Topic 'Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race' in forum 'World of Warcraft' - dslreports.com

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Mon, 21 May 2012 16:08:41 EDT

cymraeg posted : Mike has been around for a long time, i used to watch his warcraft movie posts, his only failing is that he is a Manchester supporter, but we can't all be perfect.
--
Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau!
I've lost the bleeps, I've lost the creeps and I've lost the sweeps.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Mon, 21 May 2012 15:57:03 EDT

anon posted : I agree. I don't care if they're world first or not, I care that I can learn something to make me a better raider, and I think Mike Preach's videos do that. I'm mainly dps, but do some tanking, and here's a little of what I learned from the videos just over the weekend:

(1) one thing that sets competent dps apart from great dps is how they time their cooldowns. I've been doing reasonable dps by making sure to use my cooldowns as they come up; but MP showed me how to think about (a) how many times I can use the cooldown in a fight; (b) whether my current target is going to live long enough for the cooldown use to be worthwhile; and (3) how to time my cooldowns to co-incide with other buffs. It's going to take me some practice, but it's stuff I can learn and apply.

(2) holding aggro and taking damage is just the beginning of a tank's job. What sets a good tank apart from a great tank is positioning in a way that enables the maximum uptime for the dps, particularly the melee dps. I had an intuitive idea that positioning was important, but he provided tips that I can apply after practice.

I really can't begin to describe how great Mike Preach's videos are, but I've got plenty to learn from them still, and I'll have to search to see if I can find similar materials from others.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Mon, 21 May 2012 15:08:45 EDT

Thaler posted : lol, did this thread get necroed?

Anywho, I've kind of made up my mind that Method's a joke since their Diablo 3 feed/"achievements". Zerg rushing a boss & proclaiming a world first in a dungeon grind game? Who the f*** cares? This is like camping out an amusement park grand opening just to be the "world's first" to ride the brand new swingset.

Their videos can be invaluable for raiders though, but they went from "what do I care?" raiders to tool status pretty quick for me with those stunts.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Mon, 21 May 2012 10:50:20 EDT

anon posted : Hey Metta,

I don't think anyone in my raid is clicking, but we do still have some kb turners, who nevertheless put out reasonable dps. Everyone on the regular raid team knows the gear / gem / reforge / enchant stuff, and are solid on the basics of their classes. We, and I think a lot of people at our level, just don't know how to kick it up to the next level. However, I think the mikepreachwow (it was incorrectly spelled in Defton's post) will help us a long way in that direction, and actually, the clicker as well too.

From what I've gathered from the videos I've watched, Mike Preach is raiding with Method, and has played just about every spec and role at a competing for world first level. What allows him to do this is the way he approaches the game. His vids teach his approach, and can help the complete noob just learning what a MMO is, to the new player who needs to learn the basics, to the player who is going from basics to advanced (where I think I and my raid is).

I love a bit of advice he gave with respect to LFR (paraphrased): Just assume that everyone else sucks, and that you will have to do it yourself. And really, that makes sense -- I'm a player who plays usually a couple of hours every day, and can play competently. I'm sure there are many players who play maybe a couple of times a week, who can't, and others who play 5-6 hours a day, every day, without fail, who can play at a high level. If I assume that everyone else in LFR sucks, and not rely on anyone else, the other 5-6 other people in the raid who know what they're doing will surprise me, and we will carry the raid. I just need to learn how to kick it up enough to carry 3-4 incompetent raiders.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Mon, 21 May 2012 10:50:02 EDT

anon posted : Thanks for sharing that Navy. I'm glad that I'm not an officer of my guild, because it has had its share of stuff like that, and I don't want to deal with it myself. I think the problem with a player like that is his (lack of) desire to improve, his (lack of) willingness to take coaching, and (lack of) placing the needs of the raid over his personal loot greed. I think too many players think talents / gear / gemming / reforging / enchanting is the be all and end all of Wow, but there is so much more to it. A good player in crappy gear outperforms a crappy player in good gear any day. Gear just provides resources - and the good player using limited resources to their maximum is still better than the crappy player misusing abundant resources to provide only a fraction of its potential.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Sat, 19 May 2012 22:05:53 EDT

