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SwedishRider
Rider on the Storm
Premium
join:2006-01-11
not Sweden
kudos:1
reply to pandora

Re: [House&Home] Oil's end

said by pandora:

Does anyone want to see a picture of the hot water heat pump??

Sure, why not?

pandora
Premium
join:2001-06-01
Outland
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Reviews:
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reply to pandora

The oil tanks were removed today. The oil lines were partially drained (via gravity) tomorrow the builder tells me they will blow the lines clean, cut, seal then pull them out.

The attached garage and office are to be demolished in the early afternoon. Then foundation and excavation work begins.
--
"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use."



wood pellet

@verizon.net
reply to pandora

Spend 2500 and put a wood pellet stove in. You will be amazed how it heats your house and saves you a ton of money. You may no longer have a big oil bill but your electric bill will be just as expensive, Lipa likes to add the fuel surcharge which cost more than the electric you use. My wood pellet stove heats over 2500 sq ft of home my oil is only used to heat hot water. I fill my tank once a year 275 gallons. i spend on the high side 1000 dollars on oil and 1200 dollars on wood pellets for a grand total of 2200 dollars annual thats a savings and my home is above 70 if id like 24/7 best investment of my life.



cowboyro
Premium
join:2000-10-11
Shelton, CT

1 edit

said by wood pellet :

i spend on the high side 1000 dollars on oil and 1200 dollars on wood pellets for a grand total of 2200 dollars annual thats a savings and my home is above 70 if id like 24/7 best investment of my life.

It all depends on the house.
I have heat pumps + oil backup, for the last winter (oct-apr) I paid a whole ~700 on oil + ~900 extra electricity (vs spring/fall) and the oil includes hot water. Kept the house at ~75F, 2350sqft.
Heat pumps are *cheap* to operate and don't require loading a bag of pellets every morning and evening.
Not to mention that pellets are $200+/ton and give 7800BTU/lb (so under 75000BTU/$). A heat pump spits some 50,000BTU/$ at current electricity prices, significantly more when it's warmer outside. Saving $200 or less for the whole winter is just not worth it considering the extra effort required.


SwedishRider
Rider on the Storm
Premium
join:2006-01-11
not Sweden
kudos:1

said by cowboyro:

It all depends on the house.
I have heat pumps...

And it depends on upfront cost too. Your heat pumps give you the highest BTU/$ ratio of anyone on this forum (that I'm aware of anyway), but your upfront cost was MUCH higher than what a pellet stove would be. That also factors into the cost savings vs. expected return on investment vs time frame equation.


cowboyro
Premium
join:2000-10-11
Shelton, CT

said by SwedishRider:

said by cowboyro:

It all depends on the house.
I have heat pumps...

And it depends on upfront cost too. Your heat pumps give you the highest BTU/$ ratio of anyone on this forum (that I'm aware of anyway), but your upfront cost was MUCH higher than what a pellet stove would be. That also factors into the cost savings vs. expected return on investment vs time frame equation.

Wrong on both counts.
I have XR14 units, rated at 9.0HSPF. Roughly 2.6COP on average. With my net rate of $0.16/kWh (between peak and off-peak during winter) it comes to 3413*2.6/0.16 = ~55000BTU/$.
The OP is getting 18SEER units which will have a slightly higher heating performance as well...
Now for the upfront cost... it was a 1000 investment for heat pump option (2 units!!!) vs plain cooling. You're not going to heat a 2-story house with a pellet stove, no way... When it's cold ~30F and the lower floor unit is spitting some 37000BTU/h, that's 5lbs of pellets every hour... Both floors would be easily 10lbs/h when it dips in the 15F range. Feel like waking up 3 times in the middle of the night to fill the stove? I surely don't...
Pellet stoves are nice. NICE, not really practical for heating a whole house, unless the house is a matchbox...


