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Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
reply to rradina

Re: Larger carriers losing prepaid phone sales to smallr players

I have the Straight Talk SIM plan on my at&t Captivate (upgraded recently to CM10.0) for almost a year now. It works great and no complaints from anyone.

..and I stream Pandora and Slacker like there's no tomorrow.

rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
At $45/month, that looks pretty sweet. What about tethering? Can I still use my phone as a hot spot? I rarely get close to using my 4GB cap on AT&T but tethering (hot spot) is an incredibly handy option when I need my laptop and there are no other alternatives. It's also a life saver if I'm working from home and the power goes out (lose my home network).

Will AT&T unlock my phone?

rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
reply to Simba7
Nevermind -- I just read the fine print. The phone cannot be used as a "modem", which I assume means tethering/hotspot, and MMS doesn't work for the iPhone unless you jail break it. I don't use MMS frequently but as usual, if the price is too good to be true, it probably is. This plan seems like a PITA. I'll have to check Net10 but they probably have the same limitations.


Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
said by rradina:

Nevermind -- I just read the fine print. The phone cannot be used as a "modem"

Well, you can.. but make sure it's for light use. They will throttle you if you abuse it.

rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
What's "light" use? I have never exceeded my 4GB AT&T cap. Once during vacation, all three kids had their iPods/laptops connected to game during the 21 hour drive to Yellowstone National Park. I also used my phone relentlessly for finding restaurants and driving directions. However, even with all that intense use for two weeks, I still only got to about 3.5GB during the month.

Is the "hotspot" feature available on the iPhone with this service? On AT&T they have to "enable it" which means it can be turned off. My question is whether or not they turn it off requiring me to jail break the phone to enable it again.

I'm not interested in jail breaking the phone to make stuff work such as MMS and hotspot/tethering. That's why I called it a PITA (for me). I know I could switch to Android and perhaps have an easier time of it or jailbreak my iPhone but I'm at an age where "rebel" behavior just doesn't interest me. Perhaps 20 years ago I wouldn't care but today, I have too many responsibilities to risk legal issues to save a buck. I've also been on the receiving end of unethical behavior. As such, I have a strong sense of right and wrong regardless of how strong the justification for wrong behavior might be. Although I don't always succeed, I try hard to recognize when I might be treating others in ways that I would not approve if I was on the receiving end.


Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
said by rradina:

Is the "hotspot" feature available on the iPhone with this service? On AT&T they have to "enable it" which means it can be turned off. My question is whether or not they turn it off requiring me to jail break the phone to enable it again.

Ya, you will probably have to jailbreak it. I hate it when at&t has all the control over your phone, yet you are the one who bought it. One reason I flashed Cyanogenmod on my Captivate. Got rid of all the crapware and restrictions, along with gaining JellyBean (CM10).
said by rradina:

I have too many responsibilities to risk legal issues to save a buck. I've also been on the receiving end of unethical behavior. As such, I have a strong sense of right and wrong regardless of how strong the justification for wrong behavior might be. Although I don't always succeed, I try hard to recognize when I might be treating others in ways that I would not approve if I was on the receiving end.

It's not illegal or unethical to unlock or jailbreak your device. I have no idea who stuck that in your head, but they're full of crap.

»www.slate.com/blogs/trending/201···pad.html
--
Bresnan 30M/5M | CenturyLink 5M/896K
MyWS[PnmIIX3@3.2G,8G RAM,500G+1.5T+2T HDDs,Win7]
WifeWS[A64@2G,2G RAM,120G HDD,Win7]
Router[2xP3@1G,2G RAM,18G HDD,Allied Telesyn AT2560FX,2xDigital DE504,Sun X1034A,2xSun X4444A,SMC 8432BTA,Gentoo]

rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
Jail breaking: It would most certainly be illegal to operate it on any carrier's network. Especially if I use it as a "modem" on Smart Talk which they expressly forbid.

While I know it's popular, don't kid yourself thinking you are safe. I know the law says you can jailbreak but the DMCA is always changing and I don't have a few million to fight a case should my phone start freaking out and interfering with a carrier's ability to serve other customers. Is this likely? Probably not but because I would be doing it for no other reason than to get MMS or use it as a hotspot, it's just not worth it. I'll just pay what it takes to play. As I said, I'd prefer an honest better value. Not some I-have-to-hack-it to get a better value.

I have three impressionable boys, two in their teens. The last thing I need to do is show them how dad cheats, steals, lies and whatever else they might interpret from my actions. So far they are very good about respecting copyright laws by not stealing music and they are careful about what they download, upload, say and do on-line.


Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT

1 edit
said by rradina:

Jail breaking: It would most certainly be illegal to operate it on any carrier's network.

IT IS NOT ILLEGAL. *sigh*
said by rradina:

While I know it's popular, don't kid yourself thinking you are safe.

