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Laramar

join:2002-08-23
Minneapolis, MN
reply to Mike Wolf

Re: Cisco Connect Cloud

With all the attention that Cisco has been getting, they finally put back a link to the old firmware, now called classic, on their support page.

It doesn't seem likely that Cisco will ever release new firmware that will give users the option to decline the cloud and maintain local direct access to our own routers. Cisco Connect Cloud is an added cost--they need to make up for it by collecting and selling user data.

moes

join:2009-11-15
Cedar City, UT
reply to Mike Wolf
Guess this leave the wrt160n series out then too. meh, figures.


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
reply to lordpuffer
Well if the router is set to automatically check for updates you're going to get the connect cloud interface. If it isn't then you won't but you also won't receive any fixes and improvements and because the v2 and all routers after that in the EA line are designed specifically to not be third party firmware compatible (no tomato or dd wrt and stuff) it would be shooting yourself in the foot not to update. »www.smallcloudbuilder.com/apps/a···oes-live

I'm very cautious when it comes to my router as access to the internet is the lifeblood of my existence but I haven't had any problems performance wise with the router after the update. I still get the same speeds as I did before both wired and wireless, I still have no signal dropouts, and I'm able to access my network remotely over the internet with the exact same interface as I do when I'm on a locally connected computer. I understand that the connect cloud interface and premise is not for everyone and I do wish that there was alternatives for those people as I hate to see anyone dissatisfied with their router.


lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Thanks Mike.


Harry C

@comcast.net
reply to Laramar
And just how does one install the older firmware anyway?

sabretooth

join:2012-02-14
Marietta, GA
reply to lordpuffer
said by lordpuffer:

I have the E4200v2, and I use it at home and have the auto update on for firmware. I just checked, and am still able to access the router via it's IP address.

I would like to leave well enough alone, for my router works fine. Am I going to be updated to Cisco Connect Cloud automatically at some point? I think I would rather not, however I will have to deal with it if it does.

What are the advantages of Cisco Cloud Connect?

Turn off auto updates in the router now. Otherwise you will be updated and data harvesting will occur.


lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Reviews:
·CableOne
Thanks.....But I'm going to let it update to the 'Cloud.' As was stated above, if you do not allow Cisco Cloud Connect, you won't be able to update your firmware again (if needed).
--
Obama in 2012 - There's No Tea Left In The Bag.


lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
reply to Mike Wolf
When you update to the 'Cloud,' does it save all of your current settings?
--
Obama in 2012 - There's No Tea Left In The Bag.


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
yes it does.


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
reply to Harry C
Go into connectivity, then click the manual firmware update and choose the old firmware from the website. The router will install the old firmware and reset. BE SURE TO ALLOW THE ROUTER TO COMPLETE WHAT IT'S DOING BY MONITORING THE STATUS LIGHT! DO NOT UNPLUG THE POWER FROM THE ROUTER! as this will screw up and likely brick the router. I would be safe and give the entire process 10 minutes. The current page that would be displayed won't update after the new (classic) firmware is installed.


tank

@computeca.com
reply to Mike Wolf
Wow.... I wish I didn't have my router set to auto-update the firmware, now. Someone please tell me there is still a way to get to the "old", *local*, web-admin page...or is it gone? If my Internet connectivity is down, I can't admin my local network router?? If I want to take the router offline for a local-only network, am I now out of luck??


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
Yes, as I just posted earlier in this thread, go into the configuration page and go to the manual upgrade, choose the old firmware file and go from there.
Which model do you have?


tank

@computeca.com
The EA4500. Thanks -- yes, I saw your earlier helpful post. I guess my question was really: "can I still locally admin the router *w/o* downgrading the firmware". I've been playing with the new webadmin tool, and it seems to work fine, but I'd still like to have the local-only admin option, if possible.


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
hmm well when the internet is down it prompts you for the routers password. There you only get connectivity, wireless, and troubleshooting.


PeteC2
Got Mouse?
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-20
Bristol, CT
kudos:6
Reviews:
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1 recommendation

reply to danclan
said by danclan:

said by lordpuffer:

What are the advantages of Cisco Cloud Connect?

There are none. Really. There is really ZERO need for you or anyone else to use Cloud Connect.

