dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
973
share rss forum feed


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
Reviews:
·Bright House

Caravan shudderes on accel.

My 1994 Caravan with the 3.0 and A604/41TE trans, is shuddering on acceleration. At first, I thought maybe it was the transmission, but I am not so sure now.

As far as I can tell, everything is working fine. It's possible the trans is going south, but I want to be sure before I go and rebuild it.


mob
On the next level..
Premium
join:2000-10-07
How is it on cold start up and idle?


beck
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-29
On The Road
kudos:1
reply to neonhomer
While you are accelerating, step on the brake. As your foot is going down with the brake, does the shuddering stop? If so, it might be the torq converter (part of the tranny).


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
That's what I'm thinking. So a trans rebuild is going to be in order. I've rebuilt a 42RE in my Jeep.... hoping the 41TE will be the same.

Bob4
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey
reply to neonhomer
I've had a bad spark plug and a bad fuel injector each cause shuddering. Most recent time was today at 6 AM. Thought it was the transmission, but it was a spark plug.


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
Reviews:
·Bright House
It idles fine, and once you're up to speed, it is also fine.

Just did a tune up on it about six months ago.

I'm still thinking transmission. Just trying to decide if it is worth it. The van has about 150k on it. The 3.0 v6 runs great, and doesn't burn oil (leaks a little around the valve covers though... need to fix that.) The back hatch had a lift strut lock, and snapped the bolt off on the inside of the body. The van needs a paint job.

Yet it's paid for....
--
"F is for Fire that burns down the whole town...
U is for Uranium...... Bombs...
N is for NO SURVIVORS!!!!!" Sheldon Plankton


hambone42
Peace, through superior firepower
Premium
join:2002-02-02
Manassas, VA
Reviews:
·Comcast
Before you open it up, I would recommend having a mechanic scan the transaxle controller and check the Clutch Volume Indices (CVIs). Those'll tell you what's going on inside of that A604.

Have you ever changed the fluid? A complete change with real ATF+4 might just save it without the aggravation of tearing it apart.

Since it's a 3.0 MMC V6, you might also consider replacing the A604 with an A670, but that's probably more trouble than just rebuilding the A604 .
--
Sarcasm is the Body's Natural Defense Against Stupidity


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
Reviews:
·Bright House
My SnapOn scanner can read the CVIs... I'll have to get them and report back.

Fluid was changed about 20,000 miles ago, with ATF+4. A MagneFine filter was also installed.

Isn't the A670 the 3 speed? I'd rather stay with the 4spd....
--
"F is for Fire that burns down the whole town...
U is for Uranium...... Bombs...
N is for NO SURVIVORS!!!!!" Sheldon Plankton


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to neonhomer
Bad coil or wires can cause a miss under load, but idles fine... Can mimic a tranny shudder...

Maybe read the codes off, see if there's been any misses recorded on one of the cylinders?


mattmag
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-04-09
NW Illinois
kudos:3
said by LazMan:

Bad coil or wires can cause a miss under load, but idles fine... Can mimic a tranny shudder...

Maybe read the codes off, see if there's been any misses recorded on one of the cylinders?

Excellent advice, I was about to post the same.


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
Reviews:
·Bright House
reply to LazMan
Wires were replaced with plugs.

Could be coil.... but usually a misfire will trip a CEL.... I'm not getting any, nor am I getting any codes. (via keydance)

I hafta find my adapter for the BCM harness to read the TCM codes, and then read the PCM codes....
--
"F is for Fire that burns down the whole town...
U is for Uranium...... Bombs...
N is for NO SURVIVORS!!!!!" Sheldon Plankton


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to neonhomer
Usually, a threshold has to be hit before a miss will trigger the check engine light... I've had cars (Cavaliers, in particular) that would be missing so bad they were undrivable, but wouldn't throw a light... If you read out the ECM, there would be codes stored, though...

Just something worth checking; less mess then tearing into the tranny.


mattmag
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-04-09
NW Illinois
kudos:3
reply to neonhomer


It would also be unusual for a CVI to be so close to EOL (end of life) range that it didn't activate the CEL as well. They most always do... But see where they are and you can go from there. Typically with a pressure loss in a clutch pack bad enough to cause a shudder, you will see one value skewed much farther than the rest. Makes it easy to pinpoint when that happens!


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
UGH.... I can't find my damn Chrysler CCD adapter..... Ugh...


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
Reviews:
·Bright House
reply to mattmag
Okay... Found my CCD adapter....



For those who don't want to view (or can't) the image:

LR Clutch - 58
OD Clutch - 81
24 Clutch - 46
UD Clutch - 46

I did a quick re-learn, and got this:


LR 58
OD 90
24 47
UD 53

Also when scanning, I picked up a code:

38 - Lockup Control
--
"F is for Fire that burns down the whole town...
U is for Uranium...... Bombs...
N is for NO SURVIVORS!!!!!" Sheldon Plankton

neonturbo

join:2009-02-27
Lansing, MI
reply to LazMan
said by LazMan:

Bad coil or wires can cause a miss under load, but idles fine... Can mimic a tranny shudder...

Maybe read the codes off, see if there's been any misses recorded on one of the cylinders?

94 Caravan doesn't have misfire detection. It is OBDI not OBDII.


hambone42
Peace, through superior firepower
Premium
join:2002-02-02
Manassas, VA
Reviews:
·Comcast
reply to neonhomer
Your CVI values appear to be within the acceptable ranges:

»www.allpar.com/forums/topic/1818···or-a604/

said by neonhomer:

Okay... Found my CCD adapter....

(snip)

Also when scanning, I picked up a code:

38 - Lockup Control

I think we have a winner. Another Allpar article may provide some insight:

»www.allpar.com/fix/torque-converter.html
--
Sarcasm is the Body's Natural Defense Against Stupidity


neonhomer
KK4BFN
Premium
join:2004-01-27
Edgewater, FL
Reviews:
·Bright House
Thing is though, the van does this shuddering during initial take off, not when the TCC is locking/locked up.

I cleared the code, and then drove it. It didn't throw the code again until it reached 55MPH and dropped into lockup.

I am wondering if it is trans related or not. It almost feels like the front of the van is shaking side to side.

Maybe I should take my GoPro and stick to the side of the van and see if I can see anything...
--
"F is for Fire that burns down the whole town...
U is for Uranium...... Bombs...
N is for NO SURVIVORS!!!!!" Sheldon Plankton


rayodunne

join:2007-12-12
Sudbury, ON
I had a town & country with the exact same condition. Replaced engine mounts and had the motor aligned and it was smooth after that. The engine is moving around under load and pushing the drive axles.