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bitchtorn

join:2006-10-11
Peterborough, ON

Employment test

Hi guy's

We are hiring for a I.S. Tech II position. (2-5 years exp) Considering having applicants write a test in hopes of weeding out some folks.

Is this good practice? Do others here do it?

Also, how hard / easy should we make this thing? -considering the whole job interview/application process can be stressful to begin with.

Any good recommended test questions?



donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON

Having been on the other side of those tests before I have one suggestion. Have someone NOT in IT read it. I have seen on many occasions where the following is true:

1. Grammar so poor no one knows what the question is actually asking and the poor HR person has no idea.

2. Be specific in what the question is asking (ie in what environment, etc) as the answer may vary. In your mind you may be asking about how it is in your environment but that applicant does not know that unless you are specific.

3. Do not use internal company jargon. I had one test that used a term I had never heard before. When I got home I googled it, no one else had either. The HR person could not explain it either, of course.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.



DC DSL
There's a reason I'm Command.
Premium
join:2000-07-30
Washington, DC
kudos:2
Reviews:
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reply to bitchtorn
Tests that are of the multiple choice or simple Q&A types only tell part of an applicant's story. The tests I use focus more on someone's realtime problem-solving abilities instead of their ability to regurgitate what they read in books. Hit them with "in your own words" scenarios of "Such-and-such happened. What do you do?" or "Document the process for performing _____ for a formal Procedures Manual." Draw upon things that actually have occurred/regularly occur in your environment. Mix it up for the heck of it by throwing in 1 or 2 really arcane/obscure things, and a couple that are totally bogus and see how long it takes them to realize it's a wild goose chase.

Individuals who are inarticulate or lacking in the ability to figure things out on their feet will derail on the spot. Be sure you know what you want to see, and realize that there usually are multiple routes to an acceptable outcome. Engage in discussion with those who make it through to further weed-out the weaker candidates. Without knowing your environment or the job description of an "IS Tech II" in your realm makes it difficult to give any more specific suggestions.
--
"Dance like the photo isn't being tagged; love like you've never been unfriended; and tweet like nobody is following."



bitchtorn

join:2006-10-11
Peterborough, ON

reply to bitchtorn
This job will basically its the next step from basic help desk type duties.

We have 30 or so locations spread out over Ontario, this person will need to love driving & doing yearly workstation roll outs / site visits when hardware fails.

This person will need to have a wide variety of IT troubleshooting skills, as we use lots of custom software that can be tough to troubleshoot with 3rd parties.

Kind of looking for a jack of all trades.
-Good understanding of Networking.
-Good understanding of active directory / windows, etc
-Some knowledge of linux/unix.
-Good with Hardware
-Self motivated & trustworthy.

It is in the finance field.


netboy34

join:2001-08-29
Kennesaw, GA
kudos:1

reply to bitchtorn

said by donoreo:

2. Be specific in what the question is asking (ie in what environment, etc) as the answer may vary. In your mind you may be asking about how it is in your environment but that applicant does not know that unless you are specific.

This +100
I just got done with an interview a week and a half ago where a question was missing one crucial word that changed the answer. The asker actually corrected himself after my answer cause he realized it too late. I still got the job, but it made him look bad in front of his superiors.

I would throw some general knowledge questions from A+ and Net+ practice tests, some basic command line troubleshooting (what does IPconfig /release do), microsoft tools (how would you add a user to a group through ADUC) etc.

Rajarshi

join:2012-10-26
New York, NY

reply to DC DSL

said by DC DSL:

Tests that are of the multiple choice or simple Q&A types only tell part of an applicant's story. The tests I use focus more on someone's realtime problem-solving abilities instead of their ability to regurgitate what they read in books. Hit them with "in your own words" scenarios of "Such-and-such happened. What do you do?" or "Document the process for performing _____ for a formal Procedures Manual." Draw upon things that actually have occurred/regularly occur in your environment. Mix it up for the heck of it by throwing in 1 or 2 really arcane/obscure things, and a couple that are totally bogus and see how long it takes them to realize it's a wild goose chase.

Individuals who are inarticulate or lacking in the ability to figure things out on their feet will derail on the spot. Be sure you know what you want to see, and realize that there usually are multiple routes to an acceptable outcome. Engage in discussion with those who make it through to further weed-out the weaker candidates. Without knowing your environment or the job description of an "IS Tech II" in your realm makes it difficult to give any more specific suggestions.

This is not acceptable. You would discriminate against not american employee specific to Indian. Indian education is superior with no time wasting on material not in course books. Such material is not necessary for help desk expertise with proper instruction provided. The A+ Certification provides absolute demonstration of expert. Test is absolutely not required for expert of programming because degree certifies.


DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
kudos:3

reply to netboy34
also

when do you want to do ipconfig /release and not just ipconfig /renew?

and I'd say review the questions with piers, I know sometimes I see a question that to someone not at that exact enviro can be ambiguous.



