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IsItDoneYet
Living Free

join:2009-07-11
Thunder Bay, ON

[Serious] Statists, be proud! re: Ashley Smith

»www.thestar.com/news/gta/article···revealed

“How can it get worse?”

Ashley Smith asks the question in a childlike moan.

Aboard a small government plane, 33,000 feet in the air somewhere between Saskatoon and Montreal, the teen inmate can’t fathom a fate worse than what has just befallen her in a period of six minutes.

Her forearms are shackled to the seat’s armrests, a hood of black netting and canvas is pulled over her head of long, wavy brown hair and tied around her neck. The plane’s co-pilot, a member of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, has just bound her wrists together with duct tape, restricting her as though in a straitjacket. And she is sitting in her own feces.

But it does get worse.

Its gets much worse...

Three months later, no fewer than seven prison staff dressed in black helmets, gas masks and hazmat-type suits will pin her limp body to a metal gurney. Two will crouch on her legs to hold down her hips while others press a clear plastic riot shield to her belly. They will inject her with anti-psychotic drugs.

“You have to co-operate,” a woman identified on prison surveillance videos as Nurse Melanie tells a docile Smith.

“You have no choice.”

And even more perverse:

Federal prison lawyers argued a motion on Wednesday asking the coroner to dramatically narrow the inquest’s scope to examine only the final seven days of her life in custody.

Anything more, said Correctional Service lawyer Nancy Noble, would turn the inquest into a “full-blown inquiry into the operations and management of Correctional Service Canada, which is not permitted.”

Wouldn't want daylight shone on what was OUR government inflicting torture one of its distressed citizens now would they?

Keep reading, this is a bomb shell and ought to inspire revulsion in what big government is capable of when it utterly fails and runs amok.
--
»libertarian.on.ca/


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

I've been following this for a while now. Can't even put it into words, and I'm so disturbed by this whole thing that I can't even watch the videos without either immediately turning them off or leaving the room. It's a situation disgusting that it is beneath a human being to fathom, and I hope the bastards who were involved in this are thrown in jail.

People will go on and on and on about a girl who offs themselves after some melodramatic video on Youtube because they can't turn off Facebook, but god forbid we give a damn when a girl that same age has the same thing happen by the people who are supposed to help her. The system failed for Ashley, and the way she was allowed to be treated is nothing short of criminal.



IsItDoneYet
Living Free

join:2009-07-11
Thunder Bay, ON

reply to IsItDoneYet
And every single 'helper' was collecting a government paycheck.
--
»libertarian.on.ca/



IsItDoneYet
Living Free

join:2009-07-11
Thunder Bay, ON

reply to IsItDoneYet
God bless the pre-moderated CBC comments section:

The video is meant to horrify but that doesn't mean what was being done to the girl wasn't done for good reason.

I saw what appears, at first blush, to be an abuse of the system, but that's the beauty of our judicial system, one has the opportunity to hear both sides of the story before making a judgement and here we're just seeing/reading one side of the issue.

Its a beauty all right!
--
»libertarian.on.ca/


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Bell Sympatico

reply to Gone

said by Gone:

The system failed for Ashley, and the way she was allowed to be treated is nothing short of criminal.

No, the "system" did not "fail". The "system" is not well designed to handle people with severe mental health issues and especially those under 17 in the first place.

What you are seeing is not "criminal" but the result of inadequate funding, planning and nothing shot of a "system" in crisis. There are alternatives. Sadly, our "crime and punishment" mentality (and that of the current government in Ottawa) is nothing but a massive failure for people with serious medical conditions who commit crimes.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.

EdmundGerber

join:2010-01-04
kudos:1

said by DKS:

said by Gone:

The system failed for Ashley, and the way she was allowed to be treated is nothing short of criminal.

No, the "system" did not "fail". The "system" is not well designed to handle people with severe mental health issues and especially those under 17 in the first place.

What you are seeing is not "criminal" but the result of inadequate funding, planning and nothing shot of a "system" in crisis. There are alternatives. Sadly, our "crime and punishment" mentality (and that of the current government in Ottawa) is nothing but a massive failure for people with serious medical conditions who commit crimes.

You think funding is the problem??? Explain the need for 6 stormtroopers in full riot gear for one teen. At 5:30 AM. I bet everyone one of those SOB's is earning nearly 6 figures. Funding excuse be damned!

