CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
| Verizon not going to replace copper damaged by Sandy It seems that wdoa  was right in asking:
quote:
We all know Verizon wants to ditch their copper plant, might they in some cases use this an excuse to just decide not to fix the landline infrustructure?
From what I am seeing, Verizon has no intention of replacing the copper cables damaged by hurricane Sandy. I have personally been told this by two separate managers and other techs have been told this too. Verizon's 'plan' is to migrate all effected copper customers to FIOS whether they want it or not. I have even heard reports from fellow techs that some customers are not even being informed the work being done is to move them into FIOS. The maintenance crews are still saving what the can but no replacement copper is being hung and the copper repair techs are being told there is no work.
Since the Wednesday after the storm, the company has declared a 'state of emergency' and is forcing the techs to work 12 hr days, 7 days a week. Strangely though, much of the work we are doing has nothing to do with damage from the storm. It makes one wonder if anyone is checking on what they submit to FEMA. FIOS is being repaired and cables replaced where needed... new installs are proceeding like nothing happened. It seems that people are too concerned with electricity and gasoline to think about the phones.
Bottom line is if your POTS line isn't working in another week or so... it probably never will be. Your line will eventually be moved to FIOS... if it is available and when they get to it. You could also cancel your line and just use wireless; your only other option will be the Cable company. Don't know how small businesses are going to feel about that. There will also be T1s effected but I don't know how they are going to handle them. |
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 KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK | I'm sure they'll roll it into storm expenses!
Probably take a tax write off as well on the "expenses" of "Storm losses" that are actually NOTHING TO DO WITH THE STORM.
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"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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 pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | reply to CXM_Splicer
I think this is a good idea. Why keep a damaged and obsolete copper wire infrastructure when you can replace it with something more reliable?
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USA 2012 - the mooches won. |
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CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| There are a couple of reasons:
- Because FIOS is not available everywhere the copper was damaged
- The regulations are different for FIOS and people should not be forced on to it
- It will take much longer to move people into FIOS as opposed to simply fixing the copper
- In all likelihood, FEMA is giving them money to FIX the copper... not ignore it.
For an area that isn't livable right now and must be completely rebuilt I can see Verizon doing this; there is no reason to put copper into a greenfield area. Where there are people living and businesses trying to open this should be illegal. |
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| reply to KrK
Those assets are still changed into expenses which doesn't nothing to help Verizon's income statement. |
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 rit56
join:2000-12-01
New York, NY | reply to CXM_Splicer
And when the next storm rolls around no service. Copper wired phones have electric backup and people here I know with old landlines still had access to the world. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | reply to CXM_Splicer
said by CXM_Splicer:- In all likelihood, FEMA is giving them money to FIX the copper... not ignore it. I think that is insane. Shouldn't Verizon or whoever the local phone company is be expected to have some form of private insurance, or money set aside, to fix these things?
Verizon was a Fortune 10 company the last time I checked. They don't need corporate welfare. If I am expected to save up my own cash or have insurance to cover the costs of catastrophic losses for my stuff, then so should they.
This and every other disaster proves that FEMA is the biggest, saddest joke of a government agency. They literally cannot do anything right, period. Perhaps it IS time to disband it and simply let states and local government have access to these funds so they can do their own disaster preparation instead. Consider how California responds to an earthquake, or how Florida responds to a hurricane. They seem to be far more on top of things than the federal government ever will.
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USA 2012 - the mooches won. |
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 LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5 | said by pnh102:said by CXM_Splicer:- In all likelihood, FEMA is giving them money to FIX the copper... not ignore it. I think that is insane. Shouldn't Verizon or whoever the local phone company is be expected to have some form of private insurance, or money set aside, to fix these things? Verizon was a Fortune 10 company the last time I checked. They don't need corporate welfare. If I am expected to save up my own cash or have insurance to cover the costs of catastrophic losses for my stuff, then so should they. This and every other disaster proves that FEMA is the biggest, saddest joke of a government agency. They literally cannot do anything right, period. Perhaps it IS time to disband it and simply let states and local government have access to these funds so they can do their own disaster preparation instead. Consider how California responds to an earthquake, or how Florida responds to a hurricane. They seem to be far more on top of things than the federal government ever will. Your attack on FEMA is based on one posters speculation that they're giving money to Verizon. I have found no proof of that anywhere. |
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| Anyway... next disaster how would we survive without the Feeble Excuse Making Agency? It's a tough job... but SOMEONE has to do it. |
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| Go ahead and knock FEMA, until you need it, you will be the first in line. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | said by lv66vette:Go ahead and knock FEMA, until you need it, you will be the first in line. At which point you will be like the poor saps in New Orleans and New York who did not heed the warnings and prepare. Starving and without energy.
We should all simply accept that when (not if) disaster strikes, you will be on your own and no government help will come at all. Plan and prepare accordingly. It is not that hard to do.
