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peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
reply to DKS

Re: Dalton's anti-smoking minions have had enough.

said by DKS:

said by peterboro:

said by DKS:

Given the cost of smoking to the health care system through complications, this is an effective preventative measure. Ever seen someone die of COPD?

It's cost effective to blow millions of health care dollars chasing people smoking in their workplace when there are other initiatives being starved for funding at the MOH and health units?

The cost isn't in the "millions". It is just part of existing workplace health enforcement.

Under the Smoke-Free Ontario Act Tobacco Compliance Protocol, millions are distributed to health units across the province. That does not even count the salaries and expenses incurred by municipal taxpayers for health units. Locally several health unit personnel were laid off and other programs suffered yet the anti-smoking brigade marches on. I suppose early childhood and prenatal health is not a concern nor is dental help for low income. Both of which over a lifetime across a broader public spectrum with cost more health care expenses.

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
reply to DKS

said by DKS:

Nope. It's about improving health, reducing costs to the community and society at large and making for a better community. Being a control freak has nothing to do with it.

Nope. Those are the catch word feel good phrases trumpeted through out history to justify meddling in people's lives.


urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable

said by peterboro:

Nope. Those are the catch word feel good phrases trumpeted through out history to justify meddling in people's lives.

Some people actually buy into those bullshit excuses... or they parrot them themselves because it's ideologically inline with what they want.

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
reply to DKS

said by DKS:

said by LazMan:

Where exactly IS is OK to smoke now?

Can't smoke in public places.

You certainly can. Parks, sidewalks and so on.

Wrong. You can't smoke in public parks here and that includes parking, pathways and sidewalks. Eventually it will encompass all vehicles and homes. Smokers will eventually be relegated to barb wire compounds in the far north or placed in internment camps.

Robrr

join:2008-04-19
Guelph, ON
reply to LazMan

said by LazMan:

said by Robrr:

said by LazMan:

ALSO can't smoke in a vehicle if it's your workplace (truckers, heavy equipment operators, etc)...

I'll be completely honest in saying that the first time an Owner/Operator gets fined under this law, you'll likely see the driver, the OTA and the CTA taking the province to court.

I can understand the law in the case where the driver shares the vehicle with other employees but an Owner/Operator owns the vehicle and it is as much their personal vehicle as it is their work vehicle.

»www.driving.ca/Truckers+furious+···ory.html

You're about 2 years too late... Been there, done that... Bought a $305 t-shirt...

Nope... the charges were "mysteriously dropped"

»www.thestar.com/news/gta/article···-and-won


J E F F
Whatta Ya Think About Dat?
Premium
join:2004-04-01
Kitchener, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Rogers Portable ..
reply to peterboro

They've had 6 years to get used to it. Smoking is bad for you.

Although it doesn't help that it's still a legal product. Kinda like selling alcohol but telling people not to drink it.
--
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. - Albert Einstein



Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:4

3 edits

Yes, on that point you wont catch me defending govt policy. What I dont get is govts suing tobacco companies BUT do not legislate a ban. You cant have it both ways here IMHO.

As for the tards dissing DKS, hmmm who has lived to see all the faces of cig smoking adverts to death in the long haul, or has experience in heath care on a regular basis. Perhaps that induces bias or I prefer to see it as a sense of reality.

What do I mean by that........the analogy.....

My biggest complaint with arrogan govts-politicians or hospitals that have slipped below being competent/accountable ----> In general is that they have two advanges over us
a. we live life in isolation, we only see our bad incident in a hospital, or with the health care system, and thus do not see all the problems others experience otherwise we might be more motivated to act.

b. we tend to forget what happened in the past (politicians love this one and have it down to the avg number of days one can eff up and have it forgotten for the next vote.

In DKS position, he has the advantage well the sad truth of dealing with some serious shit problems of the many and on a regular basis, so he cant forget and he understands we are connected and not isolated. The hard part, is he deals with real people, the easy part is dealing with virtual tards on Canchat.

By the way Im purely guessing as I have no clue as to his life but have a sense of it by what he posts. Dont we do that about all here



LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to Robrr

said by Robrr:

Nope... the charges were "mysteriously dropped"

»www.thestar.com/news/gta/article···-and-won

I believe it's a different case, since the charges were withdrawn Jan '09 in your link, but were laid in June '10 in mine...


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to peterboro

said by peterboro:

Wrong. You can't smoke in public parks here and that includes parking, pathways and sidewalks.

You can thank Niagara Falls for that, they were the first municipality in Ontario to ban smoking on any city property, including parks and any other city-owned land outdoors.


loosedobbs

join:2006-06-13
Toronto
reply to peterboro

said by peterboro:

said by Gone:

said by peterboro:

Ontarians Torontoids must as they keep supporting a nanny state approach by Dalton.

