Topic 'Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5' in forum 'World of Warcraft' - dslreports.com

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 13 Feb 2013 09:35:26 EDT

Soldier78 posted : Thanks for the tips and I'm in agreement I rather not play Demo if I don't have to

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Tue, 12 Feb 2013 15:37:37 EDT

Carpie posted : I've never played Demon spec at all so can't comment there. I leveled with Destro/Aff and switched from one to the other often as I leveled which I thought kept things fresh and interesting. I don't think there is a way you can go wrong in questing anymore. You're going to feel (and be) OP for just about every encounter regardless of specs and choices. So as you say, it's more about speed and fun.

For me it was burn things down with Destro as first choice. It's the speed and is fun to see the huge numbers on your chaos bolts. Plus if you have a good headset, listening to the fire sizzle from the spells is music for one's soul. In situations (ie boss of some sort) where I needed more survivability, I'd switch to Aff and pull out the blue marshmallow to tank for me. Release the hound and dot and run.

IDK... I like them both. Have always enjoyed leveling a lock.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Tue, 12 Feb 2013 14:58:26 EDT

Caelharrad posted : Got tired of my troll druid, deleted him and rolled a Blood elf warlock a couple of days ago; only played him a very little bit so far (level 7), but having fun, especially as I've never played a blood elf before... so all the quests are new to me. I'm figuring to play this guy whenever I get tired of grinding VP/LFR on my main, and need a change of pace/scenery.
...
Any pointers (other than the obvious such as "load up on heirlooms") to make the levelling process as quick/fun/easy as possible? Thanks in advance.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Tue, 12 Feb 2013 12:31:34 EDT

Carpie posted : Also for AoE targets, it largely depends on how long the mobs are going to last. If they are going to be around awhile:

Four or less: Soulburn: Spread the dots on each. Maintaing dots is the priority and will probably keep you busy but you can throw in some haunts and mal grasps here and there.

5-8: Soulburn:Seed of Corruption and Curse. Then get your dots on as many as possible. Probably the right answer is to manually apply agony on as many as you can, but I generally use the last two shards and then go into a rain of fire until seed pops and I get more shards then use those to dot up any leftovers. Using opinion only (not testing or any theoretical tools), I'd guess this is the way to go for more than 8 mobs that will last awhile. And will want to spread your seed again if it drops and there is still time.

If they are going to be downed in less than 10 seconds (as many are in the LFRs), you can still pop the seed and curse spread and then go into a rain of fire. Or my favorite, use harvest of life (talent). Not because it is the greater dps solution (though I'm sure it's not too far off), but mostly because it is just awesome to see all the green tentacles reaching out all over the place sucking the life from the mobs. One of my favorite visuals of the lock spell toolkit.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Tue, 12 Feb 2013 12:17:37 EDT

Carpie posted : The only changes talked about recently are a reduction of "spread" range down from 15 yards to 10 yards on Seed of Corruption, Soulburn:Curse of Elements, and Fire and Brimstone.

Other banter that has been going on throughout the testing is changing the ember and soulshard glyphs to not allow four of each any longer as well as possibly nerfing the Sac of Grimoire talent so that warlocks do not do more dps without a minion out. Keeping to the theme, Blizz would prefer to see warlocks with minions. Have not seen anything definite on these things lately though.

Oh, and we get a questline for green fire.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Tue, 12 Feb 2013 11:26:59 EDT

Soldier78 posted : So I'm back after a two years and I was doing great leveling up from 85 to 90 as Destro. I'm trying to do affliction since its top dps and on single target I'm good but I'm horrible on trash and AoE on heroics, should I even care? Probably not and can anyone explain the major changes in 5.2 since I'm trying to get back in the swing of things :) thanks

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 20 Dec 2012 13:46:53 EDT

Carpie posted : Yeah the embers+curse, embers+immolate, and embers+incinerate are good AOE dmg if you have the time and embers (which isn't all that often). Embers+immolate is the best pinch hitter.

I know I'm asking too much here because of people already complaining about Destros having too much burst power in PVP, but I really wish the embers didn't fade. Nothing gets under my skin more than having full embers when we get to the boss but then being down to one by the time we start because of hesitation on tank/healer.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 20 Dec 2012 13:41:31 EDT

Goldheart posted :

said by Suniojii:

Demo is an AOE beast right now.