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USA 2012 - the mooches won. |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | reply to Linklist
said by Linklist:Your attack on FEMA is based on one posters speculation that they're giving money to Verizon. I have found no proof of that anywhere.
This is government we are talking about. It is prudent to assume they are always doing the wrong thing until proven otherwise.
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USA 2012 - the mooches won. |
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 alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA | reply to CXM_Splicer
said by CXM_Splicer:There are a couple of reasons:
- Because FIOS is not available everywhere the copper was damaged
- The regulations are different for FIOS and people should not be forced on to it
- It will take much longer to move people into FIOS as opposed to simply fixing the copper
- In all likelihood, FEMA is giving them money to FIX the copper... not ignore it.
For an area that isn't livable right now and must be completely rebuilt I can see Verizon doing this; there is no reason to put copper into a greenfield area. Where there are people living and businesses trying to open this should be illegal.
This is Old Union Mentality, replace Obsolete Copper for job security. You can't fix Copper you have to replace it, so why not do it with Fiber. Copper is even more expensive these days. So spend the money wisely and put it into Fiber connecting equipment that is not obsolete and going to be taken out soon. Verizon in a crises like this does not worry about where the funds are coming from, they could sort that out later. Like I said before, Verizon main concern is The Customer, but they will work in the fastest, most efficient way possible, and utilize their funds effectively. |
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| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102:said by lv66vette:Go ahead and knock FEMA, until you need it, you will be the first in line. At which point you will be like the poor saps in New Orleans and New York who did not heed the warnings and prepare. Starving and without energy. We should all simply accept that when (not if) disaster strikes, you will be on your own and no government help will come at all. Plan and prepare accordingly. It is not that hard to do. How many people DIED in New Orleans waiting for the Feeble Excuse Making Agency? You BETTER be prepared to take care of yourself, because Washington won't.
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Isn't it sad that those that raise their right hand and swear "to support and defend the Constitution of the United States of America" are usually the ones most likely to trash it. |
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CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
1 edit | reply to alchav
quote:
This is Old Union Mentality, replace Obsolete Copper for job security. You can't fix Copper you have to replace it, so why not do it with Fiber. Copper is even more expensive these days. So spend the money wisely and put it into Fiber connecting equipment that is not obsolete and going to be taken out soon. Verizon in a crises like this does not worry about where the funds are coming from, they could sort that out later. Like I said before, Verizon main concern is The Customer, but they will work in the fastest, most efficient way possible, and utilize their funds effectively.
Strangely, your post didn't address a single one of the problems I brought up. Your dismissal as 'old union mentality' isn't going to help the people who will be out for months waiting for a FIOS roll-out nor the people who live in areas without a franchise (IOW, no chance of FIOS).
There is little doubt in anyone's mind that the shareholders are Verizon's main concern; pretending otherwise is akin to believing in Santa Claus. |
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CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| reply to Linklist
said by Linklist:Your attack on FEMA is based on one posters speculation that they're giving money to Verizon. I have found no proof of that anywhere.
TRUST ME... if someone else wasn't paying the bill, Verizon wouldn't have us working 12 hr days, 7 days a week; they have lobbied away most of the regulations that would require them to expedite repairs. Verizon has to declare a 'State of emergency' (which forces us to work) in order to get the bucks from Uncle Sam. I don't have proof that it is FEMA but it seems likely since they are tasked with infrastructure recovery... the managers quite openly state we get money from them. Maybe it was just a coincidence that immediately after the FEMA relief fund for hurricane Irene was closed, Verizon's emergency was over and our overtime cut. I will try to dig up some documentation tomorrow at work. |
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1 edit | reply to CXM_Splicer
said by CXM_Splicer: There is little doubt in anyone's mind that the shareholders are Verizon's main concern; pretending otherwise is akin to believing in Santa Claus.
There IS a Santa Claus, for Verizon anyway. It's name was Sandy this time, and came just a little early and Verizon is going to Ho Ho Ho all the way to the bank.
Before you start, there's a Tooth Fairy too. She rips the gold crowns from taxpayers mouths at night to pay for it all. Her initials are I.R.S.
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Isn't it sad that those that raise their right hand and swear "to support and defend the Constitution of the United States of America" are usually the ones most likely to trash it. |
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alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA | reply to CXM_Splicer
said by CXM_Splicer: quote:
This is Old Union Mentality, replace Obsolete Copper for job security. You can't fix Copper you have to replace it, so why not do it with Fiber. Copper is even more expensive these days. So spend the money wisely and put it into Fiber connecting equipment that is not obsolete and going to be taken out soon. Verizon in a crises like this does not worry about where the funds are coming from, they could sort that out later. Like I said before, Verizon main concern is The Customer, but they will work in the fastest, most efficient way possible, and utilize their funds effectively.