This goes all the way to the top, and the attitude of our current government. I fucking weep for what's become of Canada!


shaner
Premium
join:2000-10-04
Calgary, AB

reply to IsItDoneYet

quote:
She spent her last year in solitary confinement, where she received little treatment for her mental illness. Guards looked on as she killed herself following years of self-harm.

Read more: »www.ctvnews.ca/canada/troubling-···Ay7ktrIU
And what exactly did they think the likeliest outcome was going to be? A cure? Even my uneducated mind can tell they set this girl up to kill herself. The people involved should be brought up on charges. This is a disgusting way to treat another human being.
--
I'm a man, but I can change. If I have to. I guess.

»shaner38.blogspot.com/


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Bell Sympatico

reply to EdmundGerber

said by EdmundGerber:

said by DKS:

said by Gone:

The system failed for Ashley, and the way she was allowed to be treated is nothing short of criminal.

No, the "system" did not "fail". The "system" is not well designed to handle people with severe mental health issues and especially those under 17 in the first place.

What you are seeing is not "criminal" but the result of inadequate funding, planning and nothing shot of a "system" in crisis. There are alternatives. Sadly, our "crime and punishment" mentality (and that of the current government in Ottawa) is nothing but a massive failure for people with serious medical conditions who commit crimes.

You think funding is the problem??? Explain the need for 6 stormtroopers in full riot gear for one teen. At 5:30 AM. I bet everyone one of those SOB's is earning nearly 6 figures. Funding excuse be damned!

This goes all the way to the top, and the attitude of our current government. I fucking weep for what's become of Canada!

You really should make an effort to become informed. I work in the health care and corrections system as part of my job and do volunteer work in the mental health system. I have a child very similar to Ashley, although, fortunately, the helping circle has prevented a similar outcome so far.

Learn some facts. Better yet, stop crying "The Horror! The Horror!" and start advocating with our politicians for change. Money IS the issue.

Mental health is the poorest relative in the health care system. Workers in the mental health system are largely non-unionized and have had their salaries frozen for twelve of the last fifteen years. They have no pensions and few benefits. They earn up to 40% less than those in the hospital system.

Sunshine list? Don't make me laugh. Outside of psychiatrists and a few administrators, there are damned few there. Of all the mental health workers in our area (there are about 90 in the outpatient sector) exactly one is on the Sunshine List and she works 80 hours a week.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Bell Sympatico

reply to shaner

said by shaner:


And what exactly did they think the likeliest outcome was going to be? A cure? Even my uneducated mind can tell they set this girl up to kill herself. The people involved should be brought up on charges. This is a disgusting way to treat another human being.

Then advocate for change. Demand better. Demand better funding. Demand early interventions. Demand alcohol harm reduction strategies (you were aware that a huge number of people in the corrections system are diagnosed with FASD and self-medicate?).
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


shaner
Premium
join:2000-10-04
Calgary, AB

reply to DKS

said by DKS:

Sunshine list? Don't make me laugh. Outside of psychiatrists and a few administrators, there are damned few there. Of all the mental health workers in our area (there are about 90 in the outpatient sector) exactly one is on the Sunshine List and she works 80 hours a week.

I think you misinterpreted what he was saying. The guards in the video could very well be on the Sunshine List, which is the wrong place to spend the money. In other words, the money is there, it's just allocated to the wrong place.
--
I'm a man, but I can change. If I have to. I guess.

»shaner38.blogspot.com/


shaner
Premium
join:2000-10-04
Calgary, AB

reply to DKS

said by DKS:

Then advocate for change. Demand better. Demand better funding. Demand early interventions. Demand alcohol harm reduction strategies (you were aware that a huge number of people in the corrections system are diagnosed with FASD and self-medicate?).

I have and I will continue to do so. Mental Health is woefully underfunded, misunderstood, and ridiculously ignored. That has to change. But these thugs should still be brought up on charges. Prisoner or not, that video shows outright abuse and should be directly linked as a cause in her death.
--
I'm a man, but I can change. If I have to. I guess.

»shaner38.blogspot.com/


Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:3

reply to IsItDoneYet
Im afraid to watch based on what I have read here. Typical Canadian response......... dont fix problems just clean up the messes. Resources are spent on cleanup not prevention. From obesity to mental health, to a gazillion other issues. Oh wait, lets do expensive studies that make recommendations that are not followed.



HRMmmm

@videotron.ca

reply to IsItDoneYet

said by IsItDoneYet:

God bless the pre-moderated CBC comments section:

The video is meant to horrify but that doesn't mean what was being done to the girl wasn't done for good reason.

