Topic 'Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?' in forum 'Microsoft Help' - dslreports.com

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sun, 07 Oct 2012 15:54:56 EDT

CCat posted :

said by Cartel:

Click on image.

Fixed (Click)

[att=1]
--
I Live In My Own World, But It's OK.....They Know Me There.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sun, 07 Oct 2012 11:18:18 EDT

Cartel posted : They should have editions of Windows like , gamer edition, tablet edition, etc.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sat, 06 Oct 2012 10:23:36 EDT

Kramer posted : I really haven't seen anything about Windows 8 in itself that would convince me to upgrade from Windows 7, but I think that misses the whole point of Windows 8. Windows 8 is the first operating system that can make a tablet become a full replacement for a laptop or even a desktop. There is significant advantage to having your desktop, your tablet, your laptop and possibly your phone all using a similar interface. It just depends on how well MS ties all these devices together. I love the iPad but lets be realistic here.. IOS shuts the gates before the PC gets into its kingdom and that includes Apple PCs. Microsoft is trying something big and I hope they are successful. I'm more than willing to slap WIN8 on my PC if my next tablet purchase is going to a Microsoft driven product. I think there is a good possibility of me going in that direction.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 22:24:52 EDT

Cartel posted : Click on image.

[att=1]

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 20:07:25 EDT

Glen T posted : When I can get a desk that looks like this, then touch computing will make a lot more sense to me.

[att=1]

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 13:28:41 EDT

Michail posted :

said by spewak:

said by redxii:

My PC is not a phone or tablet.

There it is in a nutshell!
That UI "Metro" is NOT for desktops and only manages to annoy if not on a Tablet or touchscreen of some variant. I had it running and was not overly wowed by it.

Since the metro process seems to be crashing/broken on me now I'm realizing how important and integrated it is in Windows 8.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 11:04:44 EDT

NefCanuck posted : I'm cautiously optimistic regarding Win 8, but I already know that at least one of the programs that I rely on, will not be Win 8 compatible unless I pay to upgrade it to a version that will require an annual subscription fee (SAM Broadcaster)

Heck, I have no idea yet if my audio hardware will have Win 8 drivers, have to check that :hmm:

Haven't checked my other core non MS software yet (ESET/ Macrium Reflect) but I have a bad feeling that Macrium is going to be another kick to the wallet (ESET allows for free upgrades which the license is in place and I'm good until 2013 there)

As to the interface, I'm a tablet / touchscreen fanatic, having only one useable hand makes using a mouse painfully slow (take hand away from keyboard, move mouse, repeat) versus the shorter distance between the keyboard and the screen, at least the way I have things set up. Using the touchscreen features in Win 7 and loving it so far.

Interesting times indeed..

NefCanuck

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:15:00 EDT

spewak posted :

said by redxii:

My PC is not a phone or tablet.

There it is in a nutshell!
That UI "Metro" is NOT for desktops and only manages to annoy if not on a Tablet or touchscreen of some variant. I had it running and was not overly wowed by it.
--

Romney equals Epic Fail!

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 05 Oct 2012 09:01:00 EDT

Cartel posted : Windows 8 you can pin your favorite program with a booger!
Gotta love touch screen.

:p

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Thu, 04 Oct 2012 10:03:13 EDT

Octavean posted : Its well known by now that there wont be any enhancements to Media Center in Windows 8. So anyone on Windows 7 now that uses Media Center would be making a lateral move going to Windows 8 Pro, plus the added expense of buying the Media Center pack. Although I have heard the Media Center add-on will be free from Oct 26 th to January 31 st.

Those who use Media Center and have Windows 8 Pro (RTM) now are keenly aware that the “add features" option will not allow you to obtain a key to install Media Center. Presumably keys will be available starting Oct 26 th.

I believe this feature still works in Windows 8 RP (with the public key) but not RTM (no keys).

