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TSI Marc
Premium,VIP
join:2006-06-23
Chatham, ON
kudos:28
reply to MaynardKrebs

Re: [DSL] VDSL - 25/7 Congestion

said by MaynardKrebs:

said by TSI Marc:

said by HiVolt:

Marc (or Gabe), have you heard if Bell has lifted the rate limiting yet?

Next week

Your answer is imprecise - which is atypical of an engineer....but then again you didn't go to Skule(tm)

Which is it:

a) You're going to hear from Bell next week IF they're fix the rate limiting sometime in the future (ie. when hell freezes over)?
or
b) Bell will have the problem fixed next week?

It was lifted last week.
--
Marc - CEO/TekSavvy


Phibian

join:2009-06-01
Ottawa, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

Still seeing an average of 2% packet loss over the past 10 days. Seems to be only during peak times and is not due to saturation on my end (dual 25/10 mlppp with fairly light usage).

Can you confirm that this is now no longer related to the Bell links? Or is there still a capacity issue at certain times of the day?


UnixMan

join:2012-10-14

+1

I've been seeing such congestion since first day I switched to 25/7 last summer. I just never complained. I have the same configuration as Phibian (double 25/10 mlppp). It seems to me it's happening to all TekSavvy customers and only at peak hours of the day. So, what Bell/TekSavvy lifted last week is still a question.



Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to crazypants

Not seeing any congestion issues at 8:20 PM:


--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org



Mike2009

join:2009-01-13
Ottawa, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

My speeds suck every night for many months now. This is on a 19 meg profile.



This is what my speeds look like during the daytime.


UnixMan

join:2012-10-14
reply to Guspaz

Here is my result at ~9:30 PM. Note, this is double 25/10 connection. If it's not peak times I'm getting ~48/8 (slow upload because of distance to the crappy IKNS remote). I'm in GTA, not Montreal.


Phibian

join:2009-06-01
Ottawa, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to Guspaz

It really seems to fluctuate a lot. Sometimes things are fine sometimes not so much. If they are running close to capacity it would likely depend on the particular link that a given customer is on at the time. Some links might be saturated and others not (right?).

I've got smokeping running from my router to the TSI gateway (next hop) as well as a range of other hosts. I've also got the reverse setup (external system with smokeping running) and it sees the TSI gateway just fine (no packet loss) but getting to my IP I get the ~2% loss again. So it looks like the issue is in the Bell link area of things.

Given that I never used to have packet loss issues and others seem to be seeing similar loss I assumed that it was due to capacity issues on the links. My line stats are fine (loads of room to spare). The issues also come and go with the time of day (again suggesting capacity issue rather than line problems). Does it make any difference if I'm running in MLPPP mode versus someone who's not (I think I saw that you're not these days)? I vaguely remember reading something about all MLPPP connections being routed over one link? That doesn't sound right to me but I'm not an expert in that area.

My thinking is that TSI is purposefully running (too) close to capacity and waiting for the CRTC descision to come down before ordering more links. While I can understand that they are between a rock and a hard place I also don't like having my VoIP go choppy on me due to packet loss.



Mike2009

join:2009-01-13
Ottawa, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to UnixMan

Hmmm... better results with Speedtest.net.



UnixMan

join:2012-10-14
reply to Phibian

For my MLPPP I'm using two separate phone lines (two modems) bonded by a Cisco router. All equipment is directly connected to the demarc point in my basement with short cords. Here is my ping from the Cisco router to the next hop which is a TekSavvy gateway:

router#ping 206.248.154.106 repeat 100
Type escape sequence to abort.
Sending 100, 100-byte ICMP Echos to 206.248.154.106, timeout is 2 seconds:
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.!
Success rate is 98 percent (98/100), round-trip min/avg/max = 20/26/144 ms
router#

As you can see there is 2% packets loss as well. Again, it happens only between ~7PM and 12AM every day.

I don't really know how to fight all these ISPs to provide high quality service to their customers. I would suggest mister TSI Marc & company to apply more power into solving lots of technical problems like this congestion, broken CS with extremely long hold time etc. instead of focusing teenagers' attention on BS like Copyrights.


HiVolt
Premium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:21
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
·TekSavvy Cable

Well it's been a while since I tested, but I still can't hit 25meg down on the single threaded tests in peak hour... This is on Sunday 30th, 11:20pm





On a Bell login, no problems...


