dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
3444
share rss forum feed


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to donoreo

Re: [Rant] House prices in Toronto

We already have a space crunch. Art of the problem is she is being overly picky because she does not want to move again until the girls leave home. More pressure to get it right.


Mike2009

join:2009-01-13
Ottawa, ON
kudos:3
If I were you I would just stay out of the entire process since she's wasting your time. Wait until she finally sees something she likes and then go see it.


FatLadySings

@videotron.ca
reply to TOPDAWG
said by TOPDAWG:

maybe it's time you lay down the law on your wife.

From the sounds of it, she is the law. End of story.

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON

1 recommendation

reply to Mike2009
said by Mike2009:

If I were you I would just stay out of the entire process since she's wasting your time. Wait until she finally sees something she likes and then go see it.

Then he can nit pick over it and make her sweat for awhile and see how she likes it.


FaxCap

join:2002-05-25
Surrey, BC
Reviews:
·Shaw
reply to donoreo
I remember when my future wife and I were looking for a house to
buy. I couldn't believe the absolutely stupid reasons she rejected houses.

It got to the point where I said "F*ck it" and told her I had had enough.

A year later she asked if we could look again....within 2 weeks we
found the place we lived in for 15 years. Cost $125K sold for $600K.

FaxCap

46666818

join:2012-08-06
reply to donoreo
said by donoreo:

We already have a space crunch. Art of the problem is she is being overly picky because she does not want to move again until the girls leave home. More pressure to get it right.

I'd be interested in seeing the list of things that much match for you to bid on a home.


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
said by 46666818:

said by donoreo:

We already have a space crunch. Art of the problem is she is being overly picky because she does not want to move again until the girls leave home. More pressure to get it right.

I'd be interested in seeing the list of things that much match for you to bid on a home.

I'd like to see that sentence make sense Sorry, could not resist!

She asked me yesterday what to cut out of our list of wants. I said that list is not the problem, it is the internal spreadsheet she keeps (she does a spreadsheet for everything - guests at the cottage and it is a spreadsheet to cover rooms, meals, etc) that is the problem. I told her it is "all the little things" that all of a sudden become important.

She does assure me that she agrees we need a new house. It was her that started the process!
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.

mr weather
Premium
join:2002-02-27
Mississauga, ON
reply to peterboro
said by peterboro:

Heard that as well from a trade on one of the shows. I wonder how many thousands of contractors across North America have been raked across the coals because they didn't do a gut and bring in every trade under the sun with the best materials and all on a low budget that the homeowner demanded for a reno.

It doesn't surprise me that Mike is that way. He's pretty intense on his shows and I'm sure he's asked to tone it down for tv. Still, when you see some the shit he has to fix I'd be in a pissy mood too. Especially when a lot of the issues are real bush-league or common sense mistakes. Or just the original contractors not caring about the job.

I agree he does go overboard on the renos. Unless you had a pile of money and time most average people could never afford to what he does.
--
"It's all coming down!!" - Mike Holmes

PX Eliezer7
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
reply to donoreo
You've commented several times on how fussy your wife is about everything.

You must be pretty impressive if she was willing to commit to marrying you!


Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8
said by PX Eliezer7:

You've commented several times on how fussy your wife is about everything.

You must be pretty impressive if she was willing to commit to marrying you!

I'd love to see the spreadsheet analysis she did on that!

BTW, I know what the house-hunting frustration is like. It took me a year to buy my last Toronto house. I had a very specific area in mind and pretty much every offer ended up in a bidding war. I finally got the house I wanted when my agent was able to snag it for me before it went on the market, and worked an exclusive with the owner.

PX Eliezer7
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
said by Wolfie00:

I'd love to see the spreadsheet analysis she did on that!

In such a case, a spreadsheet analysis precedes spreading the sheet.


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to Wolfie00
said by Wolfie00:

said by PX Eliezer7:

You've commented several times on how fussy your wife is about everything.

You must be pretty impressive if she was willing to commit to marrying you!