So in other words you actually lose a feature,...for now.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Thu, 04 Oct 2012 06:59:07 EDT

anon posted : Windows 8 was never going to be accepted on the corporate site no matter what simply because they are now only deploying Windows 7.

Anyway, here is another start menu alternative. This one is by IObit. Program is freeware and looks like Windows 7's start menu. It is still in beta though. I have tried it, and it seems okay. Hopefully, it is a little more polished when the final release is out.

»www.iobit.com/iobitstartmenu8.php

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 16:50:26 EDT

workablob posted :

said by Glen T:

said by workablob:

Mmmmm Pulp. Arghlllll.

One of our clients actually produce 'edible' wood pulp as a sausage filler for the EU market. A completely indigestible source of fibre.

Yep. It's in all kinds of stuff we eat.

Euell Gibbons was right!

Dave
--
I may have been born yesterday. But it wasn't at night.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 14:40:57 EDT

Glen T posted :

said by workablob:

Mmmmm Pulp. Arghlllll.

One of our clients actually produce 'edible' wood pulp as a sausage filler for the EU market. A completely indigestible source of fibre.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 14:16:30 EDT

workablob posted :

said by Glen T:

said by workablob:

Sounds eerily similar to my company. We have an office in Canada. What software does your company vend?

Ours is a very vertical market. Chemical engineering simulation software, tools and services. Our primary market is pulp and paper, but we get into other water-based industries.

Mmmmm Pulp. Arghlllll. (Picture Homer Simpson Drooling)

Dave
--
I may have been born yesterday. But it wasn't at night.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 12:57:33 EDT

Glen T posted :

said by workablob:

Sounds eerily similar to my company. We have an office in Canada. What software does your company vend?

Ours is a very vertical market. Chemical engineering simulation software, tools and services. Our primary market is pulp and paper, but we get into other water-based industries.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 12:52:28 EDT

markofmayhem posted :

said by Glen T:

said by markofmayhem:

There is something deeply concerning with the malicious way advertising revenue is collected on tech sites in 2012. If you wish to make money, then you must repeat the same negativity, it FEEDS off of each other.

Wow. That's the first time that anyone has accused me of being sponsored to post negative opinions on a forum about a product to boost forum traffic for advertisers. Wouldn't that be nice!

I wasn't accusing you of being sponsored... you just happened to be the most recent post soundboarding the sponsored talking points :(

I receive promotional material from Microsoft, RedHat, Canonical, Oracle, Apple, etc. as well: they are all the same. Much different than the '90's, where they all had pictures of buildings either looking up at it or down from it: now it is colors and "amaze", "thrill", "excite", etc with clouds or cloud like colored wisps. All of them... it is comical. What is even more comical is to watch middle management, executive management, and MBA's wet their pants at the buzz words contained there-in. "We need profile managed deployment!"... Oh yeah?
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Show off that hardware: join Team Discovery and Team Helix

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 12:30:08 EDT

workablob posted :

said by Glen T:

said by kickass69:

The precedent was already set with MS Office. You had to buy a third-party add-on to get the old menu structure back.

BTW, got an e-mail from one of our corporate clients (industrial) who was inquiring if our software was compatible with Win7. They are getting ready to upgrade from XP. This is typical of fortune 500 manufacturers that we deal with.

I predict that Win8 will be bypassed by the corporate world just like they bypassed Vista.

Sounds eerily similar to my company. We have an office in Canada.

What software does your company vend?

Thanks,

David
--
I may have been born yesterday. But it wasn't at night.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 12:27:14 EDT

Glen T posted :

said by markofmayhem:

Wow. That's the first time that anyone has accused me of being sponsored to post negative opinions on a forum about a product to boost forum traffic for advertisers. Wouldn't that be nice!

However, my opinions are my own. And I post here because I hope that MS, being so sensitive to how the market feels about their products, is paying someone to troll forums like this to gather opinions. I sure can't find the "Tell us what you REALLY think of Windows" button on MS websites.

