dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
16000
share rss forum feed

adam_fd

join:2012-05-30
Saint-Laurent, QC
reply to adam_fd

Re: "Rogers is not required to honour what an agent says&qu

Well, I just got a call back from the Office of the President.

Not the result I was hoping for.

OotP: "I don't believe you that the agent offered this credit ongoing"

I suggested that we listen to the recording, since it is the best evidence available about my agreement with Rogers. (The notes in my account are of a secondary nature that I never had the opportunity to read or approve.)

OotP: "I can't listen to the call because I'm uncertain of the legality of it"

I suggested that we clarify with the legal department before proceeding. I was put on hold for a few minutes.

OotP: "We're not going to honour the credit, regardless of what the agent offered you"

This doesn't look good for me. I hope Nicolas from the Social Media team has more luck.

At this point, my problem is ENTIRELY about the principle involved, which is that Rogers can promise one thing and do another.

While I wait for Nicolas I'll start typing an e-mail to Kim Walker.

*sigh*


bt

join:2009-02-26
canada
kudos:1

said by adam_fd:

While I wait for Nicolas I'll start typing an e-mail to Kim Walker.

Failing that, file with the CCTS.

PX Eliezer7
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
reply to adam_fd

said by adam_fd:

Well, I just got a call back from the Office of the President.

Not the result I was hoping for.

OotP: "I don't believe you that the agent offered this credit ongoing"

I suggested that we listen to the recording, since it is the best evidence available about my agreement with Rogers. (The notes in my account are of a secondary nature that I never had the opportunity to read or approve.)

OotP: "I can't listen to the call because I'm uncertain of the legality of it"

I suggested that we clarify with the legal department before proceeding. I was put on hold for a few minutes.

OotP: "We're not going to honour the credit, regardless of what the agent offered you"

It is inconceivable that they would do this.

Why are they risking extensive bad publicity to their name rather than just doing the right thing?

Why are they so stubbornly defending what is undefendable?

Rogers reputation is so bad that it is already 50 miles below the earth's surface. I guess they want to make it 500.

adam_fd

join:2012-05-30
Saint-Laurent, QC

And this is to someone who has been a loyal customer for 11 years. Imagine how they treat the new customers...


bt

join:2009-02-26
canada
kudos:1

said by adam_fd:

And this is to someone who has been a loyal customer for 11 years. Imagine how they treat the new customers...

Better. New customers are more likely to switch.

Ditch the loyalty. They'll treat you better that way.

adam_fd

join:2012-05-30
Saint-Laurent, QC

Right now I'm waiting for a callback from
- Nicolas from the Social Media team
- The Ombuds Office

The Office of the President was thoroughly unhelpful, although they were much more polite about it than anyone else.



Davesnothere
No-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
Premium
join:2009-06-15
START Today!
kudos:7
reply to PX Eliezer7

said by PX Eliezer7:

....Rogers' reputation is so bad that it is already 50 miles below the earth's surface. I guess they want to make it 500.

 
You're getting WARMer !

adam_fd

join:2012-05-30
Saint-Laurent, QC

I invented a new hashtag on Twitter: #RogersBrokenPromises.

I'm inviting everyone to pile on here.

Let's keep this thread entirely about:
- Broken promises made by Rogers, with all the juicy details
- Your efforts to fix them and how they have worked or failed miserably
- Witty or sarcastic comments about the above
- Short, funny comments of a general nature

Beyond the normal moderator rules, I'd like to propose:
- Absolutely no defamation
- No accusations that we can't support
- No name calling

Remember to tell your friends!



sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
Ottawa
kudos:13
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile
·TekSavvy Cable

I almost hate to say this, but like so many such efforts before it, Rogers and Bell don't give a flying fig about this kind of bad publicity. They've ignored sites like RogersSucks and similar although they did try buying up one negative connotation domain name! Like so many others, I tend now to ignore such efforts because they have no effect.