I'd love to see the spreadsheet analysis she did on that!

BTW, I know what the house-hunting frustration is like. It took me a year to buy my last Toronto house. I had a very specific area in mind and pretty much every offer ended up in a bidding war. I finally got the house I wanted when my agent was able to snag it for me before it went on the market, and worked an exclusive with the owner.

That info is classified

Only a year, that would be nice.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.


Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8
I suppose I shouldn't tell you that I bought the current house after less than a week of searching!

To some degree that's the difference between Toronto proper and the burbs of GTA. But OTOH even around here houses are rarely on the market for more than a few weeks, and prices are rising nicely. There was actually a competing bid on it but obviously not serious enough, and down the street there was an outright bidding war that ended up above asking. Nothing like Toronto drama, though.
--
"We must change our lives so that it will be possible to live by the assumption that what is good for the world will be good for us. And that requires that we make the effort to know the world and learn what is good for it."
Wendell Berry


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
Reviews:
·VMedia
said by Wolfie00:

I suppose I shouldn't tell you that I bought the current house after less than a week of searching!

To some degree that's the difference between Toronto proper and the burbs of GTA. But OTOH even around here houses are rarely on the market for more than a few weeks, and prices are rising nicely. There was actually a competing bid on it but obviously not serious enough, and down the street there was an outright bidding war that ended up above asking. Nothing like Toronto drama, though.

I can top that, I looked at 3 houses in one night, and put an offer in on the third. It was mine the next day.

Mind you that was almost 13yrs ago and I don't have a "location location location" problem.
--
No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake.......


AR
Premium,ExMod 2001-04
join:2000-09-21
Toronto, ON
reply to donoreo
My friends (lawyer and psychiatrist) are looking in the Beaches and Forest Hill.

I predict a 1.5M purchase price.


Mike2009

join:2009-01-13
Ottawa, ON
kudos:3
I bought my current home within 2 weeks but my wife and I decided after a few days of looking to find the house with 80% of what we were looking for. Things can be changed over time. Luckily my wife isn't that picky.


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to AR
said by AR:

My friends (lawyer and psychiatrist) are looking in the Beaches and Forest Hill.

I predict a 1.5M purchase price.

Beach yes, Forest Hill....maybe. It would be higher there.


AR
Premium,ExMod 2001-04
join:2000-09-21
Toronto, ON
Well then his Mrs. will have to see more patients every day to pay the mortgage. Not to mention, it won't be CMHC insured because I know they don't have 500k to put down as a downpayment.

But she's a Doctor and all her Doctor friends have $1M plus homes so despite being otherwise financially responsible, she has a "dream house" in mind and she's gonna get it.

My buddy in the mean time, with his 140k salary and pending law school debt in the US (and his very frugal nature), is not too happy about this.


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
said by AR:

Well then his Mrs. will have to see more patients every day to pay the mortgage. Not to mention, it won't be CMHC insured because I know they don't have 500k to put down as a downpayment.

But she's a Doctor and all her Doctor friends have $1M plus homes so despite being otherwise financially responsible, she has a "dream house" in mind and she's gonna get it.

My buddy in the mean time, with his 140k salary and pending law school debt in the US (and his very frugal nature), is not too happy about this.

$1M plus home is nothing in Toronto. I will be honest and we are TRYING to keep it under $1M but having a hard time finding one, as you know.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.

MaynardKrebs
Heave Steve, for the good of the country
Premium
join:2009-06-17
kudos:4
reply to mr weather
said by mr weather:

I agree he does go overboard on the renos. Unless you had a pile of money and time most average people could never afford to what he does.

Most of the stuff shown on his shows is bare minimum as far as I'm concerned.

There's 3 ways to do structure:
- a wrong way
- code way
- the right way.
Code is the bare minimum, but 'code' is the result of the lobbying efforts of the construction industry to tone down the requirements of what the government would otherwise impose.

