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Michail
Premium
join:2000-08-02
Boynton Beach, FL
kudos:1

Windows 8 - how MS should have done it.

Despite how I feel about Windows 8 on the desktop I actually like the Windows 8 phones and the surface tablets. Windows 8 phones take the best from iOS and android and made something that is better than both. Android never one me over from iOS but Win8 may.

I think it's the traditional desktop and laptops that were botched. MS should have transitioned that a little more delicately. After all, most people will get their first exposure from the desktop and traditional laptops.

How could they have done that? By making the metro/surface shell optional on the desktop. It can still be there to run mobile apps and perhaps to integrate with Windows 8 phones and the xbox. A optional windowed, sandbox type mode could have also been added for metro apps running on a traditional desktop.

People would be curios and explore at their leisure and not feel like they are a square peg in a round hole.

lorennerol
Premium
join:2003-10-29
Seattle, WA
Yep.

If your new product is truly that great you don't need to force-feed it to people. Cramming Metro/Modern down people's throats, even on file servers, is an amateur mistake and will, I think, make Win8 the next Me/Vista.


Kilroy
Premium,MVM
join:2002-11-21
Saint Paul, MN
reply to Michail
How about making it like gagets, but turned on by default using the right half of the desktop? The tiles are a great interface for a phone or tablet, but blow on a real computer.

Then again this is probably just a stepping stone to the next version.
--
“Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something.” ¯ Robert A. Heinlein


Michail
Premium
join:2000-08-02
Boynton Beach, FL
kudos:1
reply to Michail
It is a stepping stone. I just don't want to see MS fail.

Between Apple and google MS seems to be the company I'm rooting for these days. Apple is "Our way or no way". Google is "You're on your own but we already know what you're up to anyway".

They are trying hard to reinvent themselves to the new consumer world while trying to maintain their enterprise strengths.

Kerodo

join:2004-05-08

1 recommendation

reply to Michail
What they really should have done is check the hardware during install, and if there's no touch interface type stuff, then install without Metro, and leave an option to enable it if desired. This would have pacified most of the complaints from the start. I guess there is still the issue of no start menu and rearrangement of some things, but to me those are minor issues compared with the Metro nonsense... My 2 cents anyway...


Kramer
Premium,Mod
join:2000-08-03
Richmond, VA
kudos:2

1 recommendation

reply to Michail
I pretty much agree. The start menu could have been redesigned to look like Metro and take up a good piece of the screen. It would be pretty cool to have a start menu that is as configurable as Metro, with active tiles and such, but with an "All Programs" menu closer to WIN7,XP, etc., standard controls like shut down options, search, optionally others (like run, control panel, etc).


sholling
Premium
join:2002-02-13
Hemet, CA
kudos:1

1 recommendation

reply to Michail
The egomaniacs at MS will never understand that the last thing customers want is to be forced to relearn how to use their computers ever 3 years. MS just thinks they are so much smarter than their customers that they shouldn't have to take customers' needs into account. Nobody but geeks have the time or desire to relearn everything from scratch every 3 years - they have work to do. Geeks live to learn how to tweak their computers, non-geeks use them as tools to get work done. Of course it doesn't help MS when their sycophants on forums take a break from sucking up to MS just long enough to tell people they are just to dumb to understand the brilliance of everything MS does and then tell MS to never mind customer complaints.

Windows 8 will be rejected by corporate America at a time that many companies were finally ready for an upgrade cycle.
--
"Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
--FREDERIC BASTIAT--

dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
kudos:8
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
I think your analysis is probably flawed. Or rather, that's not how I see the matter.

I suspect that Microsoft's approach is to push for more 'ease of use', but their view is too skewed towards 'ease of first use' or perhaps 'ease of infrequent use' and away from 'ease of experienced use'.

Betcha they use focus groups

lorennerol
Premium
join:2003-10-29
Seattle, WA
said by dave:

Betcha they use focus groups

The used them for the Kin. Then they took the data they collected from them and summarily dismissed it. Just like they are dismissing all the complaints about how awful Metro is on a desktop or laptop PC.


Michail
Premium
join:2000-08-02
Boynton Beach, FL
kudos:1
reply to Michail
Well, we are sort of being a focus group here almost. But my thoughts were more along the lines of putting myself in the designer's shoes and not being bound to any marketing department's focus groups. Believe me, I've been on my share of projects that saw great ideas derailed by focus groups.

