Topic 'Re: latest Frontier failure' in forum 'Frontier Communications' - dslreports.com

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 08 Oct 2012 13:46:43 EDT

NormanS posted :

said by mike1965:

I will ... say being in the tech field that I have seen more yahoo accounts and hotmail accounts hacked than I have gmail......not that gmail does not get hacked but just does not seem as common.

I have had both a Hotmail account, and an MSN account since 1999. Received an occasional "phish" threatening account deletion, but never used a password like, "prettyguy52".

I saw a variation of that password fall on a relative's MSNIA account. I expect the greatest security failure of popular Web mail services is the users.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 08 Oct 2012 13:24:27 EDT

mike1965 posted :

said by Smith6612:

said by chances14:

said by mike1965:

I agree with all of you......yahoo is the most unsecure e-mail ever.....on top of that my e-mail is currently down

all email services are unsecure. you're naive if you think otherwise.

This. The reason Yahoo! accounts tend to get hacked often is due to how high profile they are (They are 18? years old). The same stuff happens with Live (now Outlook) and Google as well. Oh, and they, just like Yahoo! tailor ads towards you as well through the Google Advertising network or the Yahoo! Bing Advertising network.

If you want some security and less folks stomping on what's in your inbox, host your own mail. Domains are $8 a year and a low powered host + 1 IP is literally just as cheap per month. It's not difficult, and I host my own mail off of my dedicated box for mail I actually want. Once it's out on the Internet or in a location where you cannot secure it, all bets are off and it's free to be intercepted, hacked, data mined, you name it. Also, keep in mind the golden rule of Internet security. You present it, they will come.

I agree with all the above, that is why I am migrating over to all my own accounts, I will how ever say being in the tech field that I have seen more yahoo accounts and hotmail accounts hacked than I have gmail......not that gmail does not get hacked but just does not seem as common.

lucky for me I have my own hosting account and several domains so I do not lack other options like many.

great post by the way
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Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 08 Oct 2012 13:17:51 EDT

mike1965 posted :

said by Cycholobo:

hi Mike

Just curious - has frontier gone Frontier-Yahoo where you are?
wondering if it's cross country of just local test here.

If they went yahoo on you within the last 2 weeks you would have received notice of this great new "Free Upgrade" to their mail service.

once in effect you can not access the acct till you agree to the New TOS with Yahoo basically giving away your first born.

sorry for the late reply......yes I have been on frontier-yahoo mail about a month.......let me tell you a failure on that part that I have relayed to my area rep.

I got several e-mails that is was going to migrate soon....so I waited and waited......I use outlook for mail......one day my e-mail failed......so I logged into webmail....to find out that it had migrated...agreed to the new terms and yadda yadda..the everything was fine......the failure part is I never got and e-mail of when it was migrating.....I was smart enough to log into my web mail, which i never use by the way, I am sure many others had the same issue as me.

the fix for my recent failure was to change the password as per a frontier tech person, they cannot explain why it happened but it did and it did fix it.

I have accounts on my own domain which i will be switching too as has been said here before Yahoo is one of the most unsecure services around
--
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Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 08 Oct 2012 13:04:01 EDT

Cycholobo posted : interesting went back to site and different TOS was up without the fee thing but it still shows in the posted link

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 08 Oct 2012 12:24:38 EDT

Cycholobo posted : should also note that the layout of the link i posted is different than the link of acceptance in the window i declined but the fee part is still there in a different place

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 08 Oct 2012 12:19:42 EDT

Cycholobo posted : here's a link

»info.yahoo.com/legal/us/frontier···ils.html

scroll down to 3 k - Fees

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 08 Oct 2012 11:53:41 EDT

Cycholobo posted : wow - will try to see if i can find it - but there was a short statement that said that they ( yahoo ) had the right to charge in the future for services and that they would notify the members.

It was after the area where they said that u could not opt out of the advertisements because that's what paid for Yahoo services

will check out local offers

Re: latest Frontier failure

Sat, 06 Oct 2012 21:20:49 EDT

NormanS posted : Basic Yahoo! ToS:

»info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/ut···173.html

But AT&T-Yahoo! is different:

»www.att.com/shop/internet/att-in···oJN7PSiU

I can only find a reference to paying additional fees in the description of "a la carte" services; which are only added when that particular service is ordered.

