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elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
Reviews:
·VMedia
reply to donoreo

Re: [Rant] My A/C has died

said by donoreo:

They pointed out all sorts of things that were done wrong.

Of course they did , $$$


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
said by elwoodblues:

said by donoreo:

They pointed out all sorts of things that were done wrong.

Of course they did , $$$

As they did them correctly. The old evaporator was installed tiled the wrong way away from the drain. The old evaporator was too large for the ducts, so the builder's guys had built a little bulge to let it fit, the drain line, things like that.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.


dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
reply to donoreo
said by donoreo:

We still suffer from flaws in the original install: no cold air return on the top floor (well, there is a hole, it just does not go anywhere) and I think the furnace blower is not quite powerful enough for the top floor.

I was thinking of getting one or two of those duct vent fans. Anyone use one?

don't waste your time/money on duct fans...proper HVAC is a balanced system...your best investment would be to have someone install proper ventilation ducts.
--
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

- George Orwell


Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8
reply to donoreo
said by donoreo:

So now things are quite cool. They did a good job on the install, everything just looks better than the original install and the work we had done when the old unit was moved a few years ago. They pointed out all sorts of things that were done wrong.

We still suffer from flaws in the original install: no cold air return on the top floor (well, there is a hole, it just does not go anywhere) and I think the furnace blower is not quite powerful enough for the top floor.

I was thinking of getting one or two of those duct vent fans. Anyone use one?

One thing that crossed my mind as I read that is that furnace blowers can usually be set for multiple speeds, and typically run at a higher speed for cooling than they do for heating. If that's possible on yours I assume they would have done that.

An air return, preferably high-mounted, would seem pretty important on the top floor to get rid of the hot air bunching up there. If you don't have one, it would be all the more reason to get the maximum possible blower airflow.
--
"Whether we and our politicians know it or not, Nature is party to all our deals and decisions, and she has more votes, a longer memory, and a sterner sense of justice than we do." --Wendell Berry


Styvas
Go Canucks Go
Premium
join:2004-09-15
Hamilton, ON
One thing that I'm going to have to ask my installer about is the relationship between our equipment and heating. When I looked at the manual that they left us, it identifies the equipment as being a split system heat pump. When I looked into this a bit, it appears that a heat pump can also assist in heating as well as cooling. My thermostat has settings to take this into account, but I have no idea if it was installed in a way that would play nicely with the thermostat.
--
"Moving your Tylenol to the low shelf in your medicine cabinet is not the way to prevent children from falling off a stool when reaching for the top shelf." (said by Savant, May 2008)


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer:

said by donoreo:

We still suffer from flaws in the original install: no cold air return on the top floor (well, there is a hole, it just does not go anywhere) and I think the furnace blower is not quite powerful enough for the top floor.

I was thinking of getting one or two of those duct vent fans. Anyone use one?

don't waste your time/money on duct fans...proper HVAC is a balanced system...your best investment would be to have someone install proper ventilation ducts.

that would involve opening the walls, ceilings and floors. Since there is no air return on the top floor (the hole is mounted in the right spot, up high) that would be very expensive.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.


dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
said by donoreo:

that would involve opening the walls, ceilings and floors. Since there is no air return on the top floor (the hole is mounted in the right spot, up high) that would be very expensive.

fixing mistakes always is.

by using a duct fan to increase the air flow slightly upstairs, you really won't be doing much...for one, i doubt those really do that much...secondly, air needs to circulate for proper consistent temps...have you had an HVAC guy come and investigate what would be required (cost) to have the problem fixed properly?

if you don't want to do it right, you would be better off just buying a window AC unit for your bedroom and using that to cool the room...reasonably inexpensive to purchase and will chill the room a lot better anyway.
--
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

- George Orwell


Kalford
Seems To Be An Rtfm Problem.
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-20
Ontario
kudos:1

1 recommendation

reply to donoreo
said by donoreo:

It is kind of funny, they have disagreed on a couple of things and going back and forth in Arabic or Farsi (not sure which).



said by Installer1 :

What you mean there's no Freon

said by Installer2 :

Oh No. Don't you blame me Mister. You forgot to order it

said by Installer1 :

No No Mister. that's your job. You are imbecile

said by Installer2 :

Easy Easy. . . .No worries. I call friend in Niagara-on-the-Lake. He will get us some quickly.



donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer:

said by donoreo:

that would involve opening the walls, ceilings and floors. Since there is no air return on the top floor (the hole is mounted in the right spot, up high) that would be very expensive.

fixing mistakes always is.

by using a duct fan to increase the air flow slightly upstairs, you really won't be doing much...for one, i doubt those really do that much...secondly, air needs to circulate for proper consistent temps...have you had an HVAC guy come and investigate what would be required (cost) to have the problem fixed properly?

if you don't want to do it right, you would be better off just buying a window AC unit for your bedroom and using that to cool the room...reasonably inexpensive to purchase and will chill the room a lot better anyway.