Demo isn't quite the AoE beast it used to be but is still good! Certainly better than the other specs. That said, Affliction isn't too bad with soulburn + seed. Destro can do embers + immolate, etc. for some decent AoE as well.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 20 Dec 2012 13:38:52 EDT

Goldheart posted :

said by Carpie:

said by Goldheart:

If you do the < hit cap you need to pay attention to your dots and make sure that they all hit. Recast for a miss.

You mean if I DON'T stick with hit cap right? Just making sure because even though it sounds backwards, I seem to miss with DOTs hit capped more often than I'd care to admit. It certainly isn't 100% chance of hit as claimed.

Correct :-)

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 21:17:40 EDT

Suniojii posted : It all comes down to playing what is fun. I personally find Aff easier than Demo. Demo is all about keeping your demon alive, in and out of forms, and demonic fury maintenance. Aff is just dot em mal/drain em.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 20:59:25 EDT

Nick D posted : But who wins cleaves right now? BoH is pretty nice for 2 dudes.

There's a difference between 8 tiny mobs and 2 larger ones.

(My impression has been Destro for 2 mobs, Afflic for 3-4, and Demo for 5+ as teh winnar)

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 20:53:54 EDT

Suniojii posted : Demo is an AOE beast right now.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 16:35:07 EDT

Carpie posted : From my experience and readings, it seems in the last two xpacs at least that Aff has been the preferred spec for multiple adds. Perhaps this sways back and forth between demonology at times, but Destro has always been the step child in those situations.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 15:49:40 EDT

Suniojii posted : Aff isn't the "AOE" spec.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 15:42:24 EDT

BlitzenZeus posted : By dumping into mastery you're working on your single target dps for the most part, but without some soft cap of haste the curve it's also less damage to go full mastery like some sites suggest. I know there is some bosses with aoe trash, but generally aoe trash is not how we judge raid dps.

I with I understood more about it, being told to use master gems instead of int gems still doesn't feel right as it lowers your spellpower overall even if dots get a percentage boost.
--
I distrust those people who know so well what god wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires- Susan B. Anthony
Yesterday we obeyed kings, and bent out necks before emperors. But today we kneel only to the truth- Kahlil G.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 15:33:21 EDT

Carpie posted : I've read it but I don't buy it. (And I love the Noxxic site btw)

I'm going to do the test for dummies again tonight or tomorrow when I reforge back, this time taking 3 shots on each dummy for a 3 minute duration, and see what I get. If my dps goes back up (which I expect it to), then it will put the nails in the theorycraft coffin for me.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 15:29:40 EDT

BlitzenZeus posted : »www.noxxic.com/wow/pve/warlock/a···priority

Current theorycrafting is soft haste cap, then all out mastery.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 15:10:49 EDT

Carpie posted :

said by bTU:

even more when there are adds with soulburn+seed of corruption.

It's funny that Aff is the "AOE" spec but if the adds don't last for more than 15 seconds I think it fails hard. When we do the dogs, my DPS is always extremely high. SB+SoC and then DOT like crazy and maintain. But when I go against the Klaxxi adds in HoF, they are dead so quick that I'm not even sure that I got to burst my seed. And my DPS is usually garbage. It always goes to the melee AOE. Dem or Destro are the better specs in those situations.

said by bTU:

One thing I have noticed is I get shadow trance procs a lot more often when questing than in boss fights. Probably just my mind tricking me since I have other stuff to watch in boss fights.

I think it's the mind trick. The only time I really lack for them is when I really need them (which is boss fights). In questing, the mobs are dead in 2-3 shards anyhow. SB to spread the DOTs, one for Haunt, and refill with Drain Soul so you don't notice/need the procs as much. I find it's sporadic on boss encounters. There are times (mostly) where I'm left praying for a proc and other times (seldomly) that they are coming so quick I'm refreshing the DOTs with SB.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 14:56:57 EDT

bTU posted : Even for affliction there is a haste soft cap you want to shoot for, I think it's in the 11% range, I can't remember the rating number at work. I noticed that swapping reforges from mastery to haste helped my DPS once I was keeping this haste target maintained. For affliction I have about 14.5% hit, 11.4% haste and about 45% in mastery bonus. With an ilvl of 466 I am getting in the 58K to 61K dps range on LFR/LFD boss fights, even more when there are adds with soulburn+seed of corruption.

