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Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:1
reply to Mele20

Re: Stranded jet-skier saunters through JFK safeguards

said by Mele20:

He swam three miles and then climbed the fence and walked across two runways and then approached a Delta worker on the tarmac near a gate.

The original article (not the Fox news article) said this:

"The highly touted PIDS system, which was first announced in 2009, has proven to be a boondoggle, having never fully come online after a series of troubling delays.

“The Port Authority PBA has been concerned about the failure of
the PIDS system for quite some time. We have brought this to the attention of former Executive Director Chris Ward, who failed to act,” Robert Egbert, spokesman for the PA PBA."

What is outrageous here is that he was arrested and charged with trespass. His only alternative was to drown along with his jet ski. Of course, he and his friends were acting stupid macho after having drinks at a local watering hole as they decided to race each other. His friends did not realize that his ski broke down and that they had left him behind. He then called his girlfriend who promised to send someone to tow him in who never showed up, thus, he swam the three miles.

If the details in the original article are correct then he had no choice except maybe call his girl friend again as the ski sank deeper? Charging him with trespass is absurd.

I am guessing the arrest is vital to security theater......
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Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:4

I am wondering why there are only four news articles about this incident: FoxNews, The Daily Mail, Gothamist and the original article in the New York Post.

»news.google.com/news/story?q=str···kQqgIwAA
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Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
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Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:1

1 recommendation

they do not want the fact that millions of dollars of tax money was completely wasted on a sensor system defeated by a guy with wet clothing and a leaking jet ski...

$100,000 in equipment could do better than that(ie a bunch of Police Impalas to drive around the perimeter roads with a guy holding a radio to call things in.)

the TSA and DHS could not secure a concrete room with one door.
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dave
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reply to Mele20

3 out of 4 of those are comic books (I don't know anything about the 'Gothamist'), so maybe it didn't actually happen like that?

The photo on the Gothamist (caption: "Casillo was wearing a bright yellow life jacket like the one above") isn't very inspiring either.

Yeah, yeah, I know: don't shoot the messenger. But surely when no respectable news organ has the story, it tells us something.



Spy
Premium
join:2001-09-22
NE
reply to goalieskates

that wasn't me. I was busy watching the bourne supremacy movie that night.



Name Game
Premium
join:2002-07-07
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:7

1 recommendation

reply to Mele20

said by Mele20:

I am wondering why there are only four news articles about this incident: FoxNews, The Daily Mail, Gothamist and the original article in the New York Post.

»news.google.com/news/story?q=str···kQqgIwAA

Because you just let google tell you how many there were instead of you using search terms like jet skier+JFK.. that way you would have found more...then also cause sunday is a slow day...but here is some more.

Call for probe in jet ski JFK breach

The outraged head of the Port Authority police union today demanded an investigation into how a swamped jet skier was able to breach Kennedy Airport’s troubled $100 million security system.

Paul Nunziato, president of the authority’s PBA, will send a letter to PA big Patrick Foye “demanding a PA inspector’s general investigation into the failed Perimeter Intrusion Detection System, the cost over-runs and the relationship between the Port Authority and Raytheon, the vendor,” said Robert Egbert, a PBA spokesman.
The ballyhooed PIDS system, which was first announced in 2009, has proven to be a boondoggle, having never fully come online after a series of delays.

The PA, which runs the airport, says that it has stepped up patrols and is reviewing the incident and that it plans to meet with PIDS maker Raytheon this week about the breach.

a Raytheon rep said, “We are working closely with the Port Authority to determine what happened. “

»www.nypost.com/p/news/local/dema···XlO3UbGM

Last year at JFK there was a huge uproar over that same perimeter fence, when it was knocked out by weather and remained down for days.

New York Port Authority officials tell ABC News this time around they "took immediate action to increase its police presence with round the clock patrols of the facility's perimeter and increased patrols by boat of the surrounding waterway."

"We have called for an expedited review of the incident and a complete investigation to determine how Raytheon's perimeter intrusion detection system-which exceeds federal requirements-could be improved. Our goal is to keep the region's airports safe and secure at all times," the Port Authority said in a statement.

