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antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

Satellite or cable service for local TV broadcasts?

Hello.

In a few months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A. broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!). So that means we will have to order cable or satellite TV for TV feeds. Since we don't watch many movies and stuff (we just rent or stream), we will still keep it simple and basic. Hopefully, cheap/low cost. Basically, we want all local broadcast channels including foreign ones (asian like Chinese).

We are definitely ordering Time Warner Cable (TWC)'s Road Runner Internet service since that is the only fastest and cheapest ($52.99 per month for standard package) since nothing else and/or good is available (no DSL, no FIOS, satellite and dial-up sucks and are too slow).

TWC sales said for monthly payments as of Christmas break of 2011 (after promotions):
$24.50 (basic/local broadcast TV)
$52.99 (regular Internet package)
$10 DVR rental (heard cable DVRs suck? Or should we get our own [however, I can't find one that doesn't require subscriptions like DTVPal and ChannelMaster DVRs]
$49.99 for installation charge

Total = $84.79 per month for service (without $49.99 for installation charge).

Bundled packages and a single bill would be nice too if it is cheap/not much different, but if satellite TV service is a lot cheaper than we will get it. However, it will suck if the whole cable goes out/down, then no Internet and TV.

I read and heard that satellite TV services for TV stuff can be cheaper and better quality. We will also need to get a new DVR (we still have VCRs, but why?) to replace DTVPal DVR (only for OTA). There are several satellite TV services like EchoStar, DishTV, DirecTV, etc. Which ones to get? We have never owned satellite TV services before so this will be new to us. Also, we still use old CRT TVs but we will get HDTV ones later on when they break/die (could be years).

Thank you in advance.



88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness

1 recommendation

said by antdude:

Hello.

In a few months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A. broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!).

Could you post your TVfool results. You can get in stations that are not in green. My best station is on the mid range of yellow and I can get that in with a small antenna indoors.


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

said by 88615298:

said by antdude:

Hello.

In a few months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A. broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!).

Could you post your TVfool results. You can get in stations that are not in green. My best station is on the mid range of yellow and I can get that in with a small antenna indoors.

Previous home owner had to use satellite dish for TV service. See:
»i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
»www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapp···09db0c9f
»i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness

said by antdude:

said by 88615298:

said by antdude:

Hello.

In a few months, my family and I (three people) will be relocating/moving to another house. We won't be able to get free over the air (OTA) due to a small mountain/giant hill blocking transmitters for Los Angeles/L.A. broadcasts. It is impossible to get a very high antenna (would require a high rise building height with twenty floors -- 193 or more feet for the local English stations in green color according to TVFool.com!).

Could you post your TVfool results. You can get in stations that are not in green. My best station is on the mid range of yellow and I can get that in with a small antenna indoors.

Previous home owner had to use satellite dish for TV service. See:
»i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg
»www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapp···09db0c9f
»i.imgur.com/KWz13.gif

antennaweb doesn't mean anything to me that site sucks.

The top 4 on TVfool you should be able to get, but KNBC would be difficult and KCBS would be highly unlikely so I guess you're stuck on getting satellite or cable.


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

1 edit

said by 88615298:

antennaweb doesn't mean anything to me that site sucks.

The top 4 on TVfool you should be able to get, but KNBC would be difficult and KCBS would be highly unlikely so I guess you're stuck on getting satellite or cable.

Ah thanks. Yeah, I do watch NBC, CBS, etc. And there's no way to get an antenna that high either.

FYI: »i.imgur.com/LTao8.jpg and »i.imgur.com/XThYd.jpg (shots of the house). You can see trees are way taller than the chimney. »i.imgur.com/q7LS4.jpg for Antennaweb's results from December 2011.

OK now back to my original questions. Which one to get? Cable or satellite for local broadcast stations only?


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1

If you are sold on Roadrunner, then probably best deal is going to be TW bundle.

Sat TV might be cheaper, but add in the internet only surcharge for RR alone maybe not, plus cable usually has the digital sub channels sat does not. Also likely to have all the locals not just the majors.
--



lalala

@rr.com
reply to antdude

Getting the double play bundle is probably a better deal since for the same price, you get digital cable with the variety tier. That means you get much more than just the locals.

Note that even with digital cable and the variety tier, TW does not offer all those Chinese subchannels that are available OTA. The only ones you get are KSCI 18, KSCI 18.8, and Skylink TV 31.5. Missing are OTA channels: 20.3, 31.7, 31.8, 31.9, 44.6, 44.7, 44.8, 57.9, 62.2, and 62.6 that have Chinese content. TW does offer a few premium channels such as Jade and Phoenix, but they are relatively expensive.



antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

2 edits

said by lalala :

Getting the double play bundle is probably a better deal since for the same price, you get digital cable with the variety tier. That means you get much more than just the locals.