DC DSL
There's a reason I'm Command.
Premium
join:2000-07-30
Washington, DC
kudos:2
Reviews:
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reply to Rajarshi
Dude, what *are* you smoking? Anyone who would base a hiring decision solely on someone having a degree or certification does not belong in that capacity. I gather you are an H-1B worker. If so, then you really do not understand how it works for everyone else. Non-visa workers are not just passed around from company to company; They must differentiate themselves with competence and ability.
--
"Dance like the photo isn't being tagged; love like you've never been unfriended; and tweet like nobody is following."



LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada

reply to Rajarshi

said by Rajarshi:

This is not acceptable. You would discriminate against not american employee specific to Indian. Indian education is superior with no time wasting on material not in course books. Such material is not necessary for help desk expertise with proper instruction provided. The A+ Certification provides absolute demonstration of expert. Test is absolutely not required for expert of programming because degree certifies.

Really?

A+ / Net+ / CCNE means you know how to memorize and pass a multiple guess test... I know, I've got them.

The ability to understand an issue, as would be commonly presented from the end user, and come up with an acceptable course of action is critical in an help-desk type role...

My personal thought - why re-invent the wheel, take some actual tickets or scenarios that the candidate may be faced with in the role, and present them - not as a pass/fail, but more so as insight into the person's thought process - do they think the right way? Specific programs and skills can be taught to someone with the right mindset and natural apptitudes.

Of course, that does require a technical person to either do the interview, or review the results - it's not pass/fail the way HR likes it...


bitchtorn

join:2006-10-11
Peterborough, ON

reply to bitchtorn
Thanks for the suggestions guys!

I like the help desk ticket ideas... and also the no right or wrong written question & answers. Seeing how a person thinks and troubleshoots problems under a bit of pressure can really give some insight on how they would perform in the field.

Also think its important that we keep the questions on neutral ground as these people are not expected to know *our* environment.

Raj - we are a equal opportunity employer, in fact in some areas around here the "minority is the majority". We are not located in the USA.

We don't hire I.T. people often. When we do, I like to get a good egg.



Modus
I hate smartassery on forums
Premium
join:2005-05-02
us
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

reply to bitchtorn
I normally do is conduct a interview (technical questions range from advanced to simple) the answers they give dictate what questions i ask. If they do well enough then i ask them to come back for a hands technical test where i have a scenario that needs to be worked through, they don't have to get everything right but by them going through it i can gauge how think as well as how much they really know.

I can tell you that i recently just did this about 2 months ago and i interviewed about a 8 or 9 people....none of them matched what was on their resume's.
--
Think Ahead. Learn More. Solve Now!



Wily_One
Premium
join:2002-11-24
San Jose, CA

reply to Rajarshi

said by Rajarshi:

This is not acceptable. You would discriminate against not american employee specific to Indian. Indian education is superior with no time wasting on material not in course books. Such material is not necessary for help desk expertise with proper instruction provided. The A+ Certification provides absolute demonstration of expert. Test is absolutely not required for expert of programming because degree certifies.

LOL. I know exactly the kind of employee you're talking about: Unable to think outside the box. Having no clue what the big picture is, or even resembles. Yet sure in your "superior" knowledge of the subject matter but cannot perform basic tasks or put two and two together. Common sense a foreign concept.

Unfortunately, my company has quite a few people just like that.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
·Comcast
·Callcentric
·Site5.com

reply to DC DSL

said by DC DSL:

Tests that are of the multiple choice or simple Q&A types only tell part of an applicant's story. The tests I use focus more on someone's realtime problem-solving abilities instead of their ability to regurgitate what they read in books. Hit them with "in your own words" scenarios of "Such-and-such happened. What do you do?" or "Document the process for performing _____ for a formal Procedures Manual." Draw upon things that actually have occurred/regularly occur in your environment. Mix it up for the heck of it by throwing in 1 or 2 really arcane/obscure things, and a couple that are totally bogus and see how long it takes them to realize it's a wild goose chase.

Individuals who are inarticulate or lacking in the ability to figure things out on their feet will derail on the spot. Be sure you know what you want to see, and realize that there usually are multiple routes to an acceptable outcome. Engage in discussion with those who make it through to further weed-out the weaker candidates. Without knowing your environment or the job description of an "IS Tech II" in your realm makes it difficult to give any more specific suggestions.

This is just what we do as well. We test less on book and answers you can find on google. Everything is all about "This happened. What do you do?"

You put people in situations where they have to think on their feet and the ones that come up with solutions or a plan in their head are the ones that you want. The ones that just do well looking things up on google or study out of a book are going to fold in front of you.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net

ke4pym
Premium
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC
Reviews:
·VOIPo
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·Northland Cable ..

reply to bitchtorn
Usually, when I interview people for my team (and I've had to do a lot of it), I like to read over their resume and pick out a few key things that interest me.

