dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
27043
share rss forum feed

Graycode

join:2006-04-17

PayPal demands SSN and DOB for US Residents

Click for full size
Click for full size
I like to keep some cash available in my PayPal account to facilitate buying things on Ebay and other places. When the cash level gets low I just tell them to move $X from a bank account that I told PayPal about. Moving the money takes several days, and my bank also notifies me (using an email address that PayPal knows nothing about).

Today an aging relative asked me to buy something for them that they saw on Ebay. Before doing so I hit the PayPal site to start moving some more cash into my account. But instead of the usual process I was presented with a prompt for Date-Of-Birth and for SSN validation. Huh?

There's NO WAY I'd give that kind of data to PayPal! Upon calling PayPal support, they claimed that they now require DOB and SSN for anyone with a USA address due to the US Patriot Act. Apparently it's either a new requirement or it's something PayPal recently decided to interpret. My complaints and objections went nowhere.

Later I put in an obviously-fake SSN and a well-known historical date as my DOB. But that wasn't helpful because then the site required me to prove it, and the site doesn't have a method to remove it. To "Resolve" the issue (of my originally wanting to add simple funds), they want:

• Photo Id: "To help confirm your identity, please send us a copy of your photo ID that shows your name and address."

• Proof of Address: "To confirm your address, please send us a copy of a bill that shows your name and address. Helpful documents include a utility bill, a cell phone bill, an insurance bill, or a tuition bill."

• Provide Proof of SSN: "Provide documentation that shows your Social Security number. Helpful documents include a copy of your Social Security card, a pay stub, or a government-issued document."

Oh sure ... would you like me to send all that to Russia, China, or to a PO box in India?

Calling PayPal support again was equally futile. When I asked the heavily accented rep whether he'd enter his own SSN into the site, he admitted to not even having a SSN. And yes, it was the real PayPal phone# that I called. It seems like a phony setup but it's really PayPal. Nice, let's just require everything be sent to Timbuktu to insure that any laws protecting US citizens & other residents aren't even relevant.

Because of my wanting to add funds into the PayPal account, my account has been assigned a "Limited" status until and unless I cough up my confidential data. There's no apparent way to get the remaining cash (over $50) out of the PayPal account. I can't buy anything with it and can't transfer it out. They're holding my account as ransom unless I give them full control over my identity. Well that's just not gonna happen.

No internet sites have my SSN, and none have my real DOB. It's important that it stays that way. Maybe I'll loose the $50 but that's much better than loosing control of my identity by disclosing confidential data to web sites like PayPal over which I have no control and little recourse. I've chosen not to participate in most of the breaches that sites like PayPal suffer so very frequently.

I'm hoping that PayPal will eventually come to their senses. I'd love to hear them tell their side of the story to a US judge.

I'll be going back to using my credit cards instead of PayPal for online purchases. At least where the card issuer is a US bank the laws of this land will be applicable. I'm done buying things on Ebay, and the bank account that PayPal knows about will be closed.

Dumb-ass PayPal and awful "The Govt is above God" wording of the Patriot Act (if that's truly related) got me mad today.


sivran
Opera ex-pat
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Irving, TX
kudos:1

Glad I haven't kept a balance in my account in years, then. For the rare case I make a payment through it, I use a virtual credit card number.
--
Think Outside the Fox.



bmetelsky
Premium
join:2005-10-16
Elyria, OH
Reviews:
·Dish Network
·DIRECTV

1 edit
reply to Graycode

said by Graycode:

Later I put in an obviously-fake SSN and a well-known historical date as my DOB. But that wasn't helpful because then the site required me to prove it, and the site doesn't have a method to remove it.

It sounds like you are in the position you are in because you attempted to put in the "fake" information. The notice states that "If you decide not to confirm your personal information, you can always use your bank account to make purchases or send money".

billydunwood

join:2008-04-23
united state
kudos:2

said by bmetelsky:

said by Graycode:

Later I put in an obviously-fake SSN and a well-known historical date as my DOB. But that wasn't helpful because then the site required me to prove it, and the site doesn't have a method to remove it.

It sounds like you are in the position you are in because you attempted to put in the "fake" information. The notice states that "If you decide not to confirm your personal information, you can always use your bank account to make purchases or send money".

I believe your are correct. I use my bank account, and have never been asked for Social Security or DOB. Since my debit card is tied to my checking account, its virtually the same thing.
--
No Victim=No Crime

Graycode

join:2006-04-17
reply to bmetelsky

That's about right. PayPal is instituting a new requirement of SSN and DOB for US residents to add funds from their bank account. They are not requiring SSN and DOB to use linked bank accounts as a form of payment. Yet if their claim of it being required by the Patriot Act is real then it would be very surprising to differentiate for long.

Once a SSN value is given there isn't any way to remove it, cancel it, or un-confirm it. What they want now is for me to give them my real SSN and DOB, and to send them proof (which isn't going to happen). There should at least remain an option to close the account & get a check when they change their policy into something I refuse to agree with. That's probably where it will end up.

