 FFH5
Premium Member
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ |
to seamore
Re: Simple way to avoid copyright issuessaid by seamore:said by IowaCowboy:If it's copyrighted, pay for it and download it from a legitimate source such as iTunes or Netflix.
Illegal downloading is a high tech form of shoplifting as it is similar to shoplifting a CD or DVD at Best Buy or Target. Downloading illegally is basically theft in my book.
But what if it's not avail. on said sites? Listen to or watch something else?? |
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 seamore
Premium Member
join:2009-11-02 |
seamore
Premium Member
2012-Oct-15 10:52 am
said by FFH5:said by seamore:said by IowaCowboy:If it's copyrighted, pay for it and download it from a legitimate source such as iTunes or Netflix.
Illegal downloading is a high tech form of shoplifting as it is similar to shoplifting a CD or DVD at Best Buy or Target. Downloading illegally is basically theft in my book.
But what if it's not avail. on said sites? Listen to or watch something else?? yea, OK |
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 ArrayListDevOps
Premium Member
join:2005-03-19
Mullica Hill, NJ |
to FFH5
so helpful. |
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Kamus
join:2011-01-27
El Paso, TX |
to FFH5
said by FFH5:Listen to or watch something else??
Be careful what you wish for... This is exactly the kind of thing that should scare the shit out of the MPAA and RIAA. |
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 pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |
pnh102
Premium Member
2012-Oct-15 11:25 am
said by Kamus:said by FFH5:Listen to or watch something else??
Be careful what you wish for... This is exactly the kind of thing that should scare the shit out of the MPAA and RIAA. I agree with you. Most people who pirate stuff would not be buying the content legitimately to begin with. Even if this system "worked," it won't result in significant numbers of people buying content... so who will the content industry blame next for faltering sales? |
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88615298 (banned)
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness |
88615298 (banned)
Member
2012-Oct-15 1:17 pm
said by pnh102:Most people who pirate stuff would not be buying the content legitimately to begin with. That's not true and you're just stereotyping people. |
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 NormanSI gave her time to steal my mind away
MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
Asus RT-AC66U B1
Netgear FR114P
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said by 88615298:said by pnh102:Most people who pirate stuff would not be buying the content legitimately to begin with. That's not true and you're just stereotyping people. Can anybody cite studies on this, demonstrating that one, or the other is true? I personally know someone who would pirate music as a "try-before-buy" exercise. After listening, they deleted. Then either bought, if they liked it, or not. Probably not typical, but absent any study, how do we know what is typical? I pirated anime back in the day, because NA releases were few. Now damned near every anime show finds its way here, so piracy is more trouble than it's worth. OTOH, I have contributed to the decline in RIAA member's revenues; just not through piracy. I only have a limited amount of money to spend on music, and I switched from domestic production to offshore. The soundtrack recording from, ( Vampire Miyu, cost twice what the soundtrack recording of, Buffy the Vampire Slayer cost. But given the choice between two RIAA music albums and one Japanese album, I chose to stick it to the RIAA. |
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88615298 (banned)
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness |
88615298 (banned)
Member
2012-Oct-15 1:44 pm
said by NormanS:said by 88615298:said by pnh102:Most people who pirate stuff would not be buying the content legitimately to begin with. That's not true and you're just stereotyping people. Can anybody cite studies on this, demonstrating that one, or the other is true? If the content owners would change it's way of doing business I'm sure they can increase sales and reduce piracy. It was proven that Netflix was reducing piracy then the content owners decided it was good idea to try to kill Netflix and Redbox. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |
to NormanS
said by NormanS:Can anybody cite studies on this, demonstrating that one, or the other is true? I agree that my post is reasoned speculation, but I certainly do not buy for a second the content industry's claim that every instance of piracy is equal to a lost sale. |
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NormanSI gave her time to steal my mind away
MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA TP-Link TD-8616
Asus RT-AC66U B1
Netgear FR114P
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said by pnh102:said by NormanS:Can anybody cite studies on this, demonstrating that one, or the other is true? I agree that my post is reasoned speculation, but I certainly do not buy for a second the content industry's claim that every instance of piracy is equal to a lost sale. Nor is every lost sale due to piracy. |
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88615298 (banned)
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness |
to pnh102
said by pnh102:said by NormanS:Can anybody cite studies on this, demonstrating that one, or the other is true? I agree that my post is reasoned speculation, but I certainly do not buy for a second the content industry's claim that every instance of piracy is equal to a lost sale. I may never intend on paying $8 to see a movie at the local theater. So the theater isn't losing a sale by me sneaking in. That however doesn't give me the right to sneak in because I feel the price is too high and I don't want to pay it. |
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en103
Member
2012-Oct-15 3:14 pm
You 'can' pay for 'on-Demand' or wait until it comes on Blu-Ray/DVD at the local RedBox.
