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FusionX101

join:2012-06-16

[Verizon] Why do companies force data on all smartphones

This is something I been ranting on for years and like opinions.. Cell phone companies are monopolizing the use of smartphones, they for years have brainwashed consumers into thinking it's the only purpose of smartphones when it's not. There's wifi and many things you can do with them like storing a ton of music, videos, etc and in general they are better looking phones.. How are companies getting away with monopolization? And why should we be forced to get data and not have a choice if we don't want it?

I blame speficially companies like Verizon and Sprint. They know it's impossible for anyone to even try to get around it because they use CMDA technology, which in the case of AT&T and T-Mobile that use GSM you can easily unlock it and there's loop holes on avoiding those expensive plans if you get a prepaid plan.

Please give me your opinions whether you agree or disagree with me, but this just gets me pissed off when companies do this.

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3
The companies emphasize in advertising the things that make the most profit. Knowledgeable employees or well designed web based support sites can show you how to do many other things with the phones that are not top money makers. The USA mobile phone usage finance model has been based on carrier subsidized phones. Since smartphones were designed to have data usage as one of the primary functions, that part of the phone must be paid for by a monthly data usage fee, just like the voice portion of older voice only phones was subsidized. Few residents of the USA are willing to pay full retail for a mobile device, hence the mandatory monthly charges. The CDMA association has pushed for a more open market device system, the Removable User Identity Module (R-UIM) »www.cdg.org/devices/omh.asp. but little has come of it.

Happydude32
Premium
join:2005-07-16
kudos:1
reply to FusionX101
I could not disagree more!

If you don’t want cellular data access, then get an iPod Touch, Samsung Galaxy Player or whatnot and pay nothing but the cost of the device. I have no idea where people get this notion that the whole planet is covered with free wifi when it is not. I see absolutely no point whatsoever having a smartphone without data, isn’t that the whole idea? For me, a smartphone means having 24/7 internet access in my pocket no matter where I am. It means being able to stream Sirius XM while driving, using the phone as my GPS, streaming live sports when I can’t be home to watch them on the big screen, or setting my DVR to record a live sporting event that I’m at but forgot to set it to record before I left home.

I also have a tablet that requires a data plan. I originally purchased a wifi only tablet last year, got back to my car, was all excited to set it up, but guess what, I couldn’t. No internet access. I was outside of the biggest mall in the Buffalo area and could not pick up any free wifi. I had to drive down the road and around the corner to a local supermarket and sit in the parking lot and use their wifi from their in-store café. Two days later I returned the tablet and went to the Sprint Store and bought one that required a data plan. Having a Sony Android based MP3 Player, I know what it’s like to have a smartphone like device without native data, and it sucks. I love the MP3 Player, it has a ton of great features and as an MP3 Player it is great, but if I want to do anything like check the score of a game, get my email, look up something on Wikipedia, it sucks. I also have a USB data card for my laptop, so when I’m out and about I don’t have to rely on 1) Actually finding wifi 2) Connecting to a network that God only knows who else is on it and how secure it actually is. $50/month for a data card is a small price to pay for not having to up up with wifi.

If the wireless carries want to sell service for smartphones that require a data plan, that is their right. It’s called business, the goal is to make as much money as possible. If you don’t like it, get a dumbphone or do with a phone altogether. No one is forcing you to buy anything. And there is certainly no monopolistic actions here. I love when people throw around the term monopoly, when there is clearly not one, it makes me laugh.
--
For the future of our nation, we must unite and vote out the terrorist known as Hussein Obama. Come November 6 2012 we must remove the socialist pig out of office and get our country back on the RIGHT track.


Cabal
Premium
join:2007-01-21
Reviews:
·Suddenlink

1 edit
reply to FusionX101
Prepaid (especially SIM card) plans don't force data on smartphones. You decide what services you want, you pay for them, and that's what you get - end of story. You should consider one, there are a lot of good SIM card plans out now.
--
If you can't open it, you don't own it.


Cabal
Premium
join:2007-01-21
Reviews:
·Suddenlink
reply to Happydude32
said by Happydude32:

If the wireless carries want to sell service for smartphones that require a data plan, that is their right. It’s called business, the goal is to make as much money as possible.