Overall though it stinks that confidential data like SSN would be asked for with little regard to individuals' concerns. I wouldn't want to get a "We're Sorry..." notification about being screwed by an accidental disclosure or breach. While there's stricter PCI enforcement for credit card processors, I think PayPal may be too loosely self-regulated. It seems much safer to bail vs. handing over my SSN & DOB. In other words, if they had required SSN and DOB when I joined then I wouldn't have.



Sober
Just Say No
Premium
join:2003-02-24
Crack House
reply to Graycode

It looks to me like all they wanted was the last four of your ssn.

Well since you already gave them fake info, take it another step and doctor up some fake images in photoshop.



Anonymous_
Anonymous
Premium
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to Graycode

said by Graycode:

There's NO WAY I'd give that kind of data to PayPal! Upon calling PayPal support, they claimed that they now require DOB and SSN for anyone with a USA address due to the US Patriot Act. Apparently it's either a new requirement or it's something PayPal recently decided to interpret. My complaints and objections went nowhere.

I think you have been specifically targeted, because I have not been demanded to give up my ssn for my paypal account.
Nor has my sister account been targeted.

maybe you keeping too much money in your account?


Bamafan2277

join:2008-09-20
Jeffersonville, IN
reply to Graycode

When you transfer funds from your Bank to Paypal they are acting as a bank and therfore must follow federal laws. If you were to go to the bank on the corner to setup a account they would want the exact same information.

Step into todays world with paypal and just link your bank account. That way you don't have to wait 3 days for a fund transfer and you just make your purchase and they charge your bank account that same day. I make as many purchases as possible through paypal or my paypal debit card as with my paypal debit card I get 1.5% cash back. All of them go through my bank account just like they would with my debit card but with the paypal card I have double protection from Paypal and my bank.



The Pig
I know you want to be me
Premium
join:2009-09-11
reply to Sober

said by Sober:

It looks to me like all they wanted was the last four of your ssn. Well since you already gave them fake info, take it another step and doctor up some fake images in photoshop.

Yikes!
Don't do that!


EUS
Kill cancer
Premium
join:2002-09-10
canada
reply to Graycode

Taxman wants a cut of the sellers' undeclared earnings.



PCInTech
keeping art alive since 1953
Premium
join:2004-06-07
Massena, NY
kudos:9
reply to Graycode

ok, do you not understand that PayPal is a banking institution and needs legal information about you?



Sober
Just Say No
Premium
join:2003-02-24
Crack House

they aren't fdic insured.



thegeek
Premium
join:2008-02-21
right here
kudos:2

that has nothing to do with the laws requiring them to collect legal information on account holders. a bank doesn't have to be a member of the fdic.


Graycode

join:2006-04-17
reply to Graycode

PayPal is not a bank and it's not licensed by the US government to be considered as one. They are not subject to (and do not agree to) the many regulations of the US banking laws. Common bank stipulations regarding fraud, solvency, contracts, privacy, disclosures, and many other things are not relevant to PayPal. They don't have to follow any federal banking laws because none of those laws apply to them. They're just a company and nothing more.

When any problem, error, or even confusion arises with PayPal then your options for resolution & recourse are extremely limited compared to what they would be with a licensed financial institution.

Any IRS implications are the same as with other normal companies, and certainly do not encompass the considerations of a bank. When you have a business account or sell volume beyond predefined limits then PayPal will be reporting fees and money volumes to the IRS. There is no IRS involvement and no real need for SSN or DOB for the vast majority of users, including myself.

Here (supposedly) some portion of the Patriot Act is being interpreted by PayPal. It's a change that they're now requiring SSN and DOB for US residents to add any funds from their own linked bank, regardless of dollar or penny amount.

If PayPal was a bank or if it was subject to some of the federal or state laws that would help to protect me then that might be different. Otherwise they're just another unregulated online company that now wants more of my identity & private data. All they can provide is a verbal promise to try keeping it secure (with exception of course to their affiliates).



Anonymous_
Anonymous
Premium
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

said by Graycode:

Here (supposedly) some portion of the Patriot Act is being interpreted by PayPal. It's a change that they're now requiring SSN and DOB for US residents to add any funds from their own linked bank, regardless of dollar or penny amount.

Sorry it's for select users only. You have been targeted because your holding on to money too long in your paypal account. this is a issue. THIS is a very common issue
I have never been asked for my SSN from paypal

Only limited to 500$ per month though withdraw, If I want unlimited withdraw from paypal I have to provide my SSN but I refuse to do so. It's not a requirement but a option.

Graycode

join:2006-04-17

I've never had anywhere near $500 in my account. I'd normally keep some funds in it for buying things on Ebay or elsewhere. As the balance drew down I'd add more to it, usually 3 or 4 times annually.

Having a few $ of funds in PayPal doesn't seem like something that should involve quoting the Patriot Act.

If you're in the US and have an account with a bank linked in, and haven't given them your SSN, then click the 'Add Funds' to see what happens. It used to be the next screen would ask how much you wanted to add to your balance.

