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ashrc4
Premium
join:2009-02-06
australia
reply to Juggernaut

Re: UTM cookies forced here on Fx and IE! HELP!

said by Juggernaut:

So, what if I do not use, nor give a damn about a loyalty card? What then? I'd say they've spent money stupidly on something they'll never get. That is, my business.

I was not just talking about Loyalty Cards. If you can imagine using a site that does profile it's users.
Say Amazon decides instead of using it's profiling to make suggestions on what book it wants to sell you next decides that after a report on "how to better fleece customers based on profiles"
comes out that they better start classing their customers and charging based on that report before their compeditors do.

Unless you have knowledge of other peoples price they were charged or weak enough not to care about price difference (potentially minimal) then ad-blocking is not suffice.
--
Paradigm Shift beta test pilot. "Dying to defend one's small piece of suburb...Give me something global...STAT!


DownTheShore
Honoring The Captain
Premium
join:2003-12-02
Beautiful NJ
kudos:14
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL

1 recommendation

reply to ashrc4
said by ashrc4:

said by DownTheShore:

......Personally, I don't give a damn what is in Google's database on me because it can't be any more comprehensive than that which the Federal government has on me as a former Federal employee.....So they might read my email; my employer had that right all along while I was working and I've never assumed that any email is private. They can use whatever information they have to try to target marketing to me but it doesn't work because my other software strips out the ads and I never see the results of all their nefarious endeavors.

That info you willing give up can still be used against you.
Sites that offer discounts etc. can deliberately target who they offer them to and to what percentage they feels best represents their best interest. Loyalty cards are a good example of how in order to get discounts you agree to hand over you data in exchange. It's well known that shops do not have to offer the same price to each customer.
While there isn't much of this profile v's price system ATM your can be sure it will develop. A few bits of specific data on an individual is all it takes to pidgeon hole you into a class.

But that presumes that I'm even interested in taking advantage in their discounts, which I'm not. To me, shopping is one of the levels of Hell and is something that must very occasionally be done with great dislike; it's not a competitive sport in my book. The supermarket spits out those discount coupons with my sale receipt and I toss them away, usually without even looking at them because I know that a) either it's something I'm not going to buy in the amount they want it bought, or b) I'll just forget that I had the coupon in the first place and won't have it with me if I actually did make that purchase. They can pigeon-hole me all they want; it's my hand that actually withdraws the money from my wallet.
--
Patriotism is not waving a flag, it is living the ideals

I want to retire to the Isle of Sodor and ride the trains.

Sign the petition: »www.change.org/petitions/target-···ksgiving



Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC
kudos:2

1 recommendation

reply to ashrc4
The problem is, I don't use Amazon, or EBay. I don't usually buy things off the web stores. I realize I am in the minority, though. To be honest, I just don't trust the process anymore.

But, even in a B&M store, my info is guarded carefully, and I don't give it without a very good reason.

But, to reiterate, you can target me all you want, but I still am not going to buy via an ad on a computer, or a cell device.

I guess I'm just old school in that regard, and not a frantic consumer.
--
I'm not anti-social, I just don't like stupid people.


ashrc4
Premium
join:2009-02-06
australia

1 edit
reply to DownTheShore
said by DownTheShore:

But that presumes that I'm even interested in taking advantage in their discounts, which I'm not.

Websites don't have to be seen to offer discounts....If it comes from a profile based decision then they can start using it...especially if they can out perform their compeditors on other levels...such as price to begin with.
--
Paradigm Shift beta test pilot. "Dying to defend one's small piece of suburb...Give me something global...STAT!
Expand your moderator at work


Snowy
Premium
join:2003-04-05
Kailua, HI
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·Clearwire Wireless

1 recommendation

reply to Juggernaut

Re: UTM cookies forced here on Fx and IE! HELP!

said by Juggernaut:

But, to reiterate, you can target me all you want, but I still am not going to buy via an ad on a computer, or a cell device.