Kerodo

join:2004-05-08
reply to Michail
Another thought on how they should have done it. They shouldn't have done a one size fits all OS.. that's one of those things that sounds cool in theory, but practically speaking, one size obviously doesn't fit all. So who are they trying to fool? Themselves I guess...


Octavean
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-31
New York, NY
kudos:1
reply to Michail
I agree for the most part,....

I suspect Microsoft's three year OS upgrade cycle made Microsoft feel like they had to make a bold move and I suspect subtle changes with a one year upgrade cycle would have been better.

Microsoft runs the risk of vilifying the new UI by forcing the issue but few would likely use it on a PC if they didn't.

I also agree that it is a stepping stone and future versions will likely improve. I honestly don't see much difference between tiles and icons though,...

I suspect a lot of people would be happy or happier if you could size the new UI start screen (like Snap) and have the live tiles dynamically sized to fit. So when invoked it would look more like a start menu with live tiles.

Glen T

join:2003-11-03
BC
reply to Michail
I'm impressed by how contradictory the MS approach to design really is. They spent all that effort designing and flogging Windows Flip and the Aero interface for Vista and then Win7 and then they completely drop it and do the exact opposite.

It's like saying "Remember all that stuff we told you about how Vista was going to make things easier for you? Well, it was all crap. We got it completely wrong. Windows 8 is what we meant to do all along."

To quote Ghandi:

"There they go. I must run and catch up with them, beause I am their leader!"


Michail
Premium
join:2000-08-02
Boynton Beach, FL
kudos:1
reply to Michail
I've have the new Nokia Lumia 920 running Windows Phone 8 and I really do like the mobile version.


Blackbird
Built for Speed
Premium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
reply to Glen T
said by Glen T:

I'm impressed by how contradictory the MS approach to design really is. They spent all that effort designing and flogging Windows Flip and the Aero interface for Vista and then Win7 and then they completely drop it and do the exact opposite.

It's like saying "Remember all that stuff we told you about how Vista was going to make things easier for you? Well, it was all crap. We got it completely wrong. Windows 8 is what we meant to do all along." ...

To me, that very thing will long stand as one of the great MS mysteries of all time (at least until someone truly "in the know" explains it). It will certainly outrank and outlast their sudden reversal after their ill-fated foray into "Bob", which at least was near-universally recognized as an utter failure from the get-go. In the case of aero in Win7, I've come to rely on some of its transparency, etc. effects when I have a lot of things open at once on my desktop.

I recall a LOT of both controversy and salesmanship over the entire aero/glass/see-through experience (and the struggles with the hardware/driver impacts to support it) in Vista and Win7. Then... suddenly... with no explanation, there's a giant "uhmm... never mind" sound uttered by Microsoft with the release of Win8, and aero's largely gone as if it never was. That kind of marketing reversal is acutely glaring, at best, to those of us who've been around computers for more than 1 or 2 years - and which, I submit, constitute the vast bulk of users. For a company the size of Microsoft, it just doesn't look good...
--
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville

dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
kudos:8
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
said by Blackbird:

For a company the size of Microsoft, it just doesn't look good...

I suspect you just answered your own question: "the size of Microsoft".

The team that does one release is not necessarily the team that does the next release. People get bored, burned out, edged out, poached, etc.

Appearance and usability are in the eye of the beholder, and one guy's opinion does not equal the next guy's opinion. Consistency probably lasts just as long as the lead of the UI design team.

It's certainly not just a computer phenomenon. Look up "Chris Bangle" some time


Blackbird
Built for Speed
Premium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
said by dave:

said by Blackbird:

For a company the size of Microsoft, it just doesn't look good...

I suspect you just answered your own question: "the size of Microsoft".

The team that does one release is not necessarily the team that does the next release. People get bored, burned out, edged out, poached, etc.

Appearance and usability are in the eye of the beholder, and one guy's opinion does not equal the next guy's opinion. Consistency probably lasts just as long as the lead of the UI design team.

It's certainly not just a computer phenomenon. Look up "Chris Bangle" some time

Perhaps you're right. But there was a time when management of large, successful (over the longer term) companies strove almost dictatorially for product-line continuity in the midst of innovative design. What you describe is a company at odds with its own vision, or a company without a single clear product-line vision at all. And that ends up being a company at war with itself, which all too often does not provide a good or enduring outcome.
--
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville

dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
kudos:8
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
said by Blackbird:

... or a company without a single clear product-line vision at all. And that ends up being a company at war with itself, which all too often does not provide a good or enduring outcome.

I worked for DEC. I rest my case.