--
F**K THE NHL. Go Blue Jays 2013!!!



jmck
formerly 'shaded'

join:2010-10-02
Ottawa, ON

I'm confused why TSI continues to even sell DSL? You'd think they would hold off until new capacity was added.



Mike2009

join:2009-01-13
Ottawa, ON
kudos:3
reply to HiVolt

Interesting. If more people figure this out I'm sure they'll move their service to Bell. I'm not going anywhere at this point but it's the second major congestion issue I've gone through with Teksavvy in the past 3 years or so.


crazypants

join:2011-02-25
North York, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to zacron

downloadDoc1.docx.zip 96,877 bytes
said by zacron:

I am getting 2.5mb/1mb on a 25/10 connection... Yet when I switch to a bell login it's all hunky dory... have the AGAS lines been balanced out yet?

I'm using the Bell login and teksavvy login from within 10 minutes of each other and there is a BIG difference. This is not even at peak time. The multi-thread and download tests tell the true quality of TSI. DL test done at »www.thinkbroadband.com

475KB/sec Teksavvy Login
2.9MB/sec Bell Login

crazypants

join:2011-02-25
North York, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to jmck

Good question. People thought it was only them since they didn't see any issues on the forum.

TSI said nothing will be done until the rates were lifted. Does this mean that it is immediate or do we have to wait for upgrades to go through in time?



zacron
Premium
join:2008-11-26
canada

It has to do with aggrigate bandwidth on bell's network... the problem is simply that bells per-megabit cost is incredibly excessive and anti-competitive. Unfortunately, the truth is that TSI must be loosing alot of cash in this one.

Until the CRTC sets reasonable rates, there probably wont be any upgrades soon. The cost is greater than the 79.99/mth they get now.

My $0.02
--
"Recognize, Realize, and Repent"


crazypants

join:2011-02-25
North York, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

Since this is the case, shaded's point is a valid one. If TSI can't afford to upgrade and is losing money, then there should be a stop sell. They can't keep on accepting new accounts if they are aware of this congestion. I do sympathize with TSI, but customers are paying $68 a month and they should get a reasonable up-to speed.



dillyhammer
START me up
Premium
join:2010-01-09
Scarborough, ON
kudos:10
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile
·Start Communicat..

1 recommendation

said by crazypants:

customers are paying $68 a month and they should get a reasonable up-to speed.

For every DSLr user that would come here and lambast TSI for a weak connection, there are 20 Gramma Jones's and 20 Uncle Bobs that'll pay $68 a month every month without ever looking at their bill and be thoroughly ignorant of what they're getting for that $68. They connect. They get their email. They look at their Facebook. They're happy. That's it that's all.

Customers like us that are analyzing every bloody bit byte and baud are a total pain in the ass and barely worth the trouble.

Mike
--
Cogeco - The New UBB Devil -»[Burloak] Usage Based Billing Nightmare
Cogeco UBB, No Modem Required - »[Niagara] 40gb of "usage" while the modem is unplugged

crazypants

join:2011-02-25
North York, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

With the way the internet is going today (more YouTube, Hulu, Netfix, HD content etc.), customers are not just using the internet for email and social media anymore. TSI got it so bad by customers on the cable side when areas were chronically congested. TSI Marc himself said that the focus is on cable, so DSL is a back burner issue.

I think you would agreed that the issue with customers on the incumbent networks is they hit the overages and just silently pay the bill whatever it is. TSI customers demand more because we use more and were fed up with paying the incumbents for exceeding the caps.



Phibian

join:2009-06-01
Ottawa, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

1 recommendation

reply to dillyhammer

True, but... Grammas and Uncles also get unhappy when their VoIP is choppy (and more and more of them are using VoIP). They just don't understand why it is choppy.

Also don't forget that lots of them are only with TSI because the techies amoung us as telling them to sign up with TSI. Given no external input who do you think the Grammas and Uncles will go with? That's right, Bell or Rogers (at least around here). Most of them will have never heard of TSI otherwise.