As an ISV, we do regularly get promotional material from MS indicating that they want us to help MS "thrill and amaze" their users. This indicates that to me that MS doesn't understand the corporate world (which the ironically dominate) at all. Corporate users don't want to be "thrilled and amazed." They want the OS to get the hell out of their way and let them do their work.

I think MS envies Apple. They miss having people lining up on sidewalks at midnight like they did for Win 95. It's not enough for MS to dominate the corporate world. They want to be loved too.

I agree with you, that I think the future is something like Corning is promoting - dedicated embedded devices with transparent OSs that integrate seamlessly. God I hope so. I don't want to be spending my weekends applying MS updates to my vehicles and domestic appliances 10 years from now.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 11:30:16 EDT

markofmayhem posted :

said by workablob:

Plummet was a bit extreme.

I believe 8 will be as successful on the PC especially corp PC as Vista.

I had no problem with Vista and 7 was basically Vista done properly.

Our company is in the process of deploying 7 to get rid of XP so we milk the OS for as long as possible.

Dave

I agree. 8 does have advanced deployment, volume, and manageability enhancements over past versions that may be very attractive. I would fully expect much settling of dust before reputable CIO's look at possibilities of upgrading, though. It may be possible that "9" is released before the cycle comes, much like 7 and Vista's proximity sealed Vista's fate in the corporate world.
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Show off that hardware: join Team Discovery and Team Helix

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 11:14:57 EDT

markofmayhem posted :

said by Glen T:

said by dave:

Yeah, yeah, I get all that - that's why I said "there is a precision problem" or words to that effect.

What I'm talking about is the sheer ludditeism exhibited here, the notion that there can never be anything better than what we have today. This is not a claim that Windows 8 is better than Windows 7. I don't plan to upgrade existing systems myself.

My topic was 'I don't see why everyone assumes it's "keyboard and mouse" versus "touch screen"'.

The topic is if there is a benefit in Win 8 over Win 7. If we all agree that the interface formerly known as Metro is the main benefit,

We do not all agree. There is something deeply concerning with the malicious way advertising revenue is collected on tech sites in 2012. If you wish to make money, then you must repeat the same negativity, it FEEDS off of each other. Eventually, it dies off and truth emerges, sometimes it is too late (Vista for example, where people claimed it used more memory because Microsoft stopped reporting "Cached" memory as "Free" in XP and begain reported it as "USED" in Vista, in 7 it is reported as "Cached"... the utter stupidity on display was phenominal).

There is more to Windows 8 than Metro, unless limiting Windows 8 to Metro only helps funnel stupidity towards staying on topic through 7 2-paragraph pages to escalate ad-revenue on blogs and "tech" review sites. Then I agree, AdSense, Windows 8's only benefit is the infamous Metro.

said by JohnInSJ:

said by workablob:

But you are very correct. Windows 8 on the desktop is going to plummet like a stone just like Microsoft Flight did, as I predicted.
»Microsoft Flight Gimme A Break

Been using it since it became available on MSDN on several machines. It takes about 10 minutes of actual use to get used to the differences. Doubtful any plummeting will happen. People will do what they always do - get the new OS when they get new hardware (and some pretty nifty hardware will be coming out for this OS) while corps will do their normal three year cycle, so they'll skip win8 and continue their slow grind to win7 (HP will be getting there THIS year, according to the handful of folks I know that still work there. Wow) and a smaller group of people will upgrade. Maybe more with the low upgrade price, but more is still not many.

Just like every other Windows release, which EVERY SINGLE ONE was predicted to "flop", "bomb", "be remembered as the release that killed Microsoft" (don't believe me? look it up, from 1.0 to XP, from NT 4 to Windows 7; every release was the "worst in human history" leading up to release):

after a year or so, the single entity causing all of the hatred will not get advertising clicks/reads and new topics will emerge, some of them with positive queues, most likely focused on what was improved/upgraded/added under the hood of Windows 8 compared to previous versions.