One thing I have noticed is I get shadow trance procs a lot more often when questing than in boss fights. Or at least I seem to. I have had many times where I get two procs on the same quest mob, but I can go well over a minute on a boss with nothing. Probably just my mind tricking me since I have other stuff to watch in boss fights.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 14:06:20 EDT

Carpie posted :

said by Goldheart:

If you do the < hit cap you need to pay attention to your dots and make sure that they all hit. Recast for a miss.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 13:53:29 EDT

Goldheart posted :

said by Carpie:

So I think Mr. Robot has some faulty circuitry and has given me poor advice. So far on my Aff 'lock I've been holding strong to the Int>Hit capped > everything else mentality because it felt right (and it was consistent with the Destro spec so no gear changes). Up until yesterday.

I haven't used Mr. Robot much at all but the site has been getting a lot of publicity and references lately so I decided to go check it out in more detail. If one thing is crystal clear to me, he is against hit capping (and not just for Warlocks). I don't know what made my change my stance, maybe it was his use of capital letters in YOU WILL LOSE DPS if you hit cap the Aff spec, but I conceded. But before I made any reforge changes, I decided I would baseline first.

I know the Dummies aren't the end all tell all, but for simplicity sake I did two minute stints on the lvl 90 dummy and the 90+ dummy. No buffs whatsoever (not even Grim of Sac) and no calling out of the Doomguard. Just the Dot, Haunt, Mal Grasp, refresh, rotation over and over.

Hit capped under this environment, Recount dps was ~55k consistent on both dummies.

Reforged all that hit to Mastery and Haste like the little robot told me, and went back out. Now my recount dps on the lvl 90 dummy was down to ~52-53k (not huge loss relatively speaking, but big loss when you were expecting the opposite) and the 90+ dummy was down to ~49k.

FML. I'll be reforging back soon.

If you do the < hit cap you need to pay attention to your dots and make sure that they all hit. Recast for a miss. This can really hurt if you have a 10 stack agony and wait till the last second to refresh and miss.

Personally I stick with hit cap.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 19 Dec 2012 13:09:31 EDT

Carpie posted : So I think Mr. Robot has some faulty circuitry and has given me poor advice. So far on my Aff 'lock I've been holding strong to the Int>Hit capped > everything else mentality because it felt right (and it was consistent with the Destro spec so no gear changes). Up until yesterday.

I haven't used Mr. Robot much at all but the site has been getting a lot of publicity and references lately so I decided to go check it out in more detail. If one thing is crystal clear to me, he is against hit capping (and not just for Warlocks). I don't know what made my change my stance, maybe it was his use of capital letters in YOU WILL LOSE DPS if you hit cap the Aff spec, but I conceded. But before I made any reforge changes, I decided I would baseline first.

I know the Dummies aren't the end all tell all, but for simplicity sake I did two minute stints on the lvl 90 dummy and the 90+ dummy. No buffs whatsoever (not even Grim of Sac) and no calling out of the Doomguard. Just the Dot, Haunt, Mal Grasp, refresh, rotation over and over.

Hit capped under this environment, Recount dps was ~55k consistent on both dummies.

Reforged all that hit to Mastery and Haste like the little robot told me, and went back out. Now my recount dps on the lvl 90 dummy was down to ~52-53k (not huge loss relatively speaking, but big loss when you were expecting the opposite) and the 90+ dummy was down to ~49k.

FML. I'll be reforging back soon.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Mon, 12 Nov 2012 10:49:47 EDT

Goldheart posted : I decided to try affliction and I am liking it a lot compared to destro. Definitely seems easier to kill mobs. Not as many casts needed. Soul shard + soul swap = instant set of dots on a mob, repeat for additional mobs. For 4+ mobs do soul shard + seed of corruption a few times.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Fri, 09 Nov 2012 04:57:31 EDT

BlitzenZeus posted : A friend bought be back into wow, and I resisted quite a bit.... However it's turned into the world of dailies which I am not a fan of.

I don't care for the new demon, but good damage, good aoe. I played destro for so long, but it wasn't putting out the dps I wanted it to at least when I was leveling to 90, good for short fights, the aoe was lacking severely. Affliction is slow to start, but has huge damage potential, however I find the proc for regaining shards isn't as fast as I would like it preventing me from doing the soulburn refresh as often as I would like on single targets. The aoe dmg with aff is decent with the move to mastery as a major stat, and fights with lots of adds which are not grouped up aff does suffer a bit on the damage, however they give a chance to get back shards with drain soul.