Beyond that, there is the issue of the Yahoo! Privacy Policy; which pretty much means the user gives up his privacy in exchange for the service.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: latest Frontier failure

Sat, 06 Oct 2012 10:40:36 EDT

Cycholobo posted : SOO glad someone else gets it :))

thanks Hank

Re: latest Frontier failure

Sat, 06 Oct 2012 10:38:59 EDT

Cycholobo posted : been watching your posts for years - always glad to have your input

thanks

Re: latest Frontier failure

Sat, 06 Oct 2012 10:30:43 EDT

Cycholobo posted : Hi NormanS

sorry but can't link - it went away after i declined - suspect it is a standard allowing Yahoo to "scan and analyze" everything as well as use the info as they choose and charge if they choose in the future.

Understand that nothing in a court of law is simply this or that but it would seem that it could fall into "Intentional" because their actions were deliberate, based on technical input from engineering staff and the consequences of their actions were known - ie they knew that they could not supply the expanded service base but continued to fraudulently sell, essentially taking payments under the false pretense that they would provide the service that they said they would.

on an individual basis in relation to the industry it's probably moot but the overall effect on the thousands of affected customers would seem significant.

I am not in any legal field so my thoughts are just that

appreciate your input - thanks

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 22:06:46 EDT

Hank posted : Sorry, most of our area was not bought out. We are legacy Frontier customers. The reason you have a different opinion is because part of the agreement when the Verizon buyout occurred was that they would make improvements to those areas. Legacy customers in our area are not receiving the benefits of those improvements. Our service continues to degrade.

I do understand that it is insulting, but that was not the intent. So if you were insulted I do appologize. Likewise if you are receiving good service we are happy that you are. No one was accused of taking bribes. The entire point was that the statements by those from other areas have the misconception that the improvmeents are system wide. They are not, those of us in some of the legacy areas continue to have service degradation.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 20:17:59 EDT

NormanS posted :

said by Cycholobo:

Their latest nonsense needs to be addressed by all customers of their service. Frontier-Yahoo ! I am personally offended that some one would represent to me that I should pay them for a service that is available for free.

Read the Yahoo agreement and you will find that Yahoo reserves the right to, in the future charge fees for their service as well as all the monitoring and other crap yahoo is so famous for. Does that mean paying both Yahoo and Frontier for e-mail. WOW - talk about bending over.

Frontier supplied a advertisement free simple and secure mail service that was supplied as part of their DSL service. They have taken that away and replaced it with something that is available for free, but they are not reducing customer charges. Hence Frontier gets more and supplies less. The Frontier management chose to free up servers rather than purchasing the needed additional equipment and have chosen to represent this farce as a Free Upgrade complete with advertizing that you can not opt out of because that advertizing is what pays for the yahoo services ( read the TOS )

Welcome to the club. Along with: AT&T, BT Internet (UK) Rogers Cable (Canada), Xtra (New Zealand), and Verizon (sort of).

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH

legal firms interested - please post - other parties input welcome

Legally, I doubt if you could prove this agreement is a tort. And you seem to be in a tough spot, with no competition.

When/if Yahoo!/Frontier start charging for email, and if you don't get an option to refuse the service, you would probably have a tort then.

Do you have a link to the Frontier-Yahoo! ToS? I would be interested in comparing it with the AT&T-Yahoo! ToS.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 19:36:45 EDT

wesm posted :

said by Hank:

Cycholobo - The folks that are responding and stating that email is not the service being purchased don't live in our area. So they single out the email aspect only; could be because the have stock in Frontier or are employed by them. The do not put up with the same poor service those of us in this area of WV do.

So? We're still Frontier subscribers. Our service areas got bought out, just like yours did. Why does having a different opinion or even a different service experience mean that our stance is automatically suspect? I can't believe you don't understand how insulting it is to imply that when someone thinks a company is decent at what they do, that person has obviously been bribed.

