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drew
Automatic
Premium
join:2002-07-10
Port Orchard, WA
kudos:6
reply to rgbond

Re: Another Edition of "What's Wrong With This Picture?&quo

said by rgbond:

I don't see any cable ties.

Funny you should say this... what I didn't take a picture of was the way the extension cords were ran along the ceiling and beams and florescent lights... all attached via cable ties. And not a single one of the ends was clipped off to make it at least look "nice." I always have a dike tool with me when using cable ties.
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Rogue Wolf
Mourns the Loss of lilhurricane

join:2003-08-12
Troy, NY
reply to drew

I think the only thing "wrong" that I see is that it isn't already on fire.
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nunya
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join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:12
Reviews:
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reply to drew

There's no justification for anything like this clusterfuck.
For what they spent in that BS arrangement, they could have probably bought a decent used shoebox dimmer pack.
--
If someone refers to herself / himself as a "guru", they probably aren't.



Jon
Premium
join:2001-01-20
Lisle, IL
reply to drew

Needs more electrical tape.



hortnut
Huh?

join:2005-09-25
PNW
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Comcast
reply to drew

The Fire Marshall in my area would not allow that.

And he would show up every 6 months. For something like that could shut the operation/business down, until corrected. Lots more power than an Electrical Inspector. And he would show up for a re-inspection on the date promised.



cowboyro
Premium
join:2000-10-11
Shelton, CT
reply to drew

There's nothing wrong with it besides the mismatch of colors.
Let's be realistic, the total load is well below what the wires are rated for.
Does it look good? NO.
Could it be made to look better? PROBABLY.
Is it a disaster waiting to happen? NO.
Extension cords and power strips are made exactly for this.


patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1
reply to drew

If the surge strip is UL listed, it has a 15 amp thermal breaker in the red switch. You won't start a fire. Depending on where those orange cords go, RFI, electrocution, or random digital errors.



DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2
reply to drew

said by drew:

I came into the building we sub-lease for our new church campus for setup on Sunday morning.

Check out the sweet wiring job.

Just getting ready for the Rapture, eh?
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.

public

join:2002-01-19
Santa Clara, CA
reply to patcat88

said by patcat88:

If the surge strip is UL listed, it has a 15 amp thermal breaker in the red switch. You won't start a fire. Depending on where those orange cords go, RFI, electrocution, or random digital errors.

Except that the brittle brass foil rails do not make proper contact with the plugs, and the resistance often leads to a fire.
The UL label is often fake.


pike
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-01
Washington, DC
kudos:3
reply to drew

said by drew:

I always have a dike tool with me when using cable ties.

If you are using cable ties in any type of quantity, do yourself a favor and invest in one of these. Might save the next guy some sliced up knuckles too!

Critsmcgee

join:2011-12-02
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

said by pike:

said by drew:

I always have a dike tool with me when using cable ties.

If you are using cable ties in any type of quantity, do yourself a favor and invest in one of these. Might save the next guy some sliced up knuckles too!

That's a unitasker gimick tool. All you need is wire snips.


John Galt
Forward, March
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:8

said by Critsmcgee:

That's a unitasker gimick tool. All you need is wire snips.

Actually, those tools are a requirement on many jobs.

Critsmcgee

join:2011-12-02
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

said by John Galt:

said by Critsmcgee:

That's a unitasker gimick tool. All you need is wire snips.

Actually, those tools are a requirement on many jobs.

I don't buy it but we can agree to disagree. It might help save a little time if your doing an insane amount of them but requirement? No way!


Jack_in_VA
Premium
join:2007-11-26
North, VA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom

said by Critsmcgee:

said by John Galt:

said by Critsmcgee:

That's a unitasker gimick tool. All you need is wire snips.

Actually, those tools are a requirement on many jobs.

I don't buy it but we can agree to disagree. It might help save a little time if your doing an insane amount of them but requirement? No way!

Agree. Maybe panel fabricators but general electrical no way
Wonder if John Galt ever laced the bundles before the wimp cable ties were invented?


Jack_in_VA
Premium
join:2007-11-26
North, VA
kudos:1
reply to Critsmcgee

Duplicate post



John Galt
Forward, March
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:8
reply to Critsmcgee

said by Critsmcgee:

I don't buy it but we can agree to disagree. It might help save a little time if your doing an insane amount of them but requirement? No way!

If you are doing professional electrical work on high-tech industrial projects, you can find the requirement in the specifications for the project.

The other requirement you can find is for torque screwdrivers.


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to drew

15 years in telco and electrical work all across Canada and the eastern seaboard; I've never seen a spec dictate the tools to be used; and I've never seen one of those gimmick Ty-wrap tools used by anyone with actual skill... I'm sure they have a use, as mentioned above, probably very useful in panel or assembly work, but it must be a pretty limited application.

I've laced miles and miles of cable, cut out thousands of improper Ty-wraps and have the scars on my arms to prove it... Dykes or side cutters are NOT the proper tool to use, either - they leave a little tail at the head of the Ty-wrap... Flush cutters or a razor knife work much better.

The quality man I worked for at Nortel had a pair of panty hose with him at all times... He'd run it across the head of the Ty-wraps - if they caught or snagged, that was a safety 'major' - 3 majors on a job, and you got a week off to think about it.



Jack_in_VA
Premium
join:2007-11-26
North, VA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom
reply to John Galt

said by John Galt:

said by Critsmcgee:

I don't buy it but we can agree to disagree. It might help save a little time if your doing an insane amount of them but requirement? No way!

If you are doing professional electrical work on high-tech industrial projects, you can find the requirement in the specifications for the project.

