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johnB

@personainc.net
reply to Riplin

Re: Sudbury ON - FibreOP FTTH - job fair Thursday 6pm

The 30mbps upload speed is going to be an excellent advantage for those who upload large files. Adding videos to YouTube, services such as iCloud, and adding photos to Facebook are all examples of when a high upload speed will make a dramatic difference. This is one area of FibreOP that cable cannot match completely.

Riplin

join:2002-05-13
canada
Meh, you don't need 30mbps to ul useless youtube videos or pictures to facecrack. Only benefit to 30+up is to maintain retarded ratio's on private tor sites or run a business where you need to send large media files out. I'm just saying gimme a 70/10 for 69.95/mth and you'll suck people in way more


BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile

1 edit
You shouldn't pick bones with the speed when your real issue is price. It doesn't cost any more to deliver 1000Mbps than it does 30Mbps.

If I was in charge of plans I would sell this unlimited

10/10 $10 (priced like Comcast Internet Essentials for low income homes)
25/25 $25 (same deal above)
100/50 $50
100/100 $60
1000/100 $100
1000/1000 $120


nitzguy
Premium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON
reply to johnB
said by johnB :

The 30mbps upload speed is going to be an excellent advantage for those who upload large files. Adding videos to YouTube, services such as iCloud, and adding photos to Facebook are all examples of when a high upload speed will make a dramatic difference. This is one area of FibreOP that cable cannot match completely.

Makes sense...hey with large download speed you want the same upload speed to ensure that you don't have any choke points for http requests and other upload type requests....so I won't complain.

Will it be available in apartment buildings, or just single family homes? Its not quite clear...

Wow, Garson first eh....that's a new one . But that being said I'll be happy to wait until August....I'm sure Teksavvy won't be happy but meh...what can you do, and I do see the Bell markings around my area...so its exciting for sure....


johnB

@personainc.net
To address your comment regarding apartments,

Much like what is being done out east, areas where FibreOP isn't planned(underground subdivisions, apartments) will have access to IPTV service over their existing wiring. This is not in the works this year, but it is on the drawing board. Internet speed aside, this service is very similar to FibreOP from all outward appearances.

Here's how it works, and here is the major difference. IPTV service requires fibre to the node. Current technology allows for up to 25mbps download 10mbps upload. However, even though the customer is provisioned for 25/10, the customer will only get 15/10 on the data portion of the connection, and video(always takes precedence) has a minimum of 10mbps dedicated. If, for example, a customer is watching 3 HD channels and 1 SD channel, their internet speed would then be 5mbps max.

This is the type of service being offered by Telus(Optik) out west and by AT&T(uVerse) in the US. It is not FibreOP, but it is a very legitimate alternative to the cable company. It will be available to many apartment dwellers who are forced to subscribe to cable due to restrictions on satellite installations in their buildings.

file

join:2011-03-29
Riverview, NB
reply to BliZZardX
said by BliZZardX:

You shouldn't pick bones with the speed when your real issue is price. It doesn't cost any more to deliver 1000Mbps than it does 30Mbps.

While it doesn't cost any more to deliver that there is a minimal amount to cover expenses don't forget. As it is while this is lower than DSL providing a better profit margin it still takes Bell Aliant many (6+) months to even begin making money off you with current pricing.

file

join:2011-03-29
Riverview, NB
reply to Riplin
said by Riplin:

Meh, you don't need 30mbps to ul useless youtube videos or pictures to facecrack. Only benefit to 30+up is to maintain retarded ratio's on private tor sites or run a business where you need to send large media files out. I'm just saying gimme a 70/10 for 69.95/mth and you'll suck people in way more

Final thought since I keep finding new stuff I want to address...

Here in Atlantic Canada where Eastlink already exists and had better plans (I say had because they improved Sudbury's ahead of FibreOP deployment to try to help so they are now equal) people are leaving Eastlink a lot. Install wait times average 3-4 weeks. This trend is the same with Rogers here in New Brunswick who has crapper plans. I suspect this will carry on to Sudbury so they won't *need* to suck people in way more. The service speaks for itself and the vast majority of people are fine with the pricing.


BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile

1 edit
reply to file
Whether you have 1Mbps or 1000Mbps, on GPON, the cost is the same. It's designed for 2.5/1.25Gbps, the standard says maximum splits is 32 customers and most ISPs pick 16.

Compare that with VDSL2. You share a 2x1Gbit line with up to 96 customers. They installed a remote in my building 2 years ago. On 12a at 200 meters loop length you can't get much more than 10Mbps upload on the Stingers. Less than 2 years later, if they want to offer 30Mbps up to compete with DOCSIS3, they have to gut and scrape the whole setup and replace it with fiber.

They recovered the cost in the first year. But it's still a waste of money to do everything twice.

file

join:2011-03-29
Riverview, NB
The cost over the fiber is the same yes but there is a cost of acquiring you as a customer which includes the equipment (since it's all free), the cost of installation in your home, the cost of installing the broken down cost of your portion of the deployment, and the cost of the fiber itself. This has to be recouped somehow (monthly costs) which yields a minimum monthly charge. These costs remain the same no matter what the speed delivered is as you said.

Just to bring some perspective into things here in Atlantic Canada they aim, just for the deployment portion and cost of physical fiber for a customer, to have that be ~$650.


BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
With 50% adoption rate using GPON most ISPs are able to break even $10/month. I'm not sweating for Bell.

file

join:2011-03-29
Riverview, NB
At an individual cost just for deployment of $650 per *potential* customer... how could they break even at $10/mth? It would take awhile for a customer to even recoup the cost of themselves let alone other customers.

Riplin

join:2002-05-13
canada
Here's a novel idea. How about letting customers that actually understand speeds when they call in let them choose their own down/up based on what they need and price it accordingly. You don't need to tell the general public about this because 95% of them are clueless so they only need the website with a few concrete pkg's set up cause all they look at is the bottom $ line.

If a first level sales person can't understand what the customer is asking for (and that will happen cause the script isn't right) let a 2nd level take over and complete the sale.

Trust me you won't have 10,000's of these type of inquiries just the people that know what they want and thats far and few between

file

join:2011-03-29
Riverview, NB
That seems like trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist. If you are trying to make the point that people won't buy the service because of the price you aren't going to convince me of that until the service is available for a period of time in Sudbury and you have evidence. Across all of Atlantic Canada people are flocking to FibreOP, even when cheaper or equivalent services are available from the competitors. In other cases FibreOP is actually cheaper in the end (of course, I'm referring to when in a bundle).

If ultimately this is all because you aren't happy with the pricing for your personal use, so be it, but don't extrapolate that to the masses until the masses have spoken.


BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile
There's all sorts of ways they can sell it.

Even the wireless model works, pay by usage blocks and forget the speeds, just give people what their line can get.

LTE-Advanced, up to 175Mbps
1GB
2GB
5GB
10GB
Fair use policy: throttle to 1Mbps after 10GB

FiberOp, up to 1000Mbps
50GB - $30
100GB - $40
1TB - $60
10TB - $100
20TB - $200
Unlimited - $250
Fair use policy: throttle to 10Mbps after 50TB
--
Fiber Optics are the future of high-speed internet access. Stop by the BBR »Fiber Optic Forum.


nitzguy
Premium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON
reply to johnB
said by johnB :

To address your comment regarding apartments,

Much like what is being done out east, areas where FibreOP isn't planned(underground subdivisions, apartments) will have access to IPTV service over their existing wiring. This is not in the works this year, but it is on the drawing board. Internet speed aside, this service is very similar to FibreOP from all outward appearances.

Here's how it works, and here is the major difference. IPTV service requires fibre to the node. Current technology allows for up to 25mbps download 10mbps upload. However, even though the customer is provisioned for 25/10, the customer will only get 15/10 on the data portion of the connection, and video(always takes precedence) has a minimum of 10mbps dedicated. If, for example, a customer is watching 3 HD channels and 1 SD channel, their internet speed would then be 5mbps max.

This is the type of service being offered by Telus(Optik) out west and by AT&T(uVerse) in the US. It is not FibreOP, but it is a very legitimate alternative to the cable company. It will be available to many apartment dwellers who are forced to subscribe to cable due to restrictions on satellite installations in their buildings.

I see. Are any apartment buildings going to be able to get it at all? I only ask this because currently I'm probably a rarity and get ADSL2 16/1 service from the CO itself....only because the CO in question is in a residential neighbourhood....

Just wondered...also see markings for what I'm guessing will be FibreOp boxes in the area....just curious.

file

join:2011-03-29
Riverview, NB

2 edits
reply to BliZZardX
said by BliZZardX:

There's all sorts of ways they can sell it.

Even the wireless model works, pay by usage blocks and forget the speeds, just give people what their line can get.

FiberOp, up to 1000Mbps
50GB - $30
100GB - $40
1TB - $60
10TB - $100
20TB - $200
Unlimited - $250
Fair use policy: throttle to 10Mbps after 50TB

That would cover the cost of bandwidth but I have serious reservations for whether it would allow a healthy payback of the customer acquisition cost and still have a profit margin. Long term it would be possible.

So really my opinion can be summed up as this: Right now the packages and approach Bell Aliant has taken is good for sustaining their business and continuing deployment. Once they have settled down the deployment and built up some money in the bank they could change to a different model and it wouldn't hurt things. Right now they are investing everything and don't have the money to spare to change.


JohnB

@184.151.61.x
reply to nitzguy
It is very possible that some buildings will be getting FibreOP installed, it was done out east usually in a partnership between the building owner and Bell Aliant. There are many ways to install it relatively easily into apartments, running the wires on the exterior being the most common. There really is no reason why it cannot be done, provided they convince the owners that the wiring will be visually acceptable. But like I said, the popular choice out east, and in larger cities seems to be IPTV.

Riplin

join:2002-05-13
canada
reply to file
I'm not extrapolating anything, the masses will always be the masses, I just don't like being lumped in with them.

I'm just saying give us more speed options only if we inquire.

Use the script for the masses.


nitzguy
Premium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON
reply to JohnB
said by JohnB :

It is very possible that some buildings will be getting FibreOP installed, it was done out east usually in a partnership between the building owner and Bell Aliant. There are many ways to install it relatively easily into apartments, running the wires on the exterior being the most common. There really is no reason why it cannot be done, provided they convince the owners that the wiring will be visually acceptable. But like I said, the popular choice out east, and in larger cities seems to be IPTV.

IPTV doesn't interest me lol....I haven't had a "cable" or "satellite" subscription in about 3 years now...not looking to go back to that....just want more speed....

Anywho, I guess I'll learn more in the future....


habskilla

join:2005-09-19
Moncton, NB
reply to JohnB