Such as:

AppLocker
BitLocker
BranchCache
Connection Manager
Client Hyper V
eDrive
Security Auditing
Smart Cards
Folder Redirection, Offline Files, and Roaming User Profiles
Windows Power Shell
Windows To Go
More effecient multimedia
Smaller footprint = older equipment usable?
Anand on DirectX 11.1 and WDDM 1.2
WDDM 1.2 enhancements

Exhaustive, mind-blowing, link-athon for WDDM 1.2, GDXI 1.2

said by Wikipedia :

Windows 8 includes WDDM 1.2 and DXGI 1.2. New features were first previewed at the Windows BUILD conference and include performance improvements as well as support for stereoscopic 3D rendering and video playback.
Other major features include preemptive multitasking with finer granularity (DMA buffer, primitive, triangle, pixel, or instruction-level), reduced memory footprint, improved resource sharing, and faster timeout detection and recovery. 16-bit color surface formats (565, 5551, 4444) are mandatory in Windows 8, and Direct3D 11 Video supports YUV 4:4:4/4:2:2/4:2:0/4:1:1 video formats with 8, 10, and 16-bit precision, as well as 4 and 8-bit palettized formats.

Technet overview

Will Windows 8 break sales records? Probably not. Is it worth upgrading to? Is any OS, really... Will it be "the end of Microsoft"? Nope.

Do we really have to go through this every release? It is amazing the effort people will go through to duplicate past shadows of others forgotten through error and chicken little panic before them.
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Show off that hardware: join Team Discovery and Team Helix

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 11:13:18 EDT

Glen T posted :

said by kickass69:

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 11:07:21 EDT

workablob posted :

said by JohnInSJ:

said by workablob:

But you are very correct. Windows 8 on the desktop is going to plummet like a stone just like Microsoft Flight did, as I predicted.
»Microsoft Flight Gimme A Break

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 10:25:35 EDT

JohnInSJ posted :

said by workablob:

But you are very correct. Windows 8 on the desktop is going to plummet like a stone just like Microsoft Flight did, as I predicted.
»Microsoft Flight Gimme A Break

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 06:53:57 EDT

workablob posted :

said by kickass69:

Once Stardock's Start8 comes out of beta though...it'll end up costing $4.99. This sets a bad precedent having to pay for features that were once part of the OS to have it work productively as it did before.

Sure there's Classic Shell out there thankfully, but once Windows 7 is past it's prime and IF Microsoft continues with this and gets rid of the desktop interface altogether, what then?

Start8 free expired a couple of days ago so I shelled out the 4.99.

I go through 5 buck attomizers on my eCig like water so not a big deal.

But you are very correct. Windows 8 on the desktop is going to plummet like a stone just like Microsoft Flight did, as I predicted.
»Microsoft Flight Gimme A Break

Dave
--
I may have been born yesterday. But it wasn't at night.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 06:53:19 EDT

anon posted : The Desktop is there for legacy purposes. If you remove it, then you literally have WinRT.

Start8's start menu replacement looks exactly like Windows 7. It even has some Aero effects. Freebie Classic Shell is fine though. Seriously, debating the interface at this stage of the game is a waste of time as either of these 2 options will satisfy 99% of the users out there.

Anyway, the purpose of of Windows 8 is not something MS created just so they can sell you an upgrade. Likewise, it is also not just Windows 7 without a start button and replaced with Metro.

Reason for Windows 8 in the first place is that Microsoft is afraid of the term Apple term "post PC" that everybody accepts. All the so-called tech experts say that everybody will be soon be using non-PC devices that uses a mobile OS. Microsoft realized that those specs can actually run Windows. That means people can do real computing on something with mobile hardware.