ZERO? I disagree. Here's a "need" that I have: My 83 year old mom knows about as much about routers and network settings as she does about Chinese Mandarin...which is to say very little. This allows me remote access...there are other advantages, and yes, potential disadvantages as well.

According to Cisco, this is the beginning stage of having any number of home devices that will be able to be accessed and controlled through one's home network, making remote access desireable. That may flop, or it may become a new paradigm in router usage, this remains to be seen.

As far as fears that this will be a Cisco "data-grab?" Yawn...anyone with a facebook account has more to be concerned about, as does anyone who uses a search tool such as Google...
--
Deeds, not words


danclan

join:2005-11-01
Midlothian, VA

2 recommendations

said by PeteC2:

said by danclan:

said by lordpuffer:

What are the advantages of Cisco Cloud Connect?

There are none. Really. There is really ZERO need for you or anyone else to use Cloud Connect.

ZERO? I disagree. Here's a "need" that I have: My 83 year old mom knows about as much about routers and network settings as she does about Chinese Mandarin...which is to say very little. This allows me remote access...there are other advantages, and yes, potential disadvantages as well.

According to Cisco, this is the beginning stage of having any number of home devices that will be able to be accessed and controlled through one's home network, making remote access desireable. That may flop, or it may become a new paradigm in router usage, this remains to be seen.

As far as fears that this will be a Cisco "data-grab?" Yawn...anyone with a facebook account has more to be concerned about, as does anyone who uses a search tool such as Google...

If this sounds harsh please don't take it that way but I have heard these arguments before from other services and people and they are not different now than they were then.

Your grandmother would likely NEVER EVER need to access the router nor you after its initial configuration which is all done via a push button or the very simple cd install. I Have yet to ever have to re-login to the dozen routers I have had to install for family members. It's been YEARS and not one has had an issue. They all have older WRT300 or WRT310, the trusty WRT54G and several more of the E3000's. Some are on standard linksys/cisco firmeware others are dd-wrt. None have remote access enabled. All have performed flawlessly even after numerous power outages and moves to other states and cable systems.

And just how many devices do you really need to remote control that would require constant tweaking of a router? And would you want all your eggs in Cisco's basket? I've worked with them for the better part of 20 years and in no way in hell would I want them doing that. Maybe being so close to them has built up a strong love hate relationship but experience with any one company running too much leads to disaster.

Do you or anyone else want their homes now to be potentially hacked or worse, hijacked? or even have the remote possibility of being hacked/hijacked? It may be paranoia on my part but I would error on the side of extreme caution before opening remote access to any home device from the outside. This goes too for Verizon and Comcast's Remote Home Control and Security services.

Your lack of fear of a data grab is what saddens me the most though. I don't and millions of others don't use Facebook. Actually Facebook use has been on the decline in much of the west (EU and US). Facebook doesn't get access to your full and complete browsing history, the legal ramifications of this are huge. Cisco would have access to EVERY LINK YOU EVER CLICKED ON and with no storage limit or opt out. If I was the local police, the FBI or other governmental agency, news of this "service" will have just made my day.

Cisco may not enable that right away as they just recently reported but I wouldn't be surprised in an "update to provide more features" it gets enabled quietly. They would be stupid to not cash in on your browsing history.


PeteC2
Got Mouse?
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-20
Bristol, CT
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Comcast
said by danclan:

If this sounds harsh please don't take it that way but I have heard these arguments before from other services and people and they are not different now than they were then.

Nope, I take no offense at all, I simply disagree. Much of what you say you are concerned about has never actually resulted in anything negative occurring. Aside of occasionally annoying ads and offers that I could live without seeing, I have yet to ever have been compromised financially, or in any other fashion, and I have no fears that Cisco has any nefarious plans to illegally separate me from my wealth...other than selling me their hardware...

Again, I see nothing in their TOS that leads me to fear that they are going to do anything that would cause me harm.

I am intensely more concerned about the federal govt's desire to be able to track browsing habits...but that is for another post...

BTW, I am as big a person on personal privacy as you are likely to know (exactly why I eschew facebook)...however, the reality is that information gathering in today's electronic/data-base age isn't going away, that rabbit isn't ever going back into the magician's hat.