In the FiOS areas of Washington, Frontier doesn't even advertise e-mail accounts. That said, of course Frontier has problems. We got our upstream speeds chopped with no warning and 15-30% price increases on Internet. Verizon had problems, and GTE before them had problems. My opinion (whoops, better check to make sure I haven't been paid for this opinion) is that Frontier has the same kinds of problems any other ISP has, but your frustration is compounded because you can't switch to another provider. Have you considered other outlets for your frustration, like trying to convince your city to build municipal broadband, assuming your state even allows that?

Frankly, no amount of complaining to Frontier or the FCC is going to do any good. Frontier has a good deal going by being the only carrier in the area and being protected by both law and geography. There aren't enough people in your area to make having multiple, competitive carriers worthwhile. Even if there were, large broadband providers have made sure that smaller or municipal providers can't even try to make a dent.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 19:36:44 EDT

NormanS posted :

said by Cycholobo:

It's all about "Ethics". Frontier is selling services they can not supply and that is the point.

Ethics? In Corporate America? The only Corporate ethic is pleasing the shareholder.

AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/CenturyLink; it is all the same, and it is all about the bottom line.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 14:04:40 EDT

darcilicious posted :

So they single out the email aspect only

No, the OP did that -- brought up the Yahoo! mail service as the "latest Frontier failure".

could be because the have stock in Frontier or are employed by them.

Uhm, no. But thanks for playing!
--
♬ Music is life ♬

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 13:59:17 EDT

Hank posted : Cycholobo - The folks that are responding and stating that email is not the service being purchased don't live in our area. So they single out the email aspect only; could be because the have stock in Frontier or are employed by them. The do not put up with the same poor service those of us in this area of WV do. I agree with you that when Frontier advertises a package deal and highlights what they are providing in that package deal then you have the right to expect them to provide decent service. It could be their local area is managed much different than the area you and I live in. So they have a different perspective of the service they receive from Frontier. Good for them that they are receiving decent service from Frontier. But they need to stop knocking folks that don't receive what they pay for, who receive service support that is well below acceptable standards, who get cut back on speed because Frontier does not address the congestion issue, and they just keep over selling an already over burdened system. That's only the internet side. I could list an equal or longer list of issues with the telephone service provided by Frontier.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:40:39 EDT

cdru posted :

said by Cycholobo:

next time you go for a six pack you may find that you are actually buying a 4 pack and the extra 2 are a "Value Added" bonus. Guess what comes next.

Bad example as the 6 pack is what you're buying. You didn't subscribe to your ISP because you needed an email account. You subscribed because you needed internet access and it came with an email account.

That six pack that you referred to...the bag that it was put in when you checked out is the email. They toss it in with your purchase. You technically pay for that bag as it does have a non-zero cost, but you don't pay less because you just carry it out instead of using a bag.

It's all about "Ethics". Frontier is selling services they can not supply and that is the point.

Sorry You missed that.

I didn't miss that. Your post was regarding their latest failure, their email service. I commented specifically on that aspect. Your line quality and packet loss is a legitimate issue and I don't have a issue with complaining about that because that is what you are paying for.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:08:45 EDT

Cycholobo posted : sad that you believe what you have presented.

next time you go for a six pack you may find that you are actually buying a 4 pack and the extra 2 are a "Value Added" bonus. Guess what comes next.

Our experience with Frontier/Citizens has been a long term relation. They are the ONLY carrier in the area due to an exclusive rights deal they have with the state. When DSL became available we signed up and it took about 6 months to get it right. Not a problem because then we had years of quality reliable service. Then came the client base expansion without the hardware expansion.

They "Oversold Capacity" and management is not willing to spend for hardware upgrade in rural areas and we have not had the service that we were guaranteed for the last three years. They did however change the guarantee to 70% of what they sold and still can't do it.

Frontier sells "Internet Packages" that include specific services including the e-mail that they replaced with Yahoo and ESPN and some other streaming.

Frontier does fine most of the time with small packets loss ranging from 0 to low single digits - bump to med sized packets and most of the time it ranges between 0 and low double digits - jump to large packets and we get 40 to 100% packet loss.

You can not "stream" with these numbers. They are selling services they can not supply. The streaming is useless and that doesn't matter. I would simply like to receive what I was sold. It would appear that you are okay with not getting what you have paid for. Apathy permeates society and the world is Not better because of it.

