 tp0dyabbazooiePremium
join:2001-02-13
Carnegie, PA
kudos:4 | sparkys- is it legal? Sparkys- got a question...
Doin a job in a commercial kitchen, and I need a new 15a ckt for a new tankless waterheater I'm installing. There is an existing 8/3 unused ckt, I think 40a breaker, close to where I am. Running a new ckt would be a royal PITA.
Can I install a fused disconnect to supply a single plug for my appliance? Is it this illegal
Tnx
-j
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if it aint broke, tweak it!!
currently on FiOS (kick aZZ!) |
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 John GaltForward, MarchPremium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:5 | Short answer is 'yes'.
You'd have to use a 60A disconnect with fusing to 15A, or, if you use a 30A disconnect, replace the upstream CB to no more than 30A. |
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tp0dyabbazooiePremium
join:2001-02-13
Carnegie, PA
kudos:4 | Ok so if I get a 60a rated disconnect with 15a fuses, its legal? Or mebe for temporary till the owners can get an electrician in there
Tnx
-j
--
if it aint broke, tweak it!!
currently on FiOS (kick aZZ!) |
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 alkizmo
join:2007-06-25
Pierrefonds, QC
kudos:1 | reply to John Galt
said by John Galt:You'd have to use a 60A disconnect with fusing to 15A, or, if you use a 30A disconnect, replace the upstream CB to no more than 30A.
Curiosity: Why a 60A disconnect? The upstream CB protects the wire that goes to the disconnect, that wire is of proper gauge (If at 40A or lower). Anything connected downstream of the disconnect is protected by the 15A fuses. |
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John GaltForward, MarchPremium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:5 | You forgot protection for the disconnect...
Disconnects are rated for 30A or 60A...so those are the choices. You cannot put a 30A disconnect on a circuit protected at more than 30 amps. |
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 leiboldPremium,MVM
join:2002-07-09
Sunnyvale, CA
kudos:6
 ·SONIC.NET
| reply to alkizmo
said by alkizmo:Curiosity: Why a 60A disconnect?
While a fused 40A disconnect may exist as a specialty part, the next larger common rating is 60A (which will be easier to get).
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Got some spare cpu cycles ? Join Team Helix or Team Starfire! |
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 MsradellP.E.Premium
join:2008-12-25
Louisville, KY
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| reply to tp0d
said by tp0d:Ok so if I get a 60a rated disconnect with 15a fuses, its legal? Or mebe for temporary till the owners can get an electrician in there
Tnx
-j It's actually legal to leave it that way permanently if the owner wants as long as he doesn't need this circuit for something else. |
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TheMGPremium
join:2007-09-04
Canada
kudos:1 | reply to tp0d
Only 15A for a tankless heater? That must be one heck of a low capacity heater. Since it's a commercial building I'm going to assume 208V, that's only 3.1kW, good for no more than about 1-1.5GPM of hot water. |
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Zach 58Premium
join:2006-11-26
NW Minnesota | For some reason I'm thinking it's a gas-fired heater. Upon my first read, I thought the same thing you did though. 
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Zach |
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tp0dyabbazooiePremium
join:2001-02-13
Carnegie, PA
kudos:4 | I'm installing a Rinnai RU98 gas tankless. It is a 199kbtu gas heater, 96% efficient. Uses about 4a max at full fire.
I picked up a 60a fusible disconnect at lowes, but they didn't have any 20a H type fuses, lowest was 35a. Got another coupla places to check for fuses, might need some adapters to use smaller fuses, if avail.
Doin the install at a local church. I'll take some pics and upload em
-j
--
if it aint broke, tweak it!!
currently on FiOS (kick aZZ!) |
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TheMGPremium
join:2007-09-04
Canada
kudos:1 | Gas heater, of course, why didn't I think of that...
Makes a lot more sense now. |
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 nunyaWho is John Galt?Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:8
 ·Charter
 ·surpasshosting
 ·voip.ms
| reply to tp0d
It would be much easier to change the breaker to a 15A, and re-purpose the existing circuit.
There are also code requirements on where you can put branch circuit OCP devices.
Are there no GP receptacles nearby that could be tapped instead?
