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NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

Pace 4111N

If I want to play with IPv6, I can't use the Pace 4111N?


IPv6 disabled?


leibold
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-09
Sunnyvale, CA
kudos:10
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

1 recommendation

I know Dane mentioned plans to roll out dual-stack IPv4/IPv6 but I don't know if that has happened yet.
Until then you can go to member tools at Sonic.net and setup an IPv6 tunnel.
--
Got some spare cpu cycles ? Join Team Helix or Team Starfire!



NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

1 recommendation

But will the Pace 4111N pass protocol 41 to the computer? That was an issue I was trying to work out with a SpeedStream 4100 and D-Link DIR 655. If it requires bridging the Pace, Sonic.net says they won't support it bridged.

Maybe I'll just swap the SpeedStream for the ZTE at the other premises (ADSL2+ wasn't faster than ADSL there) and bring the ZTE and D-Link over here.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum



DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:9

1 recommendation

reply to NormanS

In the not-too-distant future, we will roll out IPv6, in the Pace modem/router/firewall.

For customers who do not have the Pace equipment, we will provide the IPv6 6RD settings, so if you have 6RD capable equipment, you could set up IPv6 yourself in that equipment.

-Dane



WCSonic

@sonic.net

The Pace 4111N modem is fine for a user that is going to use it as a plug-in-and-forget-it device. It is much more simplistic than other home routers such as D-link, Linksys, or TP-link. There are no options for things like egress filtering, or logging. The software really looks like an early version, hopefully they will continue to improve it.

If you want to use static IP addressing on the WAN, you will need to buy additional addresses since the modem takes the one address included with the account. Sonic could at least provide a second address without charging extra.

Bridge mode does not work on firmware version 9.5.1.49.9, though they report that that will be fixed in a few weeks.

If you actually want to control your firewall, I'd recommend that you provide your own modem to avoid the problems with the Pace, and consider the rental fee just a part of the overall cost of the service when comparing to other providers. Also, be sure to complain on the forums about this rental folly. If enough users complain, I'm sure Sonic will relent since they are a company that cares about their users.



NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

I have come to hate my Pace 4111N with a purple passion. It may be adequate for non-geek customers, such as my mother. It is totally inadequate for my wants. If I could, I'd sell it for a penny. But sales, or the hammer won't do because Sonic.net will take it out of my wallet if I move away from a Fusion service area.

If I could just get up, and over to her house to swap the Pace for the ZTE I would. But I have not been able since a spinal stroke severely weakened my legs last November.

Damn my luck! First the spinal injury, then this POS Pace!
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum



DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:9

What sort of challenges are you encountering? With it's various configuration options, it's a very flexible device, even for those seeking more technical outcomes. With options like LAN subports (documented here: »wiki.sonic.net/wiki/Pace_4111N ) and DMZ Plus (route all traffic at a designated LAN host), there are lots of ways to set things up.

-Dane



NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

said by DaneJasper:

What sort of challenges are you encountering? With it's various configuration options, it's a very flexible device, even for those seeking more technical outcomes. With options like LAN subports (documented here: »wiki.sonic.net/wiki/Pace_4111N ) and DMZ Plus (route all traffic at a designated LAN host), there are lots of ways to set things up.

Bridging gives me a red service LED. LAN subports require paying even more for a /29, or even /30 block (on top of the modem "rental" fee).
quote:
If you have static IP service, you will need more than a single static IP for LAN Subports to function ...

I'll just swap the Pace with Mom's ZTE and be done with it.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum


BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

1 recommendation

reply to DaneJasper

said by DaneJasper:

In the not-too-distant future, we will roll out IPv6, in the Pace modem/router/firewall.

For customers who do not have the Pace equipment, we will provide the IPv6 6RD settings, so if you have 6RD capable equipment, you could set up IPv6 yourself in that equipment.

-Dane

So let's assume I've got a Pace device but I'm running it in bridge mode, essentially taking its capabilities (or lack thereof) out of the loop. My router is grabbing my (static) IP address and supports IPv6. Can I get the 6RD settings, as well?

I've already gone rounds with popping out of bridge mode when calling in for device-related support (and keep a subport configured as a backup for this very purpose) and I do understand that, when doing this, IPv6 routing would cease to function, and that is perfectly acceptable for me for the few brief instances where it will be necessary.

So, what's the word? IPv6 for me?

Zeonis

join:2009-03-16
reply to WCSonic

said by WCSonic :

Also, be sure to complain on the forums about this rental folly. If enough users complain, I'm sure Sonic will relent since they are a company that cares about their users.

I agree with you that it is a folly and many users have complained about it. In my opinion if they really cared about their users/customers they never would have started charging a modem rental fee. Sonic.net is the only company I can think of that does not allow you to purchase the modem they are offering or use/purchase your own to avoid having to pay a rental fee.


DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:9

said by Zeonis:

Sonic.net is the only company I can think of that does not allow you to purchase the modem they are offering or use/purchase your own to avoid having to pay a rental fee.