I saw what appears, at first blush, to be an abuse of the system, but that's the beauty of our judicial system, one has the opportunity to hear both sides of the story before making a judgement and here we're just seeing/reading one side of the issue.

Its a beauty all right!

aaah. But you see in some peoples eyes she is a punk.

What was the original story here? She tossed eggs or rocks at a mailman, judge gave her 3 months in a juvi place, and for bad behavior they just kept increasing her time and then moved her around in real jails and ended up tossing her in a windowless isolation cell for months to rot?

You see, to some people here she got what she deserved because.. you know... she's a punk.

Two ways of looking at everything, if one really wants to go there.


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Bell Sympatico

reply to shaner

said by shaner:

said by DKS:

Sunshine list? Don't make me laugh. Outside of psychiatrists and a few administrators, there are damned few there. Of all the mental health workers in our area (there are about 90 in the outpatient sector) exactly one is on the Sunshine List and she works 80 hours a week.

I think you misinterpreted what he was saying. The guards in the video could very well be on the Sunshine List, which is the wrong place to spend the money. In other words, the money is there, it's just allocated to the wrong place.

No, I understand better than you can imagine. No one has evidence or proof of any guard there being on any Sunshine List. Suggesting that is nothing more than unproductive, idle speculation. However, there is evidence of chronic under-funding of the mental health system.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Bell Sympatico

reply to shaner

said by shaner:

said by DKS:

Then advocate for change. Demand better. Demand better funding. Demand early interventions. Demand alcohol harm reduction strategies (you were aware that a huge number of people in the corrections system are diagnosed with FASD and self-medicate?).

I have and I will continue to do so. Mental Health is woefully underfunded, misunderstood, and ridiculously ignored. That has to change. But these thugs should still be brought up on charges. Prisoner or not, that video shows outright abuse and should be directly linked as a cause in her death.

That is the purpose of the inquest.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

reply to DKS

said by DKS:

No, the "system" did not "fail". The "system" is not well designed to handle people with severe mental health issues and especially those under 17 in the first place.

What you are seeing is not "criminal" but the result of inadequate funding, planning and nothing shot of a "system" in crisis. There are alternatives. Sadly, our "crime and punishment" mentality (and that of the current government in Ottawa) is nothing but a massive failure for people with serious medical conditions who commit crimes.

While you were able to better explain why something like this happened, the situation doesn't sicken me any less.


urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable

reply to IsItDoneYet

said by Gone:

People will go on and on and on about a girl who offs themselves after some melodramatic video on Youtube because they can't turn off Facebook, but god forbid we give a damn when a girl that same age has the same thing happen by the people who are supposed to help her. The system failed for Ashley, and the way she was allowed to be treated is nothing short of criminal.

So this thread is concerning a woman that was tortured by our government? There's no information in this thread other than snippets of something that sounds like it comes from a horror movie concerning actions committed against an innocent woman?

However I see the word 'inmate' in the quotes above...

Does anyone care to add some context to this story for those of us that have no idea who this Ashley girl is?


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

If you know nothing about the situation or who this Ashley Girl is, urbanruot, here's a tip: »lmgtfy.com/?q=Ashley+Smith

I would argue that considering the mental health issues this woman had and the fact that she was put into a system she should have never been put into and that same system is woefully inadequate to handle those issues, the way she was treated was torture that ultimately lead to her death. Completely inexcusable. She deserved better, and I have been heartbroken by this entire story from the very beginning.


peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON

reply to DKS

said by DKS:

What you are seeing is not "criminal" but the result of inadequate funding, planning and nothing shot of a "system" in crisis.

I don't care what the funding or conditions of your profession and employment you make a conscious decision everyday how you will proceed in any given environment.

There are plenty of examples through history from the Stanford Prison Experiment to Auschwitz and to give some of these people a pass because of systemic funding problems is shameful.


DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Bell Sympatico

said by peterboro:

said by DKS:

What you are seeing is not "criminal" but the result of inadequate funding, planning and nothing shot of a "system" in crisis.

I don't care what the funding or conditions of your profession and employment you make a conscious decision everyday how you will proceed in any given environment.

And we have no idea how many staff refused to perform their job as it was defined. Again, undocumented speculation. That may come out before the jury next year at the inquest.

There are plenty of examples through history from the Stanford Prison Experiment to Auschwitz and to give some of these people a pass because of systemic funding problems is shameful.

No. Making undocumented accusations is shameful.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.
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