Strangely, your post didn't address a single one of the problems I brought up. Your dismissal as 'old union mentality' isn't going to help the people who will be out for months waiting for a FIOS roll-out nor the people who live in areas without a franchise (IOW, no chance of FIOS). There is little doubt in anyone's mind that the shareholders are Verizon's main concern; pretending otherwise is akin to believing in Santa Claus. Remember we are mainly talking about Phone Service, replacing the Copper only deals with Phone and maybe old DSL Internet.
- Because FIOS is not available everywhere the copper was damaged.
Verizon is a Service Company, and they will work with what is available to serve their Customers as fast and efficiently as possible. If there is Fiber there they will use it, if not Verizon will make plans to run Fiber or in some cases where this is not feasible existing Copper will be replaced. A Service Company is there to provide Service.
- The regulations are different for FIOS and people should not be forced on to it.
Regulations for Phone are no different whether on Copper or Fiber. Most people will not know the difference as long as they get Dial Tone.
- It will take much longer to move people into FIOS as opposed to simply fixing the copper.
If the Fiber is there all they have to do is install the Interface Equipment and fire it up Dial Tone is there. Should be no problem.
- In all likelihood, FEMA is giving them money to FIX the copper... not ignore it.
Like I said, Verizon is not worried about the funding, they are a Service Company, and they will provide Service to their Customers in the fastest most efficient way. |
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CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| quote:
Verizon is a Service Company, and they will work with what is available to serve their Customers as fast and efficiently as possible. If there is Fiber there they will use it, if not Verizon will make plans to run Fiber or in some cases where this is not feasible existing Copper will be replaced. A Service Company is there to provide Service.
I guess you didn't understand my first post... existing copper is NOT being replaced, that's the point. If you want to pretend that it is, why not just save yourself a step and pretend their phones are already fixed?
quote:
Regulations for Phone are no different whether on Copper or Fiber. Most people will not know the difference as long as they get Dial Tone.
Wrong. FIOS is VoIP, are you familiar with it? Try and call your state PSC and tell them your Vonage or Magic Jack isn't working and you want to file a complaint.
quote:
If the Fiber is there all they have to do is install the Interface Equipment and fire it up Dial Tone is there. Should be no problem.
Well, that I almost agree with... at least those people will get dial tone back. Problem is many don't want FIOS; as was just made perfectly clear, it is unreliable in a power outage. Many don't want to be responsible for replacing a backup battery. Many don't want a large box added to the side of their house. Many don't want to wait the weeks or months it will take to get FIOS to them.
What about the people where the fiber isn't there? What should I tell them?
How about the people who aren't getting fiber and who's copper isn't getting fixed? What should I tell them? Just that it 'should be no problem'? |
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alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA | quote:
Verizon is a Service Company, and they will work with what is available to serve their Customers as fast and efficiently as possible. If there is Fiber there they will use it, if not Verizon will make plans to run Fiber or in some cases where this is not feasible existing Copper will be replaced. A Service Company is there to provide Service.
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I guess you didn't understand my first post... existing copper is NOT being replaced, that's the point. If you want to pretend that it is, why not just save yourself a step and pretend their phones are already fixed?
I said Verizon is a Service Company, and if the Copper is not being replaced there is a good reason. Fiber is a better Infrastructure, and Verizon is probably headed in that direction. quote:
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Regulations for Phone are no different whether on Copper or Fiber. Most people will not know the difference as long as they get Dial Tone.
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Wrong. FIOS is VoIP, are you familiar with it? Try and call your state PSC and tell them your Vonage or Magic Jack isn't working and you want to file a complaint.
Splicer, I know you mean well but you are way off base, FiOS Phone is not VoIP it is a form of Packet Switching. The Phone Data comes over Fiber to the Interface Equipment, and out the RJ11 Jack over the Home Copper Wiring. To the Average Person it's transparent, the Dial Tone sounds a little different. I have an Ooma Line which is VoIP and connected to my Router and the calls come over my Internet connection. Another Digital Phone is TWC that comes over Coax to their Modem...Packet Switching. quote:
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If the Fiber is there all they have to do is install the Interface Equipment and fire it up Dial Tone is there. Should be no problem.
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Well, that I almost agree with... at least those people will get dial tone back. Problem is many don't want FIOS; as was just made perfectly clear, it is unreliable in a power outage. Many don't want to be responsible for replacing a backup battery. Many don't want a large box added to the side of their house. Many don't want to wait the weeks or months it will take to get FIOS to them.
What about the people where the fiber isn't there? What should I tell them?
How about the people who aren't getting fiber and who's copper isn't getting fixed? What should I tell them? Just that it 'should be no problem'?
You are correct FiOS does have some draw backs, the biggest being Power. Sometimes progress has it's short comings, but I'm sure in the future this will be worked out. Bottom line is that Copper Equipment is obsolete and will be eliminated. If the Fiber is not there it will be laid, and like I said, if it's not feasible to run Fiber I'm sure Copper will be used. Verizon will not leave anyone without Service. |
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