Give you a few examples
.... when I was building a cottage (I was GC), code specifies 16" OC floor joist. Weyerhauser TJI to span the 25' depth of the great room was specified as 11-7/8" tall 300C joists. But I wanted essentially zero deflection in the floor joists - to deliver what is called NCR "no china rattle" - when walking across the floor. So I upped the joists to 400C joists at 12" OC. I also 'blocked' the floor at 2' centres to further stiffen it, vs. 4' centres. Cost me about 6% more on the floor structure to do all this.

Since the cottage is built to somewhere between R2000 and PassiveHaus standard, it's virtually airtight and special considerations are required to not create negative air pressure in the place. There are some wood-burning fireplaces, each with their own dedicated air intakes for combustion air. For the kitchen range hood (1600CFM), I installed a dedicated makeup air intake on the roof that passes the outdoor air past a temperature/humidity sensor. If the outdoor air is cooler than desired, a boiler kicks in and preheats the incoming makeup air so as not to to cool the house down. There have two boilers which heat the place - each can keep the place at normal temperatures. So why two? Because one can fail or be taken off-line for servicing. Controllers cycle between each boiler to 'level' the wear and tear on each and to make sure that each one is working - an important detail for a place that is off-the beaten path. In the whole scheme of things these 'extras' cost very little to add.

DO you think that ANY of the HVAC trades I had quote on installation thought of any of that? No!! That's because they are looking at just one part of the problem - their own - and they don't look at houses as a system. They do at office building construction, but not at residential - because office buildings have professional construction management and many teams of professional engineers working in-concert.

In residential there's the structural engineer......... and then there's the plumber, electrician, and HVAC guys each doing their own thing because the builder doesn't call the engineer back to vet what those trades are doing......especially plumbers cutting through structural beams to run their pipes. At the cottage I needed a waste pipe to run through a stacked laminated beam because I didn't want to drop the ceiling below by 6". So I got the structural engineer to design a pair of sleeved gusset plates and bolting pattern that would permit the hole for the waste pipe to pass through the laminated beams without creating any structural issues. Total extra cost - $800, but I saved 6" of ceiling height in the room below - which was more than worth it.

There's a full interior fire sprinkler system - not required by code. Why? Because the area is serviced by a volunteer fire department and the earliest possible response time is 15+ minutes in good weather in the event of an emergency. There's also have a portable defibrillator for the same reasons. And a cleared area large enough for a medivac chopper to land in an emergency (no, it's no a licensed chopper pad, but there is a wind sock and lights for night landings). Nothing in code requires any of this, but the cost of adding it was peanuts.

Here's another one......A $3M house was built 3 doors down from me a few years ago. Guess what the plumber did? Ran uninsulated water lines to the 2nd floor laundry area between the exterior sheathing and the batt insulation. There was no insulation protecting these pipes. The insulation contractor didn't care when he installed the batts over the pipes. The builder didn't give a shit about that, nor did he care that the vapour barrier where the pipes entered the laundry was missing. So guess what happened? Burst pipes and mould. Worse than rookie mistakes on the part of the plumber, insulation installer, the builder, and the building inspector.

Cosmetics are another matter - this is where budgets are broken, but not always. Porcelain tile is generally more expensive than glazed tile, but maybe not when you factor in lower installation costs because porcelain tiles are often much bigger and hence lay down faster. And porcelain is the same colour throughout so cut edges don't have to be dressed with Schluyter trim strips to hide raw clay edges. So maybe in some circumstances porcelain tiles are cheaper on an installed basis than glazed.

Some people choose hideous colour schemes, which devalue their homes. Yet the cost of the ugly paint and the cost of pleasing colours is the same - ditto for the application of each. So what exactly is 'going overboard'?

But don't forget about Holmes - lots of the outside material/labour is donated to the show are cost or no-cost in return for the advertising/marketing value it brings the contractor/supplier. So yes, the homeowner is generally getting a better than average install/deal because none of the trades/suppliers are going to want to see their product or workmanship shown on tv in a less than flattering light.