navymaverick posted : She was a mage... dime-a-dozen

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Sat, 19 May 2012 22:00:28 EDT

mettachain posted : I'm glad the raid group (guild) got rid of the baddie. giving gear to those undeserving of it is counterproductive. the baddie will continue to leech and bring morale of the group down the longer he/she is with them. it's a game but it is a game in which the mentality of raiders is to progress and be cognisent of everything going on. showing the overhealing to the person who was removed or told they are not getting gear goes above what i've seen others do, and I myself have done. i'd just boot that person and let them figure out why they were gone. luckily the wifey was just a dps, probably a boomkin at that point in time which is easily replaced...
--
I'm not loafing. I work so fast I'm always finished.
If idiots could fly, this would be an airport.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Sat, 19 May 2012 21:47:42 EDT

navymaverick posted : We used to have one healer with the lowest heals in the raid (wrath era raids). Since we could easily 24 or 23 man it then we didnt worry too much about it nor did we even care to see what was broken. It was later when he was bitching that he deserved better gear based on being the lowest heals and constantly going OOM, we compared "GS to HPS" and his massive over-heals to show how much he really sucked. I mean the pally off tank healed more then he did in some phases.

What he was doing was facerolling to heals and a bubble on the off tank and nothing more. He never bothered to target anyone else, he never had any HUDs or mouse overs that allowed him to see everyone's health. He spammed the heals even when his target was topped off and not taking damage. When he still demanded more welfare gear (we were on DKP system) they finally gave him his pink slip and unfortunately his wife (good DPS) followed him in a huff.

I know this does not help your question pornboob. It only goes to show there are those who do not belong in raids as you know because they dont give a shit about what they do or do not try to do. I am glad to see you are looking for every opportunity to get as great as you can be. I just thought everyone might enjoy the story.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Sat, 19 May 2012 21:35:05 EDT

mettachain posted : the biggest problem is clickers. too focused on their bars GCD so they can mouse click the next button on the action bar. they have no raid awareness and sit there click click clicking. they can't even produce solid numbers because when their little addon sounds an alarm when they're standing in fire they have move and can't focus on clicking their action bar. clickers are bad juju in raids. they should just stick to farming herbs/ore and leave the big boss killing to the people with a brain and who can use more than 4 fingers to play this game. just because there's a 20% nerf in ds doesn't mean you have a shot at seeing anything past morchock in normal DS now...
--
I'm not loafing. I work so fast I'm always finished.
If idiots could fly, this would be an airport.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 20:40:01 EDT

anon posted :

said by defton5198:

If you watch some mikpreachwow videos on youtube he talks about what it takes to raid with Method. He was in Method in Wrath or BC and is now a trial with the guild. When new content comes out they expect their main raid group to take 7-9 days off of work and spend at least 20 hours a day raiding to complete the content. That is another reason they have world top ten kills.

Wow. This is exactly what I'm looking for. Thanks Defton!

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 13:16:27 EDT

anon posted : Yes. I'm a competent raider, and as I said, my raid does DS10N in about 2 hours with maybe a wipe or two. We have done Morchok H, but haven't really tried the other bosses H yet because we have been running both mains and alts through DS, and getting the legendary staff, so we need to complete a full run on any raid night. I've looked at most of the typical resources: Icy-veins, Tankspot, Magecraft, WoW forums, and others that don't come to mind immediately. That's why I'm asking about ADVANCED tips and tricks - I think I have a pretty good grasp of the stuff most casual raiders know. If we were talking baseball, I'd say I'm beer league good, and am hoping to improve to semi-pro good. I'm not even hoping to get to the minor leagues, but just wanting to find ways of playing better.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 13:08:01 EDT

cigtyme posted : Watch Vodka Method Paragon videos. Google Deathwing video from a "enter class here".

In FL we were stuck at Bethalac. I know don't judge me lol. Our hunters couldn't solo the little dudes. I googled Bethalac surv hunter videos. and Voila. It should how to solo them. I gave ths info to our hunter, he watched it and understood it. We havent wiped to beth since that day.