More to the point, they're doing it as part of recouping the subsidization costs of the smartphone purchased through that carrier. Requiring data services on *postpaid* plans with unsubsidized smartphones has little justification.
--
If you can't open it, you don't own it.


swintec
Premium,VIP
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·VoicePulse
·Sprint Mobile Br..
·RapidVPS
reply to FusionX101
I think it is also about them causing false demand. We are told 2 things over and over the past few years. Data use is through the roof time and time again and they are at a loss about what to do besides charge more money. Smart phone adoption rates are also through the roof.

If you force data plans on users during sign up, of course data use will be through the roof. Even if users do not even want data to begin with. I have an elderly friend who wants a smart phone simply due to there screen size so he can see what he is doing. Verizon keeps him on a dumb flip phone simply because he does not want or need a data plan.
--
Usenet Block Accounts | Unlimited Accounts

FusionX101

join:2012-06-16
reply to FusionX101
Thanks for the replies folks. I can understand there's a ton of people who can't live w/o data and are data hogs. However, it doesn't justify them to rape our wallets for it.. Not everyone needs data and it's an extremely easy solution to the problem is giving consumers a choice whether or not they want data. Back in the day I believe it was like this until it became a monopoly with the smartphones.

There are no known good looking phones with all the bells and whistle s that I know that does not require some sort of data. Someone I know for years who's been paying for data all of a sudden decided they could no longer afford it just could not cut it off and stay with talk and text plan, plus they are stuck in the 2 year agreement.

FusionX101

join:2012-06-16
reply to Happydude32
said by Happydude32:

I could not disagree more!

If you don’t want cellular data access, then get an iPod Touch, Samsung Galaxy Player or whatnot and pay nothing but the cost of the device. I have no idea where people get this notion that the whole planet is covered with free wifi when it is not. I see absolutely no point whatsoever having a smartphone without data, isn’t that the whole idea? For me, a smartphone means having 24/7 internet access in my pocket no matter where I am. It means being able to stream Sirius XM while driving, using the phone as my GPS, streaming live sports when I can’t be home to watch them on the big screen, or setting my DVR to record a live sporting event that I’m at but forgot to set it to record before I left home.

I also have a tablet that requires a data plan. I originally purchased a wifi only tablet last year, got back to my car, was all excited to set it up, but guess what, I couldn’t. No internet access. I was outside of the biggest mall in the Buffalo area and could not pick up any free wifi. I had to drive down the road and around the corner to a local supermarket and sit in the parking lot and use their wifi from their in-store café. Two days later I returned the tablet and went to the Sprint Store and bought one that required a data plan. Having a Sony Android based MP3 Player, I know what it’s like to have a smartphone like device without native data, and it sucks. I love the MP3 Player, it has a ton of great features and as an MP3 Player it is great, but if I want to do anything like check the score of a game, get my email, look up something on Wikipedia, it sucks. I also have a USB data card for my laptop, so when I’m out and about I don’t have to rely on 1) Actually finding wifi 2) Connecting to a network that God only knows who else is on it and how secure it actually is. $50/month for a data card is a small price to pay for not having to up up with wifi.

If the wireless carries want to sell service for smartphones that require a data plan, that is their right. It’s called business, the goal is to make as much money as possible. If you don’t like it, get a dumbphone or do with a phone altogether. No one is forcing you to buy anything. And there is certainly no monopolistic actions here. I love when people throw around the term monopoly, when there is clearly not one, it makes me laugh.


FusionX101

join:2012-06-16
reply to Happydude32
said by Happydude32:

I could not disagree more!

If the wireless carries want to sell service for smartphones that require a data plan, that is their right. It’s called business, the goal is to make as much money as possible. If you don’t like it, get a dumbphone or do with a phone altogether. No one is forcing you to buy anything. And there is certainly no monopolistic actions here. I love when people throw around the term monopoly, when there is clearly not one, it makes me laugh.

I respect your opinion but you are wrong when it comes to monopolization and just contradicted yourself when bringing up the term "dumbphone" and business practices..

I'm assuming you mean basic flip phone or one with not much capabilities.. Well, it's very simple for phone companies to give you a choice whether or not to add data and I like androids for emailing and wifi, no it's not available everywhere but a good amount of places and I can certainly live with limited wifi.
I want a phone for listening to music, having the opportunity to download apps when at home and generally having a better looking phone that's up to date. There are other options but they're still limited capabilities and aren't so convenient.