Popular? I don't do crap because "it's popular". I am an IT professional and enjoy the latest software releases on my Captivate. Having a rooted phone also allows me to run specific software that I need for my job.
said by rradina:

I know the law says you can jailbreak but the DMCA is always changing and I don't have a few million to fight a case should my phone start freaking out and interfering with a carrier's ability to serve other customers.

Um.. Well, in that case, you might not want to do anything with any electronic device then since they could easily render anything illegal because it *could* cripple their network.
Plus, this isn't the RIAA/MPAA. I'm thinking you are confusing jailbreaking with DRM removal, two remotely different areas. This isn't "sharing a movie or an MP3". You also aren't stealing stuff off of iTunes.
said by rradina:

Is this likely? Probably not but because I would be doing it for no other reason than to get MMS or use it as a hotspot, it's just not worth it. I'll just pay what it takes to play. As I said, I'd prefer an honest better value. Not some I-have-to-hack-it to get a better value.

Then why are you even considering going to a plan that will save you money and is used my millions of people if you are happy with what you have now?
said by rradina:

I have three impressionable boys, two in their teens. The last thing I need to do is show them how dad cheats, steals, lies and whatever else they might interpret from my actions. So far they are very good about respecting copyright laws by not stealing music and they are careful about what they download, upload, say and do on-line.

I have 2 sons and a daughter. They know the ethical side of "hacking". It's not cheating, stealing, or lying. It's learning the technology and utilizing it to the fullest. You are using 2GB of data (which they fully allow). Me, I prefer music streaming. If I need to tether for a few minutes, I can without issues. I haven't lately because I don't need to.

The issue they have is people tethering 24/7 eating a ridiculous amount of data.
--
Bresnan 30M/5M | CenturyLink 5M/896K
MyWS[PnmIIX3@3.2G,8G RAM,500G+1.5T+2T HDDs,Win7]
WifeWS[A64@2G,2G RAM,120G HDD,Win7]
Router[2xP3@1G,2G RAM,18G HDD,Allied Telesyn AT2560FX,2xDigital DE504,Sun X1034A,2xSun X4444A,SMC 8432BTA,Gentoo]

rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
If you are jail breaking it to get tethering or use FaceTime or whatever else you cannot do that the carrier requires some extra fee to use or forbids, you are operating it illegally.

Just because it seems "fair" to do it, doesn't mean it's legal or ethical or moral. We're all the same. We all attempt to justify our actions because sometimes we think it's right to choose the lesser of two evils from our vantage. However, it's still wrong because you signed a contract and agreed to pay for those services, if offered. If forbidden, you signed a contract acknowledging they are forbidden. It doesn't matter if you use 1 byte or 1 gigabyte. It doesn't matter how you spin this. It's against the contract you acknowledged when you started the service. It doesn't matter if you think its fair. It doesn't matter if you don't like it.

In 2005 I got a speeding ticket for going 50 in a 35. It was a two-lane road in the flat Missouri river bottoms near where I live. The road is straight for miles. There was no traffic besides the officer that passed me. When he pulled me over I agreed with him that I was going 50. He told me he watches the speed on the road because there are a lot of bicycles and runners. Then he smiled and said, "Of course it's not likely many are out today since it's 20 degrees but 35 is for their safety." He even agreed that the speed limit was pretty low. Regardless, it didn't change the outcome. He still gave me a ticket. This despite the road was the result of realignment after building a new 10 lane highway. Part of the new highway went through the south end of a park and in order to appease environmentalists, the highway department put millions of dollars into miles of paved trails suitable for bikers, runners, walkers and skaters. The trails even cross the Missouri River on a special path built on the side of one of the new twin bridges. This allows the trails in the park to join the Katie trail which goes from St. Charles, MO to Sedalia MO (237 miles of trails). The road I was driving is not part of those trails. (Transportation engineers know it's always dangerous to mix traffic of unequal speeds.)

I do understand the difference between jail breaking, unlocking and DRM removal. I too am employed in IT. I know jail breaking and unlocking are expressly permitted by the

Why am I trying to save money? A fool and his money are soon parted. Hence, only a fool would pay more for a service if the SAME service is available elsewhere for less money.

I agree with you that jail breaking and using tethering on Smart Talk or Net 10 seems fair provided you don't abuse it. Since the duopoly now has cap-and-charge plans, it also seems fair to be able to use the bytes for which you pay, any way you want to use them. It's very logical but it's not ethical. It's not legal. It's not moral.

I'm not taking a moral high ground here. I'm certainly not perfect and I cannot say I have never broken the law or never cheated. We all have and only a fool thinks otherwise. I'm not a saint because I choose not to do this and I am not better than you because I don't do it. You are also not worse than me because you choose to this.

In closing, read the exemptions. They seem pretty grey to me regardless of how others interpret jail breaking and shoe-horn it into one of these exemptions. As I wrote earlier, I don't have spare money to fight someone if they decide I've done something to harm them. I've had to use lawyers and at $480/hour, it doesn't take long to wipe out your liquid assets and max your credit lines. If it goes on long enough, it can even eat into your retirement plan.

»arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2010···air-use/