For example, if someone lists Microsoft Clustering as a skill, I'll ask them to tell me what they've done with it in the past (SQL, File shares, NLB, some home-brew application that needs HA, etc). Then, branch out from there. Usually, the BS alarm will go off really fast if they have trouble answering technical questions about MSCS.

Then, if they don't have a lot of experience listed (which, in my book does not automagically rule them out) I like to ask what kind of setup they have at home.

If someone says "nothing much, just a pc and a router" then I'm going to start ruling them out.

But if I hear "well, I have a VM box running, and I have AD, Exchange, IIS, blah, blah, blah, big access point, blah, blah) then my ears perk up and I pay attention.

I usually like to let the rest of the interview group ask the technical questions. I like to try to figure out if the candidate's personality will fit on my team. While we're all geeky as can be, everyone on my team is outgoing and would not be pegged for being a geek out in the real world.



Kilroy
Premium,MVM
join:2002-11-21
Ann Arbor, MI

reply to bitchtorn
I had a company throw me a MS practice test. I did well since I'm certified, but an MS test isn't even close to a reflection of the real world.

Really this should be covered in your interview. One thing you forgot to mention is communication skills. This person need to understand on a technical level, but be able to explain in layman's terms. (I did this job for over a decade). You might toss the same questions an have them explain to you how they would handle it and what they would ask the end user.

I'd ask questions designed to show a good troubleshooting methodology.

For example, one user at a site can't get to the Internet, what do you do?

First they should discover if it has ever worked. Second, can anyone get access? Third, determine if they have any connectivity, ie does e-mail work, do internal system work, do they have an IP address on the network? Continue troubleshooting based up answer to question three.

What level of AD do they need? How your AD is configured?

Unless linux/unix is a large part this can be googled. I'll admit this is a weakness for me, but it doesn't come up in a Windows environment and if I'm using a linux boot disk I can google the commands I need.

Good with hardware how? Hardware repair, especially for laptops is not having a fear of taking them apart and knowing how to locate the tear down instructions. This can be addressed with questions also.

User is complaining of no video, what do you do? Their answer will let you know how they think. I always start with has it ever worked as this can save you a lot of time chasing your tail. After that you will see how they think and how much they know. If they want to reimage a machine for a hardware issue you know you don't have the right person.

But, it doesn't matter how good they are with the job, communication in this position is going to be key. If they can't communicate with end users you're going to have issues with them. Some people are front line techs, some are bench techs. Neither is better than the other, but the will do better in the correct position.
--
“Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something.” ¯ Robert A. Heinlein


ke4pym
Premium
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC
Reviews:
·VOIPo
·Verizon Broadban..
·RoadRunner Cable
·Northland Cable ..

said by Kilroy:

...
For example, one user at a site can't get to the Internet, what do you do?

First they should discover if it has ever worked. Second, can anyone get access? Third, determine if they have any connectivity, ie does e-mail work, do internal system work, do they have an IP address on the network? Continue troubleshooting based up answer to question three.

This reminds me of a time when I was exploring positions on other teams and was talking to the director of network services (data).

He decided to throw in what he thought was a simple question:

I vaguely recalling the question to be something like: "If you are at a remote facility, and you can ping the router, but nothing beyond the router, what would you do?"

I said "Blame the network".

The answer he was looking for was "It's never the network" (subnet mask was set wrong or pc had the wrong gateway were the other answers he was looking for).

Except, at that time, we were converting from statically assigned, publically accessable addresses to 10/8, DHCP assigned addresses. At the time, the team managing DHCP was part of the data networking group.

So, in the end, I was still right, because DHCP could have been handing out the wrong addresses. After much hemming and hawing, he gave me the win.

The only time I had to take a real skills test for employment, I made them re-write the answer sheet for OS/2. They weren't happy about that. But their test was written by an idiot who'd never used OS/2.

mikefxu

join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL

reply to bitchtorn
How about a weeks temporary position and if they look like a viable candidate put them on 90 day probation with possibility of hiring afterward.


ke4pym
Premium
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC
Reviews:
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·Verizon Broadban..
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said by mikefxu:

How about a weeks temporary position and if they look like a viable candidate put them on 90 day probation with possibility of hiring afterward.

We do this too. But its temp-to-hire on a 90 day basis.

Personally, if I were looking, I'd tell the company to pound sand if they only gave me a week to work on a trial basis.

mikefxu

join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL

said by ke4pym :

We do this too. But its temp-to-hire on a 90 day basis.

Personally, if I were looking, I'd tell the company to pound sand if they only gave me a week to work on a trial basis.

I think a week will tell you if personalities with mesh and if they are a total f**ktard.


bitchtorn

join:2006-10-11
Peterborough, ON

reply to bitchtorn
All our jobs come with the stranded 90 day probation policy.

Thanks for the feedback guys!


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