BlitzenZeus
Burnt Out Cynic
Premium
join:2000-01-13
kudos:3
They force data plans for profits, that's all it is. Just like forced messaging plans/etc. They are quite capable of making data entirely optional, and those claimed recovery of phone subsidies are recovered by the higher prices contract plans.

Data used to also be $10-30 for unlimited, now they want tons of money for a very small cap, and want you to use high speed services to bring you over that cap, it's pure entrapment.

Consumers as a whole need to use their damn brains, and stop paying companies that are actively extorting them.

For the record I have prepaid, most people pay more in taxes alone per month than I do when figured monthly.
--
I distrust those people who know so well what god wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires- Susan B. Anthony
Yesterday we obeyed kings, and bent out necks before emperors. But today we kneel only to the truth- Kahlil G.


r81984
Fair and Balanced
Premium
join:2001-11-14
Katy, TX
Reviews:
·row44

1 recommendation

reply to Happydude32
said by Happydude32:

I see absolutely no point whatsoever having a smartphone without data, isn’t that the whole idea?

I have always had a qwerty smart phone with no data plan.
Now i buy china android phones and use wifi only.
I use my phone as a GPS with no internet connection.
I would have no problem affording mobile data, but I dont see the point. Why have an internet connection on your hip 24/7 if it is not a business phone?

It is insane to force data plans on customers.
If you buy a china android smart phone they wont recognize the imei as a needing a data plan.
--
...brought to you by Carl's Jr.


marathonmike
Beer. You can only rent it

join:2001-12-12
Princeton, NJ
I have the last smartphone that verizon permitted without a data plan. It is a samsung i760. If you can find one, I think you can still get a regular no data plan.
It is a touchscreen phone with wifi.
--
Go desiel


Boricua
Premium
join:2002-01-26
Sacramuerto
reply to BlitzenZeus
said by BlitzenZeus:

They force data plans for profits, that's all it is. Just like forced messaging plans/etc. They are quite capable of making data entirely optional, and those claimed recovery of phone subsidies are recovered by the higher prices contract plans...

+1
--
Illegal aliens have always been a problem in the United States. Ask any Indian. Robert Orben


Robotics
See You On The Dark Side
Premium
join:2003-10-23
Louisa, VA
reply to BlitzenZeus
said by BlitzenZeus:

They force data plans for profits, that's all it is. Just like forced messaging plans/etc. They are quite capable of making data entirely optional, and those claimed recovery of phone subsidies are recovered by the higher prices contract plans.

Cable and satellite company's do the same thing. Charge us for HD programming, and you can bet HD is here to stay and just about everyone is doing it....so why pay? Its the norm already!
(maybe this should be a rant and or another subject)
But it sure does remind me of getting raped by the cell phone company's for data.

I guess 20 years from now we will still be getting charged for HD programming.
--
Long you live and high you fly, and smiles you'll give and tears you'll cry,
and all you touch and all you see, is all your life will ever be.


Chinabound
Premium
join:2002-12-21
Antioch, IL
kudos:3
reply to Happydude32
Click for full size
said by Happydude32:

I see absolutely no point whatsoever having a smartphone without data..

Well, good for you. I don't see any point in being connected to the internet around the clock. Especially at the rates they charge.

I like having a smart phone without a data plan. And it is possible to obtain what is called a "Data Exclusion Plan".

synergi

join:2007-08-24
Benton Harbor, MI
reply to FusionX101
Buy any smartphone you want. Get a google voice number, download Talkaton (iOS) or Groove IP (Android) for Voip. Buy a Mifi. I make and recieve calls, and have my data for surfing and web and I pay a grand total of 20 bucks a month. I cut out my 100 dollar cell phone bill doing this..
Expand your moderator at work


RR Conductor
NWP RR Inc.,serving NW CA
Premium
join:2002-04-02
Redwood Valley, CA
kudos:1
reply to FusionX101

Re: [Verizon] Why do companies force data on all smartphones

Easy answer, to make more money.


marathonmike
Beer. You can only rent it

join:2001-12-12
Princeton, NJ
reply to synergi
Who is your wireless provider? $20/mo unlimited data?
What am I missing?
--
Go desiel

synergi

join:2007-08-24
Benton Harbor, MI
I don't have unlimited. I'm just using a 1gb plan for my iPad. (Hot spot free) through Verizon. I carry my ipad in my purse anyway so I started using it to make calls on my Evo.