As far as my ability to remotely access my mom's network? Maybe you would have no need/desire to easily do this, but hey, that is my concern, yes? I do like that aspect of it, and to me, it is a valid convenience.
--
Deeds, not words

sabretooth

join:2012-02-14
Marietta, GA
But you have always had the power to remotely access your router from anywhere. Been built in since day one.


PeteC2
Got Mouse?
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-20
Bristol, CT
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Comcast

1 recommendation

said by sabretooth:

But you have always had the power to remotely access your router from anywhere. Been built in since day one.

...and so? I said that this was convenient, and it is. For some reason do I have to qualify that? I don't think so.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I expected something like this, based on Cisco's marketing of the EA series since day 1 as cloud-enabled. It rather makes me wonder how many folks bought EA routers without considering that all over the web site, and all over the box, they were marketing this as a different kind of router.

I do think that Cisco could have handled this more adroitly, for sure...I could have told them that making a change this big as an auto-update would lead to stress...but it just isn't the big wahoo that some have made of it.
--
Deeds, not words

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5

1 recommendation

reply to Mike Wolf
I'm stunned at the ignorance shown in this thread. What Cisco has done is to violently violate their users privacy with their cloud crap.

I have a BEFSR41 and once my ISP finally gets off it duff and rolls out IPv6, I will need to buy a new router. I had bookmarked an Eseries router to purchase. But now that Cisco has pulled this crap, I have to go look to other brands of routers.

It's a damn shame. At least Cisco has shown their true colors before I bought one of these. My BEFSR41 has been fine all these years (will be nine years old in November) but I will have nothing to do with a company that forces the cloud on router users. That is totally nuts.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson


lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Reviews:
·CableOne
said by Mele20:

What Cisco has done is to violently '(emphasis added)' violate their users privacy with their cloud crap.

I don't know about others, but Cisco wasn't 'violent' with me. No physical force was used. This thread has good people debating the issue, with some posters assuring others that the world will not end if they are updated to Cisco Cloud Connect.....At least for most people. There is no need to call them 'ignorant.'

I suggest that, based on your post, you should look for one of the many other brands of Routers to purchase, where you will feel safe.

--
Obama in 2012 - There's No Tea Left In The Bag.

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5

1 edit
There's been an update to the Cisco blog. You tell from it that Cisco is rapidly retreating because of the anger from their very badly abused customers.

For your information, ALL router vendors intended to do what Cisco has done but Cisco got there first. Now I think the other vendors will rethink what do as far as the cloud and invading user's privacy with the intent to sell their information.

I don't object to users ignorantly deciding to allow themselves to be sold to highest bidder...heck that is what all the sheeple on Facebook have willingly chosen, what I object to very strenuously is a vendor trying to FORCE this on its users.

You believe that only physical acts can be "violent"? And users who believe that everyone should live in a glass house are not only "ignorant" but dangerous to the continuation of this nation as without privacy we no longer have liberty and freedom. In my mind, there is NO debate about this. You MUST be against Cisco forcing the cloud on its users. Cisco is retreating because of the storm of protest.

»blogs.cisco.com/home/update-answ···cloud-2/

Here's an excellent article about what Cisco was trying to pull...and it is VIOLENT.

»www.extremetech.com/computing/13···retion/2
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson


PeteC2
Got Mouse?
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-20
Bristol, CT
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Comcast

1 recommendation

reply to Mele20
said by Mele20:

I'm stunned at the ignorance shown in this thread.

It's a damn shame. At least Cisco has shown their true colors before I bought one of these. My BEFSR41 has been fine all these years (will be nine years old in November) but I will have nothing to do with a company that forces the cloud on router users.

Sorry, but if anything, it is you showing ignorance in this thread.

Although I heartily agree that Cisco doing this through an auto-update was a poorly thought out move, Cisco has not forced the cloud on router users, and auto update for router firmware is hardly "new". Don't like it? Then install the "classic" firmware and be done with it. Much ado about very, very little.

Again however, unless one is truly ignorant, Cisco promoted these routers from their inception to be planned for cloud usage. It clearly was on the web site, as being touted toward this end.