Basically, when you get to their size with a monopolistic position, they don't care. They do seem to listen to Ellen Roseman (Torstar) but not a lot else.

Rogers don't care attitude essentially brought down the "Residential Broadband Users Association" (RBUA) who at one time seemed to have at least some influence, but back when they started to implement caps they seemed like they were listening but went ahead with caps anyway. It caused considerable upset amongst the RBUA people to the point where they gave up, and this was no small for the time organisation.



swintec
Premium,VIP
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·VoicePulse
·Sprint Mobile Br..
·RapidVPS
reply to adam_fd

Do they have any way on there end to show that this was promised to you for the life of your account? Documented anywhere on their end, etc? Anything short of the recording that you have on your end?

Just trying to look at it from both ways, what is there to stop anyone else from calling in and saying such and such feature was promised for life of account?

What would prevent me and a friend from putting together an audio file of a "Rogers call" and saying the feature was promised? Not saying you did this but it certainly would not be hard to do. I am assuming this is why they excused your audio due to no incident ID or whatever they called it.

What if the agent you had was found to be giving features out like candy and that is why they fired him / her and they are going back to fix the agents wrong doing?

Basically, I can see where they are coming from if it isnt documented anywhere on their side. Really how are they to know? How are they to believe you, if you have the only proof with an audio file, over many others who call in and try to work the system negatively?
--
Usenet Block Accounts | Unlimited Accounts



rogerssmoger

@start.ca
reply to adam_fd

Your call from the OOP was your followup from the social media team. The SMT can't do anything themselves and pass everything to the OOP or another dept. You will get no different outcome if the SMT even contacts you back since they passed you to the OOP.



rogerssmoger

@start.ca
reply to adam_fd

Going the CCTS route may work but unlikely as if what Rogers says is true and there are no notes then really there is nothing that you lost in there eyes. CCTS cannot force Rogers to give you something and a $5 credit is a money loss to Rogers. Plus if the credit is still on the account they will not do anything until it expires because you are getting what you were promised. They don't deal with what may/could/will happen down the road.

And the media won't do anything over a $5 credit.


adam_fd

join:2012-05-30
Saint-Laurent, QC
reply to swintec

said by swintec:

Do they have any way on there end to show that this was promised to you for the life of your account? Documented anywhere on their end, etc? Anything short of the recording that you have on your end?

That's an excellent observation, but it (in my opinion) is entirely Rogers' responsibility to keep records. Considering that the life of their agreements is often up to 3 years, it would be reasonable to expect recordings to be kept that long.

said by swintec:

Just trying to look at it from both ways, what is there to stop anyone else from calling in and saying such and such feature was promised for life of account?

Rogers is in no position to question the reliability of my copy when they had the opportunity to keep their own.

Consider a written contract signed by two parties. If one party destroys their copy and a dispute arises, they are not in a position to say "My contract didn't indicate that."

XaXiS

join:2009-08-15
Canada Eh
reply to adam_fd

For my issue I'm expecting a call today from the "Office of the President" after i emailed their ombudsman regarding my issue.
Who knows where it will go from there. If they aren't willing to grant a 5 dollar credit, I bet they won't replace my defective iphones.


bt

join:2009-02-26
canada
kudos:1
reply to swintec

said by swintec:

Do they have any way on there end to show that this was promised to you for the life of your account? Documented anywhere on their end, etc? Anything short of the recording that you have on your end?

They will have a recording of the call.


swintec
Premium,VIP
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·VoicePulse
·Sprint Mobile Br..
·RapidVPS

said by bt:

said by swintec:

Do they have any way on there end to show that this was promised to you for the life of your account? Documented anywhere on their end, etc? Anything short of the recording that you have on your end?

They will have a recording of the call.