This isnt a tip. it is an example. There are almost too many ways to improve to list them here. It is almost a "as it happens basis". Figure out how to handle situations will help you out alot trying to get to their level. But no one on here has that kind of info. IF we did we would be in Vodka and not on this forum page.
--
Cigtyme - Alliance - Galakrond - Draneri Arcane Mage
GM and RL of Exalted with Chuck Norris (Before damn Commercial)
"What the hell man, wipe it, we fricken can't heal this damn thing to death"

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:58:57 EDT

Immer posted : Have you watched videos on L2Raid and read through Icy-veins.com strats? I cannot help beyond that because I'm still trying to get my guild through 10M blackhorn normal.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:53:40 EDT

anon posted :

said by Immer:

Register an account, and send this type of sidebar via private message. I don't think it is necessary to post in the thread proper. Now I need to respond to it... the major problem with getting yourself heard is one of scale. Empirically I fully agree with your assertions; however, what you are espousing in this thread is most relevant for those moving from non-raider to competent raider. Given the title of this thread is Vodka vs Method... I can see where the naysayers have solid footing in feeling the need to limit your expectations of results from providing guidance... you can't blog someone to the level of Vodka or Method raiding skill without hours of gametime.

My apologies to the forum and Cig in particular for my last remark. I know stuff on forums comes across in ways not intended, and should not have made a personal attack.

As far as my expectations are concerned, I've repeatedly said right from the initial responses that I don't expect to get to Vodka / Method level -- I'm just hoping to learn something from the way they and other pro guilds do things that may improve my conceptual framework and help me advance as a player and a raider. Their race just inspired me to ask. I'll just give up on this thread and maybe post a more limited question like "anyone have any pro-tips on raid awareness" or somesuch somewhere else.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:51:58 EDT

Immer posted :

said by JB:

I actually gave what I thought was pretty good starting off advice

it was the equivalent of saying "buy low, sell high" to someone looking for advanced goblin AH techniques. You were being dismissive... most of us ignore it because we've learned to expect it from you.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:49:36 EDT

JB posted : I actually gave what I thought was pretty good starting off advice and he jumped all over me. More or less what I said would get you through most content.

DPS that doesn't stand in shit and put up good numbers you will be amazed at how far that will take you.
--
Here's the final bullet,
to put our love to death.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:47:26 EDT

Immer posted : actually, your first comment to his post was overly dismissive (an attempt to steal the wind from his sails). Your assertion was that there was nothing left to know about DS; therefore, he was asking for tips to riding a bike.

I can see where that might put someone on the defensive.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:42:47 EDT

JB posted :

said by cigtyme:

Yes i apologize for being stearn and somewhat rude. I was under the impression that you were looking for shortcuts to become a great raider.

He is, see my hand holding comment. At the same time, he's an AMAZING player, but yet there's just gotta be 'tips and tricks' that he doesn't know that will make him AMAZING.
--
Here's the final bullet,
to put our love to death.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:36:57 EDT

cigtyme posted : Yes i apologize for being stearn and somewhat rude. I was under the impression that you were looking for shortcuts to become a great raider. There is no shortcut for that. Advice on becoming a great raider, or tips, :toon knowledge, situational awareness, targeting macros, trial and error on bosses, converse with like toons for info, and finally every descision in WoW has repocussions. There are many others as well. You are like a WoW surgeon. Whatever boss is on your operating table getting cut up, you have to know exactly how to handle each crisis as they come up. Being Proactive instead of reactive is the best way i can describe it.
--
Cigtyme - Alliance - Galakrond - Draneri Arcane Mage
GM and RL of Exalted with Chuck Norris (Before damn Commercial)
"What the hell man, wipe it, we fricken can't heal this damn thing to death"

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:34:52 EDT

Immer posted : Register an account, and send this type of sidebar via private message. I don't think it is necessary to post in the thread proper. Now I need to respond to it... the major problem with getting yourself heard is one of scale. Empirically I fully agree with your assertions; however, what you are espousing in this thread is most relevant for those moving from non-raider to competent raider. Given the title of this thread is Vodka vs Method... I can see where the naysayers have solid footing in feeling the need to limit your expectations of results from providing guidance... you can't blog someone to the level of Vodka or Method raiding skill without hours of gametime.
--
Immergruen (resto/kitty) on Nathrezim Server (US)
Guild leader for Pride and Ego

than/then | to/two/too | A lot (notice the space in there) | you/your/you're

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:26:46 EDT

anon posted : Particularly frustrating because Cig is asking for and getting helpful tips on other threads, but he seems bound and determined to discourage me from learning. I probably just made the topic too vague and open ended.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:24:36 EDT

anon posted :

said by cigtyme:

THE BEST WAY TO RAID BETTER IS A COMPLETE UNDERSTANDING OF YOUR CLASS AND A COMPLETE UNDERSTANDING OF THE MECHANICS OF EACH PARTICULAR FIGHT!!!

Exactly. And every trick and tip adds a little to the complete understanding. The better the understanding, the better the practice, the faster I become a better player, and the raid progresses. There's stuff the pros know and I don't, and if I learn even a little of what they know, that adds to my complete understanding. Telling me I need to practice more adds nothing.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:16:44 EDT

Immer posted : don't take it as an attack on you, ciggy... just a word of encouragement for poornoob.

carry-on, gentlemen... carry on.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 12:15:37 EDT

cigtyme posted : I never said u cannot do it. Anything is possible or attainable. There is a reason some people get world first and some are stuck at 2/8 Heroic like myself. The best advice i can give you, or tip, is every button push has a result. Knowing the results of each buttonpush and understanding it will ultamately make you a better player. THE BEST WAY TO RAID BETTER IS A COMPLETE UNDERSTANDING OF YOUR CLASS AND A COMPLETE UNDERSTANDING OF THE MECHANICS OF EACH PARTICULAR FIGHT!!!
--
Cigtyme - Alliance - Galakrond - Draneri Arcane Mage
GM and RL of Exalted with Chuck Norris (Before damn Commercial)
"What the hell man, wipe it, we fricken can't heal this damn thing to death"

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 11:42:46 EDT

Immer posted : I feel ya... focus on the ones you can help... ignore the naysayers.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 11:35:37 EDT

anon posted : Not mad - frustrated that the attitude on here seems to be "you can't do it, don't bother to try." If nobody knows, nobody knows, and I'm good with that. But having 4 or 5 different people post variations of "they practice a lot, you don't, too bad for you" is simply unhelpful, and discourages other people from posting something constructive. I'd have preferred nobody replied at all.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 11:30:28 EDT

anon posted : Correction: Thanks Defton for the tip on the vid. I haven't had a chance to look at it yet, but I will!

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 11:21:10 EDT

JB posted : y r u so mad

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 11:10:42 EDT

anon posted :

said by Kearnstd:

some players are only better at raiding because they can spend so much time at it. This is why EU guilds are many times the world first leaders. They get lots more vacation time(usually by law), if they know an expansion is coming out they might burn two weeks of their time stash for the release. This means they can put in those 18hr playing sessions to be max lev in two or three days, it means they can start hitting raiding while most of us have gained two levels. They also play beta full time once they get their primary crew into the beta and the beta has raids they are raiding there too so they go into live already knowing the basic framework. Most of us have to read the beta stuff or learn it as we go in.

YES I GET THAT ALREADY. BUT HOW DOES THAT MAKE MY WANTING TO LEARN FROM WHAT THEY DO AND TRY IT FUTILE? What I'm asking is conceptually no different from watching the beta vids, and picking up their strats, but it's the next step up. I'm asking if anyone knows how they think about raids, and problem solving. I'm hoping that by learning this, even a little bit, I (and maybe other people here) can take the next step, or at least be able to go in with a better plan, and execute better after 20 trys instead of blindly going in with a bad noob plan and pounding my head against the wall wipe after wipe. I GET THAT I CAN'T GET AS GOOD AS THEY ARE WITHOUT 300 HOURS OF DUNGEON TIME. I'M NOT TRYING TO GET AS GOOD AS THEY ARE -- I'M TRYING TO GET BETTER THAN I AM FASTER THAT I WOULD BY JUST BLINDLY GOING IN TIME AFTER TIME. Practice doesn't help if you're not practicing something, and hurts if you practice it wrong. I'm trying to figure out what to practice.