But now you'll probably be presented with the 1st screen shot I posted. To actually continue you'd need to provide your full SSN in your PayPal profile and prove it like they want. But don't do any of that, just click 'Add Funds' to see what's next.

Am I the only one that's apparently been endangering national security by having a cash value housed in an online business that can't get my SSN and DOB? Oh my, I've got thousands of pennies worth.



Anonymous_
Anonymous
Premium
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
kudos:2

I added funds before without issue less then a month ago



disconnected

@snet.net
reply to Graycode

I had this same request with Moneybookers, when I decided to dump my Paypal account 3 years ago. I refused to give that UK-based foreign company any SS#. And what about those of us who never got one out of realization that it was acceptance of a contract of financial serfdom to the new Federal Reserve?
If PayPal is doing this now, then eBay is doomed to fail soon. Millions will flea the system and go elsewhere.



r81984
Fair and Balanced
Premium
join:2001-11-14
Katy, TX
Reviews:
·row44
reply to Graycode

Never upload cash or keep cash in your paypal account.
As soon as you get cash in there remove it immediately.
If you keep money in there, paypal can steal it any time and they will.

Use a credit card only with paypal as a layer of protection between your money and paypal.
You dont even need a paypal account to buy things anymore, paypal will let you pay with CC without creating an account.
--
...brought to you by Carl's Jr.



sapo
Cruising Down Memory Lane
Premium
join:2002-09-16
Sacramento, CA
kudos:1
reply to Graycode

This happens because you triggered a red flag somehow.


andrewdna

join:2012-06-20
Las Vegas, NV
reply to Graycode

I would agree with eveyone's posts. I just bought something 2 weeks ago and paid with Paypal of course. I have never provided my SSN or DOB to them. And it's not asking for it. I think we should all sign a petition or something against this invasion of privacy.

The Patriot Act is forcing them to comply with SSN and DOB is ridiculous. I think they just made it up and want it for their own marketing or ill willed pursuits. I hate Paypal but since Ebay bought them they pretty much made it the status quo. How this isn't a monopoly or anti-competitive is beyond me.



zno

join:2002-01-08
Atlanta, GA
reply to Graycode

I would worry more about PayPal having your bank acct number & cash than last 4 digits of your SSN.

Freeze your credit and subscribe to one of those ID theft monitoring services if this still bothers you.
--
got anti-virus and firewall?


iStrain

join:2010-09-02
Houston, TX
reply to Graycode

PayPal won't let me transfer funds from my bank account now unless I cough up my SSN.
They haven't frozen my account, though, because I just made a purchase today using PayPal funds.

I have never received money via PayPal. I have never sold anything on eBay.
I created my PayPal account and a dedicated small bank account to make occasional purchases only (usually where CC is not accepted and on eBay).

My PayPal usage is very limited -- at most a couple hundred bucks worth of purchases per YEAR.

I successfully transferred funds from my bank account on January 20, 2012. I thought this law went into effect in 2011? Must have had a compliance grace period.

Those who insist that this new requirement only applies to high-volume users are dead wrong.
I'm not sure why the IRS thinks it needs my info, given the very small amount of dollars being handled via PayPal on my account -- and ZERO income.

I'm never giving my SSN to PayPal, eBay or anyone else online, EVER. With ID theft an ever worsening problem, it boggles the mind why the US gummint would seek to put its citizens at increased risk, especially in cases where the amount of money involved is far below what's even reportable (ZERO income, even!). It's just stupid. My bank has my SSN, but I forked that over in person -- the alternative is to hide cash under the bed, et al.

Looks like I won't be shopping on eBay anymore. That's a shame, as I found lots of items that weren't available elsewhere. Oh well, it's eBay's loss -- guess they didn't have powerful enough lobbyists to prevent these new tax laws.



Anonymous_
Anonymous
Premium
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

Click for full size
still not asking me


TheHarvester
Premium
join:2006-08-25
Dana Point, CA
kudos:3
reply to andrewdna

They don't want you entire SSN just the last 4 digits. I'm willing to bet it is for security reasons so if an account gets hijacked, the hijackers, more than likely, don't know this information. PayPal is just verifying with your bank that this info is correct so you don't get your money stolen.
--
mbsastronomy.com



SomeguyBen

@moog.com
reply to iStrain

PayPal gives in after awhile?

So I had the same thing happen to me about 2 months ago.

I got a new credit card and bank account number and when I updated this info in PayPal I got the same "provide proof of ID" stuff. I rarely use PayPal, and I have had $50 or so sitting there (there were some comments that long standing money triggered the ID request). I ignored the ID requests and provided no further info nor did I contact anyone at PayPal (just read up on their FAQs and some other online sources). In the mean time I received copious reminders from "service@paypal" that my PayPal account required some action to resolve an issue. All of which I ignored.

Then today, I received the following email from PayPal:

"We have completed our review and have returned your account to regular
standing.

Thank you for your patience during this process and for helping to make
PayPal the safest and most trusted online payment solution."

I logged in an everything looks okay. . .

So I figure it's like I tell my girlfriend: If you ignore these things long enough they solve themselves.