Note that even with digital cable and the variety tier, TW does not offer all those Chinese subchannels that are available OTA. The only ones you get are KSCI 18, KSCI 18.8, and Skylink TV 31.5. Missing are OTA channels: 20.3, 31.7, 31.8, 31.9, 44.6, 44.7, 44.8, 57.9, 62.2, and 62.6 that have Chinese content. TW does offer a few premium channels such as Jade and Phoenix, but they are relatively expensive.

Yeah, I was wondering why there are missing foreign channels (not just Chinese) from TWC, DirectTV, etc. Hence, I still like OTA. I thought they would carry all of them if they are broadcasted OTA. I assume one can't ask for them either?


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to lalala

said by lalala :

Getting the double play bundle is probably a better deal since for the same price, you get digital cable with the variety tier. That means you get much more than just the locals.

Note that even with digital cable and the variety tier, TW does not offer all those Chinese subchannels that are available OTA. The only ones you get are KSCI 18, KSCI 18.8, and Skylink TV 31.5. Missing are OTA channels: 20.3, 31.7, 31.8, 31.9, 44.6, 44.7, 44.8, 57.9, 62.2, and 62.6 that have Chinese content. TW does offer a few premium channels such as Jade and Phoenix, but they are relatively expensive.

Variety? I only need the local broadcast channels though unless that package is free which is not. Paying $84.79 (local broadcast TV + standard Internet's 10/1 speeds + $10 DVR rental) is already expensive enough. I used to only pay for Internet with only OTA TV and DTVPal DVR (no subscription and leasing; only can do OTA though). Basically, I am trying to be cheap as possible for TV service.


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to Hayward

said by Hayward:

If you are sold on Roadrunner, then probably best deal is going to be TW bundle.

Sat TV might be cheaper, but add in the internet only surcharge for RR alone maybe not, plus cable usually has the digital sub channels sat does not. Also likely to have all the locals not just the majors.

It is still $52.99 without cable TV for TWC's standard RR Internet service.

videonex

join:2001-07-22
reply to antdude

If you really can't do OTA in that location, stay with TWC all the way. They don't have all of the sub channels but neither Dish or Directv have any. KSCI seems to have the best relationship with TWC as most of their subs are carried. As for getting others added, a combination of kindly asking TWC to add plus a similar push at the broadcaster to make it worth TWC's while to carry will do the most good. I have had good results with TWC's DVR. Best part is that if you do have a problem, it's theirs and they simply replace it. Good luck!



lalala

@rr.com
reply to antdude

TW's gives you a slight discount if you are a new user & purchase a bundle. That is why the price is close to the individually-priced services added together.

Honestly, do not expect TW to add any OTA subchannels. Subchannels are not considered must-carry. Plus, there are the obvious reasons like cost, bandwidth, and popularity. Are you going to watch all the OTA foreign language channels anyway? Is your family fluent in English, Spanish, Korean, Mandarin, Vietnamese, and more? What channels & languages are you looking for? No idea about the other languages, but I do know some options for streaming Chinese content.

I have seen you posting in the AVS forum before. There is somebody who just posted a picture in the LA OTA thread about his antenna setup. His TVFool is bad as well. Not saying that his setup would work for you, but it might be something worth investigating.



Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2
reply to antdude

If you're insistent on TW's RR internet, I wouldn't bother considering satellite for TV as you'd have to beat the $25/mo TW charges and that's really not going to happen.

Is RR really $53 a month ?? It should be cheaper bundled with TV service too, but maybe they won't since you're getting what is I presume their lowest TV package.



antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

said by Hall:

If you're insistent on TW's RR internet, I wouldn't bother considering satellite for TV as you'd have to beat the $25/mo TW charges and that's really not going to happen.

Is RR really $53 a month ?? It should be cheaper bundled with TV service too, but maybe they won't since you're getting what is I presume their lowest TV package.

Yes. It used to be $51.99 last year, but prices went up again. Prices didn't change with or without cable TV service. I know Adelphia used to do this with $10 differences.


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to lalala

said by lalala :

TW's gives you a slight discount if you are a new user & purchase a bundle. That is why the price is close to the individually-priced services added together.

Honestly, do not expect TW to add any OTA subchannels. Subchannels are not considered must-carry. Plus, there are the obvious reasons like cost, bandwidth, and popularity. Are you going to watch all the OTA foreign language channels anyway? Is your family fluent in English, Spanish, Korean, Mandarin, Vietnamese, and more? What channels & languages are you looking for? No idea about the other languages, but I do know some options for streaming Chinese content.

I have seen you posting in the AVS forum before. There is somebody who just posted a picture in the LA OTA thread about his antenna setup. His TVFool is bad as well. Not saying that his setup would work for you, but it might be something worth investigating.

I already have TWC RR in the old home. I was planning to transfer it to the new home. Do I still get the new subscriber's prices? Hmm, maybe I can use one of my folks' names. Just Chinese and Korean.
--
Ant @ »antfarm.ma.cx and »aqfl.net. Please do not IM/e-mail me for technical support. Use the forum! Disclaimer: The views expressed in this posting are mine, and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer


lalala

@rr.com

As you do not have cable tv from TW, you should be able to get the new user pricing. As far as Korean programming goes, TW only has KSCI 18.1 and KXLA 44.1. As with Chinese, there are premium Korean channels. They are different from what you get OTA.



antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

said by lalala :

As you do not have cable tv from TW, you should be able to get the new user pricing. As far as Korean programming goes, TW only has KSCI 18.1 and KXLA 44.1. As with Chinese, there are premium Korean channels. They are different from what you get OTA.

Interesting and thanks.


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to videonex

said by videonex:

If you really can't do OTA in that location, stay with TWC all the way...

FYI. The previous house owner finally moved out. They also left their coax cables and tiny satellite dish on the roof. I also managed to borrow a portable 7" DTV with a rabbit ear's single/one antenna. I went to explore while my folks were doing other things.

With this portable DTV, I only got channel 31.x indoor and outdoor and everywhere I could face on the sloped/tilted ground level. I also sort of got more channels, but sort of stable with FOX 11.x and KABC 7.x if I am outside in front of the house's garage and facing Mount Wilson's direction(?) (forgot to bring a compass to get its exact direction). I had to face the big hills/mountains away from the neighbor's big house. I also noticed the trees were much taller than the houses. I wonder if it possible to stick an antenna up there on their main trunks (they're not higher than the huge hills though). Is that possible?

Also, can I use that satellite dish to act like an OTA antenna? For kicks, I tried hooking up it up to the portable DTV and it can pick up channel 31.x like the antenna! And no, it can't get it without coax port connected. Also, the sky was cloudy and started to clearn out if that matters.


Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2

said by antdude:

Also, can I use that satellite dish to act like an OTA antenna?

You can use the coaxial cable itself as an "antenna", you can use a coat hanger, you can use that satellite dish.... Are any of those reliable or practical ? No.


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

1 edit

said by Hall:

said by antdude:

Also, can I use that satellite dish to act like an OTA antenna?

You can use the coaxial cable itself as an "antenna", you can use a coat hanger, you can use that satellite dish.... Are any of those reliable or practical ? No.

Ah, that explains why I can still get channel 31 on it. That was so weird.


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to antdude

Beside cable, do any of these satellite TV services even carry ONLY local broadcast channels for lower costs/prices? I don't care for the movies, ESPN, AMC, TNT, Discovery, TBS, Nickelodeon, etc. I noticed they all include them.



Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2

I think Dish Network used to offer a "locals only" package but doesn't anymore. You mentioned wanting some foreign programming as I recall, yes ? If so, I do believe they will sell you just the foreign channel or package + locals.

Otherwise, Dish does have a "Welcome Pack" or "Family Pack" (can't recall name now) that's pretty stripped down and includes locals.

I had DirecTV a long time ago so I can't speak for what they offer (other than looking at their website).



Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2
reply to antdude

Dish Family: »www.dish.com/entertainment/packa···-family/

Looking at DirecTV's website, they don't list anything, at least easy to find, similar. That's not to say they don't have something close.



antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to Hall

said by Hall:

I think Dish Network used to offer a "locals only" package but doesn't anymore. You mentioned wanting some foreign programming as I recall, yes ? If so, I do believe they will sell you just the foreign channel or package + locals.

Otherwise, Dish does have a "Welcome Pack" or "Family Pack" (can't recall name now) that's pretty stripped down and includes locals.

I had DirecTV a long time ago so I can't speak for what they offer (other than looking at their website).

Yeah, Dish's Welcome Pack is the cheapest and lowest, but it has the extra channels IM don't care for. I will worry about the foreign ones later since they all have them as extra addons for fees. I remember them not being cheap either. Oy!


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

1 edit
reply to antdude

Dish's support.

Hi!

Is it me or is Dish support really bad? I filled out their e-mail forms to contact Dish three times this week with questions about their TV services, but so far no e-mail replies. I used two different e-mail addresses and ISPs (work and home) too. This is not looking good. At least TWC and DirecTV were quick and responsive.

Thank you in advance.



antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

said by antdude:

Hi!

Is it me or is Dish support really bad? I filled out their e-mail forms to contact Dish three times this week with questions about their TV services, but so far no e-mail replies. I used two different e-mail addresses and ISPs (work and home) too. This is not looking good. At least TWC and DirecTV were quick and responsive.

Thank you in advance.

Finally, someone (Katrina L.- KPW; TID: OR – Infiniti; DISH Network eCare) replied. It took them five days? Sheesh.