Hence, Windows 8 is Microsoft's mobile OS meaning that it is capable of running on mobile hardware. With a mobile OS, you expect things like faster boot and longer battery life. Even traditional non-touch screen devices benefit from these types of improvements.

The biggest difference in this new version of Windows is that you get another OS. That is you get x86 WinRT that can run its own apps. Those apps are more commonly known as Metro/Windows 8 apps.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Wed, 03 Oct 2012 05:10:55 EDT

kickass69 posted : Once Stardock's Start8 comes out of beta though...it'll end up costing $4.99. This sets a bad precedent having to pay for features that were once part of the OS to have it work productively as it did before.

Sure there's Classic Shell out there thankfully, but once Windows 7 is past its prime and IF Microsoft continues with this and gets rid of the desktop interface altogether, what then?

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Tue, 02 Oct 2012 17:28:41 EDT

workablob posted : I've been using it exclusively for my work PC for a couple (maybe 3) weeks) and after installing Stardock Start8 honestly It's sometimes hard to remember I'm not running Windows 7.

If I had to pay to upgrade I would not bother.

It has some nice features that Win7 does not have but if my boss told me tomorrow I could not run 8 I would go back to Win 7 without a thought.

This is the RTM version I am running.

Dave
--
I may have been born yesterday. But it wasn't at night.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 23:25:31 EDT

OZO posted :

said by Glen T:

The topic is if there is a benefit in Win 8 over Win 7. If we all agree that the interface formerly known as Metro is the main benefit, then I have to answer, no, because touch screen computing does not make my job easier. And spending extra time working around a GUI that puts touch screen computing up front and center, does not make my job easier.

Show me touch computing where my hands are resting in an argonomically correct position, with my elbows at a 90 degree angle, while my head is held at a comfortable angle (neck not bent with head looking down) and I have precise control over the cursor at all times, and I'll see the benefit and stop being a luddite.

And one more thing about touch interface, that should be mentioned here. Along it's being imprecise (pointing to a big spot, not to one pixel), being against all ergonomic recommendations and requiring to clean the screen from greasy smudges, playing with smartphone a lot, I found it completely unreliable. You touch the screen and you never know if your touch is accepted as input or not (due to low pressure, brief time, etc). If you're lucky the button you touch will become green for a short while and it actually may help you to recognize, that input was accepted. But in many cases I touch it, I wait it for the action, there is nothing happened and I touch it again ... just to discover, that at the very same moment image of the button was replaced with a new button, that takes that input as a request for a new action (which I don't want/expect)...

There is a reason, why mouse has buttons, that click (hint - to give you feedback). It's the very same reason, why a good keyboard has a distinctive feedback too, BTW. There is no such thing with touch screens. Thus to make the UI work more reliable, it should be redesigned and many confirmation dialog boxes should be added for every critical action. That is also useful in cases when I may accidentally touch my smart phone screen without intention to do anything.

Bottom line the touch screen interface is (additionally to other problems mentioned earlier) unreliable and therefore requires a different UI, that is specifically designed with that "feature" in mind. That's one more reason why I don't want / need W8 on my desktop.
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 18:27:50 EDT

sholling posted :

said by Glen T:

The same thing happened with the ribbon bar in MS Office. Given the choice, most users would not use it. Why? Because, for experienced users, it actually reduces their productivity. The ribbon bar is still having a negative impact on my productivity in programs like Excel.

This is a marketing decision, not a usability decision. The interface formerly known as Metro is a one-size-fits-none solution imposed by a company that is once again releasing a "Me Too" product that is too little and too late. The only way that they can ensure adoption is to impose adoption on hapless desktop users.