Most carriers today charge an equipment fee, but AT&T and Frontier are the only other ones that I am sure require it. Most others allow consumers to buy or supply their own equipment, though for some services (particularly cable with voice) this is often challenging due to limited compatible equipment lists.

AT&T charges an equipment fee for their U-verse broadband service, $6.00 monthly. This does not apply to customer who buy their older DSL service, but is mandatory with U-verse.

Frontier has gone to the far end of the spectrum, charging $7 for a basic modem, and $15 for a wireless gateway. The carrier is not allowing customers to avoid this fee - even if you own your equipment, the fee is applied. »Frontier Imposes Owned Modem Fee

Comcast charges $7.00 monthly for equipment, but customers can replace it with customer supplied equipment. It's unclear though if this is possible if you have voice service too with them.

CenturyLink charges an equipment fee, $4.95 monthly for their modem/router. It's totally unclear if this is mandatory or not; it seems that for some services it now is. (I also read recently that they're also now charging a fee to disconnect service, how about that?!)

BrightHouse just started charging their customers too, $2 monthly for the modem that they already have. Customers CAN supply their own, from a short list of approved devices. »Bright House Adds $2 Modem Rental Fee

Time Warner is charging a modem fee, $3.95 monthly. Customers can supply and avoid. »Time Warner Cable Modem Lease Fee Expands

It's certainly a trend, with more and more providers charging a fee to cover the cost of equipment. FYI.


BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

1 edit

said by DaneJasper:

said by Zeonis:

Sonic.net is the only company I can think of that does not allow you to purchase the modem they are offering or use/purchase your own to avoid having to pay a rental fee.

Comcast charges $7.00 monthly for equipment, but customers can replace it with customer supplied equipment. It's unclear though if this is possible if you have voice service too with them.

Voice service requires the use of a Comcast-supplied eMTA, but I do not recall being billed for rental of the unit. On the other hand, when I did not have voice service through Comcast, they were billing me $7/mo to use my own modem, though they were gracious enough to credit my account $21 every 3 months if I called and complained enough times.

Honestly, with Cable it does make sense to own your own equipment, but I'd prefer to rent a DSL modem. When the next revision of ADSL comes out or Sonic switches to VDSL or some other flavor, I know all I need to do is make a phone call and ask for an upgrade. Modem craps out? Make a phone call. Decide to upgrade to 2 lines? Make a phone call.

So what if, after 19 months I've paid $3.50 more in rental fees (if you ignore sales tax) for that modem than if I had bought it? Had I bought it, it would be 7 months out of warranty and quite likely already failed or about to fail (they don't make 'em like the old SpeedStream models you couldn't kill with a lightning strike, anymore). Equipment and upgrade assurance, combined with an eternal warranty is only costing me $36 more than buying the modem at the end of 2 years, after which I'd probably be in the market for a replacement anyway if I owned the equipment; and that's assuming I didn't have to replace a unit, out of my own pocket, that failed a week out of warranty.

In some instances, and I'll admit it's the majority, rental simply does not make sense. This is not one of those times. For another $1/mo, it likely would be, though.

Zeonis

join:2009-03-16
reply to DaneJasper

said by DaneJasper:

AT&T charges an equipment fee for their U-verse broadband service, $6.00 monthly. This does not apply to customer who buy their older DSL service, but is mandatory with U-verse.

You pay the equipment fee if you get the U-verse TV service. If however you want U-verse internet only or U-verse internet and U-verse voice then you can buy the modem. In fact that is the only option given to you if you order online. This is the second time I have told you this Dane and at least my third time mentioning the fact you can buy the modem if you do not get the TV service on this forum.


BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

Is there a circumstance under which the fee is charged? If so, then is it reasonable to say they charge a fee. From my conversations with AT&T, even they don't consider U-Verse without TV service to be U-Verse, internally; so, even from AT&T's perspective, Dane's statement that it's mandatory with U-Verse service is 100% correct. They market it as U-Verse, but internally it's just DSL if you don't subscribe to the TV service.

This knowledge came about after I moved from a U-Verse service area (TV available) to a U-Verse IPDSLAM area (no TV available) and even though I did own my modem, which was allowed since I did not subscribe to their TV services, I could not bring it with me (I ended up giving it to a neighbor who was switching to U-Verse) as it would not work with their IPDSLAM service. Of course, I ended up not using U-Verse at all at my current location and that modem also would not have worked with Sonic, so I wish at this point that I had rented it for the 4 months I had service; I would have saved $106.

Edit: Various typos.



leibold
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-09
Sunnyvale, CA
kudos:10
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

It is very clear that uverse is just a marketing term and that actual implementing technologies vary (not just from region to region but sometimes even within the same city).

There are some who have uverse Internet service that can only use att provided dsl modems with an embedded certificate signed by att. If those customers try to use their own equipment it fails to authenticate even if their modem implements all the required standards.
--
Got some spare cpu cycles ? Join Team Helix or Team Starfire!