I realize this is OT but I share your concerns about using CC data online.
That doesn't stop me from ordering online though.
Whether it's about local availability, price etc... I use pre-paid Visa/MC cards to order online without undue risk or apprehension.


DownTheShore
Honoring The Captain
Premium
join:2003-12-02
Beautiful NJ
kudos:14
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
reply to ashrc4
said by ashrc4:

said by DownTheShore:

But that presumes that I'm even interested in taking advantage in their discounts, which I'm not.

Websites don't have to be seen to offer discounts....If it comes from a profile based decision then they can start using it...especially if they can out perform their compeditors on other levels...such as price to begin with.

My point, though, is that if I'm not inclined to spend the money (or don't even have it in the first place to spend), then they can target me as precisely as they can but it's still going to be a wasted effort on their part because I'm not going to buy what they are selling.

I am also a very lazy person and I'm not going to physically go out of my way just to get a "bargain". I don't scan supermarket flyers to see what's on sale that week and bunny hop from store to store to take advantage of them. If I've got money in my pocket and I need some groceries I stop at whatever supermarket is on my way home. I'm the type of person who doesn't leave her house on Black Friday or December 26th, and I don't even know when Cyber Monday is supposed to be.
--
Patriotism is not waving a flag, it is living the ideals

I want to retire to the Isle of Sodor and ride the trains.

Sign the petition: »www.change.org/petitions/target-···ksgiving


OZO
Premium
join:2003-01-17
kudos:2
reply to Mele20
said by Mele20:

My Proxomitron does not have current configs because File Explorer can't see the Proxo folder

What do you mean you can't see folder? Do you have admin rights on your computer?

To get rid of those pesky UTM cookies put this line into your hosts file:
127.0.0.1 ajax.googleapis.com
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...


Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC
kudos:2
reply to Snowy
I pretty much have all the major items I need right now, and online isn't cheaper for me. I can negotiate better in store usually.

Besides, Xmas is coming, and the bargains will be there for most things. I have nothing on my list though to buy. You can blame me for not stimulating the economy!
--
I'm not anti-social, I just don't like stupid people.


Dude111
An Awesome Dude
Premium
join:2003-08-04
USA
kudos:12
reply to Mele20

 

quote:
I will not allow Google to rape me of my privacy and these are GOOGLE cookies.
Well if so,THOSE ARE THIRD PARTY COOKIES! -- I thought you had 3rd party cookies blocked!

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5
reply to OZO

Re: UTM cookies forced here on Fx and IE! HELP!

Oh no! My modem tripped off line again as tried to post this (can't get TWC out here to fix it for three months now) and Proxo gave me the error screen. I clicked the "back" button and my text was gone! Is this a bug in Fx on Win 8? NOOOOO...that has been one of the best things about Fx...it keeps text if you shut down, it crashes, etc. Now it is like Opera that cannot keep text in the text box.

Anyhow, I lost two paragraphs I typed in reply to you.

I got the Proxo problem fixed. Anyone installing Proxo on Win 8 needs to AVOID Program Files as the destination. Installing Proxo there makes a complete mess with files strewn all over the place. Plus, even WinRAR (which I downloaded a trial of) could not see Proxo in Program Files so there was no way to extract Sidiki's filters to the proper location.

I had to create a separate folder completely away from Program Files, on the C drive, for Proxo to reside in. After putting it there, I could easil,y with the builtin extractor, extract Sidki's files to the Proxo folder.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson


Selenia
Gentoo Convert
Premium
join:2006-09-22
Fort Smith, AR
kudos:2

2 recommendations

We got a PICNIC problem here(problem in chair, not in computer). The problem that resides in that chair has lost the very spirit of security and is simply driving herself nuts. The spirit of security is to keep crucial data under lock and key, where it belongs, and to keep good system integrity(good running order and not leaking crucial info), keeping potential cybercriminals of all sort at bay. So, dslr supports itself by letting Google know that you are a very loyal poster and love this site, without identifying you personally? So, there is a proud member by the name of Mele20 here and we know it, so does all knowing Google, so what? I am just trying to understand how you lose sleep over something like this, but endorse use of commercial software that actually does collect personal info, but are not bothered by that. This is pretty easy to block and I endorse control of your info, but you seem to worry about the wrong things. I use hosts files, etc to block intrusive content that ruins my experience and known malware hosts. Not to deprive every site in existence of earning a living and paying the bills in non-intrusive ways, even by noticing my taste in handbags. Worry about exploits, your bank and CC numbers, etc. Not about Google knowing you like computer security. Life is too short and there are far more nefarious things out there that I am researching daily, and even helping with patches for the Linux kernel(collects no personal info, unlike MS).
--
A fool thinks they know everything.

A wise person knows enough to know they couldn't possibly know everything.

There are zealots for every OS, like every religion. They do not represent the majority of users for either.


Steve
I know your IP address
Consultant
join:2001-03-10
Foothill Ranch, CA
kudos:5

4 recommendations

reply to Mele20
said by Mele20:

Obviously, you do not understand how tracking and privacy invasion works.

Obviously, you believe that you know how to decide for everybody else, those others being incapable of informed consent as to how they interact with the rest of the universe.

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5
reply to Selenia
said by Selenia:

I am just trying to understand how you lose sleep over something like this, but endorse use of commercial software that actually does collect personal info, but are not bothered by that. This is pretty easy to block and I endorse control of your info, but you seem to worry about the wrong things. I use hosts files, etc to block intrusive content that ruins my experience and known malware hosts. Not to deprive every site in existence of earning a living and paying the bills in non-intrusive ways, even by noticing my taste in handbags. Worry about exploits, your bank and CC numbers, etc. Not about Google knowing you like computer security. Life is too short and there are far more nefarious things out there that I am researching daily, and even helping with patches for the Linux kernel(collects no personal info, unlike MS).

What commercial software have I endorsed that spies on me?

I use HostsMan but I immediately needed to come to this site right after I set up the computer. (Besides, postlist/all is my home page on all browsers so IE automatically came here as soon as I configured its settings). I had NO programs installed. So, tell me how I could have used HostsMan and my custom hosts file (which blocks all Google tracking) when the file is on my XP computer and this new computer wasn't seeing the XP computer so I could get the file off it right away? (Ironically, the new computer sees a virtual machine running on the host but doesn't see the host machine and the file I needed I had put in the host's shared folder not in the virtual machine's shared folder). To make it more difficult, I only have ONE monitor at the moment and I have to keep unhooking it from the computer I am on and hooking it to the other computer...back and forth...moving furniture to do this which has to be moved back every night so I don't fall over it in the dark.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson


vaxvms
ferroequine fan
Premium
join:2005-03-01
Wormtown
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Charter

2 recommendations

reply to Mele20
With all the problems you are having with MS Windows, XP and now 8, and almost every program you've installed onto said operating systems perhaps you should consider using a different operating system that doesn't try to perplex/annoy/frustrate/spy you and provides for all kinds of customizations that you demand.
--
Some people don't know what they don't know.


Dude111
An Awesome Dude
Premium
join:2003-08-04
USA
kudos:12

 

I dunno where she was getting that extra cookie from,I ONLY GET ONE COOKIE HERE! (The main cookie the site issues) the cookie she is talking about IS A 3RD PARTY COOKIE which she has blocked so i dunno why she is getting it!!



Selenia
Gentoo Convert
Premium
join:2006-09-22
Fort Smith, AR
kudos:2

3 recommendations

reply to Mele20

Re: UTM cookies forced here on Fx and IE! HELP!

