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miked112

@verizon.net

Give up my copper phone line to upgrade to 75\25?

Just got off the phone with VZ; in sum the rep said that I could no longer make any changes to my service unless I agree to move my remaining POTS line (I have two, one copper and one digital) to the fiber.

Understand that VZ want to get rid of the copper but my preference is to hold on to it as long as I can; anyone else encountered this and any hints on escalating\other paths w\in VZ?



Thinkdiff
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-07
Bronx, NY
kudos:11

There's no way to upgrade without changing to a bundle with Digital Voice. It's be widely posted here, and I don't think anybody has gotten around this requirement.

BTW, it's 75/35.
--
University of Southern California - Fight On!


prisaz

join:2008-08-11
Germantown, MD
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

4 edits

1 recommendation

reply to miked112

If you are no longer under a commitment. Keep your copper line, and account that it is tied to.

Cancel FiOS and port your fiOS number over to a pay as you go wireless service before you cancel. If you can. Pay as you go phones can be had at Walmart for like $10.

Complain to your PSC if you have one. Verizon cannot force you off of copper if you still have it, as it is a regulated service. Tell Verizon if they want to sell you FiOS they will need to provide it on a separate account. Verizon can refuse to provide FiOS service at their will. If you have a local cable franchise you may also go that route and file a complaint with them. Having separate accounts will cost more, if they agree to provide them. You may need to have business and residential accounts. I do not believe they will provide two residential accounts to a single residential address. Dealing with two different departments within Verizon. It will cost you.

Yes Verizon wants everyone on a digital voice account, pushing it as a savings because it is not regulated and taxed the same way. But it seems like my taxes went down and my local cable franchise fee went up. So now if you are on an unregulated voice line Verizon can do as they please. I wanted the switch to DV and had a nightmare of a time when the strike hit. At one point being without a phone.

From my experience this week, if you call cancelations, they don't care, and it looks like they have now been instructed to just drop customers, regardless of how long you have been with them, or what you are paying or have paid.



Jackarino
YacCity
Premium
join:2006-12-28
Allendale, NJ
kudos:1

Verizon is phasing copper out, and there isn't much we the consumers can do.



aaronwt
Premium
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA
reply to miked112

You just pay more with a regulated line anyway. Just switch it to Digital voice. My parents house is on an old regulated land line. Their phone service has been out for almost a week now since the storm in the DC area last week(it was supposed to be restored by 10Am this morning. The entire community on copper was still dead last night). Power and cable had no issues but their phone service was down. If they had FiOS phone service it would have only been down for hours instead of days. Based on what their neighbor with Digital Voice on FiOS said. Their phone service was restored the day after the storm.


prisaz

join:2008-08-11
Germantown, MD
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to Jackarino

You can stay on copper as long as you want. But the problem is reliability. It used to be regulated to where they had to provide lifeline service and get your service back up and running within a time limit. But service has gone in the toilet, and reliability is only with un regulated fiber service now. I was providing ideas. I have had FiOS since the summer of 2005, and have been very happy with it, because of quality, and it never goes down as long as I have power on my end. Even in Montgomery County, Maryland, when the power came back after 5hrs, I have 100% FiOS reliability.

My recent experience with cancelations was to over an argument regarding commitment dates that were changed on my account. I am 100% FiOS digital at 75/35 and happy with the technology.

So yes I am a FiOS fan! Quantum rules! So don't take my previous post the wrong way.



Jackarino
YacCity
Premium
join:2006-12-28
Allendale, NJ
kudos:1
reply to miked112

Personally I like Digital Voice better than POTS.


Stevies3

join:2001-12-29
Woodbury, NY

Ditto, Many more features......



miked112

@verizon.net

It's unbelievable. I want to pay them more money and they won't let me. Cablevision will let me keep my copper and buy whatever I want from them.

I have a digital voice line, no problems with it. The POTS is really a security blanket; it's the only thing that worked after Irene and the other blackouts we've had out here. As long as they have UPS and generators in the COs POTS will always be the most reliable when there are weather\power problems.



aaronwt
Premium
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA

said by miked112 :

It's unbelievable. I want to pay them more money and they won't let me. Cablevision will let me keep my copper and buy whatever I want from them.

I have a digital voice line, no problems with it. The POTS is really a security blanket; it's the only thing that worked after Irene and the other blackouts we've had out here. As long as they have UPS and generators in the COs POTS will always be the most reliable when there are weather\power problems.

It wasn't for my parents this past week.


blohner

join:2002-06-26
Cortlandt Manor, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Google Voice
·Optimum Online

Why would Cablevision impact your Verizon Copper while installing their own Copper - it's comparing apples to oranges... Verizon wants to get you off their copper plan because it's crap, costs them a lot to maintain, and they are forced to offer shared access to other carriers. Once they get you onto Fiber there is no going back to another 'POTS' type carrier and that is part of what they are banking on....
Personally I am ok with that... I dropped my copper land line for VoIP in 2001 and never looked back... 2 out of three major storms cable was back up quicker than patching all the single phone lines that got cut so my Verizon copper neighbors ended up calling their relatives from my house...
I had FIOS and was happy - went back to Cablevision for internet and am it is sufficient for a much lower price.... When we had the two freak storms last year (Irene and the NE early Snow) Cablevision had portable generators at the pole Power Supplies so the minute I got my own power back through Generator my internet and VoIP was up and running...
--
I am addicted to speed --- Boost + speed that is ---



ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
reply to miked112

Mike, if youre that worried about FiOS phone service being down during a power-outage, get a backup generator. With FioS, not only will you continue to have phone service, you will have internet and TV as well.


Pher9999

join:2011-07-06
Carmel, NY
reply to miked112

in NY, On Fiber no copper at all. So far in Irene and the Snow Storm, power and copper lines were out for a week, Fiber was running fine the whole time. I powered the ONT from a DC/AC converter in the Car. 100Watts powered the ONT, Router and Microcell for Cell phones, we did just fine. Neighbors complained of no phone service the whole time.


prisaz

join:2008-08-11
Germantown, MD
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to ITALIAN926

I will second this.

said by ITALIAN926:

Mike, if youre that worried about FiOS phone service being down during a power-outage, get a backup generator. With FioS, not only will you continue to have phone service, you will have internet and TV as well.



miked112

@verizon.net

Yep, I connected my ONT and router to my generator after Irene and had voice, data and TV (Cablevision was down in our neighborhood for days). Guess I'd just like to keep the belt and suspenders for as long as I can, since I don't really see a benefit to giving it up...I don't care about the additional cost or the extra features of the digital service.

If VZ said they were turning POTS off tomorrow in our town I would be fine with it, but it's not going anywhere anytime soon, and I can't imagine that getting rid of my copper wire and losing me as a customer benefits them more than letting me keep it, when probably 80% of the houses on my block still have copper. If I decide to switch to CV because VZ won't let me upgrade to the service I want, the copper will still be there and Fios will have lost a loyal customer.



ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

2 edits

lol@ Cablevision.

Good luck with that.

You have a generator, theres no need to have copper at all. Its ironic that you do hook up your generator, and consider moving to CV which will give you NO SERVICES during a power outage. But hey, youll have your copper landline working, and your lights.

In addition, the second DV line is just $10 a month unlimited calling, and you will pay way less taxes and fee's on it. Why you would keep a copper line is bizarre, especially when you have a generator.


UofMiamiGrad
Premium
join:2001-02-03
Great Neck, NY

said by ITALIAN926:

lol@ Cablevision.

Good luck with that.

You have a generator, theres no need to have copper at all. Its ironic that you do hook up your generator, and consider moving to CV which will give you NO SERVICES during a power outage. But hey, youll have your copper landline working, and your lights.

In addition, the second DV line is just $10 a month unlimited calling, and you will pay way less taxes and fee's on it. Why you would keep a copper line is bizarre, especially when you have a generator.

Believe it or not Cablevision works better than Verizon after a big storm. Irene was a good example, as my folks in Muttontown had no phone service for a week & they are on copper POTS too. They also had no cable tv & internet from Cablevision but for only 3 days. Generator was working the whole time, so I had to take an Optimum Voice line they use for faxes and plug into phone system so they had phones. Directv worked fine during the interim for TV but when they had no phones at all, no cell service thanks to NIMBY folks, I then got them a satellite phone, in case there is next time. When the whole infrastructure is gone due to trees down all over the place good luck depending on any company's services. Generator w/satellite TV & satellite phone are your only bet when you have nothing else.

gadgetboyj

join:2009-08-25
Staten Island, NY
kudos:2

said by UofMiamiGrad:

Believe it or not Cablevision works better than Verizon after a big storm.

That depends on what parts of who's infrastructures sustain damage, as well as which areas the providers chose to restore service to first.


ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2

2 edits
reply to UofMiamiGrad

quote:
Generator w/satellite TV & satellite phone are your only bet when you have nothing else.
Generator PLUS FiOS = ALL SERVICES WORKING IN HOUSE ( for a widespread or single outage )


miked112

@verizon.net

What's the basis for the assumption that Fios will work as long as you have local power? Because it's fair to assume that VZ have the same redundancy (or better) for the fiber infrastructure as the copper up to the CO...ups, generators etc. But I assume CV have that as well, and for both you're dependent on the resiliency of the last mile...in addition to the lines themselves (above ground in my neighborhood unfortunately) staying up, local repeaters etc. need to be powered, hence the post above re: CV bringing generators out to the pole.

If fiber doesn't require that - if power in the CO means that you are good all the way out to the ONT - then I agree with the posts above that argue that copper is largely redundant. But reading the variety of Irene experiences above it seems like it was just a matter of luck that Fios stayed up in my area while CV was down, and again, in that scenario it seems to me that POTS brings you a level of resiliency that FTTH and cable don't.


UofMiamiGrad
Premium
join:2001-02-03
Great Neck, NY
reply to gadgetboyj

said by gadgetboyj:

said by UofMiamiGrad:

Believe it or not Cablevision works better than Verizon after a big storm.

That depends on what parts of who's infrastructures sustain damage, as well as which areas the providers chose to restore service to first.

Well when all your services are above ground and a tropical storm or hurricane take trees down all over the place that snap telephone poles like toothpicks, let me know who's infrastructure sustains damage.

valgaav

join:2011-06-07
Dom. Rep.
reply to miked112

I'd switch to fiber right away, too bad it's not available(yet) where I live. :P



Thinkdiff
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-07
Bronx, NY
kudos:11
reply to miked112

FiOS uses PON (Passive Optical Network). There's no powered equipment from CO to ONT. Everything is passive.

The CO has generators, so if you also have a generator, you'll get service.

That being said, Verizon's fiber lines can still be taken out (if aerial) during a storm. If that happens, the other poster is correct - Satellite is the only thing that will always work.
--
University of Southern California - Fight On!



ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

3 edits

1 recommendation

reply to miked112

Mike, its pure glass from Central Office to your house. No repeaters. If theres a widespread power outage, it will work with a generator. The cable companies backup their fiber nodes? I find that extremely hard to believe. They bring generators to their nodes to accommodate the few people with generators? Hmmm ( lol Im not wagering money on this concept )

If you have a generator and power is lost to YOUR HOUSE ONLY, yes, you will have services up and running with cable. If it widespread, like an entire neighborhood, city, state, and their fiber nodes are included, you get NOTHING.

With FiOS the pon cards have backup power in the central office, thats it. Thats the beauty of FiOS.

Now that we've established that there is no electronics between you and central office, do you see any point in keeping a copper line which takes the same route to the SAME central office? Factor in that the fiber is immune to rain, unlike the copper lines, there is ZERO reason to keep copper if you have a generator. (other than being stubborn )



ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to Thinkdiff

Yea, like those hurricane winds in question ( which are "snapping all the poles like twigs") dont rip Satellite Sails off roofs. LOL Cmon now.

Id trust FiOS over Satellite in a hurricane, god knows youre not getting Satellite signals anyway in such a storm.,,, if it does survive such winds.


UofMiamiGrad
Premium
join:2001-02-03
Great Neck, NY

said by ITALIAN926:

Yea, like those hurricane winds in question ( which are "snapping all the poles like twigs") dont rip Satellite Sails off roofs. LOL Cmon now.

Id trust FiOS over Satellite in a hurricane, god knows youre not getting Satellite signals anyway in such a storm.,,, if it does survive such winds.

Keep touting how great FIOS is when the power is out all over the neighborhood and you have generator power. Doesn't matter one bit that the damn fiber is snapped all over the place in the town with cable & power company lines, none at all. Enjoy the blank TV, etc. Seen enough of that on this forum with the mid-atlantic derecho that blew through there. Keep your head in the sand, does wonders. Considering what tropical storm winds did here on Long Island with Irene last year, consider yourself lucky if FIOS & your utilities are delivered underground cause when the infrastructure is damaged severely, you are SOL even with a generator.


ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

Listen man, if all of Great Neck loses power due to one electrical line coming down, your FiOS will continue to work in a power outage if you have a generator.

The Fiber lines are not wrapped around the electric lines themselves. "Keep touting "? I will.


UofMiamiGrad
Premium
join:2001-02-03
Great Neck, NY

said by ITALIAN926:

Listen man, if all of Great Neck loses power due to one electrical line coming down, your FiOS will continue to work in a power outage if you have a generator.

The Fiber lines are not wrapped around the electric lines themselves. "Keep touting "? I will.

That's great but usually if a power line goes due to a storm it's because a tree was uprooted & took out everything between the poles. My services in my part of Great Neck are underground but many places in my village, on Long Island and elsewhere are not. So yeah if a transformer blows, no worries FIOS will work, as will cable with a generator at your residence. When a thunderstorm or tropical system take out trees left and right & your services are aerial, well then everyone is SOL with their services. One possible power outage cause is not standard across the board, i.e blown transformer vs. thunderstorm/tropical system w/trees down between telephone poles.


aaronwt
Premium
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA
reply to miked112

My parents neighborhood has all above ground lines. With last weeks storm in the DC area, their power was fine as well as their comcast cable. Yet their Verizon POTS line went down for a week.



ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to UofMiamiGrad

Youre talking about a minority of users, even in a hurricane. When the hurricane came through last year, and everyone lost power, like 90-95% of those FiOS subscribers came back online when power was restored. Anyone within that high percentage would have kept all services up the whole time if they had a generator.