MaynardKrebs
Heave Steve, for the good of the country
Premium
join:2009-06-17
kudos:4
reply to AR
said by AR:

My friends (lawyer and psychiatrist) are looking in the Beaches and Forest Hill.

I predict a 1.5M purchase price.

I predict higher than that.


AR
Premium,ExMod 2001-04
join:2000-09-21
Toronto, ON
reply to donoreo
Dude...1M is a SHIATLOAD of money.

Even if you put down 50%, the mortgage will be 500,000.

Have you looked at the amortization table for a 500k mortgage? Here's a calculator....the interest payable on that is a giganormous amount!!!

»www.bankrate.com/calculators/mor···tor.aspx

What's wrong with a 700k home in Richmond Hill? Up on Bayview somewhere?


AR
Premium,ExMod 2001-04
join:2000-09-21
Toronto, ON
reply to MaynardKrebs
They bought a 43,000 Honda Accord but I'll give them more credit for their intelligence than to buy a home over 1.5M even if she's a Doctor.


Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8
So putting $1.5M into a house that they might sell in ten years for $6M shows a lack of intelligence? Or even if they sell for less than that, living in a nice home for many years and then having all the costs returned to them plus a likely hefty profit when they sell is somehow a problem? It's only a problem if they can't afford it and/or the interest is going to kill them.
--
"We must change our lives so that it will be possible to live by the assumption that what is good for the world will be good for us. And that requires that we make the effort to know the world and learn what is good for it."
Wendell Berry


AR
Premium,ExMod 2001-04
join:2000-09-21
Toronto, ON
Assumptions:

a. 1.5M home will appreciate to 6M.
b. Level of income will be maintained/increase.
c. Maternity leave of 2 years that the higher earning parent will have to take when she's off for 2 years of her pregnancy leave. Guy ran out of cash on his 140k salary when she transitioned from resident to Doctor and wasn't working for 3 months. How's he going to support a mortgage on his 1.5M when for 10 years he still hasn't paid off his law school debt.
d. Illness, job losses, life changes etc

I call this over-optimistic, simplistic financial planning. It's always better to live below one's means.


Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8
I completely agree, AR. Hence my last sentence. A house can be about as close as you can ever come to a no-lose proposition provided that you have all your ducks in a row. A greedy idiot can lose his shirt on real estate just as easily as he can on anything else.


AR
Premium,ExMod 2001-04
join:2000-09-21
Toronto, ON
yeah...but keep in mind that this is a 500k/year income household. When I can foresee a tight financial future for them with a 1.5M purchase, how the hell is a 200k household buying a 800k home in Stouffville?

MaynardKrebs
Heave Steve, for the good of the country
Premium
join:2009-06-17
kudos:4
A friend told me that nice homes in Sydney, NS go for $250-300K.
They need lawyers & shrinks there.......and if they bought there they'd have enough money left over for a pair of his/hers snowblowers


TOPDAWG
Premium
join:2005-04-27
Midland, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to donoreo
The big issue about not picking a home and waiting is the prices will just keep going up. While your wife may not find her dream home and good luck doing that you could find a great home fix it up to your needs and be happy. Now that house that would be great and just needed a few fix-ups may cost even more and not be upgraded at all.

Home prices in TO are going up so fast it forking nuts. Hell even in barrie the prices are getting out of control.

booj

join:2011-02-07
Richmond, ON
said by TOPDAWG:

The big issue about not picking a home and waiting is the prices will just keep going up. While your wife may not find her dream home and good luck doing that you could find a great home fix it up to your needs and be happy. Now that house that would be great and just needed a few fix-ups may cost even more and not be upgraded at all.

Home prices in TO are going up so fast it forking nuts. Hell even in barrie the prices are getting out of control.

Why would prices keep going up? They did in the US for a decade, to levels we see now in Canada, but in the last five years they've been tanking.

It's a fantasy to think that the price trends we've seen in Canada will continue. They won't.