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nullstring

join:2010-10-16

New to Frontier, what do I need to know?

Frontier DSL as recently become available for my parents. (Only broadband available)

After reading a few threads here, I can see that Frontier is a pretty slimy company.
Is there anything you guys can tell me that will save them in the long run?

They're set to receive Internet Max + Digital Phone Essentials on Friday.
A few things:
-My mother was quoted 12mb. (I literally think this is a lie, but we'll see).
-My mother was told we could purchase our own modem, something I was told was not possible. Is that modem support fee still active? Any comments here?
-What modem should I buy? What kind of service do they have? PPPoE, DHCP, etc?
-Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks


wolfy339

join:2005-04-30
Edmonds, WA

said by nullstring:

A few things:
-My mother was quoted 12mb. (I literally think this is a lie, but we'll see).

I believe 12Mb is with ADSL2+, but is also dependent on wire distance from the CO.

said by nullstring:

-My mother was told we could purchase our own modem, something I was told was not possible. Is that modem support fee still active? Any comments here?

I dont think its stil active, but not 100% positive.

said by nullstring:

-What modem should I buy? What kind of service do they have? PPPoE, DHCP, etc?

This will depend on where you are. In my area (just a little north of Seattle), DHCP is used but I know that PPoE is used in other areas
--
Computer: Antec 850w PSU, ASUS M4A89GTDPRO-USB3, AMD Phenom II x4 955 @ 3.2GHZ, ATI Radeon 5770, SB XFI Fatal1ty, 8GB Kingston DDR3, Windows 7 Ultimate x64, KIS 2010, Samsung SyncMaster 2443BWX, Frontier DSL 768/128 w/ Westell 6100 C90 & Linksys WRT120N

nullstring

join:2010-10-16

Thanks wolfy.

said by wolfy339:

I believe 12Mb is with ADSL2+, but is also dependent on wire distance from the CO.

We are in a very rural area. I'll just have to see I guess. I am certainly going to push the tech to provision as high as he can with the quoted 12mb.

said by wolfy339:

I dont think its stil active, but not 100% positive.

If anyone knows for sure, that would be helpful.

I have a DSL modem I used to use for ATT, I'll bring that with me to see if there is any hopes of getting it to work.

Otherwise, I guess the best plan is to wait for the modem to arrive and see if I can buy one of the same type to replace it.

If anyone knows anything about owning your own modem for frontier, please let me know. If I have to pay the fee either way, it doesn't sound worth the hassle.

Aranarth

join:2011-11-04
Stanwood, MI
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
reply to nullstring

This is my chat with them.

This should help with some of your questions...

Here's my chat with frontier. I highlighted the important bit:

You are now chatting with Debbie

Debbie: Hello, did you know we bundle with DISH network? Ask me how you can receive a 15% discount on your monthly bill with our wonderful triple play!

Debbie: Hello Drew, what is your full address please

Drew: just a second please

Debbie: Thank you

Debbie: Sir, how may I help you?

Drew: I am interested in DSL service for my home

Debbie: 1.000M/384K - VERIFIED is what is available for you

Debbie: The first number is download speed

Drew: any chance of getting anything faster?

Debbie: No I am sorry there is not

Drew: they just put it in

Debbie: I understand, but that is what is verified by the techs to your home

Drew: I should DSL just became available in my area.

Debbie: Sir, I am reading your account right now and this is what is in there

Drew: ok

Drew: how much for installation,monthly fees etc?

Debbie: I can put in the order for you and if you are unhappy you may cancel within 30 dayd

Debbie: days

Drew: how much for installation,monthly fees etc?

Debbie: I am trying to type them out

Drew: oops sorry

Debbie: 34.99 for install fees for a price protection plan, otherwise it is 134.99. The hsi max for a one year term will be 35.99 plus the modem fee of 6.99, or if you get the two year term/contract, then I can get the promotion of 20.00 for the first year and 35.99 for the second year and then the 6.99 modem fee

Debbie: The price protection plan is the term/contract

Drew: $7/mo for the modem? You can BUY modems for $50. Why so much and is it required that i use your provided modem?

Debbie: Yes it is part of our products, and you will still have to pay the modem fee even if you use your own.

Drew: so why not say the actual monthly price is $43/mo?

