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JSheridan

join:2006-07-03
USA
reply to geotech

Re: Gen4 -or- Excede

Seems like nowadays everybody is entitled to fair pay except sat techs. According to all these 'experts' on the internet we're not only supposed to work for free but now we're supposed to buy the extra parts and supply them for free too.

said by geotech :

If one of my customers complains too much about how little i am asking then i ask them if they want to save $25 labor,
then i hand them the shovel. After the first rock they are willing to tip me even more for the back breaking work.
If that doesnt work, then I have them drive 25 miles to pick up the concrete for my next job.

said by JSheridan:

said by verizonlteda :

Yes you can buy them at lowes i did for 10 dollars when i had the hn9000 on hughes not hard find lol.

Installers over charge for them. concert ? really ? 4.99 at lowes man you guys are nuts.

You bought a thin walled fence post at Lowe's. Not only are they not approved but they are not nearly strong enough unless you do crummy work and don't care if it falls over. And yea, concrete is $4.99 a bag, times 3 bags is $15 plus tax right there. The poles are wholesale about $50, drill a hole through it with a high speed drill and expensive bit and put a big bolt so it doesn't spin. That costs money too. And I'm sure you would go shop for all this stuff, and then dig a hole in rocky soil and mix and pour the concrete for free? I won't. Like I said, $100 is a real bargain and it's worth at least $150 if done right.


greenwood903

join:2012-11-20
Wilmer, TX
reply to Lonely
I started installing exede a few months ago. Up till now, I would have never recommended sat internet. Here in the Dallas area we have been seeing 25-30 megs on exede. I would recommend it to anyone without the avail of cable or dsl.

neonjohn

join:2013-01-06
reply to Lonely5
said by Lonely5:

Well, I guess that will do. Dish had to put a pole in, so Exede will probably need to as well.

What about comparisons between Gen4 and Exede? Honestly I'm leaning towards Exede 100% and mainly due to the free download time. Someone fight against it, defend Gen4!

I can tell you how bad Gen4 is! We're an all-Linux shop with offices here in Tellico and San Diego. Been a Hughesnet customer for years. Had Gen4 installed last week. Shut me down almost completely. They're doing some sort of port 80 filtering that lets packets from browsers through but not port 80 http packets from things like SubVersion, Ubuntu Update Service (like windoze update service), Synaptics package manager (where one installs Ubuntu software from) and I'm not sure what else yet.

Breaking SubVersion is a disaster for us, as we use it not only for code versioning but also document and drawing management. I have a token windoze XP laptop, mainly so I can chkdsk SD cartridges after my camera corrupts them. I verified that SubVersion on windoze is also broken so it is not OS-specific

Reviewing the Hughsnet forum, this problem has existed since they rolled out Gen4 in November so apparently HNS has no intention of doing anything about it.

I came here to find out of Excede is doing any of the same stuff and to find out if Linux works OK with the service. Any comments in this regard are most welcome

Thanks
John
jgd@fluxeon.com

DrStrangLov

join:2012-03-28
kudos:1
reply to Lonely
said by Lonely5:

Linux works OK

I installed Linux Mint 14 the other day, updates/etc during install worked just fine for this Exede 5 user.

I have not tried to check for updates since then for this Linux version, but Windows updates work fine also.

A Tech

join:2008-11-10
reply to Lonely
In many areas of the country Gen4 has twice the available bandwidth as Excede. In others areas it is equal. I don't have a comparative map handy but you might want to consider this.

Kaosfury

join:2011-06-27
Altavista, VA
reply to Lonely
JSheridan is correct all the way, and sounds like a tech who does his job correctly.

pay the man $150 and get it done correctly.

DrStrangLov

join:2012-03-28
kudos:1
reply to A Tech
said by A Tech:

In many areas of the country Gen4 has twice the available bandwidth as Excede.

Just as a point of reference - I'm not aware of one ISP who buys extra bandwidth when it is not needed. These providers, with bean-counters fully in control of expenses, may buy more bandwidth when needed.

To my awareness, its been this way since early 90s when consumer ISPs came about.

neonjohn

join:2013-01-06
reply to Lonely
said by Lonely5:

Hello everyone!

