PC Hardware → Re: PC Ram testing software...

Time to get serious
1 What OS ?
2 What motherboard ?
3 Details on CPU and memory
4 Details on add on cards including video
5 Is anything overclocked ?
6 Any non-default settings in bios ?
7 Is the problem repeatable on demand ?
8 Is it a " hard " shut down including all fans ?
9 Any problems restarting when this happens ?
10 Does this happen only in games , or will a video test program like FurMark cause it to happen ?
11 Have you done any " tweaking " of keyboard or mouse settings ?
12 Access to any spare parts for testing ?
13 What games cause the issue ?

If it is a " hard " shutdown , the question is if the power supply is initiating the shutdown , or is the motherboard telling it to .
You would think that if the power supply is doing the shutdown , a high load test situation would also trigger it .
So far it sounds like this only happens in certain games ?

1) XP Pro SP3
2) Asus M4A79XTD EVO AM3 motherboard
3) AMD Phenom 2 x4 945, 4 gigs of GSkill DD3 (1600) ram
4) EVGA GTX 670
5) Nothing OCd.
6) Not that I remember - a zillion settings with this Asus board. At least nothing more than turning off Asus logos and boot priority.
7) Yes...
8) Yes.
9) Nope.
10) So far only games though I am not sure I have run Furmark. I have run Seti#Home 24x7 on PC and video card since I got the vc. Always turn off Seti before playing.
11) Nope.
12) No.
13) Call of Duty - Modern Warfare 3, Black Ops, and Dead Space 2.

Decidedly not heat as well.CPU not getting above 52c (back room PC is in is quite chilly in the winter). Don't remember the temps on the GPU but it was low. I will have to see if I can find the log.

There's no logs what so ever mentioning this - other than the power cycle records in the event viewer?

Edit: grammer

The first couple of times there was a note about the nvidia driver and that was with the newest driver. Since I went back to an older driver (earlier this year) - nothing. Just the logs for the services restarting.

I am running Furmark but I expect no issues. Was going to check it before I left for work but I forgot. I plan to check at lunch and see if it is still running.

Maybe something like hardware acceleration for the graphics card is affecting your system?

But then it got me thinking, did you install the graphics update off Windows update recently?
See here in the security updates topic.
Can you check for KB2670838 in the update history too please?

Isn't windows screaming at you about improper shutdown ?
Would expect it to be very unhappy when it restarts .

Will say you have more courage than I do . Not too sure I would leave FurMark running without being there to monitor it
FurMark is designed to run the card up to max temp , and it does a very good job of it .

How loaded is your computer as far as programs installed ?
To put it another way , how much of a hassle would a reinstall of windows be ?
Be sure to try norwegian"s suggestion of a clean boot first though .

You would think that a software conflict would lead to video distortion or freezing instead of shutdown , but since the motherboard is what tells the power supply to shut down , I can see conflicts causing a hard shutdown .

Have you tried down-clocking the video card ?

What you mentioned about setting back video settings helping suggests that the power supply may think it is seeing a short or overload and that is causing it to shut down . The question being if it is a real or false sensing .

What is your normal power supply load when not gaming versus gaming ?

Do wish you had another video card and power supply to try , but what is is .

FurMark - 7 hours 16 minutes. 76C, 100.9% TDP, fan @ 51%, AA set to 2x 1280x1024 resolution, avg FPS - 43.

Still running when I left the house a 1:40 PM. It was still running when I got back home - that would be almost 12 hours of burn-in running.

Windows asks if I want to boot into Recovery Console or the Windows install - that is it.

Have not tried the clean boot (never had to do that) and a reinstall would be a pain but I will eventually need to do it. I would like to get Win7 in the near future.

Those updates all look to be Windows 7 updates...

Man almost out of ideas
Only hardware that has not been tested are the input devices .
Am thinking that since the failures occur while gaming , but do not seem to occur on computer controlled testing , there might be something wrong with the mouse or keyboard .
I realize that is a real reach though ,and not sure how to test for it . Maybe try using a different USB port ?

Since it happens in 3 different games , don't know if reinstalling the games would do any good .

When you rolled back the video drivers . how did you remove the old drivers ?

I suppose you could also try testing with prime 95 and 3dMark , but have a feeling they will not show anything .

If I had the computer in front of me , I would probably start by imaging the drive to another (external) drive ,then wiping and reinstalling windows . Fully patch windows , then install the video drivers . Install 1 of the games and test . If ok install game 2 etc.
If the problem reoccurs , try power supply first ,then try with only 1 stick of memory (unless more required by motherboard )
, then video card . If problem still persists , try another motherboard.
I realize that this is not practical to do unless you have spare components on hand , which is one of the few advantages to rolling your own

I have a feeling that this is going to be one of those WTF? I didn't know that could cause that moments .

Use Driver Cleaner Pro to remove the drivers. My keyboard is ancient - literally. It is the keyboard from 1995 and my first PC - Zeos and of course it has an AT connector... Doing the clean reboot to see if it makes any difference..