»abcnews.go.com/US/jet-skier-brea···16992190

The way you searched forced google to only look for these terms.."stranded jet skier"

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Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:4

1 recommendation

said by Name Game:

The way you searched forced google to only look for these terms.."stranded jet skier"

I did a regular Google search. Google doesn't let you search as you want to anymore. It gives you the search results after maybe three keystrokes. I could keep typing but Google has already found the results after three keystrokes and usually its auto suggestions that appear after just a couple of keystrokes are the same or better than what I intended to type. I didn't do a News search but a regular one (although with Google NO search is a "regular" search anymore) and then when it gave only 4 results that were relevant, I clicked on Google News and that is the url I posted...not the original search.

I just did the original search again and Google is now reporting CBS and Wall Street Journal articles too. But they are a joke. The Wall Street Journal should be ashamed of itself...mickey mouse reporting and all they did was repeat what the original NY Post said. No actual reporting by any of the sources.

What does the weekend have to do with anything? News doesn't wait for Monday morning. This shows we no longer have access to news because no one is reporting.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson


goalieskates
Premium
join:2004-09-12
land of big
reply to goalieskates

said by goalieskates:

I wonder if this is the same system in use at Oak Ridge.

I'm still not sure if Oak Ridge's was a Raytheon product, although Raytheon is definitely in OR. But more light reading on their break-in:

Did PIDAS work? Conflicting reports (KNS / Munger)

quote:
National Nuclear Security Administration spokesman Steven Wyatt today said the federal agency stands by previous statements that a sensor on the PIDAS (perimeter intrusion detection and assessment system) triggered the response to Saturday's morning intrusion by peace protesters into the highest-security area at the Y-12 nuclear weapons plant.

There have been multiple reports from members of the Y-12 protective force indicating that there was no alarm triggered by the PIDAS, saying the initial response by security police was prompted by noise from the protesters -- who draped banners and painted messages on the exterior of the Highly Enriched Uranium Materials Facility.
Where's the Oversight at Nuclear Labs? (Project on Government Oversight) (picked up later by HuffPo) (contains multiple links)

quote:
Earlier in 2012, Independent Oversight reviewed the known problem with cameras, sensors, alarms and coordination with the central alarm station and the PIDAS (Perimeter Intrusion Detection and Assessment System) at Y-12. They found serious malfunctions in the system including some alarm systems, cameras and sensors that had been inoperable for nine months.
So both systems had known problems that didn't get fixed. We know now of 2 PIDAS systems bypassed by a nun and a jet-skier. Not bad guys looking to kill thousands by any stretch of the imagination.

DHS=boondoggle.


Name Game
Premium
join:2002-07-07
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:7

2 edits

1 recommendation

reply to Mele20

Baloney..this link you posted
»news.google.com/news/story?q=str···kQqgIwAA

it only searched for "stranded jet skier" as I stated, since all you did was hit the button for more stories..slow sunday had to do with the obvious..and they were all into the closing olympic thingie.

ht tps://news.google.com/news/story?q=stranded+jet+skier&hl=en&lr=&prmd=imvnsu&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&biw=1169&bih=895&noj=1&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ncl=dIR2k-Ssm-2VVpMPhcKAyBgPPgojM&sa=X&ei=9Z8oUMjNIdDy2gWU8IBA&ved=0CBkQqgIwAA

And google certainly does let you search for what one wants..I do it all the time

so how many do you get here
»www.google.com/search?q=Daniel+C···&bih=746

(Page 10 of about 2,880 results (0.27 seconds))

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ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Mechanicsville, VA

1 edit

1 recommendation

reply to dave

said by dave:

3 out of 4 of those are comic books (I don't know anything about the 'Gothamist'), so maybe it didn't actually happen like that?

Just like ABC, NBC, and CBS too.

It is more like the three mentioned above don't want to bring light to the current administrations waste of tax payer money since they seem to be in bed with the current administration.

Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:1
reply to goalieskates

though to be fair, Perimeter motion sensing systems are a complete farce anyway. I bet they will find the one at JFK was shut off due to birds or other wildlife constantly triggering it.

Guessing this is why the government facilities that are in theory super secure(which it seems they arent in the case of Oak Ridge) are likely in the middle of no where... if backed against a sub-division the neighborhood kids would be throwing crap over the fence just to see how many guards come running when the motion alarms went off.
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Name Game
Premium
join:2002-07-07
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:7

1 recommendation

Alarms like that are more sophisticated now days..they can be adjusted to ignore by size and weight and other signatures /features that minimize false alarms and things like that.