I agree completely - I hate the ribbon bar and Metro and I don't see any reason to have to forget everything I know about Windows and Office every time somebody in Redmond get's the bright idea to change the interface for no reason that benefits the customer. As far as I'm concerned Metro is MS Bob 2013 and will have exactly the same level of acceptance in the corporate world.
--
"Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
--FREDERIC BASTIAT--

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Mon, 01 Oct 2012 17:24:38 EDT

Glen T posted :

said by dave:

»www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZkHpNnX···youtu.be

P.S. Another issue is that I use 1920 x 1200 resolutions screens (which are getting harder to find as vendors are chopping vertical resolution to match HD formats). In order for a 24" UXGA screen to be comfortably in my field of view (progressive lenses require more head turning/scanning) it is just beyond my reach, making touch screens absolutely useless to me.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sat, 29 Sep 2012 15:42:41 EDT

JohnInSJ posted :

said by urbanriot:

said by Glen T:

Ergonomically, it doesn't work in a normal office setting.

What, people find it inefficient in offices to swipe the right bar, tap settings, tap power, tap shut down in Windows 8

vs.

Start. Shutdown in Windows 7?

The Windows 8 method seems to go well with a heavily paperworked corporate environment that has management forms for every task imaginable.

I just click an icon I made, which is a shortcut to the shutdown (and restart) command line commands. They're tiles, too. Or I press the power button (which is set to "shutdown" as its action. Or close the lid for sleep.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sat, 29 Sep 2012 10:05:43 EDT

Octavean posted : I thought this was an interesting read:

Why I Still Use Windows Or: the countdown to a fresh Start.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sat, 29 Sep 2012 10:02:48 EDT

dave posted : Yeah, yeah, I get all that - that's why I said "there is a precision problem" or words to that effect.

What I'm talking about is the sheer ludditeism exhibited here, the notion that there can never be anything better than what we have today. This is not a claim that Windows 8 is better than Windows 7. I don't plan to upgrade existing systems myself.

My topic was 'I don't see why everyone assumes it's "keyboard and mouse" versus "touch screen"'.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sat, 29 Sep 2012 00:17:21 EDT

OZO posted :

said by dave:

Pointing your finger is more natural than moving a device that moves a pointer to the thing you want pointed at.

Really? Is that so simple? And you failed to see any difference here?

Mouse is precise pointing device. You can point to one pixel on the screen. People who do graphic work, make icons, etc know how important it is. People who do simple text editing know it too. Even windows borders has just couple of pixels in width, But with mouse you can easily point on the border and change its size in a snap.

Finger, on the other hand (actually on both hands ;) ) can point only on a small area (5x5px or bigger, depending on the size of your finger and how much beer you had) and never on one pixel.

That difference required complete re-design of UI. UI for fingers can't replace UI that was designed with precise mouse pointer in mind. Thus, you don't have windows, where you can't change their sizes - you have big tails and full screen applications instead. Of course you still can handle it with precise mouse pointer, but what's the point? It's like hammering nails with a microscope - it may work (device is heavy and feel metal in some parts) too, but again, what's the point to do it this way?

Finally, regards to point of pointing on something on the screen and is it natural or not. It could be considered natural for 1 year old child. But when one has ever tried to move mouse in front of computer and see what it does on the screen it becomes as natural as any other actions. It's like you have to try to ride a bike (and may not consider it natural at first time), but after a little practice you start thinking that it's actually natural for you (you don't need to think how to do it when you do it)...
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Sat, 29 Sep 2012 00:00:24 EDT

urbanriot posted :

said by Glen T:

Ergonomically, it doesn't work in a normal office setting.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 23:45:11 EDT

dave posted : I don't see why everyone assumes it's "keyboard and mouse" versus "touch screen".

The mouse is just a hack because we don't have touch screens. Before mice, we used light pens, which was just a hack to simulate touch screens. (Light pens failed, in my opinion, because they were fatiguing to use - they were pretty heavy).

I'd remind you all that the point of pointer devices is to point at something on the screen. Pointing your finger is more natural than moving a device that moves a pointer to the thing you want pointed at.

The winning combination to me looks like keyboard and touch screen.

Agreed that the 'smear' problem is a problem, though. Ditto the precision problem, though perhaps a stylus might be the answer.

But most of you luddites seem to have fixated on the only pointer device you know as the ultimate in pointer devices. It ain't. It's just a very very successful hack.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 15:55:11 EDT

MM Blues posted : I happen to like the W8 Preview Version so far. It's not only a "tablet version" OS. You can easily access your desktop on your computer from the "home" screen.

It runs faster and crisper on my Dell laptop than any other version of windows so far (Intel 5 first generation, 8 GB memory, ATI 5400 series dedicated graphics)

As far as Windows Media Center goes, check here: »news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57445···preview/

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 14:28:35 EDT

Glen T posted : In practice, we hang on to old computers until the threat of hardware failure induces us to upgrade to new hardware. And then we get the flavour of Windows of the day that comes with it. We are usually not motivated by the need for higher performance and never motivated by the need for new features (with the exception of WPA2 support on a couple of old netbooks).

The only OS's that we have actively avoided (so far) were Vista and ME. We actually bought 7 used PCs with XP Pro licenses during the Vista period, largely because we didn't want to replace all of our peripherals (printers, scanners, etc.) at the same time. Half of our machines are still running XP. The other half are Win7.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 13:54:10 EDT

Octavean posted : XP came out in 2001 or something like that. Windows 7 came out in 2009. Is it not a possibility that those people that held-out on XP are just apt to hold onto an OS they feel comfortable with for as long as they think it possible? In this case up to ~8 years or so maybe more.

Some people will use a pair of underwear until it disintegrates off their body whereas others will toss away a pair of underwear at the first sign of overuse (or buy a new pair just for the heck of it).

So for some it may not be a question of features of a new OS but one of habit.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 13:41:06 EDT

JohnInSJ posted :

said by BillRoland:

I guess all I can say is "we'll see." I wouldn't bet my house on Windows 8 being a raving success.

Microsoft is, along with many other big bets, all related.
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Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 13:24:14 EDT

Glen T posted : I don't even like the touch pad on my laptops. It's so inprecise and I find it tiring. Not that I use my laptop keyboard either. I have external mice and keyboards at home and at work.

I use a mouse for everything. It is very precise and economical in terms of movement. I have the mouse scroll wheel set to scroll one visible page length per wheel increment. I can quickly scroll thought any document with small, precise movements and not miss anything, all with both of my palms resting comfortably and my elbows at the ergonomically recommended 90 degree angle.

I can't even image trying to select and highlight a few words of text to cut and paste to another location using a touch interface and touch keyboard. It would drive me nuts.

When I'm travelling, I can barely stand composing a 20 word e-mail on my Playbook. Sure, its fine for writing "i'll get back 2 u" But it would be hell trying to edit a 30 page proposal with graphics and screen captures.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 13:22:36 EDT

BillRoland posted :

said by JohnInSJ:

said by BillRoland:

said by JohnInSJ:

Of course one real benefit of W8 over W7 would be if you were running the OS on a touch enabled desktop/laptop. Which will be all of the new ones.

I really fail to see why anybody would resort to smearing greasy fingers all over the screen of their laptop/desktop when they have a superior input method available in front of them, aka a keyboard and mouse/trackpad. I've tried to be open minded about it, I really have, but...

Yep. If you use touch devices for everything else (tablets, phones, ereaders) and then sit in front of your compute device, your natural inclination to continue doing the same actions to achieve the same results is there. Especially for non-technical people (you know, the ones who spend the most money on stuff.) The "smearing" thing - you wipe the glass now and then :)

I guess all I can say is "we'll see." I wouldn't bet my house on Windows 8 being a raving success.
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Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:15:55 EDT

Ericthorn posted : The only reason I'll be running an 8 machine at home is simply for support purposes. Same reason I still run a stand alone XP rig. After playing with it a bit in a vm, there is just nothing there to make me change. I was on XP for years before I changed to 7, and that was only because a game I wanted to play needed Direct X 10, so I had to cave. It's pissed me off to no end that I now have to dual boot 7 and XP because one of my favorite games simply will not run reliably on 7. The company i work at is not going to move to 8, but we are going to have one rig running 8 for the customers that call and we need to help them navigate their own PC. I have firmly railed against this, as we do not support Windows. We support a custom POS system, and it's the customers job to know how to navigate their PC outside of our POS. But invariably we end up having to help customers in their Windows environment.