I dunno - maybe the PSU is still in play.... Or there is a odd software issue but then I think I would upgrade to Win7.

Anyone know if I get the upgrade of Win 7 if I have to have a XP base install or can I do a clean install right from the Win 7 disk?

For that, see these links.
»www.sevenforums.com/tuto ··· ion.html
»winsupersite.com/article ··· a-128512

quote:

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Doing the clean reboot to see if it makes any difference..

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It didn't....

Yes, sorry I missed the XP O/S you had posted initially.

That leaves the very core (kernel) of XP or hardware.
As you do not have hardware to swap out it maybe a hard path to check which is causing the issue.

If you install Win 7 and it goes away, I'll be very surprised - stranger things have happened though.
Good luck sorting it out. Maybe someone can spare a power supply or graphics card near by to help the cause?

If you want to clean install the graphics drivers:
Uninstall in the add/remove programs
Look for all files in system32/drivers that are ATI nVidia and delete them, some may be recreated, but do not be concerned.
Uninstall the video card in device manager.
By now you should be looking at a low resolution desktop, 16 bit, not 32 bit.
Also run CCleaner and the registry tool in it.
Then reboot and install the new package.
However I'd leave out installing anything Catalyst Control Center nVidia Control Panel related for now - this is run off NET Framework and best to leave out while checking a clean install of drivers for the hardware. In fact you can usually select what to install in the package or find the download for just the drivers.

Does the bug still show then?

Just so we don't confuse anyone , EVGA GTX 670 is NVIDA
Procedure described is correct though , just switch NVIDA for AMD.-ATI .
Driver Cleaner should have done this , but it never hurts to check .

Thanks for picking that up. Cross posted from a similar topic in the help forum.

I know plenty of times drivers are not completely uninstalled due to being in use. Until you see that low res, 16-bit screen resolution, the drivers are still being used.

Mind is elsewhere today too which doesn't help CylonRed at all.

Couple of final thoughts .
Just to confirm , when it shuts down the power light on the motherboard is not on ? Not the one on the front panel but the green one on the board itself ?

If I remember correctly , a short on an AT style keyboard - mouse connector would cause a shutdown . Don't know if that still holds true on current generation boards , since most of the ones I work on seem to use USB . Any chance you have another keyboard available to try ?

Took a look at the manual for that motherboard , see what you mean by options up the wazoo .
Don't think it would do any good , but it looks like it would be easy to save the bios profile that you are using now , and then reset everything to default .

I have seen where a network cable plugged in on a computer that is off but the router is still on has caused issues starting the computer up. Unplugging the lead from the motherboard header and then starting the computer would fix it. So I have no doubts that a short off an old keyboard could cause problems on a computer too.

It's that hardware swap out that really will help answer this one from where we sit.

I could try my wife's keyboard (USB- I hate the thing)... The light on the motherboard stays on actually. Till I turn off the PSU and discharge the capacitors by hitting the front power switch.

OK if you have to discharge the caps to get the light to go out , the fact that is on does not really help. Was hoping that they were actively monitoring the power from the power supply directly
Still not sure if the power supply is initiating the shutdown ,either from a overload or a false trip , or if it is the motherboard doing it .
Could you confirm the make and model of the power supply ?

Can't believe I am saying this since I strongly dislike the GUI , but you can upgrade the OS to 8 for a lot less than 7, at least until the end of January . If you don't have a copy of 7 already it might be worth considering .

Price is not much of a matter for me - OEM Win7 Pro upgrade can be had for $130. Expensive but I like Win 7 more than Win8. Does Win 8 have XP mode as well? I have enough older software that runs far better on XP.... Going to be bad enough to learn and Apple Os as my ILs are getting my wife an iPad for Christmas - going around my ban of Apple products in my house...

But - when thru the BIOS and found some interesting things....

The BIOS sees different ram timings for the 2 sticks even though they are the same brand/make and bought at the same time. I bought 4 sticks of the same brand/make for our 2 PCs - maybe the ram between my wife's PC and I got mixed but in theory - they should have the same timings.

The timings - on auto are as follows:
9-9-924-5-33-10-4 and
8-2-5-42-110-0

Suspend mode can't be disables - only Auto, S1 and S3.

PCIE Spread Spectrum is disabled.

I do have the newest BIOS.

C1E was disabled.

Disabled quick boot and Express Gate as well.

None of that helped - shut off in less time than the first MP match on MW3...

I also tried to set the ram timings on the faster one to the slower and I can't do it. I don't have the choices for 9-9-9.

I have only bought 3 PSUs inthe past 5 years. The FSP that went bad on my wife's PC, the Corsair I replaced the FSP with and the Thermaltake Toughpower W0128RU 650W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready Modular Active PFC Power Supply.

The one in my PC is the Thermaltake...

There is no XP Mode for Windows 8.

Did not think so...