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howardfine
join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO

howardfine to Razzy

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Re: Could Linux take off thanks to Windows 8?

Yes. Really. You can always find a couple of anything but if you think Windows has any significant share of embedded devices or datacenters, well, I won't say anything or this will get deleted, too.
Razzy
join:2012-06-21

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Oh yeah, xbox 360 has windows code... my Ford has SYNC.... Uverse DVR/converter box is on Windows...
Razzy

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TomTom GPS runs on Windows CE.....

howardfine
join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO

howardfine

Member

Keep going. I'm sure you can find hundreds. Of course there are millions of devices out there but keep going. btw, your router runs Linux. Charter DVR's run Linux. Oh, I'm not playing this game.
Expand your moderator at work
Razzy
join:2012-06-21

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Re: Could Linux take off thanks to Windows 8?

Believe it or not, my Linux server is a router (two network cards). ;p

howardfine
join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO

howardfine to Razzy

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said by Razzy:

Oh yeah, xbox 360 has windows code...

Honest to God? A Microsoft product has Windows code in it?! And Microsoft claims they rule the embedded world? Imagine that.
howardfine

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So does your ISP.

TuxRaiderPen2
Make America Great Again
join:2009-09-19

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said by EUS:
Strange, I have no problems using nouveau. Why is it a joke?
Lack of 3D acceleration
Lack of feature support
Lack.. of CUDA
Lack..lack of fan/temp controls
Lack.. performance

Hmmm.. lack... or lacking... period.

NON OEM - This may not be an issue to you, but I use OEM software and/or drivers ie: HPLIP, nvidia, etc. v. community drivers like noveau. unless there is no OEM support ie: Kodak AIO5500 via cups2eps

Yes in some cases the community may provide better drivers/software, which is fine, and if thats the case I would use those except in the case of video. I want nVidias drivers, period. KMS support is NOT of interest or required by me. Nor is 90% of the features of the card(s) I have. I have a card specifically to drive multiple monitors at high resolution for desktop and video playback on anything from 22 to 37"

AND more importantly in the vain of this topic...

users coming from another "OS" expect [demand] the OEM to provide the software/drivers they need. If you think there is going to be any change in ways or learning from these users on how drivers etc. work in Linux, BSD, etc.. You can fuhggeddit! Thats not happening.
itguy05
join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA

itguy05 to Razzy

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said by Razzy:

TomTom GPS runs on Windows CE.....

My Tom Tom One runs Linux - Tom Tom uses Linux a lot. As does, IIRC Garmin. Magellan does use CE.

And I've got Sync in my Ford. It's obviously a MS product. See Ford's many issues with My Ford Touch which most of which can be traced to the use of Microsoft.

Linux Owns Embedded and MS is the ones playing catch up.

pfak
Premium Member
join:2002-12-29
Vancouver, BC

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Every time a new version of Windows or OS X comes out, this question comes up.

Linux proponents seem to think Linux is ready for the desktop, but as far as I can tell in the past 10 years or so little has changed.

It is still not ready for the desktop, does not have nearly enough compatibility and has ideology gets in the way too much for actual progress (Alsa vs. PulseAudio, KDE vs. Gnome, Unity .. etc.)

El Quintron
Cancel Culture Ambassador
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join:2008-04-28
Tronna

El Quintron

Premium Member

said by pfak:

Linux proponents seem to think Linux is ready for the desktop, but as far as I can tell in the past 10 years or so little has changed.

It is still not ready for the desktop, does not have nearly enough compatibility and has ideology gets in the way too much for actual progress (Alsa vs. PulseAudio, KDE vs. Gnome, Unity .. etc.)

Eh?

I'm not sure I get you there, all of the variables you've listed are choices users and distro packagers make, not ideologies.
me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO
·Google Fiber

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I think its gonna better than it was with vista. Speaking as someone who bought a computer with vista right after it was released, as bad as it was at least it still had the normal gui I could operate. I have a friend whose dad is has a computer science degree and can work linux from 100% the command line. The two of them had to work every night for two weeks to learn how to use metro. People can download mint or ubuntu and with a few clicks be on the web. Which one of those sounds less user friendly?

