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batsona
Maryland

join:2004-04-17
Ellicott City, MD
Reviews:
·Vonage
·Verizon FiOS
reply to navyson

Re: FIOS internet - how much faster can FIOS get?

The limiting factor, is going to be the egress from the Verizon network. Sure, VZ could offer 500Mbit up/down, but what would it look like, when 100,000 people up and down the East coast for instance, try to stream their favorite TV shows & do other Internet stuff all at the same time.. All that traffic has to exit Verizon's network to get to the carrier that hosts that content. Unless there's a way to bond 50 OC192's together between carriers, and/or all carriers upgrade to multi-terrabit backbones, huge bandwidth only spells one thing: massive oversubscription. My original 768/90K DSL connection went to sleep at 5PM, so I went to cable-modem (in ~1999), and it too ended up going to sleep at 5PM. [For now], FiOS doesn't do this... yet(?)



houkouonchi

join:2002-07-22
Ontario, CA
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

said by batsona:

The limiting factor, is going to be the egress from the Verizon network. Sure, VZ could offer 500Mbit up/down, but what would it look like, when 100,000 people up and down the East coast for instance, try to stream their favorite TV shows & do other Internet stuff all at the same time.. All that traffic has to exit Verizon's network to get to the carrier that hosts that content. Unless there's a way to bond 50 OC192's together between carriers, and/or all carriers upgrade to multi-terrabit backbones, huge bandwidth only spells one thing: massive oversubscription. My original 768/90K DSL connection went to sleep at 5PM, so I went to cable-modem (in ~1999), and it too ended up going to sleep at 5PM. [For now], FiOS doesn't do this... yet(?)

10 gigabit ethernet is the new standard these days with 40 gige and 100gige options as well. You can provide for *a lot* of customers with a single 10 gige link. VZ also balances load between multiple routers.

You can also easily put up to 8 links in a bonded (802.3ad) port-channel/lacp which could easily do 80 gig with 10 gig links. VZ is alter.net which is a tier1 provider. They have *massive* pipelines to all the other tier 1 transit providers (as its required to have settlement free peering with other tier1's to be a tier1 transit provider).
--
300/150 mbit Bonded Verizon FiOS connection FTW!

zippoboy7

join:2006-06-18
USA

said by houkouonchi:

said by batsona:

The limiting factor, is going to be the egress from the Verizon network. Sure, VZ could offer 500Mbit up/down, but what would it look like, when 100,000 people up and down the East coast for instance, try to stream their favorite TV shows & do other Internet stuff all at the same time.. All that traffic has to exit Verizon's network to get to the carrier that hosts that content. Unless there's a way to bond 50 OC192's together between carriers, and/or all carriers upgrade to multi-terrabit backbones, huge bandwidth only spells one thing: massive oversubscription. My original 768/90K DSL connection went to sleep at 5PM, so I went to cable-modem (in ~1999), and it too ended up going to sleep at 5PM. [For now], FiOS doesn't do this... yet(?)

10 gigabit ethernet is the new standard these days with 40 gige and 100gige options as well. You can provide for *a lot* of customers with a single 10 gige link. VZ also balances load between multiple routers.

You can also easily put up to 8 links in a bonded (802.3ad) port-channel/lacp which could easily do 80 gig with 10 gig links. VZ is alter.net which is a tier1 provider. They have *massive* pipelines to all the other tier 1 transit providers (as its required to have settlement free peering with other tier1's to be a tier1 transit provider).

Just to add to this, Verizon has been in the news about its upgrades to 100Gbit between major US cites POPS »insanetek.com/news/1-web-and-ind···o-the-us as well as between the US and Europe »www.v3.co.uk/v3-uk/news/2030549/···k-europe While I do not know how far along they are on this project it will bring substantial increases in compacity when its done.

Also to the op, Comcast's 305Mbit tier is worthless to most people who want low latency or to actually use that 305Mbit speed since they oversubscribe there main connections to try to force people to peer with them at ridiculous rates. For this all you have to do is look at people bitching about 300-1000ms ping's during peak hours. »tech.slashdot.org/story/10/12/14···y-choice while this is from 2010 the same crap happens to this day even with Comcast denying the issue. I get people who bitch at my Job on a weekly basis who use Comcast at home and have major problems at night with lag while connecting to our VPN (We have ~40Gbit to Verizon and Cogent both major backbone providers and only Comcast users bitch about lag). To add to this when I asked for a quote for 1Gbit from Comcast (Who has fiber in the building) the price was more then I pay for a single 10Gbit circuit from Verizon and about 2x the cost of Cogent.


Fyi

@sbc.com

Comcast is using 100% fiber for the 300+ tier, so I doubt it will share the over subscription problems of its copper


zippoboy7

join:2006-06-18
USA

said by Fyi :

Comcast is using 100% fiber for the 300+ tier, so I doubt it will share the over subscription problems of its copper

The over subscription problems has nothing to do with the last mile copper, they are at the connections between Comcast and Tata Communications which is one of the major tier 1 providers. Comcast purposefully saturates there connections to Tata to try and force people like Google/Netflix/etc... to peer directly with them by having there users bitch about buffering in videos or slowness viewing images or playing games.


DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000

said by zippoboy7:

said by Fyi :

Comcast is using 100% fiber for the 300+ tier, so I doubt it will share the over subscription problems of its copper

The over subscription problems has nothing to do with the last mile copper, they are at the connections between Comcast and Tata Communications which is one of the major tier 1 providers. Comcast purposefully saturates there connections to Tata to try and force people like Google/Netflix/etc... to peer directly with them by having there users bitch about buffering in videos or slowness viewing images or playing games.

Proof?


Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:24
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..

1 edit

Search for data on what happened to Comcast's service when they dropped Level3. TATA was their dump truck provider to the non-peered providers. Folks saw some nice speed hits and some websites that I currently cannot remember supplied some data that shows the ports to Comcast from TATA were running maxed at night. I'm sure it's not happening now but that is what happened.

When Sprint had an issue with Cogent back several years ago, you just lost access to Cogent's network. They didn't use another provider to get onto their network, but Sprint is probably a different Tier provider.


batsona
Maryland

join:2004-04-17
Ellicott City, MD
Reviews:
·Vonage
·Verizon FiOS
reply to DataRiker

DataRiker says:
The over subscription problems has nothing to do with the last mile copper, they are at the connections between Comcast and Tata Communications which is one of the major tier 1 providers. Comcast purposefully saturates there connections to Tata to try and force people like Google/Netflix/etc... to peer directly with them by having there users bitch about buffering in videos or slowness viewing images or playing games.
------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly! If John Q. Public runs a webserver that's on 100mbit Ethernet in a co-location facility, access to this webserver won't get any faster, if his 1,000 customers all sign up for 5,000,000/3,000,000 FIOS in the year 2030. Another analogy would that if you give everyone on the highway Mustang Cobras, and tell them to go 120Mph on the highway, this means everyone can get hamburgers at Sonic twice as fast, right? Unfortunately no....



danclan

join:2005-11-01
Midlothian, VA

They don't need to force them to directly to peer. Many will do so because it makes economic and customer sense.

Conversely, Comcast and others don't necessarily care that these competitors have slow connections. It serves their interests for them to be purposely slow so that their last mile customers will want make use of Comcast's VOD services vs. buying content elsewhere.

They also can delay router upgrades for the same reasons.