Can they not find it because there is no "Interaction ID" or whatever they call it?
--
Usenet Block Accounts | Unlimited Accounts

bt

join:2009-02-26
canada
kudos:1

said by swintec:

said by bt:

said by swintec:

Do they have any way on there end to show that this was promised to you for the life of your account? Documented anywhere on their end, etc? Anything short of the recording that you have on your end?

They will have a recording of the call.

Can they not find it because there is no "Interaction ID" or whatever they call it?

They said they wouldn't listen to it for that reason.

No - they'll have their own recording of it. And they COULD call it up. They just refuse to do so.

camelot

join:2008-04-12
Whitby, ON
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..
·TekSavvy Cable
reply to adam_fd

In the end, your money feeds them.

It is YOUR choice whether to continue to do business with them. If you begin giving them their walking papers; you might not get your 100 long distance minutes- but you might get other discounts.

Yes principle, but it's likely time to move on from this and either fish or cut bait. Arguing with them over this will likely get you no where.



Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to sbrook

said by sbrook:

Basically, when you get to their size with a monopolistic position, they don't care.

In what conceivable way is Rogers Wireless a monopoly? There are 6 independent companies providing service on 5 different cell networks in Toronto alone, and Rogers Wireless only had a national marketshare of roughly one third in 4Q11, and I suspect that's falling as the new entrants grow and spread to new markets.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org


BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile

+1

I was just talking long distance rates in another thread. What long distance destinations are you calling?

Besides Videotron and Public there are no proper new entrants in Quebec.

But for unlimited airtime voice only use Koodo has amazing rates: »help.koodomobile.com/coverage-lo···distance

For the countries we need long distance rates are cheaper than Wind and cheaper than most voip I have looked at. I have been searching for something like this for a few days now because my brother is moving to Montreal at the end of this summer and will need home coverage in 2 provinces and needs reasonably priced outgoing voice access to Italy, France, and Poland. He should definitely save a lot of $$ with this versus undependable calling cards or VoIP.


RogersNick

join:2011-12-20
reply to adam_fd

Hi Adam,

Sorry about that. I haven't received any message on my end but I'd still like to offer help. I'm sending you a new IM to look into it.



sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
Ottawa
kudos:13
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile
·TekSavvy Cable
reply to Guspaz

Guspaz ... certainly in the wireless market you're right ... but the reality is that by sheer size they behave as if they are a monopoly. After all they could do what Bell does and buy up the competition ... like Bell bought Virgin. When the other carriers become too much of a thorn in their side, they'll try that game.



BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile

IMO more people should make Robbers feel like there is a thorn in their side. What have they done for you lately? When it comes to Bell or Rogers most people would probably say not much.

There's no reason to stay with power tripping companies that treat you like a door rug.

Go to whatever competition has the best value, even if it's a sub-brand. At least you keep some change in your pocket.


balur

join:2010-04-28
kudos:1
reply to adam_fd

Just a thought.

In all the call centres I've worked for I have never had one where call recordings were consistent / reliable / easy to access. Though I've never worked for a major telecom.

Also customers make wild "I was promised x" claims all the time. 99% of the time they aren't true, or the customer misunderstood the specifics.

If you are depending on a recording to prove your point you should record it yourself. Rogers most likely doesn't see the point of searching through hours of recordings (assuming they record and keep every call) for something that precedence tells them isn't true. If they searched everyone of these claims they'd probably need to hire more people to do it.

Not saying your wrong you may be the exception, but this is the attitude that Rogers probably has.

As for the honouring what an agent says bit... I've personally had to deny credits / freebies that were offered by the agent. It sucks and its a crappy call to have to make, but if we'd be losing money having you as a customer due to some dumbass newbie agent... well we couldn't honour that.


PX Eliezer7
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms

said by balur:

In all the call centres I've worked for I have never had one where call recordings were consistent / reliable / easy to access. Though I've never worked for a major telecom....

....If you are depending on a recording to prove your point you should record it yourself.