I do like how the simplified the specs as cata destro was a hell of a rotation for max dps, and it was more complex than affliction which was historically the most complex rotation. I would switch specs between destro, and affliction for raiding in the past as there were very few stand and nuke fights. With being able to move while casting now it helps.

In the end I'm staying with affliction for the moment, and with the drastic gear choices between the specs for me to seriously give the other specs a real shot I would have to redo the gems, even change out some gear. With many of the epic pieces giving crit it would make it easier to play destro, or demon. My lock is at an 478 ilvl right now with valor pieces, some lfr, and my gear setup for affliction is far from optimal for the other specs.

The major downfall to affliction is the dots are less powerful, and you must channel malefic grasp to make them tick for an additional 50% for the spec to produce max dps. No more op dotting, and running.
--
I distrust those people who know so well what god wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires- Susan B. Anthony
Yesterday we obeyed kings, and bent out necks before emperors. But today we kneel only to the truth- Kahlil G.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5 (Affliction)

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 18:48:35 EDT

stonhinge posted : yeah, once you learn the fights, it gets easier to determine where to use AV. Keep in mind that it has to be damage done directly by the boss - standing in bad won't help you any. Anytime there's massive unavoidable raid damage - or one of those random target direct casts - is probably a good time to use it. The bigger the hit you take, the "better". If you have Soul Link, raidwide AoE is probably the best time to use it, as the damage the pet takes will count towards it as well.
--
When the ship lifts, all bills are paid. No regrets.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5 (Affliction)

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 18:07:26 EDT

Nick D posted : It works fine on raid bosses. Figuring out when the best time to use it is part of the skill required to make use of the talent :)

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5 (Affliction)

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 18:00:34 EDT

Goldheart posted :

I personally use AV. A passive 5% damage return to attackers is nice on its own! And 25% for 8 seconds is excellent. I just wonder if it actually does this 25% return on raid bosses?

Sadly it does no damage while on cooldown. Picking the right time for 25% damage return for 8 seconds can be tricky.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 17:56:24 EDT

Suniojii posted :

said by cymraeg:

okay that doesnt explain the debate it just tells me about it, ill ask differently this time. why is 8% hit a good thing for more dps? why is 15% not?

edit; sorry just saw immers post i get it now

Sorry, I am not being vague on purpose. There is just way to much information, simtests, and theorycrafting to be able to post anything that would provide a coherent read. My best results have been the warlock forums on icy veins and the official warlock forums. I reforged into mastery/haste and I have "personally" noticed large gains.
Item Level 463 - 490ish
Haste > Mastery > Hit > Crit

Item Level 490ish - 500ish
Mastery > Haste > Hit > Crit

Item Level 500+
Mastery > Hit > Haste > Crit

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 16:35:17 EDT

Immer posted :

said by Suniojii:

Im surprised people are still using Noxxic when their information has been proven inaccurate in the past.

Their format is clean, and they are a good place for beginners (such as me) to get a feel. Icy-Veins is the next step up with more in-depth discussion. EJ is hit or miss until they have solid OP guides built. MaxDPS and GuildOX are less theory and more anecdotal "what are people actually doing for their results" but they leave it up to the reader to explain "why" or "how" it works for them. Which site is "the best" will vary based on patch and player.
--
Guild leader of Pride and Ego
Good times with Great people in the Best way to spend $15/mo.

Intelligence is no substitute for Character.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 16:22:22 EDT

cymraeg posted : okay that doesnt explain the debate it just tells me about it, ill ask differently this time. why is 8% hit a good thing for more dps? why is 15% not?

edit; sorry just saw immers post i get it now
--
Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau!
"What happened in here?" " Seems to have been a bit of a squabble." "They're all dead!" " More of a tif then."

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 14:54:06 EDT

Immer posted : I skimmed one of the discussions a bit and I'm frankly annoyed with the approach being taken on the matter.

Being at the raid spell hit cap of 15% is mathematically sound advice, especially for baseline players (or beginners), because if you are at the hit cap, you've limited your concerns to only your rotations and firing off your abilities at the perfect time to maximize Uptime. There is nothing wrong with this advice/approach. Nothing. Nothing has been disproven mathematically.

