? I don't notice any problem. I should have thought of that as soon as the OS was loaded.
--
Somebody's Back In Town


lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Reviews:
·CableOne

Here is the answer that I found to my question:

»forums.crucial.com/t5/Solid-Stat···-p/71051
--
Somebody's Back In Town



fan13027

join:2008-10-26
Winnipeg, MB
Reviews:
·Shaw

said by lordpuffer:

Here is the answer that I found to my question:

»forums.crucial.com/t5/Solid-Stat···-p/71051

Here's the way I like to look at this situation ... in mathematical terms.

How much damage will I do / how much will I reduce the life expectancy of an SSD by doing unnecessary defrags?

The typical MTBF (Mean Time Before Failure) of an SSD is 1,000,000 hours OR MORE. 1,000,000 hours (assuming the drive is constantly powered on) equates to OVER 100 years. So if I reduce the average life expectancy of my drive to only 10% of it's original ... that's still more than 10 years.

How many users expect to keep their hard drives for 10+ years before changing them out in favor of bigger, better, faster, newer technology hard drives?

Don't defrag your drive daily, but on the other hand, don't worry about how often you do defrag it ... odds are you'll be replacing it for other reasons long before any damage is apparent.


lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Reviews:
·CableOne

Thanks, that's good to know. I posted in the Hardware Help Forum what I did, for I cannot find the log to see how many times it defragged. I just want to know for my own knowledge.

EDIT: I just realized that I hijacked this thread.....Sorry.
--
Somebody's Back In Town



DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

Defraging simpily is useless on SSD's the only thing a defrag would do is extra reads/writes thus slightly shortening its life



Kanebrake
Island Time
Premium
join:2002-03-12
reply to george357

If you do this again. Try this.
»www.paragon-software.com/technol···dex.html



lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Reviews:
·CableOne
reply to george357

I did a fresh install when moving from a mechanical drive to my SSD. I could have cloned the drive, but then I would still have the bloatware.

Also, whenever I get a new computer with an image on it, I do a fresh install, The computer, be it a Mac or PC just seems to run faster and better. It may be a placebo affect, however, that affect is worth it.
--
Somebody's Back In Town



george357
Premium
join:2009-09-18
Weaverville, NC
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Charter
reply to Kanebrake

said by Kanebrake:

If you do this again. Try this.
»www.paragon-software.com/technol···dex.html

Thanks for the link Kanebrake, I'll keep that in mind.


george357
Premium
join:2009-09-18
Weaverville, NC
kudos:1
reply to george357

I have a little conflicting information. I checked msinfo32 and it shows a 512kb sector for my SSD. I then ran the Paragon alignment utility and it said that the drive was aligned correctly, anyone know what to make of this?



DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

its possible its doing 512 emulation
its also possible that the imaging was smart enough to align it.

I'm fairly sure that I read that all ssd's used advanced format because it made it easier to make ssd's


eugenek

join:2002-06-14
Palo Alto, CA
reply to george357

the wikipedia article mentioned earlier has a section on 'advanced format 512e' where 4k sector devices pretend to have 512 byte sectors (emulation)
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_format
however SSD sector sizes might well be larger than 4K anyway ...

»en.community.dell.com/techcenter···ves.aspx
scroll down to 'Frequently Asked Questions'
if your fsutil.exe is at a high enough level (win7 sp1 + kb982018) then "fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo c:" will show both the 'bytes per sector' and 'bytes per physical sector'
»support.microsoft.com/kb/982018