Fixed it for you.

Didn't want to post the obvious least I be slagged for TO bashing as some members are sensitive.

said by Gone:

said by peterboro:

Ontarians Torontoids must as they keep supporting a nanny state approach by Dalton.

Fixed it for you.

Gone is correct.

Its because of blind support in Toronto. I am living in ward which has population more than City of Peterborough. And it will always go to Liberals no matter how I vote.

said by peterboro:

said by DKS:

said by LazMan:

Where exactly IS is OK to smoke now?

Can't smoke in public places.

You certainly can. Parks, sidewalks and so on.

Wrong. You can't smoke in public parks here and that includes parking, pathways and sidewalks. Eventually it will encompass all vehicles and homes. Smokers will eventually be relegated to barb wire compounds in the far north or placed in internment camps.

I am a non-smoker and even I don't like this. Its too much regulation. DKS is wrong about the cost. If Dalton wanted to save money he better do it somewhere else. Just stop the fiasco like e-health, Gas plants...on and on...And screw those people who voted for Dalton, in recent by-election. So don't blame Toronto for everything.


Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:4
reply to Gone

said by Gone:

said by peterboro:

Wrong. You can't smoke in public parks here and that includes parking, pathways and sidewalks.

You can thank Niagara Falls for that, they were the first municipality in Ontario to ban smoking on any city property, including parks and any other city-owned land outdoors.

You rock Niagra Falls!! Muchas Gracias!!
--
Ain't nuthin but the blues! "Albert Collins".
Leave your troubles at the door! "Pepe Peregil" De Sevilla. Just Don't Wifi without WPA, "Yul Brenner"

LlamaWorks Equipment


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

said by Anav:

You rock Niagra Falls!! Muchas Gracias!!

... yet you live off the fruits of the revenue that the provinces and federal government rake in on tobacco sales. I love the smell of hypocrisy in the morning.


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
reply to peterboro

said by peterboro:

said by DKS:

said by LazMan:

Where exactly IS is OK to smoke now?

Can't smoke in public places.

You certainly can. Parks, sidewalks and so on.

Wrong. You can't smoke in public parks here and that includes parking, pathways and sidewalks. Eventually it will encompass all vehicles and homes. Smokers will eventually be relegated to barb wire compounds in the far north or placed in internment camps.

I can't help it if Peterpatch is regressive. As for relegating a disgusting, vile habit to internment camps, fine with me. But there are better ways.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
reply to Anav

said by Anav:

As for the tards dissing DKS, hmmm who has lived to see all the faces of cig smoking adverts to death in the long haul, or has experience in heath care on a regular basis. Perhaps that induces bias or I prefer to see it as a sense of reality.

Yep. Saw a guy on Tuesday in CCU with COPD. Not nice.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:4
reply to Gone

You see fruit? Where?? Show me a province where there is fruit. Our standard of living is on a downward slope my friend. Everything is going up except my pecker and income.



urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable
reply to Gone

said by Gone:

You can thank Niagara Falls for that, they were the first municipality in Ontario to ban smoking on any city property, including parks and any other city-owned land outdoors.

Remember when all those local businesses spent many thousands, some as high as $100,000, to renovate their businesses so they could conform to the 'smoking room' laws? Then a couple of years later they change the law again...? Our government is grand.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

said by urbanriot:

Remember when all those local businesses spent many thousands, some as high as $100,000, to renovate their businesses so they could conform to the 'smoking room' laws? Then a couple of years later they change the law again...? Our government is grand.

Yup. It put a lot of local businesses into a very difficult financial situation, especially since renovations like that are costed over a multi-year period.


Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:4
reply to urbanriot

Urban, the myth of the smoking area was actually thought up and pushed through legislation by lobby groups representing the tobacco industry. These are very smart people that wished to ensure there remained a viable smoking outlet at the work place. It did not originate from govts. Most of what goes on, unfortunately we have no clue about,especially when it comes to policy, legislation or heck tendering of construction contracts. Money (greed-profit) is the driver, not much else.
--
Ain't nuthin but the blues! "Albert Collins".
Leave your troubles at the door! "Pepe Peregil" De Sevilla. Just Don't Wifi without WPA, "Yul Brenner"

LlamaWorks Equipment



LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to DKS

said by DKS:

I can't help it if Peterpatch is regressive. As for relegating a disgusting, vile habit to internment camps, fine with me. But there are better ways.

Hamilton, Niaraga Falls, Peterborough, Ottawa/NCR...