Now, there is another group of players who are of the mindset that they are willing to accept a chance to miss a raid boss target if they can effectively increase the dmg they are doing when they don't miss. Here is what I find annoying... the "you just need 8%" or "why are you saying they Need to be hitcapped when it's been proven that being under hitcap is a dps gain". See what's missing? The full disclosure of the real argument.

Just being under the hit cap (15%) is not in itself a dps boost. Choosing to sacrifice Hit/Exp in favor of Mastery/Haste is a dps increase for your hits provided you make enough adjustments to your playstyle to account for your misses. If you are under hit cap, you need to pay closer attention to your Haunt and stacks of Agony. If you lose your Agony stacks or lose Haunt uptime, you could see a dramatic drop in your dps. The Haste will allow you to re-cast a missed spell faster, and hopefully prevent you from losing uptime on Agony stacks and Haunt. So, in the interest of full disclosure... if you are micro-managing your DoTs really well and are looking for a way to squeeze out some more dmg, then consider adjusting your reforge priority so that Mastery and Haste are higher than Hit... and experiment. Staying above 8% will keep life running smoothly for lol dungeons and dailies.
--
Guild leader of Pride and Ego
Good times with Great people in the Best way to spend $15/mo.

Intelligence is no substitute for Character.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 14:29:20 EDT

Suniojii posted :

said by cymraeg:

why is the hit so low Suni?

It's an open debate on wow warlock forums, but the consensus is that lower hit does max dps. As far as talents, I use www.guildox.com to look at the spec that top guilds and players are using in current content.

Im surprised people are still using Noxxic when their information has been proven inaccurate in the past.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5 (Affliction)

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 13:09:06 EDT

Immer posted : I just checked MaxDPS.com and they are still using SimulationCraft version 505-2. Noxxic is using version 505-5. That might explain the discrepancy.

edit: and don't worry... you did provide references. Not everyone can provide a link. ;)

edit2: Anyone else disappointed in the lack of an OP Guide for Locks at EJ?

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5 (Affliction)

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 13:02:36 EDT

Carpie posted :

said by Immer:

I think the locks here could use a reference for the 8% hit cap claim... everywhere I look says 15%.

said by Immer:

www.Noxxic.com/wow/pve/warlock/affliction

Stat Priority:
Intellect > Spell Hit (15%) = Mastery > Haste > Crit

Noxxic states this now? I could have SWORE that it (and maxdps.com) had mastery before hit on Afflication. It was actually one of the reasons I went away from Aff because I could never get used to having hit less than 15%. I did quite a bit of research on it at the time and there were a number of debates on the subject without any clear solution. Many people pointed out that the majority of players on the leaderboards had hit reforged to get that 14-15%. I ended up maxing hit anyhow (plus I wanted the same gear for Destro OS).

I know, I know. References. DAMN YOU WEBSENSE!

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 12:53:17 EDT

Carpie posted :

said by Nick D

The glyph is only good if you expect Dark Soul to be off cooldown due to sandbagging for higher damage phases or some such. Otherwise, it should generally be on CD constantly, so it ends up being a pure nerf.

I make it simple and just replaced Incinerate with a macro of:

/cast DS
/cast Incinerate

That way DS is blown every time it is up and I'm maximizing dps (because backdraft is buffed before hitting it) and building back embers fast with the crits.

Plus I'm just lazy like that. It's easier to hit one button than two.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5 (Affliction)

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 09:31:13 EDT

Immer posted :

said by Suniojii:

Affliction top dps parses use Archy's Vengeance vs Kil'jaeden. Also, affliction only needs spell hit to 8%.

I think the locks here could use a reference for the 8% hit cap claim... everywhere I look says 15%.

As for the top parses using Archimonde's Vengeance, that probably has more to do with the encounter design than raw potential of the talent/spec/player. Base talent specs are for baseline guides. Once mastered, the idea behind the current talent tree/glyph approach is to game (min/max) each encounter for more dynamic gameplay.

The tough thing about Simulations is I don't think they run with a "boss does X amount of dmg/sec to player"... so the SIM probably can't quantify the value of Archimonde's Vengeance properly.

said by IcyVeins :

Tier 6 talents provide situational DPS increases.