I am trying to gather all knowledge I can before signing up for satellite internet for the first time. I was thinking to get Excede some time ago, then Gen4 sounded great, and then Excede sounded better... and that back and forth keeps going! I'm not sure which to go with, so I figured I would need to ask... at the moment I am leaning towards Excede.

Thanks

Two weeks ago I upgraded my Hughsnet system to Gen4. Today I cancelled the service and scheduled Exede to be installed Thursday. The time between the two events has been spent pulling out my hair, trying to figure out why most everything broke, dealing with hour hold times and off-shore tech support, "we don't support Linux" BS and so on. Here's the deal.

I live in a very remote fishing resort. I'm a semi-retired engineer who does most of his work over the net so reliable internet service is absolutely vital. Hughesnet fulfilled that role until the upgrade.

The first thing I noticed is that SubVersion was broken. (this is a revision control system for documents and code for you non-techies). It would proceed partially through a commit but then fail 100% of the time.

Then I noticed that my Ubuntu Linux update service (like windows update, only better) wasn't working. I had 156 MB of updates backed up. Looking at the logs I saw that the problem was that the update server was returning "connection refused" and "authentication failure" during each attempt.

Finally I noticed that the Synaptics package manager (program installer) was broken, with authentication errors.

I spent days trying everything I could think of (different computers, windows vs Linux, etc). My hosting service where my SubVersion server is located was wonderful (dreamhost.com - love those guys) in helping me by resetting my Apache server, looking at logs, etc. They could see nothing wrong on their end.

Then while prowling the Hughesnet support forum, I found a note that suggested the web accelerator might be the problem. Fortunately I found this thread

»community.myhughesnet.com/hughes···n_myself

That showed me how to turn off the accelerator. I did so. Viola! All the problems went away but now web browsing was as slow as with the previous generation system.

Knowing what to look for I searched the net and discovered that their accelerator has broken:

SubVersion
Ubuntu update service
Ubuntu Synaptics
TiVo TV guide updates
X-box Live
Steam
Opera web browser (that might be fixed now)
and a few others that I can't recall now.

In other words, just about everything that uses Port 80 except for web browsing is broken. On the Hughesnet support site I found that this has been an issue from the beginning and that back in November a Hughesnet employee promised a fix rollout "the next day". Obviously that didn't happen.

Here are some other issues that swing the pendulum toward Exede.

Data metering: Hughsnet meteres uploads; Execed does not
Late night FAP-free period: Hughsnet eliminated the unlimited period and now only allows 15 additional GB. Exede does not meter the FAP-free period.
FAP Free time interval: Hughesnet - 2 - 7AM EST. Exede - midnight -5AM local time.

The Hughesnet usage meter does not work. The meter on my modem's built-in website shows 100% available bandwidth. The meter on the Hughesnet site shows 15%.

Hughesnet claims in their support forum not to meter the first month to allow for people coming off dial-up who may have a LOT of upgrading to do. This is a lie. My account was metered from day one.

I have spent several hours tonight searching the web looking for similar problems with Exede. I have found nothing. About the only complaints I've found so far are about the off-shore support center and that they reduced the data cap with this new program.

My Exede install is Thursday. I'll report back after I've had a few days' experience.

John
jgd@fluxeon.com

OldSatUser

join:2012-05-10
Fresno, OH
I am not sure where you got some of your information, but it is not all correct.

Exede metering - does monitor uploading and downloading combined.

Viasat support for Exede - based in the United States. Not located overseas.

Be advised it is CRITICAL to get a proper install of the Exede hardware done by the technician. Failure to do so can result in a number of problems including performance issues.

Recommended that once the install is complete, note the stats from the modem status page and report them here for review. Also, have the tech run a speed test (testmy.net) before he leaves. Speeds should be as advertised right away. If not...don't take any excuse from the tech until you are satisfied and review everything with the install.

For more information on Exede...you can visit there support website at »wildblueworld.com/forum/index.php. You will find a lot of good and helpful information there.

Good luck with everything!

neonjohn

join:2013-01-06
said by OldSatUser:

I am not sure where you got some of your information, but it is not all correct.