I might be wrong, but my strong impression has been that the OP actually did have his own recording, which the company refused to listen to.

said by balur:

Also customers make wild "I was promised x" claims all the time. 99% of the time they aren't true, or the customer misunderstood the specifics....

....As for the honouring what an agent says bit... I've personally had to deny credits / freebies that were offered by the agent. It sucks and its a crappy call to have to make, but if we'd be losing money having you as a customer due to some dumbass newbie agent... well we couldn't honour that.

Well, how on earth can ANY customer deal with ANY company over the phone, in that event?

HOW is the customer supposed to know whether the offer is the official one authorized by company management, or if the agent is telling lies to make a sale?

said by balur:

It sucks and its a crappy call to have to make, but if we'd be losing money having you as a customer due to some dumbass newbie agent... well we couldn't honour that.

Sorry, friend.

It is the company's responsibility to monitor and supervise the agents.

Now, IF a deal were truly unbelievable, then a company may be able to claim that the customer should have realized that it was too good to be true.

But in this case, it was a discount of $ 5 a month on a mobile plan, which is quite believable.

Again, HOW is the customer supposed to know whether the offer is the official one authorized by company management, or if the agent is telling lies to make a sale?

And if a company is allowed to say that, then they could hook in large numbers of customers on purpose, with "deals" that the company later refuses to honor, blaming "rogue agents".


rogerssmoger

@start.ca
reply to balur

All calls are recorded. most with screenshots of the agents screen. And kept 2-3 years.



rogerssmoger

@start.ca
reply to adam_fd

Customer Made Recordings: Can be faked and that is why they do not hold up and Rogers doesn't care to hear them.

2 people calling each other and reading a script could quite easy make a fake recording and then claim it was a real one to get things.
People have attempted to do it in the past.


balur

join:2010-04-28
kudos:1
reply to PX Eliezer7

PX Eliezer, your taking it to an extreme, I was only trying to present an example of call center mentality.

Of course its the company's responsibility to monitor and supervise agents but sometimes mistakes happen, and if it was blatantly stated yes we'd try to do everything we could to accommodate, but it doesn't always work out that way due to high costs involved.

In the past I've had a case where a free rental modem / router broke. Without calling support they went out and purchased a retail kit. The customer then called up demanding a refund for the cost of the modem... without properly understanding the situation the agent thought they were asking for a refund of a modem purchased through us and agreed. However were not going to eat a few hundred dollars cost of retail kit, when no troubleshooting was done on our kit, and sending a replacement free rental out would have been far cheaper.

Mistakes happen. Not saying the poster is wrong, just trying to give context regarding the call center environment.

rogerssmoger, That's a far better call recording system then I've ever gotten to use, best I've had is time estimate and then pull agent calls from that day and listen until I find the right one. Ugh painful. I hadn't even considered that nor have I come across it (that I know of, maybe I was fooled lol), policy makes sense.


PX Eliezer7
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
reply to rogerssmoger

said by rogerssmoger :

Customer Made Recordings: Can be faked and that is why they do not hold up and Rogers doesn't care to hear them.

2 people calling each other and reading a script could quite easy make a fake recording and then claim it was a real one to get things.

People have attempted to do it in the past.

Fine.

Then the company can listen to its own recordings.

This isn't the 1960's when this would involve magnetic tape.

Everything is digital, and the company certainly should be able to pull up the digital record of any calls relating to a particular account, without much trouble.

PX Eliezer7
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
reply to balur

said by balur:

In the past I've had a case where a free rental modem / router broke. Without calling support they went out and purchased a retail kit. The customer then called up demanding a refund for the cost of the modem... without properly understanding the situation the agent thought they were asking for a refund of a modem purchased through us and agreed. However were not going to eat a few hundred dollars cost of retail kit, when no troubleshooting was done on our kit, and sending a replacement free rental out would have been far cheaper.

In that case, I would agree with the company 100 percent.

But I think that's a very different situation....