Windows, for one. Microsoft forces you to register to get support with personally identifiable information. It then collects personally identifiable unique info about your PC and sends it to MS update. These cookies you worry about from Google are not personally identifiable to you by name. They track habits of 1 PC user across their partners, at best. You never registered anything with them. Dslr cookies are only personally identifiable to dslr, worst case scenario. What is different about Google, dslr, and MS in your eyes?
--
A fool thinks they know everything.

A wise person knows enough to know they couldn't possibly know everything.

There are zealots for every OS, like every religion. They do not represent the majority of users for either.

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5

1 edit
I don't use Windows Update. When I was able to get security patches on XP Pro SP 2, I always got them from Microsoft download site, one by one, and I never got any that required WGA or WGA Notification. I have not used used Windows Update since 2004.

I did use it ONE time on the new computer because I didn't know how to see what security updates are not on this computer because of the build date. Then I permanently disabled it and I need to figure out how to stop Win 8 from bugging me about having disabled Windows Update. I will get security updates from now on for the Win 8 computer by reading the monthly Security bulletin that arrives in my email ,and that I can read here also, and then go to the KB article and download the update directly. I would never update drivers, etc. from Windows Update.

The UTM cookies identify me so that Google can attempt to build a file on me. You can't be too careful with Google. I would trust Microsoft over Google as far as tracking me but only slightly more than I trust Google. I use GoogleSharing extension so that all my Google searches are scrambled in with tons of others and I can't be identified. This extension is why I don't search on SeaMonkey (it is not ported there yet) and only rarely on Opera or IE the latter which I don't use on the XP host computer and only a little on Win 8 because I was curious about IE 10.

I am a long time member of Microsoft's Windows Panel. But I CHOSE to accept an invitation to become a Panel member...it was not forced on me like UTM cookies or Google spying or Bing spying. Ironically, Microsoft, a few hours ago, sent a new Windows Panel survey asking about Win 8 and Bing and Google and IE 10 usage/non usage. I told Microsoft I use Google and never Bing and the reason is because I can stay private using Google search because of the Fx extension Google Sharing. That answer generated more dynamic questions about Bing and why I won't use it, and why I don't use IE, etc. I believe strongly in giving good feedback and who knows maybe answers like mine will spur a little thought on Microsoft's part. I expect more surveys soon all on Win 8 reactions/experiences.

edit: I haven't used Belarc Advisor in ages since I have XP Pro SP2 so I never thought till just this moment that I should have installed it on Win 8 right away and let it tell me what security patches were missing on the new computer. Then I could have gotten each one individually from Windows Download site (unless there were a ton of them missing where doing it that would have taken forever).
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson


sivran
Seamonkey's back
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Irving, TX
kudos:1
reply to Dude111

Re:  

It's a first party cookie.


chrisretusn
Retired
Premium
join:2007-08-13
Philippines
kudos:1
Reviews:
·PLDT
·Comcast
reply to Dude111
As sivran See Profile mentions, they are first party cookies. They will not get set unless google-analytics.com is allowed.



--
Chris
Living in Paradise!!


pizz
1gbps is all the rage.
Premium
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable

3 recommendations

reply to Mele20

Re: UTM cookies forced here on Fx and IE! HELP!

This mele20 bashing is getting quite old here. If you, cannot reply to her post(s) without bashing her, then don't respond to them.

Been on this site for quite a long time here, and this forum is one of my favorites. But now, this forum is turning in the Pub and it's sister forum(s).
--
It's ok to say, 'I don't know'. It's even better when someone takes the time to explain what you, 'don't know'.


DownTheShore
Honoring The Captain
Premium
join:2003-12-02
Beautiful NJ
kudos:14
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL

1 recommendation

Not true. I just think that most of us can't understand the degree to which she wants to remain untracked on the internet, not to mention the seemingly excessive time and effort she devotes to it. The gain doesn't seem to be worth the effort, because the information made public in an informed way causes no personal harm and actually helps to fund the continued existence of the current 'net.