I don't demand perfection from TSI. I demand a reasonable effort to to their best for their customers. I work with technology and I understand that things happen. But if the lines are saturated to the point that it is causing problems (albeit minor ones for now) for all of their DSL customers (who until recently where the meat and potatoes), and probably still represent the bulk of the techies, I think that needs addressing.


morisato

join:2008-03-16
Oshawa, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·TekSavvy DSL
·ELECTRONICBOX
reply to crazypants

Myself i don't really Mind getting 12-15 meg During prime time in the slighest I consider that Perfectly acceptable UP to speeds. i do all my downloading in the free window anyways. Packet loss is not an issue for me atm if it becomes one and affects my voip or gaming then tek will have a mad me until then i am good p:)
--
Every time Someone leaves Sympatico an Angel gets its wings.


crazypants

join:2011-02-25
North York, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

My main internet activity is live tv streaming in the evenings. I would be happy with 12-15 meg during prime time because it would be enough for this purpose, but the fluctuations in the bit rate causes constant buffering. I myself don't download because there's nothing worth downloading IMHO.


Calmuser

join:2011-10-27
Canada
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

Hmm, this is still going on?

Still in my deciding mode on who to switch too when my Bell promo rate ends.

This congestion issue does not bode well in my book...

Would of prob gotten my neighbour to switch too, but not with these issues.

Maybe I should consider *shudder* Acanac!



jmck
formerly 'shaded'

join:2010-10-02
Ottawa, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
·Start Communicat..
reply to dillyhammer

said by dillyhammer:

said by crazypants:

customers are paying $68 a month and they should get a reasonable up-to speed.

For every DSLr user that would come here and lambast TSI for a weak connection, there are 20 Gramma Jones's and 20 Uncle Bobs that'll pay $68 a month every month without ever looking at their bill and be thoroughly ignorant of what they're getting for that $68. They connect. They get their email. They look at their Facebook. They're happy. That's it that's all.

Customers like us that are analyzing every bloody bit byte and baud are a total pain in the ass and barely worth the trouble.

Mike

i don't really think that is TSI's target market. it's also really bad form to oversell a service, this isn't the 90s anymore.

keltron

join:2012-12-26
North York, ON

I still think I'll make the speed upgrade from my 5mbit profile instead of switching to a Bell profile.

I can probably still live with the Teksavvy bandwidth inconsistencies as they are offset by Teksavvy's overage policies - Bell's max overage charges are 125GB and $80 Max (vs Teksavvy's 200GB and $20 + off peak hours)...

Bell's ability to give me true to speed will just bring me closer to their max cap

Anyone disagree with my reasoning?


crazypants

join:2011-02-25
North York, ON

Yeah I think we all agree that you are better off staying with Teksavvy's just for the awful 125GB cap and $80 Max for overage which would pay for a 2nd TSI account!



Mike2009

join:2009-01-13
Ottawa, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to jmck

said by jmck:

said by dillyhammer:

said by crazypants:

customers are paying $68 a month and they should get a reasonable up-to speed.

For every DSLr user that would come here and lambast TSI for a weak connection, there are 20 Gramma Jones's and 20 Uncle Bobs that'll pay $68 a month every month without ever looking at their bill and be thoroughly ignorant of what they're getting for that $68. They connect. They get their email. They look at their Facebook. They're happy. That's it that's all.

Customers like us that are analyzing every bloody bit byte and baud are a total pain in the ass and barely worth the trouble.

Mike

i don't really think that is TSI's target market. it's also really bad form to oversell a service, this isn't the 90s anymore.

Their customer base changed when they started advertising on billboards, buses and on TV.


jmck
formerly 'shaded'

join:2010-10-02
Ottawa, ON

dupe.


sunnyd71

join:2004-05-22
l7z2t4
reply to crazypants

Does the crtc have any hearings or proceedings scheduled for this topic (interconnection rates) currently?



zacron
Premium
join:2008-11-26
canada
reply to crazypants

Bell's network seems to have an issue at the AGGREGATION point in the centre. For two or three days it's major packet loss.

Z
--
"Recognize, Realize, and Repent"


UnixMan

join:2012-10-14
reply to sunnyd71

TekSavvy, can somebody comment the issue and shed the light on any upcoming plans to finally fix this?

It seems like it's going to be ignored as a major problem. If so, then there should be an option for customers to pay up to $60 (in my case 2x$60) for such "up to" service!!!