• Archimonde's Vengeance causes your target to suffer 25% of all the damage you take for 8 seconds. It has a 2-minute cooldown. When the ability is off cooldown, enemies who attack you suffer 5% of all the damage they deal to you.
• Kil'jaeden's Cunning enables you to cast and channel while moving for 6 seconds. It has a 1-minute cooldown. This talent also grants you a passive effect, which allows you to cast and channel while moving but the cast/channel time of your spells is increased by 50% and each cast reduces your movement speed by 10% for 6 seconds (stacking up to 2 times). This passive effect is disabled when Kiljaeden's Cunning is on cooldown.
• Mannoroth's Fury increases the area of your AoE spells by 500%. The wording of the tooltip is rather poor. What this talent really does is increase the radius of your AoE spells by roughly 125% (so the radius is multiplied by 2.25), which causes the area affected by your AoE spells to become 5 times bigger (source=wowhead).

All of these talents have situational use. Kil'jaeden's Cunning Icon Kil'jaeden's Cunning will be useful in movement-heavy fights. Mannoroth's Fury Icon Mannoroth's Fury will be nigh-mandatory in AoE-heavy fights where enemies are loosely stacked. Archimonde's Vengeance will be the default choice and can be used when you will regularly take a large amount of unavoidable damage (if Soul Link is active, the damage done to your pet will also be dealt back to the enemies).

edit: So, if you have the rest of your rotation down, uptime maximized/optimized on all of your dmg dealing abilities, and you are taking a lot of unavoidable dmg... give Archimonde's Vengeance a try to see if it will increase your dmg output.
--
Guild leader of Pride and Ego
Good times with Great people in the Best way to spend $15/mo.

Intelligence is no substitute for Character.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Thu, 08 Nov 2012 09:07:51 EDT

cymraeg posted : why is the hit so low Suni?

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 23:29:20 EDT

Suniojii posted : Affliction top dps parses use Archy's Vengeance vs Kil'jaeden. Also, affliction only needs spell hit to 8%.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 21:04:43 EDT

Goldheart posted : For destro noxxic.com and icy-veins.com seem to have different recommendations for the talents.

Icy claims sacrifice has the best dps where noxxic claims supremacy does.

Elitist Jerks show about the same for pets and for sacrifice.

I suppose if sacrifice is about the same there are a couple schools of thought. No pet = no pet management. However some pets can buff the party. Imp for health for example.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.1

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 20:28:04 EDT

stonhinge posted : True, other people might find it useful.

Lately I've just been using WeakAuras for a few things like shuffle/stagger, and Inquisition/holy power on my paladin. Makes it easier to put the info I feel I need right where I want it. Any time I need to track more than 2 things for myself to be optimum, I start feeling a bit overwhelmed when combined with the chaos that can be a raid boss.
--
When the ship lifts, all bills are paid. No regrets.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.1

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 19:29:14 EDT

Immer posted : totally understand. Just thought I'd might toss out and idea.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.1

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 19:17:30 EDT

stonhinge posted : If I need an addon specifically for one spec of one class, I pass on that spec. I try and keep my UI ... well, not quite minimalistic, but sparse compared to some.

Now if my main was and had been a warlock, I might consider it. I've been content tanking Cataclysm and MoP so far. Besides, i tend to be the most "active" player outside of raids in my raid, so having a tank with slightly better gear than the rest of the raid is probably a bit better than waiting on a tank to gear up.

I've gone from Rogue > Warrior in vanilla (switched to prot warrior because one of our tanks in MC was flaking out on us. Leveled prot out of apparent sado-masochism.), enh shaman in BC, elemental shaman in Wrath, then prot warrior and prot paladin in 2 Cataclysm raids. I'll probably keep on tanking as things go forward on my monk, but we do have a DK in my current raid who would like to tank, although letting him and out warrior trade off might work out better.

I do understand that some people like classes with the micromanagement, but I'm a person who would prefer either difficult encounters or a difficult (to master) class - not both at once.
--
When the ship lifts, all bills are paid. No regrets.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.1

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 17:32:02 EDT

Nick D posted : Affliction is a Cata Shadow Priest.

Keep up 3 dots
Spam a channel
Use a cast-time spell to keep up a buff on roughly a 6 second CD.

EDIT: its by far the most tricky to micromanage of the 3 specs, in terms of rote rotation (and destro is by far the easiest).

It feels like a flip from Cata where Destro was playing Eine Kleine Nachtmusik and Afflic was Moonlight Sonata.