At this point, I'm wasting my time on here. All the responses I've gotten have been "they practice a lot, and we don't". Well DUH. Either nobody on here knows, or they don't want to share. I just hope someone was able to learn something from what I've shared.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 11:01:02 EDT

JB posted : Lmfao.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 10:51:37 EDT

Kearnstd posted : some players are only better at raiding because they can spend so much time at it. This is why EU guilds are many times the world first leaders. They get lots more vacation time(usually by law), if they know an expansion is coming out they might burn two weeks of their time stash for the release. This means they can put in those 18hr playing sessions to be max lev in two or three days, it means they can start hitting raiding while most of us have gained two levels. They also play beta full time once they get their primary crew into the beta and the beta has raids they are raiding there too so they go into live already knowing the basic framework. Most of us have to read the beta stuff or learn it as we go in.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Thu, 17 May 2012 10:34:21 EDT

anon posted :

said by cigtyme:

So instead of a monster crit Arcane Blast you will perfect an iceblock lol.

Yes, actually, because sometimes that's what the situation calls for. My raid team learned to do iceblock pulls on Lady Deathwhisper trash. The mage would blink into the middle of the trash, do a couple of AoE pulses, then iceblock. The trash would then collapse on him, and everyone else would AoE the bejeezus out of them. Took us about 10 seconds to clear the trash, instead of the 5-10 minutes a conventional pull required. A monster crit arcane blast in that situation would just have everything running everwhere, and wipe the raid. Take that and put it in your bag of tricks -- unless you think that's something only Vodka or Method can pull off, and only after they're heroic geared.

Despite your negativity and feeble attempts to mock me, I will always try to learn how to play smarter, and try to help those around me play smarter. If you don't want to play smarter, that's your choice; but don't narrow-mindedly try to drag me down with you.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 22:03:30 EDT

cigtyme posted : So instead of a monster crit Arcane Blast you will perfect an iceblock lol.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 18:34:03 EDT

anon posted : One other coment: The responses seem to think I'm asking for tips in hopes of an easy shortcut to becoming as good as Vodka and Method. Really, the race made me realize how weak my skills are, and have inspired me to improve much the way watching, say, watching Blake Griffin doing a monster slam might inspire a kid to practice basketball. I don't think I will ever become as good as they are, but that doesn't mean I can't learn from what they do. Maybe I don't have the physical skills to do a monster jam, but that doesn't mean I can't learn to do a pick-and-roll.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 15:42:48 EDT

anon posted :

said by cigtyme:

Look i will agree tip or tricks can be learned to be a better raider, but this also goes with bring the player, not the class. Some players are just better. Kind of like Speed for an athlete. It is not something really learned, you either have it or not. Sure you can work on getting faster, but really it is something you are born with. Just like being good at activities like WoW. Some people you can explain the button boss to 100 times and they still die to the button boss 50% of the time or greater. Then take this to the next level of Heroics an oh my. The heroic button boss adds another person out and more fading lights. It is a recipe for disaster.

My thinking is we can argue all we want about this, but i truly feel some people are just better at raiding then others. The lacking players can learn tips, tricks, and spend time practicing, but some people will just "get it" faster.

I don't dispute anything you are saying; but you're giving up without trying, and worse, arguing that it's useless for me or anyone else to try. Show me how to grip the cutter, and I'll try throwing it; maybe I'll get it, maybe I won't. It may be that I just don't have the physical talent, but can understand how the cutter works and can teach it to someone else. Maybe I'll be able to throw a passable cutter that gets a swing an miss every once in a while. Or maybe, once I understand how to grip the ball, I'll be the next Mariano Rivera. But if nobody teaches me and I never try to learn, I've failed before I started. Isn't the whole point of this type of listserv to share knowledge? If nobody here knows and can't figure it out, I'm good with that -- but don't tell me it's useless even to try!

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 14:40:26 EDT

Immer posted :

said by cigtyme:

i truly feel some people are just better at raiding than others. The lacking players can learn tips, tricks, and spend time practicing, but some people will just "get it" faster.