Debbie: Because all too often customers want to know why they are being charged the modem fee on their bill when a representative has quoted the prices together so we make sure we divide it so the customer will know exactly the charges of internet and modem

Drew: ok so sign up for two years and $35 install fee, and $27.mo for first year. The second year will be $43/mo

Drew: correct?

Debbie: That is in addition to your current phone service and dish, yes.

Drew: that's what I wanted to know. If they come out and find the line can go faster than 1mbs will they give that to me at this price point?

Debbie: Yes, that is correct

Debbie: I will notate your order with this information as well

Drew: thanks. I'll let the wife know and see what she says.

Debbie: Thank you for contacting us at Frontier Communications Live Chat Support, have a wonderful day!


Aranarth

join:2011-11-04
Stanwood, MI
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
reply to nullstring

Debbie: Yes it is part of our products, and you will still have to pay the modem fee even if you use your own.

Drew: ok so sign up for two years and $35 install fee, and $27.mo for first year. The second year will be $43/mo
Debbie: That is in addition to your current phone service and dish, yes.

Those two above are the two most important pieces you need to know.


nullstring

join:2010-10-16

Thanks. Although, I honestly don't know if I can believe their customer service reps.


Aranarth

join:2011-11-04
Stanwood, MI
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..

Yep that's why we have FrontierTim and Smith6612 etc. to help out.

This is a little company that is suddenly 10 times bigger in the space of 6 months. They are still working out the kinks more than a year later. Since management really seems to be on your side I expect them to get it sorted eventually.


EdmondsFios

join:2010-09-02
Edmonds, WA
reply to nullstring

While Frontier has many problems, I don't think the term "slimy" is appropriate. There are a lot of good people working for that company.


Crookshanks

join:2008-02-04
Binghamton, NY
reply to nullstring

YMMV but they waived the fee for me when I brought my own modem. I later transitioned my residential service into commercial service and the $0 fee is even part of my contract.

Pester them enough and they'll waive it for you. Just be polite about it.


nullstring

join:2010-10-16

Maybe not slimy, but then perhaps incompetent?
(Though hard to see them as just incompetent with the way they are screwing over the previous verizon customers by slowing their service and adding fees to "price for life" contracts"

I called today to confirm everything was set for my appointment for setup today. I had a feeling they probably screwed something up, so I made sure to call ahead of time.

Turns out, they did. The previous rep had created an entirely new account instead of simply using the previous one. They had to cancel the order and create another one... which meant that I lost my appointment for today because they were "all booked up", which doesn't even make sense

I was pretty pissed at this point. When you expect them to screw up and then they do, thats pretty bad. I talked to the supervisor and she was completely unsympathetic. Sounded like the life was sucked out of her and she was used to people yelling at her all day. Did not give me hardly any feedback.

Also turns out my mother had to call them 5 times in order to get the pricing that was simply listed on the website.

I'm not surprised in the slightest.

At this point, I have zero confidence in anything they do, and I'll have to call on Monday to make sure the order is again correct.
And I have to be their when the tech installs to make sure they don't make any mistakes and correctly provision.

Seriously, wtf? These guys got to get their shit together.

anyway, Thanks crooksshank. I'll keep that in mind.


EdmondsFios

join:2010-09-02
Edmonds, WA

Perhaps "incompetent" understates it based on your experience.

"Seriously, wtf? These guys got to get their shit together." wraps it up nicely.


rifleman69

join:2006-04-12
Beaverton, OR
reply to Aranarth

said by Aranarth:

Yep that's why we have FrontierTim and Smith6612 etc. to help out.

This is a little company that is suddenly 10 times bigger in the space of 6 months. They are still working out the kinks more than a year later. Since management really seems to be on your side I expect them to get it sorted eventually.

Pretty sure FrontierTim has been shut down by "the man".


Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:24
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..

said by rifleman69:

said by Aranarth:

Yep that's why we have FrontierTim and Smith6612 etc. to help out.

This is a little company that is suddenly 10 times bigger in the space of 6 months. They are still working out the kinks more than a year later. Since management really seems to be on your side I expect them to get it sorted eventually.

Pretty sure FrontierTim has been shut down by "the man".

If that's true, that's quite a bummer. I understand the reason if sensitive company info is being leaked, but if the dudes are simply showing up to help and are being told not to touch DSLReports again, that's quite a shame. The people I've spoken with on this site have truly been a big help in both my understanding of things, and in resolving issues that have cropped up. This isn't for Frontier either. This includes Verizon, and even Time Warner. If it weren't for those folks, me as well as many others would be upset, and probably not being using Verizon, I'd be pulling the plug on my DSL connection with Frontier most likely, which, going with it would include two POTS lines that have been around for years, one of which is a business circuit, both having long distance and unlimited calling on them, and a friend of mine wouldn't be very happy with his Cable service.