There are legal alternatives. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |
to 88615298
said by 88615298:I may never intend on paying $8 to see a movie at the local theater. So the theater isn't losing a sale by me sneaking in. That's not what the content industry is arguing. They are claiming that everyone who sneaks into the theater or otherwise watches the movie illegitimately would have paid the $11 ($8? Nice!) for a ticket to watch the movie, if there was simply enough incentive to do so. |
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slckusr
Premium Member
join:2003-03-17
Greenville, SC |
to pnh102
said by pnh102:said by Kamus:said by FFH5:Listen to or watch something else??
Be careful what you wish for... This is exactly the kind of thing that should scare the shit out of the MPAA and RIAA. I agree with you. Most people who pirate stuff would not be buying the content legitimately to begin with. Even if this system "worked," it won't result in significant numbers of people buying content... so who will the content industry blame next for faltering sales? I just recently downloaded an album to see if it was any good, few days later I paid for a lesser quality version of what I downloaded. /shrug |
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seamore
Premium Member
join:2009-11-02 |
seamore
Premium Member
2012-Oct-15 4:04 pm
said by slckusr:I just recently downloaded an album to see if it was any good, few days later I paid for a lesser quality version of what I downloaded. /shrug
Sadly, some would say "too bad." |
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88615298 (banned)
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness |
to pnh102
said by pnh102:said by 88615298:I may never intend on paying $8 to see a movie at the local theater. So the theater isn't losing a sale by me sneaking in. That's not what the content industry is arguing. They are claiming that everyone who sneaks into the theater or otherwise watches the movie illegitimately would have paid the $11 ($8? Nice!) for a ticket to watch the movie, if there was simply enough incentive to do so. You're missing my point. My reluctance to pay doesn't not give me a right to that content. |
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| 88615298 |
to seamore
said by seamore:said by slckusr:I just recently downloaded an album to see if it was any good, few days later I paid for a lesser quality version of what I downloaded. /shrug
Sadly, some would say "too bad." That's directed towards me and is in fact have nothing to do with what I said. Your comment is stupid. |
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to NormanS
said by NormanS:said by 88615298:said by pnh102:Most people who pirate stuff would not be buying the content legitimately to begin with. That's not true and you're just stereotyping people. Can anybody cite studies on this, demonstrating that one, or the other is true? Ever heard of iTunes? Or the insanely rising sales of online video sales? Or are we ignoring those quite easily seen options? Good products with Good values and Good selections MAKE MONEY HAND-IN-FIST. Of course, we usually get a half-assed try with most online sources and then those who cant find their stuff ANYWHERE (like me) end up pirating it. Want me to buy it? Put it up. I buy everything I can legally. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |
to 88615298
said by 88615298:You're missing my point. My reluctance to pay doesn't not give me a right to that content. I'm not claiming it does. Me personally, I agree that copyrights must be respected by all, but I don't think that my ISP subscriber fees should be financing that effect, especially when I have to prove that I am innocent of such infringement should I get one of these love notes. As a paying customer, I am the boss, and it is my ass that should be kissed by the vendor, not the other way around. If content owners wish to go after those who infringe on their work, there exist plenty of existing legal vehicles for them to go do that. |
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 Shadow01
Premium Member
join:2003-10-24
Wasteland
1 recommendation |
to pnh102
said by pnh102:said by Kamus:said by FFH5:Listen to or watch something else??
Be careful what you wish for... This is exactly the kind of thing that should scare the shit out of the MPAA and RIAA. I agree with you. Most people who pirate stuff would not be buying the content legitimately to begin with. Even if this system "worked," it won't result in significant numbers of people buying content... so who will the content industry blame next for faltering sales? I like the way you think... The chances of me ever buying a Ferrari are about zero. That should make it ok for me to steal one. At least they get the advertising from me driving it around. I didn't hurt their sales since I wasn't buying in the first place.  |
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Kamus
join:2011-01-27
El Paso, TX
1 recommendation |
Kamus
Member
2012-Oct-16 12:07 am
said by Shadow01:I like the way you think... The chances of me ever buying a Ferrari are about zero. That should make it ok for me to steal one. At least they get the advertising from me driving it around. I didn't hurt their sales since I wasn't buying in the first place.
That's cool, and when you get a Ferrari, can you please get your sister, mom, friends, Girlfriend and me one too so they can get to know the brand and maybe support them in an upcoming race? Oh wait, you can't make copies of cars, so your analogy is crap. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |
to Shadow01
said by Shadow01:I like the way you think... The chances of me ever buying a Ferrari are about zero. That should make it ok for me to steal one. At least they get the advertising from me driving it around. I didn't hurt their sales since I wasn't buying in the first place.
Did I say it was OK to steal something simply because you couldn't or wouldn't buy that thing? I am simply disagreeing with the idea that every incident of piracy is a "lost sale." |
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CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picture
Premium Member
join:2011-08-11
NYC |
to Kamus
said by Kamus:said by Shadow01:I like the way you think... The chances of me ever buying a Ferrari are about zero. That should make it ok for me to steal one. At least they get the advertising from me driving it around. I didn't hurt their sales since I wasn't buying in the first place.
That's cool, and when you get a Ferrari, can you please get your sister, mom, friends, Girlfriend and me one too so they can get to know the brand and maybe support them in an upcoming race? Oh wait, you can't make copies of cars, so your analogy is crap. The way he presented the analogy is wrong (and crap) but if you fix it, it makes more sense... If I get my friends permission to take apart his Ferrari and copy every piece in my workshop, then I put my parts together to make an exact replica of his car, have I somehow STOLEN something? Did my friend (or Ferrari) lose one of their cars? No. You could certainly argue that Ferrari lost the possibility of selling me one of theirs but is that theft? People make copies of products for their own personal use all the time and no one ever thinks it is stealing. It isn't until they start to sell them that they are going to run into morally questionable territory. The entire concept of 'You stole my intellectual property because you are using it for your own personal use without paying me' is utterly ridiculous. I fully suspect that RIAA/MPAA/Wiley will soon start demanding that libraries charge patrons for the use of the material and send them the money... after all, no one could argue that libraries don't also cost them lost sales. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
1 recommendation |
pnh102
Premium Member
2012-Oct-16 6:54 am
said by CXM_Splicer:If I get my friends permission to take apart his Ferrari and copy every piece in my workshop, then I put my parts together to make an exact replica of his car, have I somehow STOLEN something? Did my friend (or Ferrari) lose one of their cars? No. You could certainly argue that Ferrari lost the possibility of selling me one of theirs but is that theft? People make copies of products for their own personal use all the time and no one ever thinks it is stealing. It isn't until they start to sell them that they are going to run into morally questionable territory. Didn't you steal this idea from Johnny Cash? |
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to CXM_Splicer
said by CXM_Splicer:The way he presented the analogy is wrong (and crap) but if you fix it, it makes more sense...
If I get my friends permission to take apart his Ferrari and copy every piece in my workshop, then I put my parts together to make an exact replica of his car, have I somehow STOLEN something? Did my friend (or Ferrari) lose one of their cars? No. You could certainly argue that Ferrari lost the possibility of selling me one of theirs but is that theft? People make copies of products for their own personal use all the time and no one ever thinks it is stealing. It isn't until they start to sell them that they are going to run into morally questionable territory.
The entire concept of 'You stole my intellectual property because you are using it for your own personal use without paying me' is utterly ridiculous. I fully suspect that RIAA/MPAA/Wiley will soon start demanding that libraries charge patrons for the use of the material and send them the money... after all, no one could argue that libraries don't also cost them lost sales.
So...your example is analagous to borrowing your friends music recording, listening to it and performing each part yourself (or hiring professional musicians to do it), recording it, mastering it and producing it, then making a copy of your recording for your personal use and nothing else. Don't really see any problem with that as you're returning the original without keeping a duplicate for your personal use. As that would be copyright infringement which is illegal assuming it's a copyrighted recording. |
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to 88615298
said by 88615298:said by pnh102:said by NormanS:Can anybody cite studies on this, demonstrating that one, or the other is true? I agree that my post is reasoned speculation, but I certainly do not buy for a second the content industry's claim that every instance of piracy is equal to a lost sale. I may never intend on paying $8 to see a movie at the local theater. So the theater isn't losing a sale by me sneaking in. That however doesn't give me the right to sneak in because I feel the price is too high and I don't want to pay it. $8???? My local threader is $14 for an adult 3D movie and $11 for 2D. |
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CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picture
Premium Member
join:2011-08-11
NYC |
to PaulHikeS2
said by PaulHikeS2:So...your example is analagous to borrowing your friends music recording, listening to it and performing each part yourself (or hiring professional musicians to do it), recording it, mastering it and producing it, then making a copy of your recording for your personal use and nothing else. Don't really see any problem with that as you're returning the original without keeping a duplicate for your personal use. As that would be copyright infringement which is illegal assuming it's a copyrighted recording.
...
Of course it's not "theft" or "stealing".
I have no problem with you modifying the analogy a little as long as my recorded performance is a bit-by-bit identical copy of the original... glad you agree with me that there is no problem  Incidentally, since I am using my own electricity to create the 'recorded bits' onto my hard drive, there is little difference between what you describe and copying. quote:
If you think distribution of copyrighted material is OK, well that's fine, but it's still illegal.
I don't think anyone here is arguing to the contrary. |
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| CXM_Splicer |
to pnh102
said by pnh102:Didn't you steal this idea from Johnny Cash?
No, I only borrowed it... I SWEAR! |
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to pnh102
Oh ya?... Taken from this exact site.... Totally destroys your argument. » thenextweb.com/media/201 ··· erparts/ |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |
pnh102
Premium Member
2012-Oct-16 8:15 pm
How? All this is is just a telephone poll. It isn't representative of all pirates at all. |
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