XT0RT
S3x, Drugs, War
join:2001-07-28
Edmonton, AB

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said by HoboJ:

Until you find linux pre-installed on computers sold at bestbuy, etc you'll never see it take off spectacularly.

This happened quite a few years ago actually. Best Buy was selling desktops with Lindows on them for $300. You paid for the hardware and you got the OS for free. In the end, it was a major flop.

I agree with pfak though about it not being ready for the desktop. You'll never have a standardized version of Linux that revolves around one GUI. Myself, I am a Gnome kind of person and I use to love Ubuntu. Then came along this pile of horse-sh** called Unity, thus having me find another Debian based distro. I know there are ways to fix that, but I don't want the time in doing so.

El Quintron
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join:2008-04-28
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said by me1212:

I think its gonna better than it was with vista. Speaking as someone who bought a computer with vista right after it was released, as bad as it was at least it still had the normal gui I could operate.

Vista before SP2 was nearly unuseable, it was so laggy it made my head spin, and I was running it on a Q6700 with 8GBs of RAM...

I haven't used Win8 (and don't intend on moving beyond Win7 for the forseeable future) but if Win8 has a foreign feeling GUI, and lag, Desktop Linux is going to have a once in a lifetime opportunity to make some big waves.
Razzy
join:2012-06-21

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Right I did not deny that. It's all from this:
said by howardfine :

*nix already DOMINATES all those (except the desktop) and Windows is virtually non-existant

Razzy

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said by El Quintron:

said by me1212:

I think its gonna better than it was with vista. Speaking as someone who bought a computer with vista right after it was released, as bad as it was at least it still had the normal gui I could operate.

Vista before SP2 was nearly unuseable, it was so laggy it made my head spin, and I was running it on a Q6700 with 8GBs of RAM...

I haven't used Win8 (and don't intend on moving beyond Win7 for the forseeable future) but if Win8 has a foreign feeling GUI, and lag, Desktop Linux is going to have a once in a lifetime opportunity to make some big waves.

Vista RTM ran perfect on my C2D 3.16ghz and 4GB (jumped to 8GB sometimes later). Better than XP did.

markofmayhem
Why not now?
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join:2004-04-08
Pittsburgh, PA

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said by El Quintron:

said by me1212:

I think its gonna better than it was with vista. Speaking as someone who bought a computer with vista right after it was released, as bad as it was at least it still had the normal gui I could operate.

Vista before SP2 was nearly unuseable, it was so laggy it made my head spin, and I was running it on a Q6700 with 8GBs of RAM...

I haven't used Win8 (and don't intend on moving beyond Win7 for the forseeable future) but if Win8 has a foreign feeling GUI, and lag, Desktop Linux is going to have a once in a lifetime opportunity to make some big waves.

It is very similar to Unity and Gnome 3 (start screen), with more up-front social connectivity and very efficient mouse-keyboard usage to move around in the OS. Lag is nonexistent in both beta versions on a computer that is minimum spec for Windows 7. DirectX 11.1 will further enhance acceleration and "snappiness".

The OS itself, in a vacuum, is not a disaster. IMO, there are a few things happening:

1. It is the "every other OS" step to be hated. Some are jumping the band wagon before release for "cred".
2. Microsoft Store eliminated a non-pay release on ARM, hope was there to reduce cost on this small form factor OS (Google/Apple).
3. Integration into Metro to include the cost/time to perform it was ignored due to "classic desktop HAS to be included, right?" ignorance.
4. OpenGL sure does cost less than DirectX...

Ideologues pray for 4 being the reason. I happen to think populist supporting people, such as Gabe, are more focused on number 1. But, so what? Get those OpenGL optimizations/fixes upstream and foster Linux to be an acceptable gaming alternative OS.
me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO
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I used vista no SP on a c2d e4300 + 2GB ram. horrid it was. Windows 8 forces you to use metro to start the old windows 7 like desktop and the metro menu replaced the start menu. Its supposed to be resource light, but if the users can't learn how to work it its not going to do well I pray linux takes advantage of this some how.