It's a bad thing when a common fix is to turn down speeds, replace modem, blame computer. It's another thing to run plant on off-spec statistics or to say there's no problem when packet loss occurs at a consistent rate. At work, while it is a widely different scenario, I can't do break-fixes like that. I'd be sent elsewhere if I did so.


Hank
Searching for a new Frontier
Premium
join:2002-05-21
Burlington, WV
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..

2 edits

Nullstring - based on posts in this forum I can understand how you determined the rating of "slimy." From my own experience Frontier's impression is that every time they failed to arrive for a scheduled visit or failed to resolve the issue I was completely happy with the results. Interesting that I do not share that impression. I have often heard how when they took over from Verizon in WV that the Verizon network was in shambles. That it impacted their ability to provide excellent service statewide. Just a rhetorical question; but if they were providing excellent service prior to acquiring Verizon, why is service still below advertised standards on the original portion of the Frontier network. Based on my experience their standard resolution is to replace the modem (which does not resolve a network issue) or reduce speed (which disguises the network issue). The complaints from Frontiers technical staff, posted in this forum, this is exactly what Verizon did.

Deals and additional charges, based on information posted in this forum, gives one the impression that the customer believed they were provided misleading quotes or the customer was often provided only a portion of the actual cost. I have always demanded a full disclosure of the charges. The process has often been very time consuming and a struggle to obtain, but I eventually receive the correct information.

I do agree that a few of the individuals from Frontiers technical group that have posted here in the past have been very helpful. Some not so helpful.


Crookshanks

join:2008-02-04
Binghamton, NY
reply to Smith6612

said by Smith6612:

If that's true, that's quite a bummer. I understand the reason if sensitive company info is being leaked, but if the dudes are simply showing up to help and are being told not to touch DSLReports again, that's quite a shame.

Might it have something to do with the hostility directed at Frontier on a regular basis by the editorial staff here? I have no idea why Karl holds Frontier in such contempt but I wouldn't want my employees posting here if I was a manager/executive at Frontier.

There's no way for a company to win here; the editorial staff bemoans the likes of Verizon and AT&T because they are too big and act as a mono/duopoly. Simultaneously they bash smaller outfits like Frontier because they don't have enough capital to expand their networks as fast as the big boys.

I've seen Frontier make investments in rural areas around Binghamton that have NO broadband options other than satellite. Karl bashes them because they don't provide FIOS like speeds with these offerings. He has absolutely no understanding of the capital constraints a company like Frontier operates under or how much of a godsend 3.0mbit/s DSL is for someone whose only alternative is high latency/low caps satellite service.


Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:24
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..

1 edit

Well, see that's the thing. I consider the news section of this site along with the forums to be two separate portions of the site. Ultimately, journalism is based on bias and opinion along with a mix of fact checking. It's very hard to maintain a neutral, unbiased, and a non-opinionated front in that sort of business/profession. It's the same thing that goes with putting oneself in another's shoes. Not very easy. As such, while the news articles bash Frontier and the forums mention those articles, Frontier could very well take them with a grain of salt knowing that some of the bashing is due to a lack of insight if they know better than the article does. I can see where a well researched article can "offend" the company though, and that is simply journalism. I do know Karl isn't the only one who holds Frontier in hostility, but I also know there are a bunch of folks who praise Frontier and write about it as such. As the world moves around I say.

Now if Frontier had even the remotest chance of offering FiOS-like speeds in their footprint, I'd love for that but I'm not going to expect it. Better for my well being to keep it meant as a surprise. I do like Frontier as a company, and it's why I am with them. They've never really treated me badly, and much of what I speak of around here as far as my services is based upon a real time experience of my service within a few years time. There are some changes I know they can make practically overnight to correct some backwards thinking, but that is about it. That's where these forums come along. If Frontier checks these forums, hears what people have to say, reach out to them on the forums to find out what's going on, they can improve services. Forums != News Articles.



Hank
Searching for a new Frontier
Premium
join:2002-05-21
Burlington, WV
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..