Exede metering - does monitor uploading and downloading combined.

Just going by what I was told by a barely understandable, heavily foreign accented guy on the other end of the support line.

Viasat support for Exede - based in the United States. Not located overseas.

OK, I made an assumption based on this one contact. My bad. Glad to hear the support center is in the US.

Thanks for the other advice. I will certainly do as you recommend and test the system while the tech is here.

John
--
John DeArmond
Chief Engineer,
Fluxeon.com

OldSatUser

join:2012-05-10
Fresno, OH
Not sure who you purchased it from...but hopefully not from Dish or Directv. Best to purchase Exede directly from Viasat. Their sales and support is all United States based. I can't say the same for Dish or Directv when they resell it. But whoever you purchase it from (Dish, Directv, NRTC, or Viasat) is also responsible for the support then.

marsh_0x

join:2006-04-25
Tomahawk, WI

1 edit
Ditto going direct with Exede as the others do NOT have LNFZ.

10 months of superb service with Exede but with Dish Network.
If the day comes when needing more than 15GB then I'll pay a small penalty and go direct.

Forgot my password and called Dish and talked to a guy from the The Dominican Republic, oh well better than the Hindi Indians with script readings.

The new installer will love the job, I always tip well besides.

Also a beta tester for Jupiter so I know what's going on with their troubles.
Feeling bad for those making the mistake of Generations.
Yep, have mine all paid in advance my local funeral home.

OldSatUser

join:2012-05-10
Fresno, OH
One correction Marsh...NRTC customers do get the LNFZ. Dish customers do not. And I can't speak for what customers buying Exede through Directv are getting (other than Directv pushing Exede to people that have no business buying it in the first place...as they already have cable or DSL internet...and then getting high frustrated).

As you wree a beta tester for that "other" satellite service....you still haven't got the bugs out of it? lol

courty3210

join:2004-03-29
Wilmington, DE
reply to Lonely
Hi Lonely,

My Parents just got Exede12 in Delaware. They live in the sticks and have used a variety of internet services (no cable, DSL or fiber is available) so they've used, dial-up, the old wild blue, and verizon 3g which was patchy service.

Exede is by far the best internet experience they've ever had at home. The connectivity and speed appears reliable. They hooked up the modem to a Linksys WRT54G v6 router and are really enjoying the service. They use a MacBook.

Some tips:
1) It seems like a proper install is the key for great service. This includes the proper cable lengths from the dish (can't be too short or too long). Good grounding. Quality connections. A proper setup will prevent alot of troubleshooting of service and repeat calls. A bad installer will leave your upset thinking it's the service.

2) Slowly add devices to your network to ensure you don't have a rogue device eating bandwith. Many people complain about caps, but alot of times it's a devices health (ensure virus/spyware aren't present) and configuration. Monitor your usage daily to ensure you know how much something consumes.

3) Modify your hosts file to prevent pulling in a bunch of advertisements to help save bandwidth and speed up the data calls.

4) We have used Facetime, ichat, and remote machine control with out issue and can barely notice any delay.

5) Just the other night they downloaded Mountain Lion 4gb in the LNFZ (12AM -5AM) and ensured it wasn't part of their usage. Handled it no problem. They also run other software updates overnight that were in the hundreds of mb's w/o issue.

Hope this helps.

peg645

join:2012-07-31
Cherry Valley, NY
reply to Lonely
Boy, you are all definitely tempting me...

Several chats w/ Hughesnet CS this week, including one today with Brownsville. They're sending out a tech "for free". Since 1/1 I've had almost no service from 10am til evening (unless it's right after I have one of those longggg talks). Can't tell me it's not traffic/overloaded equipment/changes to accommodate Gen4.

Long ago out of contract. Hate signing up for another since I may move within the year, but have thought this for the past 5.

Looking at the Exede page now...do you believe that I, a Hughesnet customer, can't seem to open the page to check availability for my zipcode? Am instructed to call them...

Just starting a small business, doing all my marketing/website work right now. Can't imagine being ready to go and hearing any more excuses.

Neonjohn - appreciate all the groundwork you've done ahead of time. Hoping to hear how you've fared.