Dell is putting out an ultra book that comes with ubuntuon it, an ivy bridge mobile(still ht'd quad core) i7, and hd 4k. Not good for gaming, but its enough for l4d2 and minecraft and I believe wow. and for the first two enough to run a server on and play at the same time. I know nothing of running wow servers or if it can be done on a personal non blizzard box.

And theres a laptop that radio shack and some other places are gonna sell with a sandy bridge mobile i5 and a 6770m i believe. again, not good but enough for wow, minecraft, l4d2, and the servers. Plus the rest of the source games should follow in toe once the engine is ported.

While these are not high end laptops, they are still commercially sold(at least one in a nation wide store) that come with linux pre-installed.

JohnInSJ
Premium Member
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

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said by me1212:

The two of them had to work every night for two weeks to learn how to use metro.

Two weeks to learn to press the Windows key + D key? Wow. Yeah, they're ready for Linux.

El Quintron
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join:2008-04-28
Tronna

El Quintron

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said by JohnInSJ:

said by me1212:

The two of them had to work every night for two weeks to learn how to use metro.

Two weeks to learn to press the Windows key + D key? Wow. Yeah, they're ready for Linux.

I'm sure he meant "finding what they needed because they were used to doing it another way."

JohnInSJ
Premium Member
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

JohnInSJ

Premium Member

said by El Quintron:

said by JohnInSJ:

said by me1212:

The two of them had to work every night for two weeks to learn how to use metro.

Two weeks to learn to press the Windows key + D key? Wow. Yeah, they're ready for Linux.

I'm sure he meant "finding what they needed because they were used to doing it another way."

Two Weeks to learn the Charms shortcut? Other than that, there isn't two weeks of changes to learn if you're using your existing apps on Win8. You don't HAVE to use metro for anything. The UI changes for trivial stuff take about 10 minutes to learn. You can dismiss the Metro (hey, it's a really big start menu) screen and live in the desktop if you want. Other than bugfixes, the OS isn't any different than 7 >= Visa >= NT.
Razzy
join:2012-06-21

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They could not find the Desktop tile on the start screen?

Cheese
Premium Member
join:2003-10-26
Naples, FL

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No...

FF4m3
@bhn.net

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said by howardfine:

said by No_Strings:

There are many people, like myself, who advocate the adoption of Linux and Open Source and think it would be great to have it showing up in greater numbers in everything from embedded systems, datacenters and desktops.

*nix already DOMINATES all those (except the desktop) and Windows is virtually non-existant.

Agreed.

The following was last updated on 8 January 2012 so it is not nearly all inclusive by any means. It's 143 pages provide a general overview of sorts: Linux-Based Devices.
me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO

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No, if you re-read what I posted they spent two weeks learning how to actually use metro. They didn't take the easy way out, they wanted to actually learn about/how to use metro before they passed judgment on it.
ctggzg
Premium Member
join:2005-02-11
USA

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Windows 7 won't instantly die when Windows 8 is released. Hell, XP is being supported and updated through 2014, 13 years after release. I expect that many people will with 7 rather than jump to a completely different OS.
scross
join:2002-09-13
USA

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said by me1212:

No, if you re-read what I posted they spent two weeks learning how to actually use metro. They didn't take the easy way out, they wanted to actually learn about/how to use metro before they passed judgment on it.

This just hot off the press - it's officially not "Metro" any longer, it's "[insert name to be decided at a future date]"!

»bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2 ··· ct-look/

Santa Fe
BUT.....I Digress!

join:2000-08-22
Freight Yard

Santa Fe

said by scross:

said by me1212:

No, if you re-read what I posted they spent two weeks learning how to actually use metro. They didn't take the easy way out, they wanted to actually learn about/how to use metro before they passed judgment on it.

This just hot off the press - it's officially not "Metro" any longer, it's "[insert name to be decided at a future date]"!

»bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2 ··· ct-look/

Maybe MS figured out there would be a lot of "Metro-Sexual" jokes floating around out there?
scross
join:2002-09-13
USA

scross

Member

said by Santa Fe:

Maybe MS figured out there would be a lot of "Metro-Sexual" jokes floating around out there?

Apparently they are trying to head off some kind of trademark dispute, but I like your idea better!