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boogi man

join:2001-11-13
Jacksonville, FL
kudos:1
reply to Grumpy

Re: Stihl power equipment and ethanol "enhanced" gas

there is a special blend of stabil that can be used to store drunk gas. it's blue. there is also startron enzyme that does the same thing.
--
my site



Robotics
See You On The Dark Side
Premium
join:2003-10-23
Louisa, VA
reply to Jack_in_VA

This whole ethanol thing just pisses me off.

What in the hell was the govt. thinking when they enacted this law anyway?
I think the govt. should be held liable for the damage it does to cars, mowers, tolls, etc. (course that will never happen)

I know of a pilot that used to buy gas at a local station out here for his small piper plane. Said it was cheaper than at the small airport out here.
Ended up the station had ethanol in their gas (and it wasn't posted), and in a short time of half a summer ruined his plane, gaskets, and other items that I cant remember what he called them.

This has even made me wonder about the gas in the tanks underground. Most tanks that I am aware of cant pump out any gas when the tank gets to about 6 inches of product left in it. (that can be up to several hundred gallons)
Then comes along the delivery person and unloads gas into the almost empty tank. Which in turn mixes up all this bad water infested gas through out the tank...and into your car eventually.

They need to get rid of ethanol in our gas. Its a freaking joke!
--
Long you live and high you fly, and smiles you'll give and tears you'll cry,
and all you touch and all you see, is all your life will ever be.



boogi man

join:2001-11-13
Jacksonville, FL
kudos:1

well if the gas station is properly equipped and maintained a fuel drop even on an empty in ground tank shouldn't effect customers. due to the fact that if properly equipped the station will have a filter/water separator at each dispenser and said filters will be changed on a regular basis thus preventing water/sediment from being passed into the customers tank.
--
my site



Robotics
See You On The Dark Side
Premium
join:2003-10-23
Louisa, VA

Sounds good enough for me I suppose. The station I am talking about has been in this county for at least 40 years, and still have the old analog pumps. Hope they do have their stuff up to date and maintained.
--
Long you live and high you fly, and smiles you'll give and tears you'll cry,
and all you touch and all you see, is all your life will ever be.



Jack_in_VA
Premium
join:2007-11-26
North, VA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom
reply to Robotics

said by Robotics:

This whole ethanol thing just pisses me off.

What in the hell was the govt. thinking when they enacted this law anyway?
I think the govt. should be held liable for the damage it does to cars, mowers, tolls, etc. (course that will never happen)

They need to get rid of ethanol in our gas. Its a freaking joke!

They were buying the votes of the corn farmers who already get all kinds of aid from the government and the "Green Wacko's" who think it's their mission in life to impose their beliefs on everyone else.

Result is we have ethanol in gasoline.


boogi man

join:2001-11-13
Jacksonville, FL
kudos:1
reply to Robotics

on the older pumps i've seen the filter/separator on the side of the pump but not always. if i see the filter is old rusty etc i generally go somewhere else if i can. you can always ask to see what they do and or dont do. i'd be curious to know.
--
my site



Robotics
See You On The Dark Side
Premium
join:2003-10-23
Louisa, VA

I frequent the station often (cheapest price around usually) and they do not have the filters on the sides. Ive seen them before so I know what you are talking about.
I just may question them next time I am there.

Thanks
--
Long you live and high you fly, and smiles you'll give and tears you'll cry,
and all you touch and all you see, is all your life will ever be.


iknow
Premium
join:2012-03-25
reply to Robotics

said by Robotics:

This whole ethanol thing just pisses me off.

What in the hell was the govt. thinking when they enacted this law anyway?
I think the govt. should be held liable for the damage it does to cars, mowers, tolls, etc. (course that will never happen)

I know of a pilot that used to buy gas at a local station out here for his small piper plane. Said it was cheaper than at the small airport out here.
Ended up the station had ethanol in their gas (and it wasn't posted), and in a short time of half a summer ruined his plane, gaskets, and other items that I cant remember what he called them.

This has even made me wonder about the gas in the tanks underground. Most tanks that I am aware of cant pump out any gas when the tank gets to about 6 inches of product left in it. (that can be up to several hundred gallons)
Then comes along the delivery person and unloads gas into the almost empty tank. Which in turn mixes up all this bad water infested gas through out the tank...and into your car eventually.

They need to get rid of ethanol in our gas. Its a freaking joke!

YIPES!! that pilot could have killed himself and whoever was in the way of his plane when he lost power!. unbelievable!. aviation fuel is special. »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aviation_fuel anyway, ethanol production has increased the cost of feed grain, which has increased food prices quite a bit!.


Robotics
See You On The Dark Side
Premium
join:2003-10-23
Louisa, VA

I thought aviation fuel is different. But he definitely used regular gas for his (I think its called) piper plane.