StuartMW
Who Is John Galt?
Premium
join:2000-08-06
Galt's Gulch
kudos:2

1 recommendation

reply to goalieskates

This story (and discussion) reminds me of Mathias Rust who back in 1987 landed his small plane in Red Square (Moscow). The Soviets were not amused that all their air defenses were breached by an amateur.
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MaynardKrebs
Premium
join:2009-06-17
kudos:4

Toronto cousins regret touching U.S. soil
»www.thestar.com/News/GTA/article/485451



Name Game
Premium
join:2002-07-07
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:7

1 recommendation

reply to goalieskates

But this wasn’t just any ordinary fence. It was part of the Port Authority’s Perimeter Intrusion Detection System, or PIDS, backed up by motion sensors and closed-circuit cameras. None of the fancy gadgets managed to pick up the image of a lone figure scaling the fence, dripping wet and clad in a bright-yellow life jacket. Nor was Casillo detected when he crossed Runway 4L, where it intersects a second runway. In fact, he made it all the way to Terminal 3 without anyone noticing him.

If he hadn’t flagged down a Delta worker on the tarmac outside the terminal, he might well have made it clear inside the building and out the other side to the taxi line. Instead, he was arrested by Port Authority police and charged with criminal trespass.

»hotair.com/greenroom/archives/20···etected/
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Subaru
1-3-2-4
Premium
join:2001-05-31
Greenwich, CT
kudos:1
reply to goalieskates

Did they not care that he could of died? Where else could he have gone? Sounds like they are trying to save face here.



Name Game
Premium
join:2002-07-07
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:7
reply to MaynardKrebs

said by MaynardKrebs:

Toronto cousins regret touching U.S. soil
»www.thestar.com/News/GTA/article/485451

»www.greenhulk.net/forums/showthr···?t=71340


Mike
Premium,Mod
join:2000-09-17
Pittsburgh, PA
kudos:1

1 recommendation

reply to Subaru

Illegals come over the border. The herp derp fest that is ICE doesn't take any chances.



ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Mechanicsville, VA

1 edit

1 recommendation

reply to Mele20

said by Mele20:

If the details in the original article are correct then he had no choice except maybe call his girl friend again as the ski sank deeper? Charging him with trespass is absurd.

Uh.. Last time I checked, cell phones could call 911 where he could have gotten help. No need for jumping a chain link fence, into a secure area to get help.


FutureMon
Ach Du Lieber
Premium,ExMod 2002-05
join:2000-10-05
Seaside, CA
Reviews:
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Not knowing the details of the fence line, why couldn't he have just walked along the fence line until he got somewhere he could be noticed?

Even if he does get charged, public outrage over the incident will hopefully get them dropped. But of course, the officials in charge of security have to have some time to beat their chests first...

- FM
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ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Mechanicsville, VA

1 recommendation

said by FutureMon:

Not knowing the details of the fence line, why couldn't he have just walked along the fence line until he got somewhere he could be noticed?

Even if he does get charged, public outrage over the incident will hopefully get them dropped. But of course, the officials in charge of security have to have some time to beat their chests first...

- FM

In my opinion, he did something stupid and SHOULD be charged for it as there were other ways for him to get help that would not have involved jumping a chain link fence into a KNOWN SECURE area.

Also, there SHOULD be an investigation as to why the multi-million dollar system that WE the tax payers paid for did not work.


Cheese
Premium
join:2003-10-26
Naples, FL
kudos:1
reply to Mele20

said by Mele20:

said by Name Game:

The way you searched forced google to only look for these terms.."stranded jet skier"

Google doesn't let you search as you want to anymore.

Bullshit...

iknow
Premium
join:2012-03-25

1 recommendation

reply to ropeguru

said by ropeguru:

said by FutureMon:

Not knowing the details of the fence line, why couldn't he have just walked along the fence line until he got somewhere he could be noticed?

Even if he does get charged, public outrage over the incident will hopefully get them dropped. But of course, the officials in charge of security have to have some time to beat their chests first...

- FM

In my opinion, he did something stupid and SHOULD be charged for it as there were other ways for him to get help that would not have involved jumping a chain link fence into a KNOWN SECURE area.