Agreed. That does not preclude the need to share tips, tricks, and starts... it merely implies the reduction of expectation might be in order.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 14:18:18 EDT

cigtyme posted : Look i will agree tip or tricks can be learned to be a better raider, but this also goes with bring the player, not the class. Some players are just better. Kind of like Speed for an athlete. It is not something really learned, you either have it or not. Sure you can work on getting faster, but really it is something you are born with. Just like being good at activities like WoW. Some people you can explain the button boss to 100 times and they still die to the button boss 50% of the time or greater. Then take this to the next level of Heroics an oh my. The heroic button boss adds another person out and more fading lights. It is a recipe for disaster.

My thinking is we can argue all we want about this, but i truly feel some people are just better at raiding then others. The lacking players can learn tips, tricks, and spend time practicing, but some people will just "get it" faster.
--
Cigtyme - Alliance - Galakrond - Draneri Arcane Mage
GM and RL of Exalted with Chuck Norris (Before damn Commercial)
"What the hell man, wipe it, we fricken can't heal this damn thing to death"

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 13:27:24 EDT

Immer posted :

said by Poornoob :

Yes, I have no doubt that the time spent in dungeon is the single biggest factor in their skill level and learning raiding skills. But, I also think knowing a tip or skill and understanding what it is about speeds up the learning process....

As a corollary to your argument, some activities (like golf and tennis) are prone to development of horrible habits when practiced without proper foreknowledge. In the case of golf, you may spend months unlearning what you "taught yourself" at the driving range... when a few hours of lessons would have avoided the problems in the first place.

However, some tips are meaningless the would-be raider, until said raider has actually seen the mechanic a couple of times... then they get their light-bulb moment, and all is well with the raid.
--
Immergruen (resto/kitty) on Nathrezim Server (US)
Guild leader for Pride and Ego

than/then | to/two/too | A lot (notice the space in there) | you/your/you're

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 11:05:44 EDT

cigtyme posted : No matter what time spent is the key not holding a damn ball. If you learn a tip on hold the damn ball, it still takes time throwing this damn ball to perfect it. Just with a tip you will not perfectly execute a cutter, after 1000 cutters you should know how to throw it correctly.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 10:59:30 EDT

Jakiel00 posted :

said by Threatco:

Pornboob is right.

If only that was really his name...That would be funny
--
There cannot be a crisis next week. My schedule is already full.
- Henry Kissinger

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 10:00:27 EDT

cymraeg posted : that is true but just because you know how to hold the ball, if you cant practice it for the amount of time you need to perfect it what help does it really give you, and if your teammates arent up to speed with you then you being that much better than they are just makes it frustrating to you and them.
--
Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau!
I've lost the bleeps, I've lost the creeps and I've lost the sweeps.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Wed, 16 May 2012 01:23:33 EDT

Threatco posted : Pornboob is right.

Lot's of things you can learn. Lot's of ways to get rusty and lazy.

Some people think they are good when really they have never been a group that does anything hard. And so they have no reason to improve.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Tue, 15 May 2012 17:14:15 EDT

anon posted : Yes, I have no doubt that the time spent in dungeon is the single biggest factor in their skill level and learning raiding skills. But, I also think knowing a tip or skill and understanding what it is about speeds up the learning process. You might as well say "if you want to learn pitch, you have to spend your time pitching." That's true, but you'll learn faster, and understand what you are doing better, and have to do fewer problems, if you have a conceptual grasp of what you're doing rather than just blindly throwing ball after ball. How much faster will you learn to pitch if someone shows you how to grip a cutter? If someone shares that tip with me on attempt 10, I can start practicing that grip instead of trying to figure out "what's a cutter?" Am I the only one that gets that????

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Tue, 15 May 2012 14:38:23 EDT

cigtyme posted : No matter what pro tips you bring up, the one thing these "pros" have on us is hours spent raiding. You cannot duplicate time. They spend more time in the beta learning these fights than regular guilds will spend the whole time the current patch is active. I know your little tips may help, but time is the reason the VODKA's of the world can down it in 1 hour. Time also teaches these tricks you speak of. They have been beta farming this while you were still on Shannox.
--
Cigtyme - Alliance - Galakrond - Draneri Arcane Mage
GM and RL of Exalted with Chuck Norris (Before damn Commercial)
"What the hell man, wipe it, we fricken can't heal this damn thing to death"

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Tue, 15 May 2012 14:32:59 EDT

anon posted :

said by JB:

Sadly, there's not much left aside from not stand in fire, memorize your 3 button rotation and make sure you have good coordinated healers...... Anything you can do to make the raid easier = a good idea. Use cooldowns that aren't being, maximize damage output, multi-dotting, etc.

