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Bregal

@clayton.edu

DSL filter at Dmarc?

Has anyone here installed a DSL filter at the Dmarc and run net and phone separately into the house? Work better on CATx than taking net all the way to the other end of the house on the old POTS pair? Worth the trouble?

medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
kudos:4
said by Bregal :

Has anyone here installed a DSL filter at the Dmarc and run net and phone separately into the house? Work better on CATx than taking net all the way to the other end of the house on the old POTS pair? Worth the trouble?

like the one I have? filter on top most of NID...

orange/white and orange for dsl

blue/white and blue for phone...



I asked for that from Bellsouth when they hooked up my house for phone and internet. Not in use anymore though...

I think you're better off asking your ISP to install one for you.


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:12
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
reply to Bregal
said by Bregal :

Has anyone here installed a DSL filter at the Dmarc and run net and phone separately into the house?

Yes:

Normal view.

Opened to show wiring.

Alas, I have no "before" pictures.

Work better on CATx than taking net all the way to the other end of the house on the old POTS pair?

I used 2-pair Cat 3. It was marginally better than the forty-three-year-old quad station wire it replaced.

Worth the trouble?

Because I cleaned up some latter year telco "Okie" install, as well as a DirecTV "Okie" install, I considered it worth the effort.

If you have a modular NID, look for the appropriate snap-in filter module; it might be cheaper than the one I used.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
kudos:4
said by NormanS:

If you have a modular NID, look for the appropriate snap-in filter module; it might be cheaper than the one I used.

hmm...I think I have one like that similar to the one marked DSL that I haven't used....ATT shipped me one for no reason at all...

anyway, here's a closer look similar to mine from another user...


Austinloop

join:2001-08-19
Austin, TX
kudos:1
reply to Bregal
To answer your questions, I have installed one and did a home run to the computer/modem location when I first got DSL some 12, or so years ago. Definitely worth the effort to cut out all the old inside wiring.

It is not a difficult job to accomlish, just pay attention to the markings on the filter as to which leads go the modem and which to the POTS service.

Not counting the running of the home run (cat 5), I think the actual installation took about 15 minutes.

medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
kudos:4
reply to Bregal
you could also read the faq's...

10.0_Homerun_Diagrams_and_Procedures - »AT&T Southeast Forum FAQ


wayjac
Premium,MVM
join:2001-12-22
Indy
kudos:1
reply to Bregal
said by Bregal :

Has anyone here installed a DSL filter at the Dmarc and run net and phone separately into the house?

Yes I have done this. I used quad station wire to connect the modem
Here's some more info on this topic

»AT&T Midwest/Ameritech FAQ »NID Splitters and Installation


Bregal

@bellsouth.net
reply to Austinloop
How critical is the distance from the NID to the modem? Cat5 necessary? My modem is at the other end of the house (in my office) from the NID, house length is 45ft.


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:12
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
said by Bregal :

How critical is the distance from the NID to the modem? Cat5 necessary? My modem is at the other end of the house (in my office) from the NID, house length is 45ft.

A 45 foot run on the premises is just 1% of the total of a 4,500 foot loop. Cat 5 would not be, "necessary", but you can probably get 60 feet for a reasonable price.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
kudos:4
said by NormanS:

A 45 foot run on the premises is just 1% of the total of a 4,500 foot loop. Cat 5 would not be, "necessary", but you can probably get 60 feet for a reasonable price.

4500 foot loop? can you explain to me where you got this?

I thought cat5e runs were at a max of 300ft? Anything beyond that may need repeaters...

»wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_m···5e_cable

cat5e is cheap and the standard now...why get anything below it?


graysonf
Premium,MVM
join:1999-07-16
Fort Lauderdale, FL
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Comcast

A 4500 foot loop might be considered a typical average for a copper loop run between a home and a CO.

The supposed 300 foot limit for CAT5 is from the ethernet specification. It does not apply to telephone service or DSL run over twisted pairs.


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:12
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
reply to medbuyer
Arbitrary figure based on your stated distance between your demarc (NID) and your wall jack where the modem will be located. Made an easy mental calculation of percentage; sans "fence post consideration".

Cat 5e is a cabling standard, regarding twist rate needed for noise rejection to comply with the Ethernet standard for up to Gig Ethernet. But your telephone company is not using Ethernet between the CO/RT and the premises; nor even between the NID and any wall jacks. The premises wiring is an insignificant portion of the overall loop length between the DSLAM and the modem.

When I first got DSL service, there was approximately 35 feet of quad station wire (red-green/yellow-black) between the demarc (old-fashioned station protector; no NID) and the jack. And a 75 foot drop from the pole to the demarc. No standard for rate of twist in either. And no telling if there was any twist in the F1/F2 spans back to the CO; 9,156 feet by MLT(?) test. You could probably get away with using bell wire between your demarc and your wall jack.

My premises wiring was an ugly patchwork of quad station wire mixing daisy chain and star topology. 70's and 80's telephone wiring standards were to use either two-pair, or three-pair Cat 3 wiring, so I bought a spool of two-pair Cat 3 wire and rewired the premises. Cat 3 rating is only good for Ethernet up to 10 mb/s; but, again, premises telephone wiring is not Ethernet. BTW, even with splitter, and home run of twisted pair (Cat 3) wiring, I did not show a significant improvement over the "no-twist" premises wiring. I might gain a bit by separating the DSL line and voice line (used blue for voice and orange for DSL), but can't go back and and DiY it (chronic axonal demyelination of leg motor nerves), and don't want to pay for what would likely be a marginal gain. It is certain that rewiring the premises will not raise my ADSL sync from the estimated 5200 kb/s max to the near 7000 kb/s max needed to assure a 6016 sync for the AT&T 6M tier. ADSL2+ did not buy much more room; AT&T will still only build a 3M profile for that 9,156 foot loop.

Certainly Cat 5e is cheap enough, now. But you don't have Ethernet until you reach the LAN port(s) of the RG (modem).
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
kudos:4
said by graysonf:

A 4500 foot loop might be considered a typical average for a copper loop run between a home and a CO.

The supposed 300 foot limit for CAT5 is from the ethernet specification. It does not apply to telephone service or DSL run over twisted pairs.

ok...so, dsl signal from the NID to his modem using cat5e for example...what's the max length for that then?

I understood that ethernet over cat5e should not exceed 300ft....meaning from modem to whatever he wants to connect inside his offic on a wired connection.


graysonf
Premium,MVM
join:1999-07-16
Fort Lauderdale, FL
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Comcast
The introduction of any reasonable amount of CAT5 cable between a NID and a modem will make no difference.

You would have to be at or near the limit of being able to obtain DSL service in the first place for this to matter. If this was the case, then using an entire 1000 foot spool of CAT5 might be enough to push your electrical distance back to the CO beyond an acceptable amount.