1 edit
reply to Crookshanks

said by Crookshanks See Profile
Might it have something to do with the hostility directed at Frontier on a regular basis by the editorial staff here? I have no idea why Karl holds Frontier in such contempt but I wouldn't want my employees posting here if I was a manager/executive at Frontier.

Simultaneously they bash smaller outfits like Frontier because they don't have enough capital to expand their networks as fast as the big boys.

I've seen Frontier make investments in rural areas around Binghamton that have NO broadband options other than satellite. Karl bashes them because they don't provide FIOS like speeds with these offerings. He has absolutely no understanding of the capital constraints a company like Frontier operates under or how much of a godsend 3.0mbit/s DSL is for someone whose only alternative is high latency/low caps satellite service.
[/BQUOTE :

It really doesn't make much difference the size of an organization. Frontier knew they were biting off way more than they could handle prior to the acquisition of Verizon. They plowed forward telling the various sates involved they would make improvements and continue to provide high levels of service to the current Frontier customer base. In many areas they did not prior to or after the take over provide a high level of service that they led customer to believe they we going to receive.

Having individuals from management participate in the DSLReports forums works wonder if properly done. I site Cox Communications, the were failing after taking over Media General Cable and they recognized it. They took the heat the was expressed in DSLReports and used it to help identify they areas that they needed to improve. I know this as a fact because I had many conversations with their chief engineer. In my book they are one of the better providers in the U.S. But I do not see Frontier making this effort, I see just the opposite in my area. Additionally Cox advised customers via this DSLReports on their game plan. At first some customers were sceptical, but as Cox began to act upon the plan more customers began to work hand-in-hand with them.

Small company or not it is Frontiers responsibility to make sure they are capable of handling the expanded network. For a company to succeed they have to recognize their shortcomings. It is also their responsibility to treat their customers with a small bit of respect and not just look upon them as a revenue source that shouldn't expect for them to live up to their agreements with those customers.



Hank
Searching for a new Frontier
Premium
join:2002-05-21
Burlington, WV
kudos:2
reply to rifleman69

frontiertim appears to still be active:

»[DSL] DSL is finally in my area..


Crookshanks

join:2008-02-04
Binghamton, NY
reply to Hank

said by Hank:

Small company or not it is Frontiers responsibility to make sure they are capable of handling the expanded network. For a company to succeed they have to recognize their shortcomings. It is also their responsibility to treat their customers with a small bit of respect and not just look upon them as a revenue source that shouldn't expect for them to live up to their agreements with those customers.

*shrug*, I can only speak from my own experiences but I've found Frontier's CSRs to be infinitely more respectful than Verizon's CSRs. As an example, I was charged installation fees for my POTS line when the salesperson assured me I would not be. They waived these fees with a simple phone call. I've had similiar experiences in the past with Verizon and never got any headway out of them no matter how high I escalated the issue. The only way I got satisfaction out of them was to file complaints with the Public Service Commission.

As far as the network, I've seen Frontier make investments in rural areas that Verizon has neglected for decades. In my old hometown (Binghamton) Verizon hasn't deployed a SINGLE remote terminal; if you live more than 15k feet from the CO you are stuck with the local cable monopoly. Frontier by contrast has deployed DSL to virtually their entire footprint; over the last three years remote terminals have popped up all over the place.

The biggest problem I've seen with Frontier is the same problem I've seen with all large/med-sized companies: The left hand has no idea what the right hand is doing. This is why you get different answers depending on which call center you wind up talking to. They need to do better here (I dinged them for it in my review) but it's not as though this a problem that's unique to Frontier.


Hank
Searching for a new Frontier
Premium
join:2002-05-21
Burlington, WV
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..

said by Crookshanks:

*shrug*, I can only speak from my own experiences but I've found Frontier's CSRs to be infinitely more respectful than Verizon's CSRs. As an example, I was charged installation fees for my POTS line when the salesperson assured me I would not be. They waived these fees with a simple phone call. I've had similiar experiences in the past with Verizon and never got any headway out of them no matter how high I escalated the issue. The only way I got satisfaction out of them was to file complaints with the Public Service Commission.

As far as the network, I've seen Frontier make investments in rural areas that Verizon has neglected for decades. In my old hometown (Binghamton) Verizon hasn't deployed a SINGLE remote terminal; if you live more than 15k feet from the CO you are stuck with the local cable monopoly. Frontier by contrast has deployed DSL to virtually their entire footprint; over the last three years remote terminals have popped up all over the place.