While it's her choice to pursue this path (sorry for speaking about you in the third person, Mele), some of us apparently view this as an obsession, and being friendly acquaintances, try to inject a note of balance and commonsense (as defined by the majority).
--
Patriotism is not waving a flag, it is living the ideals

I want to retire to the Isle of Sodor and ride the trains.

Expand your moderator at work


Dude111
An Awesome Dude
Premium
join:2003-08-04
USA
kudos:12

 

Well Mele values her privacy,i dont see anything wrong with that and i dont want anyone to discourage her from safe/aware browsing technique!

Frodo

join:2006-05-05
kudos:1
reply to Mele20

Re: UTM cookies forced here on Fx and IE! HELP!

For what its worth, I found the Google description of the UTM cookies here:
»developers.google.com/analytics/···sCookies


Blackbird
Built for Speed
Premium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
reply to Mele20
I believe Mele20's original questions involved how to stop the appearance of "outside" cookies employed by DSLR's web pages, and why they were appearing in the first place. Additionally, there have been a lot of back-and-forth contentions and assumptions about the purpose/nature of the cookies and the practices/nature of some of the posters themselves.

Cutting to the chase... as I understand it, the cookies are typical of those employed by a great many websites to provide site-navigation feedback about where site users go on the site and via what paths. They can be (and are, for many saavy users) blocked by cookie-blocking techniques ranging from browser cookie settings to blocking extensions or programs to using custom hosts files in the OS. As I also understand it, the privacy risks of such cookies to a given user depend in large measure upon the assumptions or trust/distrust levels a user brings to the table, as well as the user-inferred reputation of the data manipulation houses providing the services/functionalities at the other end of the cookies. One man's "safe" first-party cookie might be another woman's "unsafe" privacy-invasive tracking cookie. But, in any case, blocking them is not some hidden, black art... I've been blocking them here for years, without even knowing they existed at this site, by simply using a first-party cookie selection in Opera along with a custom (MVPS) hosts file. For those highly concerned about privacy, it should be just that simple. And for all of us, it shouldn't bring into question the character or personality of any of the posters involved.
--
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville

Zach1
Premium
join:2006-11-26
NW Minnesota
reply to Dude111

Re:  

said by Dude111:

Well Mele values her privacy,i dont see anything wrong with that and i dont want anyone to discourage her from safe/aware browsing technique!

+1

While not quite as concerned (albeit damn close) as Mele20 is about this issue, her post(s) bring up many interesting points about 'net privacy. Many of her posts and topics send me looking to verify privacy holes don't exist on my machines or in my behaviour. These forums allow many to become educated consumers which, in the end, benefits everyone. As someone who holds the value of privacy and security in high regard, I'm thankful for Mele and others on this forum who openly discuss it and give back by helping others.
--
Zach

Frodo

join:2006-05-05
kudos:1
reply to Mele20

Re: UTM cookies forced here on Fx and IE! HELP!

I'm only showing two cookies on this site. Someone previously posted that if some Google sites are blocked, then the UTM cookies don't get set. I'm showing some sites blocked as shown below, so that's probably what has to be done to prevent the UTM cookies from appearing.


RequestPolicy


There are various ways to block these sites.


Blackbird
Built for Speed
Premium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
reply to Mele20
All that is getting through on my system (set up as noted in an earlier post) are:
one dslreports.com session cookie
one dslreports.com user-id/log-in cookie
--
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville


pizz
1gbps is all the rage.
Premium
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
reply to DownTheShore
downtheshore, i understand where you're coming from and i respect your opinion (as i do with anyone). But she doesn't have an obsession in my view. She's just the type of person that wants privacy on the internet. Sure most of us (including myself) don't seem as possible. But as I respect your opinions, i respect hers as well, in terms of trying as i said above.

Btw as the other poster mentioned. Her posts make me research some stuff, as I do with so many others who post on the forum.
--
It's ok to say, 'I don't know'. It's even better when someone takes the time to explain what you, 'don't know'.