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telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

2 edits
reply to andyross

Re: Say goodbye to ClearQAM

OK, looks like this is the end of Clear QAM now:

FCC Votes to Lift Ban On Basic Tier Encryption
Contains three-year sunset on NCTA commitment, but with Media Bureau able to extend it.

By John Eggerton, Broadcasting & Cable - October 12, 2012
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···tion.php

EDIT: The order and statements from the Commissioners can be found here: »www.fcc.gov/document/commission-···hibition



telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

2 edits

An article on the SlashGear site today with some details on how things will work now:

FCC cuts Boxee a little encryption slack (but not forever)
By Chris Davies, SlashGear - October 15, 2012
»www.slashgear.com/fcc-cuts-boxee···5251887/

EDIT: Also an article on the Light Reading Cable site:

Cable Cleared to Encrypt Basic TV Tiers
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - October 15, 2012
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···d=225922

EDIT 2: An article on the CED Magazine site:

FCC relents, lifts basic tier encryption ban
By Brian Santo, CED Magazine - October 16, 2012
»www.cedmagazine.com/news/2012/10···tion-ban



motorola870

join:2008-12-07
Arlington, TX
kudos:3

said by telcodad:

An article on the SlashGear site today with some details on how things will work now:

FCC cuts Boxee a little encryption slack (but not forever)
By Chris Davies, SlashGear - October 15, 2012
»www.slashgear.com/fcc-cuts-boxee···5251887/

EDIT: Also an article on the Light Reading Cable site:

Cable Cleared to Encrypt Basic TV Tiers
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - October 15, 2012
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···d=225922

anyone want to bet a lawsuit gets started soon? I can see it already as those terms do not work for everyone and a lot of people are p*ssed not just a few like the FCC says.


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7
reply to telcodad

BTW - Boxee's blog entry about all this:

Boxee Welcomes FCC Rulemaking That Opens Door for Innovation
By Avner Ronen, CEO & co-founder - October 14, 2012
»blog.boxee.tv/2012/10/14/boxee-w···ovation/



spdickey2

@rr.com

Boxee might cheer since they want us to buy Boxee Boxes. I for one don't want any box on my kitchen cabinet tv, or the one on the wall in my bedroom (with nowhere to hang a box!).


Tekneek

join:2012-02-19
Bethlehem, GA

Welcome back to the 1980s with this set top box thing. We have the technology to not require set top boxes for this stuff, so choosing to walk back in time makes absolutely no sense to anyone except those that are hoping to lease/rent/sell set top boxes.



DrDrew
That others may surf
Premium
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
kudos:15

2 edits

said by Tekneek:

Welcome back to the 1980s with this set top box thing. We have the technology to not require set top boxes for this stuff, so choosing to walk back in time makes absolutely no sense to anyone except those that are hoping to lease/rent/sell set top boxes.

Problem is most of the equipment makers gave up supporting the standard that allowed their gear to decrypt secured signals (CableCARD), so now it falls back on the cable boxes to do that which were required by the FCC to follow the same standard.
--
If it's important, back it up... twice. Even 99.999% availability isn't enough sometimes.


mikedz4

join:2003-04-14
Weirton, WV
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
·Verizon Online DSL
·Comcast
reply to spdickey2

Eventually if you want TV you will need a box. Unless your tvs are digital then you can hook an antenna up to them. But for cable yes you will need a box.
There is one option that my parents use. They have the cable split off after the box in the living room and run the cable through the wall to the kitchen so the kitchen tv gets cable also. Only problem is you watch the same program in both rooms.



telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

1 edit
reply to telcodad

The FCC has set December 10th as the effective date for the new rules:

New Cable Video Security Rules to Get Real
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - November 16, 2012
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···lr_cable

EDIT: Also see:

FCC Will Lift Basic Digital Encryption Ban Dec. 10
Move will cut truck rolls, help prevent theft of service

By John Eggerton, Broadcasting & Cable - November 16, 2012
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···c_10.php


GTFan

join:2004-12-03

But where's our HD DTAs, Comcast?? Supposed to be rolling out by end of this year but are nowhere to be seen.

Knowing them, this is a case of being careful what you wish for given that they started charging $2/mo. for old SD DTAs that they gave everyone for free. Existing ones, not new ones. They'll probably charge $5 or more for the HD ones.