The biggest problem I've seen with Frontier is the same problem I've seen with all large/med-sized companies: The left hand has no idea what the right hand is doing. This is why you get different answers depending on which call center you wind up talking to. They need to do better here (I dinged them for it in my review) but it's not as though this a problem that's unique to Frontier.

We are in agreement that we are speaking about our individual experiences. We have not fared as well while speaking with the CSR's. Many have been exceptionally poor and often very rude.

Please don't get me wrong I am no fan of Verizon for reasons other than you mentioned. My comparison was that the poor service that the Frontier technical staff complained about Verizon doing is exactly what they are doing now in our area. Resolutions to trouble tickets are false and I have to believe that this behavior rises up the ladder.

Where you believe its the left hand not knowing what right hand is doing I believe it to be by design. You're correct its not unique to Frontier and I don't condone deliberate poor performance in any organization. But, unfortunately it is the trend today.


wesm
Premium
join:1999-07-29
Redmond, WA
Reviews:
·Frontier FiOS
reply to Crookshanks

said by Crookshanks:

Might it have something to do with the hostility directed at Frontier on a regular basis by the editorial staff here? I have no idea why Karl holds Frontier in such contempt but I wouldn't want my employees posting here if I was a manager/executive at Frontier.

There's no way for a company to win here; the editorial staff bemoans the likes of Verizon and AT&T because they are too big and act as a mono/duopoly. Simultaneously they bash smaller outfits like Frontier because they don't have enough capital to expand their networks as fast as the big boys.

Pretty much this. I'm a Frontier shareholder--via an investment portfolio, not direct, paper shares--and subscriber in Washington state and it's appalling how badly Frontier has been treated by Karl, specifically. Yes, Frontier made some severe missteps early on in the Verizon to Frontier transition, and, for over a solid year, they acted like they didn't know their new business from a hole in the ground. I agreed with Karl's articles, especially when they tried the stunts with the $500 TV install fee, rate hikes, and backing out of franchises in Oregon, all while saying "we're committed to FiOS." But, here's the problem:

Those are all gone.

There is no FiOS install fee any longer, Frontier actively markets all of their services--including FiOS TV--on the FiOS-specific website, television ads ("This $month on Frontier Communications" adverts now feature a tag line that advertises frontierforhome.com), billboards in Kirkland and Everett, and direct mail. Package prices are competitive with Comcast's not-the-promotional-for-6-months-on-a-24-month-contract rates. In the non-FiOS territories, even users here have reported that "hey, Frontier is offering high speed Internet where they didn't before," or increased speeds. Yes, Frontier is pulling some stunts, like people losing higher speeds if they change from Verizon to Frontier-specific packages, and Karl/DSLReports properly reports on those, but they're not willing to acknowledge that Frontier has fixed a lot of problems and is now doing most of what DSLReports has carped about Frontier not doing.

Would I like HBOGO, the extra MLB Extra Innings channels, and real online account maintenance? Yes. Is that a competitive issue versus "Frontier continues to suck in every respect?" Yes.

If I were in Frontier's management, there's no way I'd put my front-line employees in that mess. PR folks, sure; regular CSRs, not a chance.


jh321

@frontiernet.net

Sorry, but I have to disagree. While their CSRs are professional and helpful, Frontier has slowly been flushing FIOS customers here in WA state down the toilet. This week, they shut-down Call Assistant so I no longer get e-mails with the caller ID info when we receive calls. The "updated" website changed recently with the billing changes at least no longer has Verizon's name all over it, but it is just as useless as it was after the takeover. I was hoping we'd at least be able to view and change our service options for TV/phone/Internet services. They also screwed up our auto-pay and charged us for two months after the billing changes. Not a major issue, but just goes to their incompetence.
And all this after shutting down all online/mobile DVR options when they bought us from Verizon. No Android STB remote, no Android DVR app, no web DVR access, no online Guide, etc, etc, etc. And all this after both Verizon and Frontier PROMISED us prior to the takeover that our service would not change.


nullstring

join:2010-10-16

lol, you guys have appeared to have slightly jacked my thread.

The tech came today and our internet is now working. We appear to have been given an PPPoE modem. I forgot to grab the one from my own apartment, so they'll have to use this one for at least a little longer.

On the bright side, our connection is provisioned at 7.1mb, which, while less than 12mb, is more than what I was expecting and will be plenty for my parents.

I will report back with any billing or modem leasing update.