Maybe I'm "Old School" from a time when an entities worth to society was based on "Ethics", "Honor", and a persons "Word" or "Handshake". My wife and I have always provided our clients with what we say we will provide, and in most cases more.

It's all about "Ethics". Frontier is selling services they can not supply and that is the point.

Sorry You missed that.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 22:55:22 EDT

Hank posted : Excellent post Smith6612.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 22:13:28 EDT

Smith6612 posted :

said by chances14:

said by mike1965:

I agree with all of you......yahoo is the most unsecure e-mail ever.....on top of that my e-mail is currently down

all email services are unsecure. you're naive if you think otherwise.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 21:09:16 EDT

Hank posted :

said by cdru:

Then why gripe here?

Don't like it? Don't use it. If you have another alternative for email then what's the big deal? I have my own domain that I use exclusively. I'm sure I have a Frontier email account of some sorts somewhere, but I never use it. If Frontier/Yahoo/whoever is going to base a profile on me, it's going to say that I have a gigantic need for natural male enhancement, I'm in need of a casual relationship with some Russian models, and some Nigerian has a business opportunity for only me.

Because this is the appropriate forum to complain or complement Frontier. Sorry about your perversion, is this really the place to address it? :D

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 17:23:57 EDT

chances14 posted :

said by mike1965:

I agree with all of you......yahoo is the most unsecure e-mail ever.....on top of that my e-mail is currently down

all email services are unsecure. you're naive if you think otherwise.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:23:29 EDT

cdru posted :

said by Hank:

cdru - If you would had read the entire thread you would have seen that both Cycholobo and I have gone elsewhere for our email service.

Then why gripe here?

But it really does not make any difference if it is value added service or not, the problem is that they are requiring you to sign a new TOS that provides one with zero protection and permits Yahoo to use your emails to gather information about you that is provided to other organizations.

Don't like it? Don't use it. If you have another alternative for email then what's the big deal? I have my own domain that I use exclusively. I'm sure I have a Frontier email account of some sorts somewhere, but I never use it. If Frontier/Yahoo/whoever is going to base a profile on me, it's going to say that I have a gigantic need for natural male enhancement, I'm in need of a casual relationship with some Russian models, and some Nigerian has a business opportunity for only me.

As I said in a previous post, valuing your privacy is one thing. Overestimating your worth/importance is another.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:03:56 EDT

nfgbrian posted : Agreed. There are a ton of e-mail services that can be used to replace Frontier's Yahoo based e-mail service. My area has been with Yahoo since I signed up for DSL 8 months ago or so, I barely ever use it.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:02:04 EDT

Hank posted : cdru - If you would had read the entire thread you would have seen that both Cycholobo and I have gone elsewhere for our email service. But it really does not make any difference if it is value added service or not, the problem is that they are requiring you to sign a new TOS that provides one with zero protection and permits Yahoo to use your emails to gather information about you that is provided to other organizations.

Plus it is just not the email change it is the entire exceptionally poor service Frontier provides and it is not limited to internet.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 13:57:32 EDT

cdru posted :

said by Cycholobo:

Email is a value added service. Just like webspace, usenet, etc. A small fraction of a cent of your monthly service fee pays for email. You are not paying for email service. You are paying for internet access that just happens to have email service thrown in for free. Bitching and moaning that they no longer directly supply the service will fall on deaf ears.

If you don't like what they provide, get a different email account elsewhere. There are hundreds of different free email accounts. Or get your own domain and host it at one of thousands of different hosting companies.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 13:10:38 EDT

darcilicious posted :

said by Cycholobo:

Just curious - has frontier gone Frontier-Yahoo where you are?
wondering if it's cross country of just local test here.

It's everywhere, I'm in Oregon and on FiOS and my account is being switched over later this week. (But I don't give a rat's *ss as I never use an ISPs email service anyway. I've been through too many changes in the 10+ years I've lived in the same house: GTE, Verizon, and now Frontier).
--
♬ Music is life ♬

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 10:04:16 EDT

Cycholobo posted : hi Gozer

been noticing over last year DNS issues cross country - wouldn't be surprised at all to find feds hand in it all.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 09:59:40 EDT

Cycholobo posted : hi Mike

Just curious - has frontier gone Frontier-Yahoo where you are?
wondering if it's cross country of just local test here.