There's a broad spectrum of places that don't allow, or limit smoking in public...

I'm (essentially) a non-smoker, I made my wife quit before we got married... I see the results of smoking first hand (one of the leading causes of residential fires is smoking; as well as medical response to those who are suffering the effects of CA or other illness).

I'm not for smoking.

But it's legal.

I'm against the curtailing of the rights of citizens to perform a legal act... Just beacause no-smoking laws don't directly impact me, doesn't mean I don't care about the direction they head...


First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.


When 'they' start limiting the rights of one group to do legal activities, we have to pay attention... Just because it's something that doesn't change my life today; doesn't mean it won't tomorrow.

For the record, if they made smoking illegal tomorrow, I'd have zero problem with that... (even with the gov't paying for addiction treatment/stop smoking programs to assist addicts in kicking their fag habbit...)

(edit - spelling)


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to Anav

said by Anav:

You see fruit? Where?? Show me a province where there is fruit. Our standard of living is on a downward slope my friend. Everything is going up except my pecker and income.

Well, aside from the fact that there is plenty of fruit growing in the Niagara Peninsula in the Province of Ontario...

... you drive on freeways? You receive health care when you go to the hospital? Your kids go to school? Who do you think funds those services, and how do you think they receive a portion of that funding?



Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to LazMan

said by LazMan:

Hamilton, Niaraga Falls, Peterborough, Ottawa/NCR...

You can add the entire Regional Municipality of Niagara to that list, because they're planning on taking the Niagara Falls law and turning into a regional bylaw.


vue666
Small block Chevys never die
Premium
join:2007-12-07
Halifax, NS
kudos:1
reply to Anav

said by Anav:

Urban, the myth of the smoking area was actually thought up and pushed through legislation by lobby groups representing the tobacco industry.

There's no shortage of conspiracies floating around in that noggin of yours. Listening to too much Alex Jones radio perhaps...

»www.prisonplanet.com/

»www.infowars.com/about-alex-jones/

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Jones···io_host)

He seems to share your point of view on a few things we've been discussing....


Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:4

Thanks! I did not see them talking about construction contracts in MOntreal. I love a good conspiracy, like that far-fetched one, "there is no WMD".


peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
reply to LazMan

said by LazMan:

For the record, if they made smoking illegal tomorrow, I'd have zero problem with that... (even with the gov't paying for addiction treatment/stop smoking programs to assist addicts in kicking their fag habbit...)

Same here. Ban it completely and lose your lower taxes and state supported programs or you just come across as a hypocrite.

I have never smoked and wish it didn't exist but the greater evil is the curtailing of people's freedom incrementally.

And don't fool yourself people there is a long term agenda to curtail more freedom that will eventually spill over to something you do or like guaranteed.

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON

4 edits
reply to DKS

said by DKS:

I can't help it if Peterpatch is regressive.

So banning smoking outside that is of no danger to others, well I guess to the uptight anal control freaks it is to their sense of power over others, is regressive is it?

Yet on the other hand you seem to support the Ontario Smoke Free Act and the health units implimintation of such. Which is it?

Edit: that's right five tries at spelling


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2

said by peterboro:

said by DKS:

I can't help it if Peterpatch is regressive.

So banning smoking outside that is of no danger to others, well I guess to the uptight anal control freaks it is to their sense of power over others, is regressive is it?

Yet on the other hand you seem to support the Ontario Smoke Free Act and the health units implimintation of such. Which is it?

Edit: that's right five tries at spelling

Both. Not all municipalities have banned outdoor smoking.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


corster
Premium
join:2002-02-23
Gatineau, QC
reply to MichelR

said by MichelR:

said by peterboro:

said by Rifleman:

Candians want this kind of control on their lives.

Ontarians must as they keep supporting a nanny state approach by Dalton. I don't know what goes on outside Ontario.

Steer clear of Quebec. One of the reasons I moved out of there. Ontario, even with Dalton, is very hands-off in comparison.

I don't know about that. Beer in corner stores! :P

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
reply to DKS

said by DKS:

said by peterboro:

said by DKS:

I can't help it if Peterpatch is regressive.

So banning smoking outside that is of no danger to others, well I guess to the uptight anal control freaks it is to their sense of power over others, is regressive is it?

Yet on the other hand you seem to support the Ontario Smoke Free Act and the health units implimintation of such. Which is it?

Edit: that's right five tries at spelling

Both. Not all municipalities have banned outdoor smoking.

So it's regressive yet you support it. Interesting position to take.


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2

said by peterboro:

So it's regressive yet you support it. Interesting position to take.

Nothing wrong with being consistently inconsistent.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
reply to urbanriot

Weed is cheaper then smokes