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If someone refers to herself / himself as a "guru", they probably aren't. |
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 whizkid3Premium,MVM
join:2002-02-21
Queens, NY
kudos:9 | reply to tp0d
While its certainly not the proper way to go, it could be code-compliant if done the right way. You would need to:
1. Follow the tap rule - its a tap.
2. Use listed equipment that is purpose built to support a single 15A fuse in a 60A fused disconnect. Or better yet, use a very small, 60A circuit breaker panel. Or use a 30A fuse panel with 15A fuse, and reduce the upstream OCPD to 30A.
3. If the 15A circuit & receptacle within the commercial kitchen, it must be GFCI protected.
Would I do it this way? No. It calls for running a new circuit, IMHO. |
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ke4pymPremium
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC Reviews:
·VOIPo
 ·Verizon Broadban..
·RoadRunner Cable
·Northland Cable ..
| reply to tp0d
said by tp0d:I'm installing a Rinnai RU98 gas tankless. It is a 199kbtu gas heater, 96% efficient. Uses about 4a max at full fire.
You're gonna love it!
»Got a Rinnai installed today! |
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 Jack_in_VAPremium
join:2007-11-26
Mathews, VA
kudos:1 | said by ke4pym:said by tp0d:I'm installing a Rinnai RU98 gas tankless. It is a 199kbtu gas heater, 96% efficient. Uses about 4a max at full fire.
You're gonna love it! » Got a Rinnai installed today! What is your cost and expected ROI? |
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tp0dyabbazooiePremium
join:2001-02-13
Carnegie, PA
kudos:4 | reply to ke4pym
said by ke4pym:said by tp0d:I'm installing a Rinnai RU98 gas tankless. It is a 199kbtu gas heater, 96% efficient. Uses about 4a max at full fire.
You're gonna love it! » Got a Rinnai installed today! Lol, i`m gonna love the $ when the customer pays! hahh
actually I have a Bosch tankless in my house now, got it free as a test unit. Cant complain about that.
Glad to hear you like your Rinnai though. If I had to replace my heater tomorrow, it would be a new Rinnai. I`ll be elaborating on the new model in the next post
-j
--
if it aint broke, tweak it!!
currently on FiOS (kick aZZ!) |
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tp0dyabbazooiePremium
join:2001-02-13
Carnegie, PA
kudos:4
3 edits |  |  |  | 
slice is 4 inches by 1/8 deep. has iodine on it. not enuf for stiches | 
taped it up... lol |
Got the heater installed, as seen in pics.. Also cut the shit out of my arm with a piece of 3/4" tracpipe, was a dumbass move. Did it about 1/4 into the job, duct taped that bitch up and kept movin..
Heater is a new one for me. Its the newest high efficiency Rinnai, the RU98i. They turned the guts of the heater upside down, the burners are on top, and the secondary heat exchanger is on the bottom, with a U shaped exhaust conductor. Damn this thing is quiet. I have a customer with a RC98hpi that had complaints about fan noise (shes a pickass, but a rich pickass), and I might have to recommend swapping this heater out, as it is wayyy quieter. Dunno if she`ll go for the price tag, but ya never know.
As for the electrics, the maintenance guy felt better if I just ran a 25ft extension cord as a temporary, and he is going to have a sparky come in and wire up a new dedicated ckt for the heater, not a bad idea. I didnt feel like kludging it anyways, and now I can return approx 35$ of product. (the disconnect and 22$ worth of fuses and adapters)
Oh, and I used 1/2" copper piping, as I only had 1/2" to tap into, the church just wanted to get hot water to the kitchen again, as the boiler had failed, and they didnt want to replace the whole thing (10-15k$ job)
-j
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if it aint broke, tweak it!!
currently on FiOS (kick aZZ!) |
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 PostalFirst pull up, then pull down.Premium
join:2000-08-30
Simi Valley, CA | Uh, I think that could use a few stitches.... |
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 dosdoxiesPremium
join:2004-12-15
Wallingford, PA | said by Postal:Uh, I think that could use a few stitches....
"'Tis but a scratch!" (The black knight from Monty Python and the Holy Grail.)
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The more people I meet, the better I like my dogs. |
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tp0dyabbazooiePremium
join:2001-02-13
Carnegie, PA
kudos:4 | "just a flesh wound!"
hehh
-j |
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