Also, there SHOULD be an investigation as to why the multi-million dollar system that WE the tax payers paid for did not work.

that's absurd!. would it be a crime to break into a house that is on fire to rescue possible occupants? NO!. would it be a crime to kill an arsonist who is about to set fire to a house or building? NO!. it's quite ok to commit a lower crime to prevent a higher crime. trespassing to save a life is quite ok in the U.S.

dave
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not in ohio
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Reviews:
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1 edit

said by iknow:

would it be a crime to break into a house that is on fire to rescue possible occupants? NO!.

I don't think he 'broke into the airport' to rescue anyone there.

would it be a crime to kill an arsonist who is about to set fire to a house or building? NO!.

I don't think anyone was about to set fire to the airport.

it's quite ok to commit a lower crime to prevent a higher crime. trespassing to save a life is quite ok in the U.S.

He was supposedly trespassing to supposedly save his own life. Although once he was on shore, maybe he was no longer in imminent danger of loss of life.

And in any case, your argument does not generally hold. One may expect the jury to consider the compelling need of preventing the 'higher crime', but there is AFAIK no such statute in law.

But in this situation there was no 'higher crime' to be prevented.

--
It's not that I think he ought to be charged with trespass, it's simply that the arguments you put up are irrelevant.

dave
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reply to ropeguru

said by ropeguru:

Last time I checked, cell phones could call 911 where he could have gotten help.

Last time I checked, cell phones generally don't survive a swim in salt water.

The way I read the story, he didn't swim until after his craft had started sinking ('taking on water'), and it probably wouldn't be prudent to wait around for someone to show up. So he swam. And we don't know if he has the wherewithal to keep his phone dry while swimming. In retrospect, a little waterproof phone case would have been a smart move, but we already know that forethought wasn't his strong suit.



AVD
Respice, Adspice, Prospice
Premium
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Onion, NJ
kudos:1
reply to Mele20

said by Mele20:

I am wondering why there are only four news articles about this incident: FoxNews, The Daily Mail, Gothamist and the original article in the New York Post.

»news.google.com/news/story?q=str···kQqgIwAA

post = fox news
I don't know who owns the Daily Mall.
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JALevinworth

@embarqhsd.net
reply to ropeguru

said by ropeguru:

said by FutureMon:

Not knowing the details of the fence line, why couldn't he have just walked along the fence line until he got somewhere he could be noticed?

Even if he does get charged, public outrage over the incident will hopefully get them dropped. But of course, the officials in charge of security have to have some time to beat their chests first...

- FM

In my opinion, he did something stupid and SHOULD be charged for it as there were other ways for him to get help that would not have involved jumping a chain link fence into a KNOWN SECURE area.

Also, there SHOULD be an investigation as to why the multi-million dollar system that WE the tax payers paid for did not work.

After looking at birdseye on Bing I don't think he had much choice. Realizing he was in dark and needing to swim for it, you naturally are going to save your ass and swim towards lights (I've been on a disabled power boat in the dark out in similar surroundings.. you can't see shore or any land in the dark unless there are lights). There doesn't appear to be anything but the airport around there. Looks undeveloped, swaps, and a golf course closest. The rest is the airport property.

Of course, he could have walked miles on the perimeter of the fence (assuming it was passable all the way around, but if it's dark you can't tell that) after that 3 mile swim to the front of the airport, but he didn't.

Whether he physically could or not or just didn't is still unknown - but if he could, so what? he's charged with climbing the fence. What's the PA to do? Not charge him and say, cool story bro? Of course they will and should. Doesn't mean the charges might not be dropped or reduced later either. It must be investigated completely first IMHO.

Even so, I bet he's glad to be alive to face the charges. That's a far better scenario than drowning.

-Jim


Name Game
Premium
join:2002-07-07
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:7
reply to goalieskates

Jet ski riders are on notice: stay off Jamaica Bay

MARK MORALES
Wednesday, June 20, 2012
Jet ski riders won’t have Jamaica Bay to cruise around anymore.

Federal park officials have started cracking down on jet ski riders, enforcing a ban that’s been on the books since 2001.

Riders who speed down the Brooklyn and Queens waterway have been getting either a written warning or a ticket for as much as $75 since the start of the summer season, according to sources.

“We get harassed constantly by (the US Parks Police),” said Anthony Stallone, owner of a jet ski tour company operating out of Venice Marina on Emmons Ave.