To a point you can't always have someone holding your hand, you have to think for yourself, the above is a solid start though.

Frankly, there's plenty more than this. For example, on fights where adds are going to pop, as a dps or off-tank, I'll change my camera angle so I can see the spawn location, which allows me to locate that much faster than if I'm looking straight ahead at the boss. I suspect that's a trick that most non-pro raiders don't use. On fights with multiple targets, I'll have a targeting macro that will automatically go to the highest priority target. That's 2 tips that every raider can put in his play book. Add that to being completely spacially aware of the fight area, being in position ahead of the mechanic instead of reacting to it, and being aware of AoE maximixing situations from my prior posts, and that's five tips on raiding over and above don't stand in the fire.

Here are more tips: Call out when you're accepting a b-rez so the healers are ready to top you off; Warriors should prioritize heroic leap over intercept or charge when switching targets because of the damage it does; if you have a dk on a fight where you have to prevent something from getting somewhere, use deathgrip when it is close to where it's trying to get to.

I'm sure that pro tanks have tricks on how to position the boss that are way above facing him away from the raid; pro melee have tricks on how to move from one target to the next quickly; maybe there are tips on how to group the raid, etc. It's knowing these little things that turn your typical LFR doofus into a real raider, and a real raider into a pro.

I'm not talking about hand-holding. I'm talking about adding to my toolbag so maybe when my raid is struggling on something, I can say "hey, why don't we try this?" Yeah, a lot of this is knowing your class, and everyone else's class on top of that. Maybe my question is just too general; or maybe everyone thinks what they know is just too obvious; or maybe people on here haven't really thought about it. But specific recurring cases can be distilled into general principles that can be applied to different situations. That's what I'm asking about.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Tue, 15 May 2012 13:47:27 EDT

Immer posted : So far, Blackhorn has been the first fight where I simply cannot talk the raid through the fight. Can't happen. We discuss everyone's role... then give it a go... review what went wrong, try again. Hope to give it a try again this week.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Tue, 15 May 2012 11:37:02 EDT

JB posted : Sadly, there's not much left aside from not stand in fire, memorize your 3 button rotation and make sure you have good coordinated healers...... Anything you can do to make the raid easier = a good idea. Use cooldowns that aren't being, maximize damage output, multi-dotting, etc.

To a point you can't always have someone holding your hand, you have to think for yourself, the above is a solid start though.
--
Here's the final bullet,
to put our love to death.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Tue, 15 May 2012 11:13:59 EDT

anon posted : I certainly don't expect to get to their level -- I don't have that much time to put in, and even if I did, my guild doesn't -- but I was hoping that ppl might have some insight beyond don't stand in the fire and know the kill order.

For example, in the Blackhorn fight, they kited the Vykrul to whichever drake was reeled into the deck, so they could take advantage of AoEs. My guild tanks had been tanking the two Vykul together, but hadn't been dragging them to the drake. A general principle that all raiders could learn from that is to look for opportunities to maximize AoE on multiple adds.

I'm sure I'll look at the vid again at some point, but it'd be nice to know what I'm looking for.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Tue, 15 May 2012 10:37:39 EDT

stiki posted : They had another one of these last weekend. With blood legion stars paragon and some russian guild. You might want to check out if the vod is out. I was surprised at how popular it was there was over 50k people watching the stream.

Re: Vodka v Method heroic mode DS race

Mon, 14 May 2012 22:53:51 EDT

defton5198 posted : If you watch some mikpreachwow videos on youtube he talks about what it takes to raid with Method. He was in Method in Wrath or BC and is now a trial with the guild. When new content comes out they expect their main raid group to take 7-9 days off of work and spend at least 20 hours a day raiding to complete the content. That is another reason they have world top ten kills.