Pher9999

join:2011-07-06
Carmel, NY

1 recommendation

reply to Jack_in_VA

Having worked at a Gas Station back in 96-98, You don't want to ever pump gas if you see a truck there unloading. It does stir up everything in the tank and makes far dirtier gas. Don't trust filters on pumps to be replaced regularly.


MaynardKrebs
Heave Steve, for the good of the country
Premium
join:2009-06-17
kudos:4
reply to Jack_in_VA


Ethanol also does bad things to boats with fiberglass fuel tanks. The ethanol softens the fiberglass resin and eventually the 'gunk' finds its way into the engines causing damage.

»www.boatus.com/seaworthy/fueltest.asp
also
»www.boatus.com/seaworthy/e10Tips.pdf



cableties
Premium
join:2005-01-27
reply to Jack_in_VA

I saw this coming.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corn_ethanol

They added ethanol (which would increase feed, grain and food costs over time, let alone the energy, resources that necessary to farm and process the ethanol) from Farming (co-ops and corporate-owned farms...sic ADM, Monsanto,...) to trick the consumer into thinking it is cleaner and better.

"let's add this to fuel, boost farm subsidies, burns faster thus selling more fuel and forces new car sales, fools the 'merican people that think its greener/cleaner and heck, makes (everyone but taxpayer) a whole lotta money!"

But the cost is the factor: you will burn ethanol-additive fuels faster than non-additive. And you pay more over time (mileage drops a few, yet you are paying more at pump). But I would rather have ethanol in fuel than MTBE.

Now missing from the wiki, the harm in older engines and smaller engines. Works fine in E85 motors and newer cars (better rings, seals, ...). Lawn care and motor-boating are victims.

Throw in mother nature's humor (drought) and you have unstable food price increases, transportation issues (see Mississippi River), and global food shortages. Ofcourse, in the name of "selling rope to hang others", food corps will gladly export corn to other countries for profit, rather than logistically selling it local for buffeting shock to inflation and recessive markets.

Greed is an amazing b-tch.
--
Splat



workablob

join:2004-06-09
Houston, TX
kudos:3
reply to Jack_in_VA

Yeah, Ethanol killed my blower and trimmer.

I am now all battery powered and love it.

No as powerful but they do the job and it is more fun.

Dave
--
I may have been born yesterday. But it wasn't at night.



Ken
Premium,MVM
join:2003-06-16
Markle, IN

1 recommendation

reply to Critsmcgee

said by Critsmcgee:

There is no ethanol free gas in the entire state here. Ethanol is mandated to be in the gas by state law.

It's interesting to see how abundant non ethanol gas is in some areas, and other areas are completely devoid of it.



Rxdoxx
Premium,Ex-Mod 2002-13
join:2000-11-03
Middle River, MD
kudos:11

Looks like 17 in Maryland, all seem to be on the Eastern Shore
»pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=MD

216 in Virginia
»pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=VA
--
Was a Cruise Fanatic, one cruise on Princess cured me. Bleah



pike
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-01
Washington, DC
kudos:3

And none in the DC metro area...



scott2020

join:2008-07-20
MO
reply to Rxdoxx

I had no idea how difficult it is in some areas to get ethanol free gas. I have 5 or 6 stations that offer it within 6 miles of me. I live in a lake resort town, so I guess the demand for it is here due to all the boaters. Most is 93 octane. I haven't used anything but in any of my lawn equipment. Guess I'm lucky!



fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

said by scott2020:

I had no idea how difficult it is in some areas to get ethanol free gas. I have 5 or 6 stations that offer it within 6 miles of me. I live in a lake resort town, so I guess the demand for it is here due to all the boaters. Most is 93 octane. I haven't used anything but in any of my lawn equipment. Guess I'm lucky!

I don't think we can get ANY ethanol free gas here unless you buy Avgas which is leaded.


BillRoland
Premium
join:2001-01-21
Ocala, FL
kudos:3
reply to Jack_in_VA

I looked today and Sunoco is selling Ethanol Free 90 Octane at a few stations around here.



Jack_in_VA
Premium
join:2007-11-26
North, VA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom

said by BillRoland:

I looked today and Sunoco is selling Ethanol Free 90 Octane at a few stations around here.

What was the price relative to 10% ethanol?


agtle

@teksavvy.com
reply to Robotics

said by Robotics:

...

I know of a pilot that used to buy gas at a local station out here for his small piper plane. Said it was cheaper than at the small airport out here.
Ended up the station had ethanol in their gas (and it wasn't posted), and in a short time of half a summer ruined his plane, gaskets, and other items that I cant remember what he called them.

...

The lack of TEL (lead) in the automotive gas would have been an issue too. Av gas is still leaded, and the engines are designed for that. Av gas is OK for lawn equipment, but I wouldn't put it in a modern auto engine designed for unleaded fuel.