SwedishRider
Rider on the Storm
Premium
join:2006-01-11
not Sweden
kudos:1

said by cowboyro:

System itself was some 18k starting from the scratch.
It wasn't made with the primary intention of saving, it was made to 1)have central air and 2)get rid of the ugly baseboards.

Above was cut from another thread in this forum. Dropping 18 grand is a lot of scratch... much more than the $2500 the other poster is talking about for a pellet stove.

I know quite a few people who have migrated to pellet stoves, and one that uses it for primary heat in their new build. They have propane as backup for really cold evenings, but their 2-story home gets pretty toasty when that pellet stove is fired up. Last year they filled their 500 gallon propane tank only once... all the other heat was provided by pellets (granted, it was an unusually mild winter!).

I agree with you that they are too much work, but let's not confuse a pellet stove @ $2500 with your heat pump system that cost more than some new cars.


cowboyro
Premium
join:2000-10-11
Shelton, CT

said by SwedishRider:

said by cowboyro:

System itself was some 18k starting from the scratch.
It wasn't made with the primary intention of saving, it was made to 1)have central air and 2)get rid of the ugly baseboards.

Above was cut from another thread in this forum. Dropping 18 grand is a lot of scratch... much more than the $2500 the other poster is talking about for a pellet stove.

Again, the central system was going to be installed anyway (there was just a baseboard system and window AC units). Having the option of going full HP was a very small extra expense.
Same for those who already have central air but no heat pump - when time comes to replace a unit, it's just a small ($500) extra expense to have heat pumps instead of just cooling. Hell it may be worth doing it just to move away from oil at current prices...


disconnected

@snet.net
reply to cowboyro

Wait til he gets his next revaluation and property tax bill for that 'upgrade'. Bethcha' he's not gonna like the extra costs there.

With the 2 week power outages that CT is becoming legendary for since 2002, staying in a motel for 2 weeks every time there's a minor storm that CL&P can't handle, is gonna get mighty expensive. Have to add up all those costs. Why not just get a larger tank and buy oil in bulk for bigger savings?



cowboyro
Premium
join:2000-10-11
Shelton, CT

said by disconnected :

Why not just get a larger tank and buy oil in bulk for bigger savings?

Based on my previous calculation of 55,000BTU/$ with heat pump, the break-even price for oil is $2.13/gal. Good luck with that!
Yes getting the heat on generator would be very expensive... and he won't be able to use central air, but it's his choice, his money. That's one of the reasons for which I stayed with oil - possibility to heat on generator.


SwedishRider
Rider on the Storm
Premium
join:2006-01-11
not Sweden
kudos:1

said by cowboyro:

said by disconnected :

Why not just get a larger tank and buy oil in bulk for bigger savings?

Based on my previous calculation of 55,000BTU/$ with heat pump, the break-even price for oil is $2.13/gal. Good luck with that!

Interestingly, my last propane fill-up @ $1.61/gal got me pretty darn close to your 55,000BTU/$ heat pumps.. but that was a unique summertime price dip that I don't expect to replicate during the winter months. At the moment, I'm still significantly ahead of oil.


disconnected

@snet.net
reply to cowboyro

My last oil fillup was at $2.59 a gallon, when most placed were quoting $2.80. The key negotiating factors were cash and 1000 gallon or more order size.
We've been losing power around here at least monthly this year. It's unprecidented. A month ago, during a downpour, a limb let loose from a tree and brushed the bare, above ground wires just up the road. Tripped the explosive breaker on the pole. Took them four hours to roll a truck and fix it. Last year, we didn't get power for 3 weeks out of the year. I reckon it's gonna get worse as we slip into banana republic status.

Those heat pumps are comparatively complicated and I reckon the maintenance costs will add up. Meanwhile, my oil furnace has chugged along with minimal mainenance for 40+ years. I've modernized it with a new burner, heat manager, flue dampers, etc., but basically simple and reliable. And without the tax burden of a heat pump central air system, which could easily add a grand a year to your property taxes in this town.