I feel like Walter saying 'pisses me off'

I guess it keeps the bills getting paid.
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Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 08:59:38 EDT

JohnInSJ posted :

said by Jan Janowski:

The whole point of my post is not for a new computer.... but is it worth the $$ to upgrade existing computer?

And the answer has been given. If you need or want any of the new features, yes. If not, no. For you, it's a no (at release, anyway.)
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Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Fri, 28 Sep 2012 08:58:15 EDT

JohnInSJ posted :

said by BillRoland:

said by JohnInSJ:

Of course one real benefit of W8 over W7 would be if you were running the OS on a touch enabled desktop/laptop. Which will be all of the new ones.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Thu, 27 Sep 2012 19:28:28 EDT

OZO posted :

said by BillRoland:

said by JohnInSJ:

Of course one real benefit of W8 over W7 would be if you were running the OS on a touch enabled desktop/laptop. Which will be all of the new ones.

Absolutely...

I don't know how the people will be able to work with it all day long. Just try to imagine you have to keep your hands not on the top of your desk, but constantly pointing with their fingers to something on the screen.... It's weird how the designers of new (and "preferred" now user interface) don't see any problems here. Don't they know some (if not many) people are buying keyboard and mouse pads to rest their palms on during all day of their work with computers? Why do they're doing that? It's because they are getting tired. And now they have to lift their hands to rich the screen directly... IMO It's dumb (from ergonomic perspective) to force people to do it whole day long.

There is a place for UI for smartphone and there is a place (and the need) for UI for old desktop environment (proven by many years to work just well in business environments). Forcing the new UI will shoot MS in the foot and push businesses to invest in another OS's. Is that the goal behind this change?
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Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Thu, 27 Sep 2012 18:10:51 EDT

Glen T posted :

said by BillRoland:

Ergonomically, it doesn't work in a normal office setting. I chuckle when I watch Daily Planet on Discovery channel, the tech segment, with their big wall display and grand, exagerated gestures, to open a window (probably powered by something like Kinect). It would give you a full body workout, but I can't see doing it all day long.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Thu, 27 Sep 2012 16:51:56 EDT

BillRoland posted :

said by JohnInSJ:

Of course one real benefit of W8 over W7 would be if you were running the OS on a touch enabled desktop/laptop. Which will be all of the new ones.

Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Thu, 27 Sep 2012 16:51:38 EDT

Jan Janowski posted : (Touch Enabled) No, I upgraded to a Jog/Shuttle knob in W98/XT, and that allows me to build macros per button... Touch... No... That doesn't give me any improvements over Keyboard shortcuts, JogShuttle Knob, and/or Mouse control...

The whole point of my post is not for a new computer.... but is it worth the $$ to upgrade existing computer? The XT to W7-64 had very obvious feature Improvements that I'm not seeing in W8... XT to W7-64 was a "No-Brainer".... and I jumped...

These 'No-Brainer' features that I'm searching for in W8.... (That jumped right out to be Obvious in W7) seem to be lacking... That was the whole point of my post...

Still Searching.....

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Re: [WIN8] Windows 8 --- What benifits over W7-64?

Thu, 27 Sep 2012 16:40:12 EDT

JohnInSJ posted : Of course one real benefit of W8 over W7 would be if you were running the OS on a touch enabled desktop/laptop. Which will be all of the new ones.
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My place : »www.schettino.us