PaulGo

join:2005-01-29
Gaithersburg, MD

My guess is that the encryption will be phased on over several months and giving notice in bills and direct mail to allow customers to pick up HD DTAs.


JoeHemi

join:2011-05-06
Bellevue, WA
reply to GTFan

We've got some different models in our headend right now that are being tested. They are pretty tiny, but the power supplies are bigger than the unit itself.



telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

said by GTFan:

But where's our HD DTAs, Comcast?? Supposed to be rolling out by end of this year but are nowhere to be seen.

said by JoeHemi:

We've got some different models in our headend right now that are being tested. They are pretty tiny, but the power supplies are bigger than the unit itself.

There was an interesting article on the San Francisco Chronicle's site yesterday about a particular issue with needing to use cable boxes now on all TVs - independently controlling multiple boxes/TVs that are in the same room:

Cable switch messes up 3-TV living room
By David Einstein, The San Francisco Chronicle - November 18, 2012
»www.sfgate.com/technology/comput···8855.php

This will slowly become a non-issue once the X1 boxes and HD-DTAs become more common in users' homes, as they employ RF remotes using the ZigBee RF4CE standard that "pair" like Bluetooth devices.

See: »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZigBee


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

Another "issue" with needing to use cable boxes on all TVs now - as ds7 See Profile says in a comment »set top? in the forum on the DSLR story »Comcast's X1 Set Top Heads to Philly

set top? We continue calling these things set top boxes, tho there is no way you could balance one of them on a modern TV!
Actually, there are some products out there to allow the placement of components "on top of" today's flat panel TVs:
»news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-200···anel-tv/
»www.amazon.com/ScreenDeck-Shelf-···04GKM4DQ


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7
reply to DrDrew

said by DrDrew:

Problem is most of the equipment makers gave up supporting the standard that allowed their gear to decrypt secured signals (CableCARD), so now it falls back on the cable boxes to do that which were required by the FCC to follow the same standard.

A recent article on the Broadcasting & Cable site:

CEA to FCC: Deny Charter Set-Top Waiver and Come Up With Standard
Says FCC should bite bullet and resolve issue through standard interface for directly attaching retail boxes to MVPDs

By John Eggerton, Broadcasting & Cable - November 30, 2012
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···dard.php

GTFan

join:2004-12-03

said by telcodad:

said by DrDrew:

Problem is most of the equipment makers gave up supporting the standard that allowed their gear to decrypt secured signals (CableCARD), so now it falls back on the cable boxes to do that which were required by the FCC to follow the same standard.

A recent article on the Broadcasting & Cable site:

CEA to FCC: Deny Charter Set-Top Waiver and Come Up With Standard
Says FCC should bite bullet and resolve issue through standard interface for directly attaching retail boxes to MVPDs

By John Eggerton, Broadcasting & Cable - November 30, 2012
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···dard.php

Way overdue after the FCC shirked their duty with AllVid. Instead they're just going to keep kicking the can down the road and hope cable comes up with something.

»apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/comment/view?id=6017143898


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

said by GTFan:

said by telcodad:

A recent article on the Broadcasting & Cable site:

CEA to FCC: Deny Charter Set-Top Waiver and Come Up With Standard
Says FCC should bite bullet and resolve issue through standard interface for directly attaching retail boxes to MVPDs

By John Eggerton, Broadcasting & Cable - November 30, 2012
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···dard.php

Way overdue after the FCC shirked their duty with AllVid. Instead they're just going to keep kicking the can down the road and hope cable comes up with something.

»apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/comment/view?id=6017143898

From today's Light Reading Cable cable news round-up article (»www.lightreading.com/document.as···lr_cable ):
It's deja vu all over again for Tom Rutledge, Charter Communications Inc.'s new CEO. The Consumer Electronics Association (CEA) is opposing the operator's request for a two-year waiver on set-tops with integrated security so the MSO can move ahead on a plan to go all-digital and introduce a downloadable security system that relies on a security chip. The CEA opposed a similar request by Cablevision Systems Corp. (Rutledge's former company) in 2009, but the MSO ended up getting the waiver, which has since expired.