If they went yahoo on you within the last 2 weeks you would have received notice of this great new "Free Upgrade" to their mail service.

once in effect you can not access the acct till you agree to the New TOS with Yahoo basically giving away your first born.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 00:22:26 EDT

gozer posted : I bet the reason you can get into webmail and not pop3 is because of Frontier's DNS server's they seem to be changing them alot as they expand and make changes to thier network. And most of the time it causes some problems. Try a pub DNS like googl's or w/e

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 19:37:46 EDT

mike1965 posted : I just checked I can log into my web mail.....but outlook is failing.......damn frontier they suck

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 18:56:49 EDT

mike1965 posted : I agree with all of you......yahoo is the most unsecure e-mail ever.....on top of that my e-mail is currently down

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 14:02:59 EDT

Cycholobo posted : Hey Hank

As you have done we also have another e-mail service that we have paid through the years since dial up days. they will again become our primary.

Yahoo is dangerous and an invasion of personal privacy

Federal Trade commission is another contact.

Really don't get into this on line complaints but Frontier needs to be held accountable.

Now if we could only get accountability from DC LOL

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 13:51:20 EDT

Hank posted : You are correct. The WV PUC authorized them to take over the Verizon areas and those are the areas getting improvement. The rural customers are not being looked after. They just keep over selling, the results is that speed and reliability have gone way downhill.

Unfortunately the email service for the last few years has been with a contract firm. But I refused to use the Yahoo mail service because as you I took the time to read the terms of service. You have absolute zero privacy and they will use the information they gather from your email for marketing. No thanks, that is not for me.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 13:38:55 EDT

Cycholobo posted : Hi Hank

Truly bothers me that that after all is said and done the only option is litigation.

when DSL 1st became available we signed up and it took 6 months to get it working - we then has a couple of years of service till the push started to increase customer base. We have not had promised service since and this latest attempt to get over on people proves they only have an interest in doing the least for the most.

They oversold server capacity and now are dumping e-mail to Yahoo

Seems that WV is part of the issue for granting monopoly status to Frontier effectively locking out other suppliers.

Re: latest Frontier failure

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 13:10:29 EDT

Hank posted : I fully understand your frustration. I have filed complaints with the FCC, they respond to the FCC but nothing has improved. The area manager just does not seem to care.

latest Frontier failure

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 12:16:47 EDT

Cycholobo posted : After fighting with Frontier for the last three years over speeds and having them respond by changing their agreement to only guarantee 70% of the speed packages they sell. Not surprising that even at 70% still Not be able to supply 1 Mb down. SAD

Their latest nonsense needs to be addressed by all customers of their service. Frontier-Yahoo ! I am personally offended that some one would represent to me that I should pay them for a service that is available for free.

Read the Yahoo agreement and you will find that Yahoo reserves the right to, in the future charge fees for their service as well as all the monitoring and other crap yahoo is so famous for. Does that mean paying both Yahoo and Frontier for e-mail. WOW - talk about bending over.

Frontier supplied a advertisement free simple and secure mail service that was supplied as part of their DSL service. They have taken that away and replaced it with something that is available for free, but they are not reducing customer charges. Hence Frontier gets more and supplies less. The Frontier management chose to free up servers rather than purchasing the needed additional equipment and have chosen to represent this farce as a Free Upgrade complete with advertizing that you can not opt out of because that advertizing is what pays for the yahoo services ( read the TOS )

The only upgrade I see is getting out of Frontier. Unfortunately there are no options available in my location.

It is time for all the frustrated Frontier customers who have been abused by this company for too long to take a stand and litigate the issue.

We need to find a legal firm to institute a class action against Frontier for "False advertising" and "Failure to supply contracted services".

We can all start by sending complaints to FCC, State Attorney Generals, State Utility Commissions. Federal and state consumer agencies and so on.

Mine are in the process.

Document everything and the overwhelming preponderance of data might actually bring results

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH

legal firms interested - please post - other parties input welcome