Hubby, has a Virgin Mobile Mifi, he uses that to make and receive calls on his Google Nexus. Has to be bought through Walmart to get the 1gb for 20 and I think you can get 5 gb for 55 and 2 for 35 if I'm not mistake. If you are a data hog, these probably won't help you. If you use use less then4 or 5gb,s then check out Mifi's.


marti
Color outside the lines
Premium,MVM
join:2001-12-14
Houston, TX
kudos:5

1 recommendation

reply to FusionX101
If you don't want data, then get a phone that that is not smart. You still can find phones that make phone calls and that's it. There are providers that have grandpa and grandma phones that only make phone calls.
--
Team Discovery

Don Juane

join:2001-12-19
Anguilla
It always kills me when this discussion comes up. First you have to spend hours proving why you don't want a data plan while weeding through post after post of social commentary on your lack of coolness or not being with the program in order to search for an answer that usually never manifests itself. WTFDIM? If you don't want a data plan, you don't want one. Personally, tell me why it is "smart" to have a "smart phone" that siphons $30 on top or over the $50 or more out of your bank account each month for a service you may use 5-10% of the time, utilizing a home or workplace wi-fi the remainder of the time.

Maybe simply you want a computer to fit in your pocket and don't have enough pockets to hold an arsenal of devices (camera, phone, computer). GPS might be an offline issue but if the phone has the capability you can load one that works offline. You can buy a heck of lot of mapping software in trade for not paying $360+ per year for a seldom used data plan. A two year contract plus the subsided cost of most smart phones is $1000+ )+tax +texting +voice) up front for the contract duration and $360+ (+tax +texting +voice) per year of ongoing fees. Not that smart in my opinion.

Still there are those who may stress an alternative of using a full data/voice/text package with a carrier off the mainstream but a lot of these use Sprint and the coverage map for it is sub-par to most of the competition. Still it comes back to the fact that if you don't want a data plan, you don't want a data plan and it would be kind and beneficial to receive info here only about how you accomplish that without commentary on why you are making a mistake or not intelligent to ask for info on how to set up a smart phone with voice and no data plan.

With all that said, it looks like buying a Chinese smart phone with an IMEI number unknown to the monopoly US carriers may be the answer. I will continue to investigate.


Hagar

join:2004-10-31
Sunnyvale, CA
Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
·AT&T U-Verse
It is hard to give you more detail advice on unknown IMEI phones unless we know which provider you eventually want to use, I am guessing AT&T.

I have an unlocked Samsung Exhibit II 4G that AT&T does not recognize. AT&T also did not recognize a Nokia 900.
I see two problems with this strategy
1) You do not know if your provider (AT&T) will eventually start to sell the model, e.g. the unknown phone model gets recognized
2) The AT&T plans (data or no data) are not the best value (IMHO)

My strategy is unlocked phone, Google voice as the main number, several sim cards that I can activate as no contract prepaid in a few minutes.
I can now use T-mobile or AT&T or a MVNO as Straighttalk. No contract means I leave my provider if I am unhappy for any reason. I can try out a provider with little effort and cost.


Boricua
Premium
join:2002-01-26
Sacramuerto
Unfortunately, it does not work for VZW who I am currently with. Granted, their newer phones uses a SIM for the LTE, but I (and my mum) is still on 3G. I know my mom does not want anything to do with fancy phones (as she told me when I was shopping for one), and I sure as hell have no need for a data plan. I broke an LG Chocolate Touch and now have the Samsung Rogue. Unless something happens to it, I'll be with that phone until (unfortunately) they turn off the 3G and force me and my mom on LTE.
--
Illegal aliens have always been a problem in the United States. Ask any Indian. Robert Orben

Don Juane

join:2001-12-19
Anguilla
reply to Hagar
AT&T is the plan and it is for a family member add-on at $9.95 a month who talks seldom, about 90 minutes a month at most, wants one device with phone capability, no data plan, camera and internet access through wi-fi all in one device. GPS using satellite without any data plan requirement for cell tower location would also be nice. If the cell tower locator doesn't require a data plan, I wouldn't be against the technology. Thanks.


Hagar

join:2004-10-31
Sunnyvale, CA
Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
·AT&T U-Verse
Don Juane,

I recommend that you get a Samsung Galaxy Nexus, it is unlocked and AT&T did not recognize the IMEI last time I checked (June 2012).

For GPS I would checkout the apps MapDroyd or Navigon I do not have experience with either but they claim to do GPS without data plan.