Stallone, 41, said he was riding with friends earlier this month when a slew of federal officials s stopped them and handed out fines.

“As soon as we came out of the marina they were right there waiting for us,” said Stallone.

Last weekend, parks officials were back again - this time preventing anyone from leaving the marina through Jamaica Bay causing Stallone to cancel his tours for the day.

“They totally shut down the whole marina - and there’s hundreds of jet skis riding out here,” said Stallone.

Officials for the US Parks Police said the law was always enforced but did not say how many tickets have been handed out.

It’s unclear if the ban is being consistently enforced: The News observed jet ski riders on the bay Wendesday afternoon.

National Parks Service officials also would not confirm the crackdown but said the ban is necessary to protect wildlife.

“Jamaica Bay is a sensitive environment. Species use it as their home,” said National Parks Service spokesman John Warren. “They get startled because of the sound [of the jet ski] and it erodes the salt marsh. We want to reverse that process.”

But local riders and marina operators said the ban is not fair.

Mike Bulzomi , who has been - manager of the Sea Travelers Marina on Flatbush Ave. for 16 years, said he’s never seen anyone come back on their jet ski with a ticket.

Bulzomi said he’s afraid that if the ban is enforced, jet skiers will hop off their rides for good.

“It’s ridiculous,” said Bulzomi. “It’s hard enough to stay in business with the way the economy is.”

One rider who got a written warning last week said he’s worried about what to do with his jet ski.

“It sucks. I spent a lot of money on this thing to get it fixed,” said the rider, who also paid $800 for the season for dock his jet ski. “I don’t know what their enforcement is going to be. It’s really bad.”

»articles.nydailynews.com/2012-06···aica-bay

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Name Game
Premium
join:2002-07-07
Grand Rapids, MI
kudos:7

Gateway National Recreation Area has announced that the ban on the use of personal watercraft in National park waters in the New York metropolitan area will remain in effect for the 2008 boating season.

The area includes most of Jamaica Bay (Brooklyn and Queens), the ocean and bayside waters of Sandy Hook, N.J., and the area along the eastern shore of Staten Island.

The Staten Island area includes Fort Wadsworth, Miller Field, Hoffman and Swinburne Islands and Great Kills Park and its boat ramp and the surrounding waters of Great Kills Park and its entrance channel.

The ban has been in effect for the past six years and will continue due to ecological distress, noise and non-compliance of boating rules by the operators of the PWC.

Remember also that you can not launch or land a PWC from any beach in New York City.PWC use is allowed from all other areas and in Raritan Bay.

In New York State all operators of a PWC must be at least 14 years old and have taken an approved eight-hour safe boating class and have passed a proctored exam.

The certificate of passing must be carried by the operator at all times. Personal Watercraft can only be operated from sunrise to sunset and when conditions are not classified as restricted visibility (rain, fog).

PWC operators must comply with all navigation rules that apply to all other vessels. The U. S. Park Police will continue to enforce the ban through patrols by their marine unit. Failure to comply will result in a summons being issued.

REQUIRED PWC EQUIPMENT

A life preserver must be worn by each person on or being towed by the PWC. It must be impact rated for 50 MPH and approved by the Coast Guard.

A horn or whistle capable of a two-second blast must also be carried.

A visual distress flag (orange color -- 1 foot square) must also be onboard.

Engine cutoff switch must be attached to the operator.

Lines for securing the PWC and a fire extinguisher are also required.

PWC operation is also not allowed in designated swimming areas. Reckless operation of a PWC is also not permitted. Examples are wake jumping too close to other vessels, weaving in and out of congested or anchorage areas, last minute swerving to avoid collisions and any maneuvering which endangers the life or property of others. PWC's can be great fun if used responsibly.
_________________

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Rook008
Miles To Go
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Far Rockaway, NY
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reply to ropeguru

said by ropeguru:

...
In my opinion, he did something stupid and SHOULD be charged for it...
Also, there SHOULD be an investigation as to why the multi-million dollar system that WE the tax payers paid for did not work.

I agree.
Castillo made a bunch of mistakes to get to where he was and even though he may have done the right thing to him, jumping an 8 foot fence to get to help quickly, he should still pay for jumping the fence. I think paying a fine would be fair and end the matter.

The bigger story here is why this expensive security system didn't work.
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