Ex Gen4 pers

@suddenlink.net
I had Gen 4 and now have Exede. It's wonderful. They can say they will fix it but they never do. They may fix your problem for a little while but it will be back. Believe me I know.

neonjohn

join:2013-01-06
reply to peg645
said by peg645:

Boy,
Neonjohn - appreciate all the groundwork you've done ahead of time. Hoping to hear how you've fared.

---------
You're most welcome.

My situation has a sad outcome - No shot at that the Exede bird without extensive tree cutting on other people's properties. So it's Hughesnet for me.

The installer was very nice and was very experienced (starting installing satellite receivers in the C-band days). He handed me his az-el instrument and let me sight for myself. From anywhere on my property all I stared at was tree trunks.

The GOOD news is that my next door neighbor has a perfect shot at the bird. I got the installer to survey her site while he was here. Just a pole install on the hill behind her cabin and she's set. I'll test her setup after it's installed and report back.

I asked the installer several questions regarding issues that have come up here.

The cost of setting an Exede post is $49.95.

The pole that comes from his distributor does NOT have any sort of anti-rotation augmentation.

There is supposed to be no charge for up to 100 ft of coax run, though many installers try to slip in that charge.

As a different installer is doing my neighbor's install today, this guy stressed over and over never to pay the installer. Exede bills the proper amount from what the installer reports back.

Tipping is appreciated and is permitted. I tipped this guy for walking over to the neighbor's house to do the survey.

On the good side with Hughesnet, I have gotten executive-level attention from my posts here and on the Hughesnet. I've been promised that fixing the port 80 problem will be one of their highest engineering priorities. So there's reason for hope.
--
John DeArmond
Chief Engineer,
Fluxeon.com

OldSatUser

join:2012-05-10
Fresno, OH
Sorry it didn't work out for you. Does that mean you are out of the running for Gen4 too? I mean aren't both the birds in about the same location in space?

viasatguy
Premium
join:2002-06-11
Carlsbad, CA
reply to neonjohn
ViaSat-1 is at 115.1 West longitude.

Echostar XVII is at 107.1 West longitude.

So the Echo/Hughes bird is 8 degrees further to the East. Might be enough for you, might not.

Best of luck and sorry it didn't work out.

zeddlar

join:2007-04-09
Jay, OK
Reviews:
·exede by ViaSat
·McDonald County ..
reply to Lonely
I would offer to supply your nieghbor with a high power wireless router and offer to pay half her bill if she would let you share her connection. It's a win win if you two get along and are close enough that you can get a signal from a router. The worst that can happen is you 2 have a disagreement and she changes the wifi password and you stop paying your part of the bill. You will both just have to pay close attention to the monthly usage.
--
HughesNet elite plan/.74 dish w/1watt trans. / 9000 modem / 3 computers on a linksy's wired network

neonjohn

join:2013-01-06
said by zeddlar:

I would offer to supply your nieghbor with a high power wireless router

-------

We were actually headed toward going the other way, her sharing my connection. She had had a very bad experience with Hughesnet (installer aimed the dish right at a large tree down low on her sloping property) and was convinced that no internet was available.

That's why I had the Exede installer go over and do a site survey after he did my site. So now the shoe's on the other foot. She has much better service than I.

testmy.net shows 18MB down and 0.75MB up at about 5PM. I think that the slow upload is caused by using some inside-house cable that was installed when the house was built. The installer said to try it and if it didn't work, he'd come back, drill holes in the walls and so on. She didn't want holes drilled in a brand new house so that's the route she took.

It was raining hard during the install so I'm hoping that when everything dries out, the upload speed will improve.

John
--
John DeArmond
Chief Engineer,
Fluxeon.com

OldSatUser

join:2012-05-10
Fresno, OH
Exede uses one cable. If not using the recommended solid copper cable...there will be performance issues with Exede.

peg645

join:2012-07-31
Cherry Valley, NY
reply to Lonely
Getting closer and closer...

Thanks again, Neonjohn - sorry yours isn't a perfect situation. (I'd quote you, but haven't figured out the quote tool in this forum yet...) Hope you can do well with the neighbor...