Zeonis

join:2009-03-16
reply to BronsCon

said by BronsCon:

Is there a circumstance under which the fee is charged? If so, then is it reasonable to say they charge a fee. From my conversations with AT&T, even they don't consider U-Verse without TV service to be U-Verse, internally; so, even from AT&T's perspective, Dane's statement that it's mandatory with U-Verse service is 100% correct.

You are entitled to your opinion of course but I don't agree. There is U-verse TV, U-verse Internet, and U-verse Voice. Just like Comcast offers Xfinity TV, Xfinity Internet, and Xfinity Voice. Don't you see the difference? With AT&T you are not forced to pay the rental/equipment fee unless you want U-verse TV whereas with Sonic.net you are forced to pay the rental/equipment fee no matter what.


BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

1 edit

My point (which, by the way, is based in fact [detailed in parts of my post which you did not quote], not opinion) is that AT&T internally only considers U-Verse to be the TV service and, as they only require that you pay the fee if you subscribe to that service, they do, in fact (and it's this phrase that makes it clear I'm not stating an opinion), charge a mandatory equipment fee for (what everyone outside of their marketing department considers) U-Verse.

You opinion is welcome to differ from this fact, but that's called being wrong.

Now, can we stop being pedantic and start considering that maybe rental isn't so bad? For the record, my rented Pace 4111 didn't burst into flames when I put it in bridged mode and it's trivial to switch it back if I need to call in for support; it's also light-years ahead of the $130 modem AT&T made me buy when I signed up for U-Verse (a $32.50/mo rental fee when amortized over the 4mo I had service before I moved out of the U-Verse-serviced area and the device became a paperweight).


Zeonis

join:2009-03-16

1 edit

I don't care what ignorant people that you have spoke to consider U-verse to be. The company decides what U-verse is and they have decided that their services (whether it be TV, Internet, or VOIP phone) delivered via FTTN (Fiber to the Node) are U-verse.



BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

said by Zeonis:

I don't care what ignorant people that you have spoke to on the phone consider U-verse to be. The company decides what U-verse is and they have decided that their services (whether it be TV, Internet, or VOIP phone) delivered via FTTN (Fiber to the Node) are U-verse.

That's quite an assumption you've made, there. For your reference, my contact with AT&T personnel is not limited to phone reps and field techs.

Tobester

join:2000-11-14
San Francisco, CA
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

1 recommendation

said by BronsCon:

said by Zeonis:

I don't care what ignorant people that you have spoke to on the phone consider U-verse to be. The company decides what U-verse is and they have decided that their services (whether it be TV, Internet, or VOIP phone) delivered via FTTN (Fiber to the Node) are U-verse.

That's quite an assumption you've made, there. For your reference, my contact with AT&T personnel is not limited to phone reps and field techs.

Zeonis needs to step back and take a long look in the mirror.

His previous long thread rants in this forum show a lack of courtesy and respect, especially towards the Sonic representatives trying to give assistance.

Zeonis

join:2009-03-16

You are going way off topic Tobester but I just wanted to tell you I was very patient and courteous when dealing with the Sonic.net representatives who attempted to fix my issue when I had Sonic Fusion.



Nora Hollywo

@sbcglobal.net

Zeonis,

Although it has not come up in this thread, itemizing the $6.50 as a rental fee lowers the taxes on the service, so that is one reason to do it. Also, I just comparison-shopped between Comcast, U-verse, Sonic, and my last provider DSL Extreme, and even with this rental fee, Sonic is a far better deal in terms of speed-and-overall-package-for-the-money. If you know of a better option, please let me know. I'd like my internet service to be cheaper, too, but I don't think hammering on the cheapest provider will get me there.



NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

1 recommendation

reply to DaneJasper

said by DaneJasper:

What sort of challenges are you encountering?

I hope it is okay to update a dead thread ... challenges ...

»2Wire 3801HGV - ports open (even when I didn't open it)

I was going to reply to the OP of that topic with a list of the services listening on the ports he enumerated. But I hit a snag with port 3479: It wasn't listed at my "go-to" site of registered reserved TCP ports. Some additional searching suggested something related to AT&T.

Since Pace bought 2Wire, I got curious and probed at port 3479 from GRC "Shields Up!" And found that port 3479, listed by GRC-SU as, 'twrpc', is listening.

So my CPE, and LAN is accessible from the Internet, and security is dependent on Pace/2Wire firmware not to be vulnerable.

Some time this week the Siemens SpeedStream 4100 is coming out of its box, and going online at the relative's residence behind the Netgear FRP114(she gets no advantage from ADSL2+ over ADSL). The ZTE ZXDSL 831II will come here, along with the D-Link DIR-655 (which has useful features the Pace lacks). And the Pace 4111N-030 will go back in its box. And it will be galling to know that I am paying $6.50 a month to rent an unused piece of equipment, sitting in its box.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum