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Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1

[Professions] Gathering wish list.

Ok, after fishing until my eyes bleed, and then fishing some more, I had a few thoughts.

Why can't all gathering professions be like fishing?
Meaning you could be in the land of Panadas and decide to take up mining. So you go around whacking mining nodes. Based upon your skill level, you could get junk, or the ore you are looking for.

For cloth/skinning, just have a random roll as to what the body will have on it. Again, base it on skill level.

It would make it a heck of a lot easier, then having to go zone hoping for your mats.

I only sell items in the AH, I dislike paying 75% or more in mark up.
My mark up is around 50%.
For example Ghost Iron ore sells for 100 and up in the AH. I sell mine for 60. As common as ghost Iron is, I can't see why it's so high. Heck, I'd think copper is worth 100 gold, because it's a lot harder to find.

Then there is smelting. Why can't I take items and remelt them for ore?
The item would be destroyed and all you'd have is ingots.
The magical properties would be lost [the stuff you get when you disenchant].

Same with tailoring, skinning, engineering, alchemy. Why can't the stuff be taking apart and be reused.
At least it would save on trips to the NPC to sell off gray items.
--
Is a person a failure for doing nothing? Or is he a failure for trying, and not succeeding at what he is attempting to do? What did you fail at today?.



Nick D
Premium
join:2010-02-04
Orange, CA

People need a lot more ghost iron than they do copper. And copper isn't hard to find; people just aren't farming it. Adamantite, now THAT'S annoying to find (and I usually see it priced accordingly).

That said, GI ore IS indeed easy to find, but people have more money in general, and need it. A lot of raiders don't have a mining main (because gathering profs are not ideal for raiding), and since you can't fly at 85, its hard to just float around and hit up nodes.

Reusing materials would be cool, but it turns gathering into a quasi-useless profession. Right now, you have to go out of your way to get mats off nodes with the appropriate skill (and quests don't always line up with skinnable mobs so you can consider that to be useless kills).



stonhinge
Premium
join:2003-07-28
Topeka, KS

Plus there's the fact that trillium seems to be more rare than Pyrite was - and you don't know what color you're going to get. After a few days of dailies and mining as I go along, i've ended up with Over a stack of white trillium - and still can't make a trillium bar.

However, I do have an alchemist with the transmute:trillium, which has no cooldown, and takes 10 Ghost Iron bars (one stack of Ghost Iron Ore). 20 ghost Iron ore is trivial to farm up, 120 isn't so tough either. So in an hour or so of lackadaisical farming, I can make a Living Steel.

Of course, there's the fact that for most people, they only way you're going to get a gem is from JC prospecting, and the fact that 3 rare gems are needed to learn JC patterns. So ore price is up to feed the JCs that don't have miners feeding them.

Mining pick/skinning knife/gnomish army knife all add +10 to appropriate skills now, so it's actually less likely you're going to outlevel what you can skin if you've been keeping up.
--
When the ship lifts, all bills are paid. No regrets.


JoelC707
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL
kudos:5
reply to Snakeoil

Hmm.... I can see both sides to this. Let's compare mining to fishing. Fishing, you can fish in schools or in open water. Schools basically give a 100% catch chance on the fish in that school. Open water is a crapshoot and depends on skill level.

To make that work for mining, you would have to be able to mine every square inch of dirt and get whatever, but nodes would stay and be similar to schools. The same could possibly apply to herbs except you would "pick" at trees and other plants. Skinning is more difficult for this to work for, not sure if it would even be possible to make this work for skinning.

The downside to this is that anyone with fishing, even level 1 fishing can catch the stated fish in a school (at least as far as I know). If this were applied to mining and herb nods, it would basically make leveling that profession useless. The difference is fishing is a secondary profession and everyone can learn it. They would need to make some big changes to professions to apply this model to other gathering professions.

As for breaking apart items, in a sense they already have this, its called disenchanting. The downside is only the enchanter can do it once it's soulbound. Pulling apart grey cloth items, I could see giving you various thread based on the item level. As for leather/mail/plate that wouldn't be as obvious. Sometimes thread is used for leather but not often.

Ahh good old Ghost Iron ore. My paladin (my miner) is a little past 86 right now. I've done some questing with him sure just to open up some areas (phasing out of nodes) but most of that was from mining. I've had NO problems running around Honeydew glade, Strongarm airstrip and those areas evne on a ground mount. I've had literally zero competition. Sure flying would be nice but as long as I only do Ghost Iron ore, and no one else goes in those areas, I'm good to go.


JoelC707
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL
kudos:5
reply to Snakeoil

While we're on the subject of professions, is it possible to remove socketed gems yet? I saw someone in trade last night ask for a JC to pop out two socketed gems from their equipment. No one ridiculed them and I asked a couple of online friends and they saw it too and were like "huh I guess you can" but my Google-fu failed me last night. So what's the deal, is this person right and you can pop out gems now or was he trolling trade (and didn't get a response)?



Nick D
Premium
join:2010-02-04
Orange, CA

You can always replace socketed gems, but doing so destroys the gem. Not sure if you can actively remove them to leave the socket empty (and if you can, you definitely do not need a JC to do so). That wouldn't make any sense anyways.

I guarantee you can't remove them and get them back for resale.


JoelC707
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL
kudos:5

Oh yeah I've always known you could "resocket" a gem destroying the existing one in the process but that's definitely not what this person was asking for. From what I could gather, they wanted someone to remove the gem as is and presumably give it back to them.



Nick D
Premium
join:2010-02-04
Orange, CA

Yep, they missed the intent of the system.

Reselling your socketed gems would make JC even more worthless. Like glyphs!



Gainsborough

@johnstonesupply.com
reply to Snakeoil

I'd have no problem with them changing skinning/mining/herb so that if your level is lower than required for a node you could still mine it and get the skill up and some vendor rocks/scraps/weeds and the node will disappear. Then you'd not have to zone hop to level.



Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1
reply to stonhinge

no wonder why I've been able to sell trillium ore for more then ghost iron. I think I'm sitting on 10 trillium ores now. Waiting for friday to put it up for auction.
--
Is a person a failure for doing nothing? Or is he a failure for trying, and not succeeding at what he is attempting to do? What did you fail at today?.



Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1
reply to JoelC707

quote:
As for breaking apart items, in a sense they already have this, its called disenchanting

Which you do for the "magic" materials. Which you can use to enchant another item.

But what I was saying, for example:
you have a blue or green item the binds upon using.
It's chain mail. You smelt it.
The indicator would give you a list of possible bars that you'd get from that item if you were to smelt it. and the % chance of getting said item.
So you decide to smelt it, and you end up with 1 or 2 copper bars.
So smelting returns bars, not magic mats. And it'll return less bars, then what went into making the item.

You have leather working [maybe make it skinning] and you want to take apart an item.
Same as smelting, hover the pointer over the item and then decide if the mats are worth the lose of the item.
Then you get what ever you get, Again, no magic mats, just hides/leather.

Same with cloth items and tailoring.
--
Is a person a failure for doing nothing? Or is he a failure for trying, and not succeeding at what he is attempting to do? What did you fail at today?.


DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

Then they'd have to add smelting, skinning, and tailoring buttons to the loot roll window



Nick D
Premium
join:2010-02-04
Orange, CA
reply to Snakeoil

The difference is disenchanting is the only place to get enchanting mats (sans the odd vendor like Spirits of Harmony).

You have nodes/animals for the other materials.

A large part of why gathering mats work as a system is the materials get destroyed with crafts. Getting them back would require you to up to cost to craft by a requisite amount, or to play havoc with the economic balance. There's a large chunk of material crafted during leveling that is essentially turning ore/herbs into low quantities of consumables or enchanting materials. This inefficient trade ensures markets for gathered materials.



Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1

What markets?
IMO, only the foolish would decide to work professions that require them to be robbed by the sellers of the AH.
On several occasions, I have tried to build up Leather working, tailoring, Blacksmithing, engineering, Alchemy, Healing, Enchanting.
Only to give up in frustration.
1]The mats in the AH are extremely over priced. I have often been tempted to buy gold outside of wow [or mat packages] just to level my professions.
2]Gathering the needed mats takes a bit of time, and effort. It gets boring as watching political ads. And at the end of the day, after you grind away, you find out you are 1 copper bar short of that 1 skill point gain to the next level.

I really like what they did with MOP.
The tillers are sat up great. You can level your cooking [up to 550] without leaving the spot.
Then you can turn in the "paws" [or what ever they are] to buy sacks of raw mats. And you can buy seeds to grow your own veggies.
I think it would be "kool" if they had a vendor like that for other professions. Where you can earn special tokens by doing quests and turning them in for ores/mats. It would beat the hell out of flying/walking around looking for ore nodes.
Or they could increase the amount of ore nodes in all the zones. MOP, it seems like you are stumbling over ghost iron nodes all the time.
Why can't the other zones be like that?

*Yes my beef is mostly with mining, because I have an engineer and a blacksmith toon. Neither are fun to level.
I also have an enchanter and I know what a PIA it is to level him. Which is why I gave up on it, for a while.
--
Is a person a failure for doing nothing? Or is he a failure for trying, and not succeeding at what he is attempting to do? What did you fail at today?.



Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1
reply to DarkLogix

Why?
And whats a loot roll window?
I don't raid or go into dungeons with other players, so I don't know what that means.



Nick D
Premium
join:2010-02-04
Orange, CA

said by Snakeoil:

Why?
And whats a loot roll window?
I don't raid or go into dungeons with other players, so I don't know what that means.

When you have group loot on (or the slightly modified Need before Greed system), if a green or better drop,s you get a chance to roll Need (the dice), Greed (the coin), or if there's a disenchanter in your group, Disenchant (like a greed roll, except it DEs it for you automatically and puts the mats in your bag).

You can test this with your kids or friends just questing, and if a green drops, you'll see the UI.

If things were dismantleable (sure why not that word), you'd want additional prompts for group content, like disenchant.


DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

said by Nick D:

said by Snakeoil:

Why?
And whats a loot roll window?
I don't raid or go into dungeons with other players, so I don't know what that means.

When you have group loot on (or the slightly modified Need before Greed system), if a green or better drop,s you get a chance to roll Need (the dice), Greed (the coin), or if there's a disenchanter in your group, Disenchant (like a greed roll, except it DEs it for you automatically and puts the mats in your bag).

You can test this with your kids or friends just questing, and if a green drops, you'll see the UI.

If things were dismantleable (sure why not that word), you'd want additional prompts for group content, like disenchant.

Ya, and if your an enchanter its very handy to be in a group.
then just roll DE and even if no one is in range to loot it you get an auto de. (saves bag space)

Just party up with your kids and do quests, together and any time a mob drops a green or better you'll see it.

so if they made things dismantlable then that window would need another button so someone could roll smelt against the guy that rolled DE.


Nick D
Premium
join:2010-02-04
Orange, CA
reply to Snakeoil

A lot of people make money by buying mats (expensive as they are) and then crafting things that people will buy.

They watch the AH and figure out where these opportunities lie.

They never gather a thing. Rather, they rely on insight. If mats are too expensive, they might get a farming alt going because there's profit to be made. The WoW economy is a pretty pure example of supply and demand in action, so its hard to accuse people of being "robbers" there, especially because the barrier to entry is so low.

Also, to your point about special mats for other profs: that's kind of the point of Spirits of Harmony. Quest, kill things, gather motes, trade in for profession mats. The only problem is that the prof mats aren't good, because 3x Golden Lotus is clearly better due to world rarity and consumable use (one per flask). This means your best bet for spirits is to buy GoLo, sell on AH, and use that to buy whatever other materials you need.



Phantasee

join:2009-08-27
Hammond, LA

Where is you sense of adventure!?



mettachain
Goblineer

join:2011-09-27
Azeroth
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Cox HSI
reply to Nick D

Snakeoil only gets on these forums and complains about how other players mess up his experiences in game. He doesn't quite get that it's an MMO and not a single player RPG. It's always amusing when someone says something like "loot roll UI" and he's like WTFIZTAHTSHIT! I'm amazed why some people pay $15 a month to play an MMO and freak out when someone undercuts them on the AH, kills a mob before them, or gets to that mining/herb node before them.

If I knew someone like that in game, I would search them out and intentionally mess with them. Just saying. If I was a lion and they were a tuna, I would go out of my way to go the ocean, find that school of tuna, have my way their tuna girlfriend, then beat the shit out of them.

The sound of their piss hitting the urinal just sounds feminine to me.

Also, I got so hammered drunk last night, I thought a toob of toothpaste was astronaut food.
--
If you find the information in my post helpful or interesting, please throw me a Kudos. Thanks!



Nick D
Premium
join:2010-02-04
Orange, CA

And you forgot how to spell "tube"