The CEA hasn't altered its argument much. In its Federal Communications Commission (FCC) filing Friday, the CEA argues that the FCC needs to instead "identify a new, secure, open, and national standard interface between MVPD [multichannel video programming distributor] services and retail device." The CEA and its cohorts have been urging the FCC to move ahead on AllVid, a possible successor to the CableCARD that would be applied to all U.S. pay-TV providers. The CEA fears that the security chip in Charter's plan will support just one conditional access system, removing any notion of device portability with other service providers. Replies are due to the FCC by Dec. 10, but Charter has already stressed that it intends to continue to support retail devices that rely on the CableCARD. (Cable Lobby Gripes About Google, AllVid: »www.lightreading.com/document.as···lr_cable)


DrDrew
That others may surf
Premium
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
kudos:15
reply to GTFan

said by GTFan:

Way overdue after the FCC shirked their duty with AllVid. Instead they're just going to keep kicking the can down the road and hope cable comes up with something.

»apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/comment/view?id=6017143898

I think the FCC and Cable are done trying to create standards that the CEA won't back or say they will and then don't. They've been burned and spent way too much money which gets passed on to customers, for nothing it seems, being forced to develop solutions to support the CEA.

Cable has adapted to what the CEA already put to market (i.e. Smart TVs and some media consoles) and released secure IPTV clients for them. Satellite and other providers have adopted it too. They're pushing their contracts with channel broadcasters to allow it, developing and going to court over network DVR functionality, and developing and revamping their networks for data channels in place of video channels.

The closest thing to "AllVid" getting released will be in the form of a stand alone Android or iOS media center box which can run cable company or channel created client apps. AppleTV, Roku, and GoogleTV can do it now, but they can't get enough video channel support yet to make a compelling line up at a low enough price. I'm sure compulsory channel packages have something to do with it.
--
If it's important, back it up... twice. Even 99.999% availability isn't enough sometimes.

GTFan

join:2004-12-03

If you read the FCC waiver I linked, you'll see that they want a standard. They're just waiting for cable to come up with one (likely based on DLNA), which essentially means nothing is going to happen.



telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

Charter's response (»apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?···22078929) to the CEA's objections to their set-top security integration ban waiver request, from today's Light Reading Cable news round-up article:

Charter Strikes Back at the CEA
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - December 14, 2012
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···lr_cable

Charter Communications Inc. rejected assertions from the Consumer Electronics Association (CEA) and others that a chip the cable operator wants to use for a new downloadable security system in digital set-top boxes is proprietary and will support only Charter's service and conditional access system. Charter is seeking a two-year waiver from the July 2007 set-top security integration ban so it can deploy dual security boxes containing silicon that would support the future downloadable security system alongside the traditional integrated conditional access system. Once Charter activates the downloadable system, it intends to use a "simulcrypt" system that will also allow it to support televisions and TiVo Inc. boxes purchased at retail that use CableCARD security.

In its reply comments at the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) , Charter said the downloadable chip would rely on the same "commodity chips" that Cablevision Systems Corp. now uses for its downloadable system, and that the silicon can support security systems other than the one Charter wants to deploy. Cablevision's system, like the one being proposed by Charter, relies on the NDS (now Cisco Systems Inc.) key ladder as the "hardware root of trust," which will be offered on an open, royalty-free basis for use by other retail "host" (i.e. set-tops, televisions, and other connected devices), the MSO added. Charter intends to use its downloadable system as a key component of its all-digital video migration. The CEA wants the FCC to reject the request for temporary waiver and instead pursue a CableCARD successor called AllVid that would be applied to all pay-TV providers.

GTFan

join:2004-12-03

If it's a chip used by Charter STBs for their own downloadable security it's not an open cable standard, period. They're just trying to confuse the issue.



telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

said by GTFan:

If it's a chip used by Charter STBs for their own downloadable security it's not an open cable standard, period. They're just trying to confuse the issue.

Well, it sounds like the chip Charter is talking about is not currently in use by them:
... that a chip the cable operator wants to use for a new downloadable security system in digital set-top boxes ...
:
Charter said the downloadable chip would rely on the same "commodity chips" that Cablevision Systems Corp. now uses for its downloadable system, and that the silicon can support security systems other than the one Charter wants to deploy.

GTFan

join:2004-12-03

That is irrelevant to the point, which is that any new chip is by definition not a standard until CableLabs or the FCC says it is.



telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

said by GTFan:

That is irrelevant to the point, which is that any new chip is by definition not a standard until CableLabs or the FCC says it is.