The other requirement you can find is for torque screwdrivers.

Old time Electricians that came up under a master Electrician had calibrated wrists. God how do you think we ever built or wired anything? Given what I see and read today we did better without the tools because we had trained people vs tools with incompetent workers trying to use them.


John Galt
Forward, March
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:8

said by Jack_in_VA:

Old time Electricians that came up under a master Electrician had calibrated wrists. God how do you think we ever built or wired anything? Given what I see and read today we did better without the tools because we had trained people vs tools with incompetent workers trying to use them.

That was then, this is now.

I'll agree, though, it all comes down to competent supervision.
--
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Jack_in_VA
Premium
join:2007-11-26
North, VA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom

said by John Galt:

said by Jack_in_VA:

Old time Electricians that came up under a master Electrician had calibrated wrists. God how do you think we ever built or wired anything? Given what I see and read today we did better without the tools because we had trained people vs tools with incompetent workers trying to use them.

That was then, this is now.

I'll agree, though, it all comes down to competent supervision.

You also need workers intelligent and engaged enough to supervise.


John Galt
Forward, March
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:8

said by Jack_in_VA:

You also need workers intelligent and engaged enough to supervise.

I'll agree with that also.


leibold
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join:2002-07-09
Sunnyvale, CA
kudos:10
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
reply to Jack_in_VA

said by Jack_in_VA:

Wonder if John Galt ever laced the bundles before the wimp cable ties were invented?

I have laced communication cables (too many to count) but don't recall ever lacing power cables. I remember learning cable lacing still with organic fiber twine (a special treatment gave it a deep red color) but by the time I did actual installations it was already all waxed polyester.

As for the ty-wrap tools, even the cheap knock-off ones save some effort and produce a more uniform result. I would probably not go and fetch it from the toolbox for just one or two quick cable ties (depending on just how far away the toolbox happens to be) but I'd certainly do it for a dozen or more.
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Jack_in_VA
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North, VA
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Reviews:
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1 edit

said by leibold:

said by Jack_in_VA:

Wonder if John Galt ever laced the bundles before the wimp cable ties were invented?

I have laced communication cables (too many to count) but don't recall ever lacing power cables. I remember learning cable lacing still with organic fiber twine (a special treatment gave it a deep red color) but by the time I did actual installations it was already all waxed polyester.

As for the ty-wrap tools, even the cheap knock-off ones save some effort and produce a more uniform result. I would probably not go and fetch it from the toolbox for just one or two quick cable ties (depending on just how far away the toolbox happens to be) but I'd certainly do it for a dozen or more.

How did you hold them together? The lacing was a little heavier duty but still tied the cables together. Control panels and MCC's were full of laced bundles.

Bob4
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey
reply to LazMan

I used to use a Ty-Wrap tool. Besides cutting off the tail, it made sure the tension was correct. I lost the tool many years ago.

My ex-brother-in-law worked for T&B and had patents for some of the Ty-Wrap products.



leibold
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join:2002-07-09
Sunnyvale, CA
kudos:10
Reviews:
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reply to Jack_in_VA

said by Jack_in_VA:

How did you hold them together?

I don't recall ever lacing either AC power cable or the main DC bus cables (to the battery backup rooms). As far as I can recall those cables always ran loosely placed in enclosed raceways (usually with removable lids). The only tying of the AC cables was the strain relief at the end.

In datacenter wiring I have placed AC power cables in overhead power troughs (again loosely placed without tying). The only time they got tied down (with ty-wraps, not lacing) was when the power cables ran across an overhead cable ladder. Even then the power cables were not bundled up but tied individually to ladder rungs (side by side).

I'm not saying that lacing of power cables never happened, just that I'm not familiar with it (having never done it myself). I would think that it is more desirable to allow power cables to dissipate heat then to neatly bundle them together (which would allow heat to build up inside the bundle).
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Jack_in_VA
Premium
join:2007-11-26
North, VA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom

What did you use before tyraps? I'm not talking abut power wiring but control wiring, control circuit wiring etc. Surely you didn't have a spaghetti bowl of wires going all directions.
Maybe I should ask how old are you. Perhaps tyraps existed when you came along.



leibold
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-09
Sunnyvale, CA
kudos:10
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET

said by Jack_in_VA:

I'm not talking abut power wiring but control wiring, control circuit wiring etc.

The topic of this thread was power cables. I'm sure industrial control systems at that time did lace the wiring but that is not something I ever did.

As for my age, old enough to have done cable splices with hammer and blow torch
PILC (paper insulated lead-shielded cable) telco dry-core cable. The hammer was used to shape a shell from a sheet of lead (fitting it to the size of the splice) and the blow torch was used to solder it around the cable ends.
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nunya
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join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
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Reviews:
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reply to Jack_in_VA

I learned the fine art of cable lacing from Ma Bell. They had a real hard-on for that kind of shit at the phone company. When they decided cosmic frames would be the panacea to the old MDF, ty-wraps has come out. Those could only be used on poly jacketed cables, so the individual pairs were still laced all through the backside.

I agree about the ty-wrap tool - it's a gimmick. Panduit was literally giving them away years ago and I still have one somewhere.
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If someone refers to herself / himself as a "guru", they probably aren't.



Raphion

join:2000-10-14
Samsara
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to LazMan

said by LazMan:

The quality man I worked for at Nortel had a pair of panty hose with him at all times... He'd run it across the head of the Ty-wraps - if they caught or snagged, that was a safety 'major' - 3 majors on a job, and you got a week off to think about it.

If that's a safety "major", my fingernails could be deadly some days.