Or Yngwie Malmsteen vs Billie Joe Armstrong

Or Busta Rhymes vs Linkin Park

I mean, pick your favorite analogy here.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.1

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 17:29:12 EDT

Immer posted :

said by stonhinge:

And yeah, I avoided Affliction because of the watching DoTs/timers/cooldowns bit.

Might this pain be mitigated a bit with some modification of the UI? Perhaps FortXorcist, Gnosis, or even RoguePowerBars (because they track debuffs, bleeds, combo points and dots). Or is afflic still twisty even with a good UI?

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5 (Demonology)

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 17:27:11 EDT

Immer posted : www.Noxxic.com/wow/pve/warlock/Demonology

Stat Priority:
Intellect > Spell Hit (15%) > Crit > Mastery > Haste

• Intellect Increases damage dealt by spells and slightly increases critical strike chance.
• Spell Hit (15%) Any Hit Rating will increase your chance to hit and at 15% Hit (5100 Rating) your spells can no longer miss on bosses. To check your hit percentage, open your character panel and then check under the Spell tab for "Hit Chance." The choice of how much Hit to stack comes down to your comfort level with missing and reapplying DoTs. Thanks to Pandemic, Warlocks have room to spare in their rotation but heavy misses can make the rotation difficult to manage. Stack as much Hit as needed (up to 15%) to maintain a comfortable rotation.
• Mastery: Master Demonologist increases the damage dealt by your demons and your damage in both caster and Metamorphosis form.
• Haste Reduces cast time, lowers GCD, and can gives extra ticks to your DoTs.
• Crit Increases the chance for your attacks to critically hit for 200% damage.

Reforging:
1. Check for 15% Spell Hit If you are not at or above 15% Hit, then reforge your gear until you are at the Hit cap. On any gear without Hit, reforge the weakest stat (see stat priority) into Hit Rating or Expertise. Do this until you are at or slightly above 15%.
2. Optimize Secondary Stats On any gear without Crit or Mastery, reforge the weakest stat (see priority) into Crit or Mastery as available.

Major Glyphs 5.0.5

• {Glyph of Siphon Life} Recommended. Provides a small survivability boost.
• {Glyph of Demonic Circle} Optional. Good for high movement fights.
• {Glyph of Demon Hunting} Optional. Become a backup tank.
• {Glyph of Imp Swarm} Optional. Good for fights with key burst phases.
• {Glyph of Soulstone} Optional. Improved utility for saving players.

Minor Glyphs 5.0.5

• {Glyph of Shadow Bolt} Required. Slightly improves procs from Shadow Bolt.
• {Glyph of Crimson Banish} Optional. New color on Banish can be used to identify targets.
• {Glyph of Enslave Demon} Optional. Useful if you get to enslave a strong add.

Single Target Rotation - 5.0.5

Demonic Fury Builders: Follow this priority to build Demonic Fury.
• Corruption Maintain at all times.
• Hand of Gul'dan Maintain at all times.
• Soul Fire with Molten Core proc.
• Shadow Bolt as a filler spell.
• Fel Flame when on the move, but not to extend Corruption.

Metamorphosis Priority: Follow this priority while in Metamorphosis demon form.
• Enter Metamorphosis at > 900 Demonic Fury.
• Metamorphosis: Doom Maintain at all times.
• Metamorphosis: Touch of Chaos as a filler spell and to refresh Corruption.
• Exit Metamorphosis at ~750 Demonic Fury.
Demonology Warlock DPS involves building up Demonic Fury to then enter Metamorphosis and spend the Demonic Fury on powerful demon form abilities. To build Demonic Fury, maintain Corruption and use Hand of Gul'dan as much as possible without overwriting Shadowflame. Use Soul Fire to consume Molten Core procs. Use Shadow Bolt as a filler spell.

When Demonic Fury goes above 900, activate Metamorphosis. Now, maintain Metamorphosis: Doom at all times. Use Metamorphosis: Touch of Chaos as a filler spell or to refresh your Corruption. When Demonic Fury goes below 750, end Metamorphosis and resume the Demonic Fury Building rotation. Only stay in Metamorphosis below 750 Demonic Fury if Dark Soul: Knowledge is still up or the target will die in < 30 sec.