Any idea then, what these "commodity chips" are that Cablevision currently uses for its downloadable system?


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

said by telcodad:

Any idea then, what these "commodity chips" are that Cablevision currently uses for its downloadable system?

I think I found some info on it, they may be using a new "open" downloadable conditional access system (DCAS) that uses the NDS "key ladder" (KLAD) and VideoGuard conditional access system:

Cablevision Scores Set-Top Waiver Extension
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - January 20, 2009
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···lr_cable

Cablevision May Take Security for a Spin(off)
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - December 13, 2010
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···lr_cable

Cablevision Makes its Security Deadline
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - January 20, 2011
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···lr_cable


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

1 edit

An article on the LRC site about Broadcom introducing their latest DTA chipset, the BCM7576, that will be used to deploy the proposed E-DTAs, which will allow cable companies to meet one of the conditions they agreed to for allowing encryption of their their digital basic-tier channels.

Once these E-DTAs become available, you'll likely see the basic-tier encryption begin rolling out quickly.

New DTA Will Extend Cable TV to Retail Devices
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - March 11, 2013
»www.lightreading.com/internet-vi···40150431

EDIT: The press release on it: »www.broadcom.com/press/release.p···=s746990



telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

said by telcodad:

An article on the LRC site about Broadcom introducing their latest DTA chipset, the BCM7576, that will be used to deploy the proposed E-DTAs, which will allow cable companies to meet one of the conditions they agreed to for allowing encryption of their their digital basic-tier channels.

Once these E-DTAs become available, you'll likely see the basic-tier encryption begin rolling out quickly.

New DTA Will Extend Cable TV to Retail Devices
By Jeff Baumgartner, Light Reading Cable - March 11, 2013
»www.lightreading.com/internet-vi···40150431

FYI - Just came across this new webpage on Comcast's Support site entitled "Encryption of Limited Basic Services" »customer.comcast.com/help-and-su···ryption/

At the end of that page, it says that (currently) the E-DTAs will only be available for Comcast customers with Boxee TV devices.


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

said by telcodad:

FYI - Just came across this new webpage on Comcast's Support site entitled "Encryption of Limited Basic Services" »customer.comcast.com/help-and-su···ryption/

At the end of that page, it says that (currently) the E-DTAs will only be available for Comcast customers with Boxee TV devices.

BTW - that "DLNA Specifications" link »media2.comcast.net/anon.comcasto···sued.pdf at the end of that page is now working and brings up the latest version of Comcast's "DLNA Client Implementation Guide" which "describes [the] technical requirements ... that a DLNA client should implement to interact and interoperate with an Ethernet enabled High Definition universal Digital Transport Adapter, or EHD-uDTA" ... providing " subscribers with the ability to stream content to a DLNA capable display or player device over an Ethernet interface"
:
The EHD-uDTA provides the standard services of an HD DTA with the added ability to stream content out of an Ethernet port. The streaming of the currently tuned channel out of the Ethernet port is done according to DLNA and OCAP HNP specifications.
"


telcodad

join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ
kudos:7

1 edit

In today’s cable news roundup article on the LRC site »www.lightreading.com/internet-vi···40151081 was this item:

Shares in Entropic Communications Inc. dropped more than 8 percent Monday after the chipmaker slashed first-quarter guidance because a pay-TV provider changed its deployment plans for a new class of HD-capable digital transport adapters (DTAs), leaving Entropic with excess inventory. … Entropic, which counts Broadcom Corp. as a key competitor, didn't identify the MSO in question, but Comcast Corp. is among those that are in early-stage HD-DTA deployments.
I wonder if this is Comcast deciding to deploy only Ethernet-enabled HD-DTAs (E-DTAs) now using that new BCM7576 chipset from Broadcom?

EDIT: From an Chicago Tribune article about this »articles.chicagotribune.com/2013···t-hd-dta it looks like it could be just Comcast delaying the nationwide rollout of HD-DTAs:
Benchmark Co said it believes the service provider delaying set-top box orders is Comcast Corp.

"Because of the delayed rollout of these boxes to basic cable subscribers, it will take a few quarters for HD-DTA set-top box suppliers to burn through Entropic inventory," the brokerage said.


Cozmo85

@comcast.net

Got my tv antenna perfected this past weekend. Gonna call comcast and have our basic turned off once i verify everything is good. I will never give up my hdhomerun.