In response to my lack of consistent service since 1/1/13, coincidentally happening on the same days around the same time , Hughesnet required I accept a "free visit" since I'm such an old customer, they won't charge...

Not talking slow speeds, I'm talking not being able to download Yahoo in 5 minutes.

They wouldn't give me any guidance whatsoever with obvious web acceleration issues, which are consistently noted...

Appt scheduled for today - been waiting a week. Call last minute this a.m. they need to reschedule for another week. Scheduler admitted Hughesnet already overscheduled before they began handling their new scheduling work recently. I'm supposed to wait some more...

Fortunately for us, a local coop electric company provides installation for Exede here. Not sure before I jump ship, if I'll have a clear line of sight as well. They are coming tomorrow to check out my house. Both Dish and Hughesnet on the same roof edge, Dish appearing to point west/SW, and Hughesnet southwest.

1) Since the others work fine here (when Hughesnet works), I should be ok, hopefully?

I HATE having to sign up for another contract, paricularly as it's very possible I may have to move within 2 years.

I only need highspeed when my 24 yo CS graduate son visits - frankly he's SOL.

But I do need regular access, starting my own insurance claims business out of my house. Can't be getting a client letter asking for an immediate response and waiting for when the traffic clears.

So far, I may occasionally watch a 5min. news/interest video a day. May like to download more depending. Not into gaming.

2) Recommendations for which plan to select if I come on over?

3) Using Hughesnet w/ Outlook for my e-mail. Creating a website right this minute, and holding off on where to point it. But are you all happy with Exede e-mail? I've been having a lot of issues the past year with Hughesnet's spam filters stopping a lot of Roadrunner e-mail...?

Thanks, everyone!


BasilAR
WildBlue

join:2006-07-20
Parks, AR
said by peg645:

But are you all happy with Exede e-mail?

Exede email is gmail.
For your business you should get your own domain and host (NOT GoDady); a minimal reasonable, deductible business expense for your peace of mind.
--
WildBlue - Beam 35 - value

peg645

join:2012-07-31
Cherry Valley, NY
Thanks for the info BasilAR.

I agree. Name parked at GoDaddy, but we're not using them as a web host.

We're trying to start with Squarespace which doesn't provide e-mail but we loved several other features. A few false starts trying to get going, the least of which is it's been difficult to move blocks in their layout engine considering Hughesnet's erratic/slow speeds. Works fine with my son's highspeed provider at his Dad's house. Meeting tomorrow for more work at Panera Bread. May go with Westhost or Wordpress if we can't move along.

peg645

join:2012-07-31
Cherry Valley, NY
reply to Lonely
Well, making the switch!
Will be lots of changes - to accounts, needing to get used to changes in e-mail, as I'm also doing this at the same time we're setting up a new small business website.

And frankly, so far this is the first week since Jan 1 that Hughesnet has continued to work during the day.

But turns out my local Exede installer is a local electric co-op. Very customer service oriented. Monthly charge for the new high speed $20 LESS than I'm paying for "Pro" with a 7000s modem. (Although Hughesnet gave me a $20 monthly credit for a year. Right...) Low install price that includes several weeks' service.

I just got off the phone with Hughesnet, and they are leaving the service on for free for one month, "in case I change my mind". So that should make the changeover easy, hopefully. (Did I say "easy"?!?) Going into my account to make sure the credit card number removed.

With Exede, maybe my CS degreed son will visit me for longer periods of time?? We're very close, but he can only stand being away so long from him games.

Thanks to all who have posted!

pvtpilot94
System
Premium
join:2001-11-23
Bucyrus, OH
reply to Lonely
In am in Ohio, and considering my experience with Hughesnet GEN4, Do not get it. It has been nothing but a headache.
--
HT1000 Beam 23

DrStrangLov

join:2012-03-28
kudos:1
reply to BasilAR
said by BasilAR:

For your business you should get your own domain and host (NOT GoDady);

GoDaddy does offer static IP via premium site offer...more $$$

Those GoDaddy sites on dynamic IPs get flipped/flipped/flipped over time.

But, I'd find another site provider...GoDaddy has too many 'suckers.'