It is worth noting that the core Metamorphosis abilities replace your caster form abilities on your action bar. Metamorphosis: Doom replaces Corruption and Metamorphosis: Touch of Chaos replaces Shadow Bolt.

Demon: Use the Summon Felguard as your pet for single target DPS. Activate its Felguard: Felstorm with Command Demon as often as possible.

AoE Rotation - 5.0.5

• Hand of Gul'dan
• Harvest Life
• Metamorphosis: Void Ray
• Metamorphosis: Immolation Aura

In caster form, apply Corruption on as many targets as possible while casting Hand of Gul'dan on cooldown. Use Harvest Life as a filler (if available) to help build Demonic Fury.
If Metamorphosis is ready, activate it and apply Metamorphosis: Doom to as many targets as possible. Use Metamorphosis: Void Ray to refresh any Corruption you cast earlier. Finally, activate Metamorphosis: Immolation Aura. You may use Carrion Swarm as long as the knock back is not a problem.

Demon: Use Command Demon with the Summon Felguard to activate its Felguard: Felstorm ability for AoE DPS.

Effective Cooldowns - 5.0.5

These effective cooldowns are available if you chose them in your talent build.
• Kil'jaeden's Cunning Use as needed for penalty-free casting during raid movement.
• Grimoire of Service Use on cooldown for a 2nd Summon Felguard.

These are effective cooldowns to try and incorporate into most all encounters.
• Dark Soul: Knowledge Use on cooldown. Stack with Metamorphosis.
• Summon Infernal Use for burst AoE DPS. Exclusive with Summon Doomguard.
• Summon Doomguard Use for burst single target DPS. Exclusive with Summon Infernal.
--
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Good times with Great people in the Best way to spend $15/mo.

Intelligence is no substitute for Character.

Noxxic Demo Spec Recommendation

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.1

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 17:22:38 EDT

stonhinge posted : I agree with you on the Demonology change. I liked Metamorphosis being a cooldown, instead of switching in and out. Maybe it'll just take some getting used to. I went Destro for now leveling up, perhaps once I hit 90 and dungeons I'll give Demo another shot.

And yeah, I avoided Affliction because of the watching DoTs/timers/cooldowns bit.
--
When the ship lifts, all bills are paid. No regrets.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 16:45:33 EDT

Nick D posted :

said by Goldheart:

Ah right, Dark Soul: Instability does increase crit chance by 30% for 20 seconds.

The glyph of Dark Soul has a passive bonus of 3% to crit (except on cooldown) but at the cost of only 20% bonus. Could be useful.

This might be implied, but to be specific ...

The glyph is only good if you expect Dark Soul to be off cooldown due to sandbagging for higher damage phases or some such. Otherwise, it should generally be on CD constantly, so it ends up being a pure nerf.

That said, I use it for questing because I'm not usually blowing DS to kill 3 mobs.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.1

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 16:40:09 EDT

Carpie posted : I'm with you Goldheart, Destro seems much simpler to me as well. I was Destro pre-MOP but when I say the gap in the noxxic stats, I switched over to Aff for MOP. Before long I was switching back and forth between Destro and Aff; I think leveling for me was about the same either way, it was more of a boredom issue with Aff. (plus I like to burn shit)(I love to listen to the sound of the crackle in my head phones as those fire spells heat up). At some point though I was outdoing dps with destro so I never went back to Aff. Now that I'm in the dungeons and raids and there is so much need for AOE, Aff is probably the better choice (though some are holding out for the cataclysm spell in 5.1).

I think if I went Aff for any extended period of time I'd have to switch all my macros over to mouseover macros.

One last thing, one site that I never see mentioned much that I like to use for reference is maxdps.com. It lists out the top 30 or so pieces of gear for each slot and the dps contributed by each. Helps especially when leveling to see whether it is really worth swapping out for that new higher ilvl piece when you just gemmed and enchanted the existing one.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 16:35:06 EDT

Goldheart posted : Ah right, Dark Soul: Instability does increase crit chance by 30% for 20 seconds.

The glyph of Dark Soul has a passive bonus of 3% to crit (except on cooldown) but at the cost of only 20% bonus. Could be useful.

Re: [Classes] Warlock 5.0.5

Wed, 07 Nov 2012 16:33:13 EDT

Jodokast posted : its ok, im at work and dont have all the spells memorized, ill update tomarrow once i get my facts straight :-)