When I bought my EA4500, I was fully aware of Cisco's intentions towards this line of routers, though I confess not the exact implementaion. I for one, have still not made up my mind if I will continue with the cloud based firmware or revert to the "standard" firmware...but either way, it simply is not the horrific calamity that others here make it out to be.
--
Deeds, not words


danclan

join:2005-11-01
Midlothian, VA

1 recommendation

Well it would seem the internet spoke and Cisco was forced to listen:

»arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/07/···setting/

CCC will no longer be the default setting, from my perspective this is exactly how it should have been from the get go.

Better yet they should have merely added another page of options and allowed you to optionally create a new CCC login that would then allow you to remotely access.

The end user remains in full control, Cisco can still provide cloud access and remote management and you the customer gets to choose.


newview
Ex .. Ex .. Exactly
Premium
join:2001-10-01
Parsonsburg, MD
kudos:1
Reviews:
·DIRECTV
·Comcast

1 recommendation

quote:
UPDATE:
Cisco has told us that going forward the automatic update process will accomodate people who prefer the local, browser-based management console over the cloud service. That's good news, as customers who don't want to use Connect Cloud won't have to choose between their current management setup and firmware updates that could be important.

"If a customer chooses to use the Embedded Web UI and selects the Auto-Update feature, Cisco will offer them an update," Cisco said. "Currently the only update we have is for the Cisco Connect Cloud feature set, but in future, we plan to provide updates for the embedded Web UI feature set specifically. The core message is that a customer can/will be able to choose an embedded web UI and Update without having to use CCC.”
»arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/07/···setting/


PeteC2
Got Mouse?
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-20
Bristol, CT
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Comcast

1 edit
reply to danclan
said by danclan:

Well it would seem the internet spoke and Cisco was forced to listen:

»arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/07/···setting/

CCC will no longer be the default setting, from my perspective this is exactly how it should have been from the get go.

Better yet they should have merely added another page of options and allowed you to optionally create a new CCC login that would then allow you to remotely access.

The end user remains in full control, Cisco can still provide cloud access and remote management and you the customer gets to choose.

That I have zero argument with...and yes, they could have avoided much if not all of the hard feelings by setting it up this way in the first place.

I am still using the cloud-based firmware, as I have no serious concerns (so far) with the implementation, but I heartily agree, that this was the approach Cisco should have led off with.

Maybe I am just not as quick as some to suspect a dishonest design behind Cisco's cloud implementation, but of course it would have made much better sense to offer the cloud-based firmware, rather than an auto-update. But, that strikes me more as a lack of fore-thought rather than evil intent.

Then again, keep in mind that I am on Comcast, and they flash firmware to your modem whether you own it or they do...so this doesn't seem as extreme to me as it otherwise might have...

--
Deeds, not words


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
reply to Mike Wolf
Well I came across this today »Cisco Backpedals a Little on Cloud Firmware which says that the new firmware is now optional?


lordpuffer
RIP lil
Premium
join:2004-09-19
Rio Rancho, NM
kudos:2
Reviews:
·CableOne
said by Mike Wolf:

Well I came across this today »Cisco Backpedals a Little on Cloud Firmware which says that the new firmware is now optional?

Correct. There was enough pressure on Cisco, and they made it optional.
--
Obama in 2012 - There's No Tea Left In The Bag.


Mike Wolf

join:2009-05-24
Beachwood, NJ
kudos:4
but still doesnt tell us if Cisco is going to continue to update the firmware for the classic interface. Here is a thread I came across. »linksys.lithium.com/t5/Wireless-···p/538014


Gone Fishing
Premium
join:2001-06-29
reply to Mike Wolf

Cisco removes cloud sign ups from default router settings

quote:
w w w . n e o w i n . n e t

Cisco removes cloud sign ups from default router settings

...Cisco Connect Cloud is an optional service that brings additional features to a home network. It is not required to set-up and manage Cisco Linksys EA Series routers. In response to our customers’ concerns, we have simplified the process for opting-out of the Cisco Connect Cloud service and have changed the default setting back to traditional router set-up and management.

...


Read more @ »www.neowin.net/news/cisco-remove···settings
--
non nova, sed nove
primum non nocere