The principle of doing it right is sound and I agree with it, reality however has to take over.

Window AC is not an option for our style windows.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.


loosedobbs

join:2006-06-13
Toronto
reply to Kalford
said by Kalford:

said by donoreo:

It is kind of funny, they have disagreed on a couple of things and going back and forth in Arabic or Farsi (not sure which).



said by Installer1 :

What you mean there's no Freon

said by Installer2 :

Oh No. Don't you blame me Mister. You forgot to order it

said by Installer1 :

No No Mister. that's your job. You are imbecile

said by Installer2 :

Easy Easy. . . .No worries. I call friend in Niagara-on-the-Lake. He will get us some quickly.


LOL. Typical Corporate Don't "Blame me" bickering. Everybody thought Somebody will order it and at eventually Nobody Ordered it.

prairiesky

join:2008-12-08
canada
kudos:2
reply to LazMan
said by LazMan:

said by Guspaz:

Define properly sized: if you buy a unit that will be able to cool from 30 degrees to 25 degrees when on max, will it also be able to cool from 35 to 25?

Couple of ways to size a system... I'm not a mechanical engineer or anything, but based on furnace air capacity is one way, heat-gain calc is another; Manual "J" calc is the textbook method.

I'm sure there's others on here that can explain it better... But basically, the HVAC system needs to work together; the coil, air handler, and evaporator all need to be appropriate. Any one of then being too large or small will lead to a less then ideal result...

We take the opposite approach, we always slightly undersize units based on heat gain not sq footage.

Reasons;

1) it's able to drop the humidity out

2) It doesn't short cycle the compressor. They like to run, they don't like to stop and start frequently.

3) worst case is, on hot days, the temp inside creeps up a bit. It's still much cooler inside than out and no one notices. That and the crazy hot days are very rare and should not be designed for.


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
You are looking at it from a mechanical perspective, not operational. It would cost a lot more to run the A/C 24/7 then it turning on and off based on the thermostat.


Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8
reply to prairiesky
said by prairiesky:

2) It doesn't short cycle the compressor. They like to run, they don't like to stop and start frequently.

3) worst case is, on hot days, the temp inside creeps up a bit. It's still much cooler inside than out and no one notices. That and the crazy hot days are very rare and should not be designed for.

You can solve #2 just by setting the thermostat to a wider temperature range like mine is -- it doesn't turn on until the temp is more than 0.5°C above the setting, and doesn't turn off until the same amount below. Keeping the fan running prevents the upstairs from getting too hot, and the A/C doesn't cycle often at all, yet it's still powerful enough to cool the place down quite fast and can get it much colder than I would ever need, which the undersized unit in the previous house could never do -- on a day like today, it would have run continuously or close to it.

One advantage of having an A/C running almost continuously on a hot day is that if you have a thick-furred large dog, and you have a wall-mounted air vent, the dog can snuggle right up to it when he has his nap!
--
"Whether we and our politicians know it or not, Nature is party to all our deals and decisions, and she has more votes, a longer memory, and a sterner sense of justice than we do." --Wendell Berry

prairiesky

join:2008-12-08
canada
kudos:2
reply to donoreo
I should explain a little more,
We have developed our own program that calculates the latent and sensible heat loads on an hour by hour basis for the year then picks the maximum amount. It's based on occupancy, average temperature and solar gain through an average day. So from that we get a max heat gain and pick a unit slightly smaller than that unit.

As for costs, it doesn't matter if it's a bigger or smaller unit, it's gonna cost the same (- the fan). You're removing X btu of heat. The only thing that changes is the time that you do it it. A unit that is sized for the extreme days is going to short cycle during the off seasons, and it's going to not drop out the humidity as it should.