Daarken
Rara Avises
Premium
join:2005-01-12
Southwest LA
kudos:3
reply to Jack_in_VA

I have ethonal 13 stations within 15 miles of my home, and 3 are within 2 miles.
About a year after I purchased my riding mower, it wouldn't start.
I tore off the carborator cover, and notice white gunk in it.
I used a little bit of Sea Foam to clean it up, filled up the tank with fresh gas with a few onces of Sea Foam and it started right up.
Now I just use the ethonal free gas with some Sta-Bil in it.
--
Getting it Done.


Mr Matt

join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom
·Embarq Now Centu..
·Comcast
·CenturyLink
reply to MrIcehouse

In response to MrIcehouse's comment about making Ethanol from sugarcane. I have viewed several documentaries about how Brazil became energy independent by supplementing petroleum with cane based ethanol. One of the things that our government does not mention, was described in the documentary is that cane based Ethanol has a higher energy content than corn based Ethanol. There is also Switch Grass which can be used to produce a higher energy Ethanol unfortunately US Agriculture has not converted to Switch Grass or Sugar Cane Ethanol production.

In response to Robotics comment, Aviation gasoline is anhydrous which means it contains no water. Water can freeze up in the fuel system cutting off fuel flow, stopping the engine and causing a crash. Gas pumps designed to pump aviation fuel have a final filter that contains a desiccant like silica gel to remove any residual water in the fuel.

Using leaded fuel in current automobiles will destroy the oxygen sensor and catalytic converter. Both are costly to replace.

Although the government claims that Gasoline with 10% Ethanol is safe to use in modern automobiles, when 10% Ethanol is used in late model automobiles that were not designed with fuel systems to accommodate Ethanol, the fuel system can still be slowly be damaged by corrosion of Aluminum parts and degradation of plastic parts.



Robotics
See You On The Dark Side
Premium
join:2003-10-23
Louisa, VA

Interesting read!

Thanks for posting this.


Tig

join:2006-06-29
Carrying Place, ON
Reviews:
·voip.ms
·TekSavvy DSL

2 edits
reply to Jack_in_VA

I've been using E10 for 20 years in my four stroke engines. Cars (83, 86, 90, 96 and newer.), mowers and snow blower from the 70s. No problems.
In my 2 stokes I switched around y2k. Outboards from 66 and 88, weed whacker and snowmobiles from 90, Stihl chainsaw 08. Only one problem. The weed whacker primer bulb dried out and cracked after 10 years.
As a rule I don't use additives other than occasional sea foam or injector cleaner. I do like to drop the sled carb bowls every couple years, but that was always required maintenance even before eth.
Eth has been available at the pump for a couple decades now, so if a five year old product cannot handle eth, then it seems like a defect to me.



mityfowl
Premium
join:2000-11-06
Dallas, TX
reply to Jack_in_VA

The bottom line like I've said for years is ethanol gas is bad for the economy, bad for gas millage and bad for engines.

Good for harpies.

The EPA should think about their charter.



Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
kudos:18
reply to Ken

said by Ken:

said by Critsmcgee:

There is no ethanol free gas in the entire state here. Ethanol is mandated to be in the gas by state law.

It's interesting to see how abundant non ethanol gas is in some areas, and other areas are completely devoid of it.
[att=1]

It may look like a lot on the map from the flag size alone, but if you changed the data to show little pinpoints in Red for 10% ethanol gas and little pinpoints in Blue for pure gas, it would be very negligible and hard to see the Blue for all the Red around them.
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time?

PrntRhd
Premium
join:2004-11-03
Fairfield, CA
Reviews:
·Comcast

1 edit
reply to Mr Matt

Ethanol from corn has exactly the same energy per gallon as ethanol from cane. Ethanol from switchgrass is the same energy per gallon as both of the others.
The energy used to grow corn and process corn into ethanol is greater than that to grow cane, so the net energy advantage goes to cane.

The fact is the auto and power equipment manufacturers have to make the equipment run on what fuel is available/mandated.



mityfowl
Premium
join:2000-11-06
Dallas, TX

said by PrntRhd:

Ethanol from corn has exactly the same energy per gallon as ethanol from cane. Ethanol from switchgrass is the same energy per gallon as both of the others.
The energy used to grow corn and process corn into ethanol is greater than that to grow cane, so the net energy advantage goes to cane.

The fact is the auto and power equipment manufacturers have to make the equipment run on what fuel is available/mandated.

I disagree a little with you.

I think we neeed to force the the EPA into publicly retract their love for ethanol,


mityfowl
Premium
join:2000-11-06
Dallas, TX
reply to Jack_in_VA

How many gallons of of imported oil is 10-12% lower gas milage per year in the us?

I can't figure it out. big billions